BedeHistory731

G&G-Fan said:

sade1212 said:

The hard part really is just finding appropriate footage of Hayden to use. I’ve scanned through ROTS a few times (and the various deleted scenes) and never found anything at the right angle or which wouldn’t be a super obvious lift.

There’s the scene of him saying goodbye to Obi-Wan, or the balcony scene with Padme.

I mean this is a pretty great smile

Eh, it looks better later in the shot and a few shots later, with teeth showing. This nails it more:

Still, the lighting would make it very obvious that it’s not from the original. Some method of fixing it would be needed, but that’s simple.

Still, I’d say manipulation of more straight-on shots, interview footage from now, and/or deepfakery would do the trick.

Pretty much. Just do the subtle aging that Ascendant had in the close-ups and keep the outfit consistent with ROTJ/Ascendant. The change’s main goal will be to give the Hayden ghost a warm and proud expression akin to Shaw’s, as well as a less jarring link between head and body (i.e., maybe don’t use Shaw’s body).

Anakin Starkiller said:

I mentioned this in the Resurgence thread for the Shaw ghost, but wouldn’t it be a good idea to do a 3D model of Hayden’s head (with photorealistic textures) to better incorporate the Hayden ghost into ROTJ? Either that or convincingly deepfake Hayden’s head onto a similarly-sized costumed body double (with ROTS-like wig) duplicating Shaw’s expressions.

Ideally you’d do both, but we’re not exactly Corridor Digital.

Really, like hinventon said, the Ascendant Anakin ghost looks great, and it didn’t need any of that fancy stuff.

Definitely! It’s just a matter of appropriate clip selection and manipulation/editing to get it just right. A non-creepy Hayden ghost would be the perfect goal for any ROTJ edit (one that’s the full length of the OOT shot, so somebody could insert it into the current/next Despecialized or other fan edits).

I mentioned this in the Resurgence thread for the Shaw ghost, but wouldn’t it be a good idea to do a 3D model of Hayden’s head (with photorealistic textures) to better incorporate the Hayden ghost into ROTJ? Either that or convincingly deepfake Hayden’s head onto a similarly-sized costumed body double (with ROTS-like wig) duplicating Shaw’s expressions.

I may just be spitballing here, but a well-produced Hayden ghost would be my preferred version of Anakin. I’d say we’re at the point where it would be doable.

This may sound hilariously stupid, but what if somebody 3D modeled Shaw’s head and used photo-based textures for it? Then it could be composited into the shots for the redone ending. It would be a pain in the butt, but it might be worthwhile.

Given what Luke learned about the fall of the Jedi, it’d make sense to toss away the Youngling Killer 9000 like garbage.

Servii said:

Change Obi-Wan’s Krayt Dragon call in ANH to a Godzilla roar.

I’d go for the headless kamikaze scream from the Serious Sam games.

fmalover said:

Since Rey’s godlike mastery of the Force is being discussed, I want to say that if there’s one thing that bothered me most about the PT, it’s how everyone goes on about how strong Anakin is with the Force, but we never see him do anything noteworthy in AotC and RotS other than basic stuff like telekinetically moving stuff around or boosting his jumps. Now I’m not saying he should have breezed through waves of enemies Force Unleashed style, it’s just that I would consider this a case of “Show, don’t tell”.

Heck, something like enhanced precognition, complete sensory awareness, or even some large telekinetic feat (e.g., ripping ships apart) would’ve sold both his status as a “chosen one” and how much becoming Vader diminished him. I don’t know if 2002/2005 CGI and physical modeling could do that convincingly, but it would’ve sold it more.

Servii said:

Also, “Mary Sue” is not a dogwhistle. There are plenty of well known male Mary Sues/Gary Stus in fiction. I’m not sure what you’re implying about Marcia Lucas with that. I know people who avoid using the term because they don’t want to be accused of being some sort of reactionary, but it’s a valid term in character criticism.

I agree that it’s valid, but it’s been used so often by the reactionary sort that it has kind of lost a lot of its original meaning and has become a dogwhistle for some (akin to “ethics in video game journalism”). It sucks that such a useful term has been ruined, but that’s the impact of the culture war on pop culture discussion.

NeverarGreat said:

Are we sure that’s higher quality than anything we have, or is he just implying that he got a fan project?

Even so, digitizing analog video masters is just standard archival policy at this point. Analog video doesn’t exactly have the shelf life of safety film.

Anakin Starkiller said:

Omni said:

Yeah, not a flaw at all. Complaining about Carano’s firing should be a major red flag.

Strongly diasgree. What she said may have been really stupid but it wasn’t dangerous, and I’ve had with this cancel culture.

It was very dangerous. Any attempt to spread misinformation at this time should be seen as dangerous. It’s much bigger than just “cancel culture.”

ZkinandBonez said:

How is it not a flaw to fail to explain how a new protagonist far supersede both of the previous saga main characters for two movies, then retconning it to some vague super-inheritance in the third film?

But is she really all that more powerful than Anakin or Luke? Do we really need to see a training arc beyond what was in TLJ and the opening of TROS (she’s been training with Leia and on her own during the time skip)? The character still struggles and has the whole “found family” arc, so it’s not like she’s a god-mode Mary Sue (e.g., Starkiller from The Force Unleashed).

And as for killing off the OT characters, even Mark Hamill has expressed disappointment in Lucasfilm failing to bring back the old cast as so many fans were hoping for. Yes, Ford has an odd relationship with SW, Fisher’s passing was obviously out of everyone’s control, but killing off Luke was to many a step too far. And Lando’s “mandatory” appearance in TROS didn’t really serve much of a story purpose.

I get the issue around it, but I really don’t think it was an issue because the sacrifice was handled so well in the movie. I know an OT reunion scene would’ve been welcome, but I think the story is fine without it.

What annoys me is that I think the new trilogy could have been saved with just one minor adjustment to TLJ. If Luke hadn’t been killed off and Rey had received some actual mentoring in the third film, then I think the whole thing could have come to a much more satisfying conclusion.

I really don’t think that. Rey gets enough mentoring in the movie and it serves the story well.

I still would have had some complaints, sure, but it would have felt more consistent and like a proper “passing of the torch” story. It would have given Luke more of a complete arc and a position in the saga worthy of what was set up previously and how he is perceived by the fandom, and it could also have helped give some much needed limitations to Rey’s abilities (which TLJ did kind of touch on), while still allowing for her grand powers in the third film. And hopefully this would have resulted in a third film that gave Finn and Poe more to do.

I’d say that TLJ did all of that. That was the worthy ending that fit with the Luke of the OT.

I personally can forgive TFA for it’s unoriginality due it having the massive task of having to bring back fans after the PT, and I can appreciate the depth and nuance that Johnson attempted to add to Luke (though I’m still torn on whether it should have been done or not), but in the end I think the lack of an organic ending made the whole trilogy crash and burn. With Luke as a strong link to the OT and ideas more akin to Trevorrow’s planned finale I think the ST could have been quite good, if not a fair bit derivative.

I’m not all that keen on TROS, but it still feels like a decent and fairly organic ending to me. Rey has her found family and much like Luke in ROTJ, there’s room to speculate on her next move. Heck, the claiming of the name with ghostly approval works well as a torch pass to me.

Granted, I’d have set the ST 100 years after ROTJ with only Chewy, R2, 3PO, and ghost Luke returning. All the themes could be explored without causing unexpected disturbances with OT fans.

LexX said:

BedeHistory731 said:

I think she sounds bitter and spiteful more than anything else. Like the guy who played Boba Fett for the Jabba scene in ANH whining about the name of Fett’s ship. OK, maybe not that bad…

Still, I find her critiques paper-thin more than anything else.

Those are pretty much the same critiques anyone has had if they have had any.

Yeah, whining about killing the OT characters and trying to argue that Rey is a bad character. That’s a bit more shallow than some of the more substantial critiques. Surely she knew that Harrison would only do the movie if Han died. Luke’s sacrifice was handled beautifully in the movie. No “magic is gone” because the OT characters died.

There are always people who take critique as bitterness if they can make a possible reason why whatever the subject would be. I can’t see how the fundamental flaws of the films are paper-thin.

Killing the OT characters was not a fundamental flaw. Not explaining everything about Rey is not a fundamental flaw. She came very close to dropping the “Mary Sue” dog whistle.

I think she sounds bitter and spiteful more than anything else. Like the guy who played Boba Fett for the Jabba scene in ANH whining about the name of Fett’s ship. OK, maybe not that bad…

Still, I find her critiques paper-thin more than anything else.

SparkySywer said:

oojason said:

Servii said:

It’s important to understand that, when it comes to liking or disliking a fictional space movie, morality has no bearing on a person’s opinion. Whether or not you like a space adventure movie says nothing about you as a human being, because it’s just a movie.

I remember after TLJ came out, and for the next couple years, there was a massive wave of articles by journalists that tried to either trivialize or vilify criticizers of the film. “It’s just Russian bots.” “It’s just a small group of racist trolls online.” “They’re not real fans, anyway. They’re just manbabies who don’t understand the true meaning of Star Wars.” I heard all of these repeatedly from journalists, with similar sentiments even being repeated by Lucasfilm employees. Of course, antagonizing your own customers is never a good idea, no matter how little you care about them. But the whole thing was so bizarre, I still can’t fully wrap my head around it.

That was because it was true (the part about Russian bots, trolls spammers - the racists, sexists and homophobes - we even had numbers of them on here). There is a massive disconnect between criticising and outing these fuckwits - and ‘antagonizing your own customers’, as you claim.

This is true, but it’s at least worth mentioning that there’s a vocal minority of trigger-happy ST fans who’ll happily lump valid criticism in with bad faith actors.

Definitely. I’m kind of guilty of that myself, if only as a defense mechanism when interacting with people online. I see dislike of the sequels as a red flag about certain attitudes that needs to be disproven by the disliking party. If they start ranting about Gina Carano’s firing, a “Lucasfilm civil war,” or even how there will be a “retcon of the sequels through the World Between Worlds,” then I feel the urge to disengage.

That’s a flaw on my part.

Hal 9000 said:

I love how the character of the original saber effects still comes through and isn’t totally overwritten.

Definitely. It feels more “alive” than other saber repaints.

Overall, I’m very impressed with your work, Ady!

So, are people who like the ST awful people for liking it?

I’d be more open to watching “The Edwards Cut” (the mess the movie was before reshoots), because that would at least be a hilarious mess and not a dour mess.

Like, let’s be real: the Snyder Cut is still a mediocre-to-bad miniseries/movie. It’s just good-looking compared to the Whedon Cut.

I think the hallway scene is the worst part of that already-awful movie. It just feels like a slasher movie bit got stuck in the wrong series. I tend to dislike people who like that scene, especially the ones who want roughly two hours of it in an “R-rated horror movie.” I also find that a certain crowd that likes this scene also enjoy harassing people who worked on the ST, so…

R1 fails the “eight deadly words” for me. Not even AOTC and TROS did that.

Rewrite all the title crawls and credits in Aurebesh.

screams in the void said:

I think he was right in the context of the original unaltered trilogy , before the prequels , back when it was widely believed by a lot of authors that the Clone Wars took place 35 years before the original film .

Definitely. The timeline chicanery of the prequels is a bit of a pain.

Ideally, David Prowse should’ve been unmasked Vader/Ghost Anakin. He was only a few years older than Anakin’s post-PT canon age!

Mocata said:

recontextualizing the world, characters, or events of the original film in a way that makes them better in hindsight

Yup. That’s why I like Better Call Saul. It makes Saul Goodman/Jimmy McGill’s arc more compelling, as well as the Salamanca family-Gus Fring conflict. It also makes Walter White’s achievements all the more impressive in Breaking Bad, as he was able to annihilate all of these people.

I made the joke before, but I now kinda want an HD remaster (or at the very least, a Steam/PSN/Xbox Live Arcade release) of Super Bombad Racing or even a new Star Wars-themed Mario Kart clone.

Meh, call me when Super Bombad Racing gets an HD remake. 😉

I’m excited for this!

thebluefrog said:

Prequels barely work in general.

Can people really come up with any prequels outside of SW that enhance the original?

Better Call Saul