BedeHistory731

adywan said:

After seeing the second episode, they have basically cut Gary Kurtz. The only brief times they mention him it’s negative. NO mention of the fact that he took over the second unit to direct many scenes in order to get the film finished on time before the studio pulled the plug. They just portray him as this “looming” figure who couldn’t control anything. Yet people who actually worked on the film have said the opposite and have been quite unhappy with the way he was portrayed in the first episode. God knows how they will feel after this second one.

Well that sucks.

We do now know about the different cuts of the film . It is said in this doc that the Biggs/ Luke scenes were cut very early on and BEFORE the rough screening George did for his friends ( De Palma, Spielberg etc) AND long BEFRORE ANY PUBLIC SCREENING. It seems that , for the one and only public screening prior to release, the only difference was the opening crawl. So all those people that have been claiming they saw a cut in the cinema that contained these scenes, are either flat out lying or completely misremembering.

Like, I fully expected some lying and exaggeration in Dark Side of the Ring. The wrestlers interviewed were all some variety of carny, guys who try to tell exciting and questionable stories for a living. Many are also pretty brain-damaged from concussions, so it makes sense they’d misremember.

I guess there’s not much of a difference between network-produced documentaries and carnie entertainment.

It’s been interesting hearing just how much influence Marcia had on this film, finally. The fact that George let De Palmas comments about the force get to him and George started re-cutting the film to eliminate much of the force , with marcia going behind his back and adding them all back in. George worshippers won’t be happy with this doc though.

Part of me thinks this was a condition that Marcia had for agreeing to do the documentary. It had to paint her in as favorable a light as possible for it to work.

This isn’t entirely uncommon in documentary filmmaking. Look at Vice’s own “Last of the Von Erichs” or FMW episode of Dark Side of the Ring if you want a thorough display of interviewee-influenced misinterpretation.

[AlecBaldwinNarration] Help me, please! [/AlecBaldwinNarration]

Turn the Vader-Luke-Palpatine confrontation from ROTJ into a Jim Can’t Swim-style interrogation analysis.

Servii said:

STK is good for how much it tries to call out all the jerks who have ruined the Star Wars fandom and is a safe space for people to like the sequels without being yelled at or belittled.

So, criticizing the prequels is all well and good, but criticizing the sequels is “ruining the fandom”? The vast majority of Star Wars subs are largely positive about the whole franchise. It’s not like sequel fans are some oppressed minority.

It’s more or less calling out the Geeks+Gamers, Mauler, TheQuartering, Star Wars Theory, etc. part of the “fandom” that simply want to grift and enable grifters. Like it or not, they exist and make the whole fandom look bad. Besides, STK isn’t all that OK with prequel criticism (except for the people who miss the points of those movies).

Also, pro-sequel content gets downvoted a lot on the main subreddit, most of r/prequelmemes is “sequels bad” content, and grift content is still pumped out on the regular on YouTube. Being an ST fan is like being a PT fan back in the '00s. The difference is that a wider spread of social media avenues makes it seem louder and angrier.

Servii said:

BedeHistory731 said:

Servii said:

BedeHistory731 said:

The Mauler subreddit also works for this.

SaltierThanKrayt is worse, though.

I think it, StarWarsCantina, and MawInstallation are the only worthwhile places to talk Star Wars on reddit.

I haven’t been on StarWarsCantina lately, but MawInstallation is pretty decent.

MawInstallation and DaystromInstitute have always been safe havens away from fandom BS for their respective franchises. I like a subreddit where just posting memes will get you banned.

Servii said:

BedeHistory731 said:

The Mauler subreddit also works for this.

SaltierThanKrayt is worse, though.

I think it, StarWarsCantina, and MawInstallation are the only worthwhile places to talk Star Wars on reddit. STK is good for how much it tries to call out all the jerks who have ruined the Star Wars fandom and is a safe space for people to like the sequels without being yelled at or belittled.

The Mauler subreddit also works for this.

digitalfreaknyc said:

Re: 1/2 - why would they scan that instead of something internally at Lucasfilm? Is it possible it’s a print from one of the ILM people?

I would presume that #2 would be in the archives of Lucasfilm, along with the IB Tech print. IIRC, it’s that fabled IB Tech print that is the source for the '77 scroll in the GOUT and OOT footage for Empire of Dreams.

digitalfreaknyc said:

adywan said:

digitalfreaknyc said:

adywan said:

OK, i have just found proof that they are using footage of the OT from trailers.

I guess the other question is: does that Han *yahoo" shot show up in any trailer with the same blemishes in the print on his face? That would confirm everything.

I don’t think all the footage is from trailers.

Right. So then where does that Han shot come from? None of this makes much sense.

Here are a few ideas I have:

1. The Lucas-owned IB Technicolor print
2. A surviving interpositive or a CRI-sourced print (like 4K78) that has damage unique to it - there’s too much detail for it to be a release print, even an AI-enhanced one
3. Trailers for some, other print sources for Han
4. IIRC, the shot of Han appeared in From Star Wars to Jedi, so maybe a scan of that?
5. Press kit materials

Topaz was definitely used to process these scans, which makes me think something about them didn’t warrant a full 2K or 4K scan.

My guess is that it’s trailer, damaged interpositive footage, or press kit footage, scanned in 1080p. The fact that the footage has damage we’ve not seen in any of the period release prints (including 4K77 or 4K78) or on 1985 IP-derived transfers (e.g., GOUT and JSC) leads me to believe it’s an additional source.

I know it doesn’t have the slight color fringing present on IB techs of the time, but could the source be the mythical Lucas-owned IB Tech?

I’d just be game to do a bait-and-switch. Instead of the Special Edition, why not have a whole re:View episode on Thankskilling? I think it would break Mike like the Jack Frost movie did.

So, what’s the TL;DR of your DS9 criticism? I’m curious.

Would that be with or without the kidnapped and tortured sex worker plots?

I think the mods should intervene and make an example of this chode.

I kinda wish for an ROTJ fanedit that includes Luke meditating, learning about Anakin’s name and appearance. Maybe set it during the deleted cave scene? That’d make a good version of the Hayden ghost make sense.

I like the idea that Anakin picks his ghost form depending on whatever he feels like that day. Maybe he even has his legends tattoos in some forms?

If you just look at The 1st Album by Modern Talking and a “best of” for Blue System, Dieter Bohlen isn’t that terrible of a pop composer. It’s just that the guy valued quantity over quality so much that he decided to produce the same kinds of songs over and over again.

He’s still a terrible lyricist, no matter what you look at (both in English and German versions).

Some movies should just be one-offs and not franchises.

That said, JPIII is the best Jurassic Park sequel.

As for the latest movie I’ve seen, Viva Knievel was a delightfully goofy experience. The Rifftrax improves it a lot, but without it it’s still a good “funny-bad” vanity project.

Kaweebo said:

BedeHistory731 said:

henzINNIT said:

I have contributed to the tangent so my bad if I have derailed things somewhat. I think it did originally tie in to this show, how the last duel in OWK ended, and whether Obi-Wan walking away after defeating Vader makes sense. I don’t believe it does, but that is no doubt influenced by my reading of Ben’s intentions in the OT. If I was to buy in to the notion that killing Vader is just not a jedi thing to do, the resolution in OWK works I guess, but that leaves me wondering if perhaps this was also the prefered outcome in Ben’s mind for ROTJ too: Luke messes up Vader’s suit, says ‘goodbye Darth’ and walks away with a moral victory, leaving Vader free to oppress the galaxy for another decade.

Well, the Death Star explosion would’ve blown Vader up, so I guess he was just hoping the Rebels would do the job for Luke?

That assumption of death why I kind of wanted Vader to shut down his suit/cut himself off from the force temporarily to make Ben think he was dead this time. Just wait until Kenobi is a few light years away before he re-activates and heads back to Mustafar. I would’ve appreciated that trick, to show that Vader is learning more control.

At the same time though, I think it’s out of character for Vader to play dead. I think he’d think it’s beneath him. He’d rather go down fighting as a true warrior and Sith than pretend to die just to live another day.

That’s totally fair and more reasonable within canon. Vader, at this point in the canon, really doesn’t have much of a self-preservation instinct. If he can do something, he will try to do it in the here and now.

If anything, he chilled out a lot by the time R1 and ANH happened. I guess working for an additional decade in the Empire’s equivalent of upper management dulled his madness a bit. Management jobs do tend to soul-suck you a little. It’s my head canon that Vader is so utterly bored and complacent with his life by R1 than he relishes in all the chaos of Scarif, Ben’s return, and Yavin. He feels truly alive again.

Even if yotsuya is being 100% legit, I love that they’re riling up the people here so much. Sometimes the best trolls are the ones who are entirely honest.

At least yotsuya is less predictable than Stardust1138 and doesn’t spam a crap ton of YouTube links. Stardust was under the faulty impression that watching YouTube video essays makes you extra-intelligent. Trolls shouldn’t make you do homework.

Fan_edit_fan said:

I’ll put my Saber on low power and leave this topic. You’re giving the adults headaches.

Well that’s a funny ragequit.

henzINNIT said:

I have contributed to the tangent so my bad if I have derailed things somewhat. I think it did originally tie in to this show, how the last duel in OWK ended, and whether Obi-Wan walking away after defeating Vader makes sense. I don’t believe it does, but that is no doubt influenced by my reading of Ben’s intentions in the OT. If I was to buy in to the notion that killing Vader is just not a jedi thing to do, the resolution in OWK works I guess, but that leaves me wondering if perhaps this was also the prefered outcome in Ben’s mind for ROTJ too: Luke messes up Vader’s suit, says ‘goodbye Darth’ and walks away with a moral victory, leaving Vader free to oppress the galaxy for another decade.

Well, the Death Star explosion would’ve blown Vader up, so I guess he was just hoping the Rebels would do the job for Luke?

That assumption of death why I kind of wanted Vader to shut down his suit/cut himself off from the force temporarily to make Ben think he was dead this time. Just wait until Kenobi is a few light years away before he re-activates and heads back to Mustafar. I would’ve appreciated that trick, to show that Vader is learning more control.

ADR14NAT1ON said:

Very interesting discussion. But why is it taking place in this thread?

Natural form of conversation and moderators not wanting to interrupt it? That’s good, BTW - I hate when moderators step in and try to kill productive and insightful conversations for the sake of “staying on topic.”

Really, I tend to like how loose the moderator team is here. Nobody too strict or too obsessed with rules, while also taking care of any potential issues. I also don’t see a lot of blatant favoritism, which was very much blatant on other boards I’ve visited.

I wish an anti-theist was the franchise creator, one who very clearly saw the flaws of faith/belief as a concept and realized that people would better off without any of it.

The Force would just be a genetic abnormality that some humanoids can use for foresight and telekinesis. The Jedi and Sith both ascribed religious power to it and abused said power for millennia. Luke, being the first to divorce religion from this power, leads in a new enlightened age of discovery.

Nah, that sounds really pretentious and cold.