xhonzi

I think another thing is that ANH introduced concepts and things like the civil war, rebels, Galactic Empire and DEATH STAR and Princess Leia before the movie even started... but ESB and RotJ don't really.  They build upon characters and situations understood from the previous films and just update them a little.

AotC and RotS continue to introduce totally new characters and concepts (Dooku, Grevious, Separatists) in the crawls.  Perhaps that is debatable is the CN Clone War cartoons are taken into account... but I think there's still a big part of the audience saying, "Erm..... what?" at those crawls.

As long as I get a double rainbow lightsabre....

WHAT WOULD IT MEAN!?!?!?

Back to the question... it does seem that the right script, the right talent, and a strike of lightning might produce a decent something for a ~$0 budget.

All of the parts are difficult... but the lightning is hardest.  You never know when or where it's going to strike.

But you know that he and I are not the same person?  Because that's apparently not well know 'round these parts.

TheBoost said:

xhonzi said:

The first thing that comes to mind is Harry Potter 3, which probably isn't quite what you're looking for.

Any fan of the book (or someone who's read it recently, at least) can tell you that the film is missing a few bits of info that make the ending all make sense.

It's been awhile for me. What's the film missing? (the films and the books all blur together for me)

 I can't tell you with the razor like accuracy I could have several years ago, but IIRC, it has to do with Harry's Dad's friends and their relationship to the maurader's map and that Harry's dad's patronus was a stag.  Some part of that or all of it.  I just remember being shocked that they left maybe a sentence of exposition out that sort of tied it all up in a neat cherry on top.  Not to mix metaphors.

TV's Frink said:

And you'll have to forgive me for "already said in this thread" moments.  I don't read hal posts very closely, if at all.

Actually (literally) it was from a well respected member of this board.  No, not bkev, but Bingowingo: http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/anothe-example-of-lucas-changing-things-to-appeal-to-a-new-generation-lightsaber-dueling-styles-of-OT-vs-PT/post/458520/#TopicPost458520

This is never said, but one could infer that the Rebellion would de-centralize once the threat of the Death Star is apparent.  (It's just like when you realize your Terran opponent in Star Craft has nukes so you don't want all of your expensive units too close together anymore).  And that the Empire would draw them out of "hiding" by setting the TRAP with the DSII.

TV's Frink said:

Carp.  Speed read fail.

Well, that's something that doesn't really bother me about the prequels.  All we see in the OT is an old man, a newbie, and a machine.  Doesn't it at least sort of make sense to have different styles, even if that wasn't the real reason it was done?

No, this argument stinks to high heaven.

As was already said in this thread, how much older is Christopher Lee than Obi-Wan?  How much more robotic is Grevious than Vader?  How much more newb is *any lightsabre kid that we see twirling* than RotJ Luke?

Hmm... I misread the title as "missing explosion" which this post is indeed missing.

The first thing that comes to mind is Harry Potter 3, which probably isn't quite what you're looking for.

Any fan of the book (or someone who's read it recently, at least) can tell you that the film is missing a few bits of info that make the ending all make sense.

KAAAAAABBBBBBBBBBBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMM!

ChainsawAsh said:

pittrek said:

Wow, am I the only person who LOVES AOTC ?

I think so.  That movie's a worthless piece of dogshit if you ask me.  No redeeming value whatsoever, and that isn't hyperbole on my part.

To me, AotC is the best of the PT.  Which isn't saying much, since I don't know that I would give any of them more than 1 or 2 balls (out of 1 million).  But AotC neither sets up the failure nor concludes the failure.  Also, I was somewhat intrigued by the mystery it set up (which RotS fails to follow-up) and I think it had the least offensive content.  It was most 'meh' of them all, which mean it was least 'blerch' of the three.

So I don't LOVE AotC.  But it's the one I would most likely watch if forced to choose one of the three.

1 ball out of 10 balls.

TV's Frink said:

xhonzi said:

Alright, is it just me, or did hal have a good point even if he sort of botched the delivery?

The PT change in lightsabre style was not story motivated and it remains as one of the inconsistencies between the trilogies that prevents them from being a cohesive whole.  He probably did it because he thought it would 'look cool' and the pervasiveness of Asian culture in the West led him to think that he had to have the Jedi be superninjas just so they could be competitive with the other superninjas in recent pop culture.

Maybe you still don't agree with that.  I do.  But isn't that what he was trying to say?

I'm not entirely sure I agree but there's absolutely no doubt Sam Jackson was given a purple one because he wanted it...so how much could the saber colors mean to the story in Lucas' mind?

I said nothing of colours.  I meant, as was the subject of the OP, the fighting styles, not the prop design or effects design.

TV's Frink said:

Well, if you are saying they would have built the DS smaller so it could survive a run-in with a spaceberg, then I concede the point.

Q: What's a spaceberg?

A: Like an iceberg, but IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN SSSSSSSSSSSSPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

The Queen Anne is hardly smaller than the Titanic.

TV's Frink said:

xhonzi said:

2. Not building a second Death Star would be like never buying a second car.  Yes, the Rebels found a flaw and exploited it to destroy the Death Star.  Yes, it must have cost trillions of space bucks, and the loss of life must have been a tremendous set back...  But seriously... if the idea was this good in the first place, a little thing like having it destroyed on it's maiden voyage would not convince you the whole idea was flawed to begin with.

The Titanic would like a word with you.

Was the Titantic the last steamship ever built?  Or just the last one with a flaw in the "don't sink" mechanisms that turned out to be a bad idea?

Have they ceased Royal Cruise lines since 1912?

Did no one ever sail from Liverpool to New York again?

I think you proved my point.

Alright, is it just me, or did hal have a good point even if he sort of botched the delivery?

The PT change in lightsabre style was not story motivated and it remains as one of the inconsistencies between the trilogies that prevents them from being a cohesive whole.  He probably did it because he thought it would 'look cool' and the pervasiveness of Asian culture in the West led him to think that he had to have the Jedi be superninjas just so they could be competitive with the other superninjas in recent pop culture.

Maybe you still don't agree with that.  I do.  But isn't that what he was trying to say?

TV's Frink said:

There's an even faster way to do it, but I'll be damned if I'm going to try and help again.

EDIT: Two faster ways, though the second takes a little more brain power.

 Is it this way:

*insert pic of sad xhonzi bot shuffling away*

???

I've seen quite a few people ragging recently on the ol' Death Star II.  I wanted to share my thoughts on it, and then let you all rip me to shreds.

Sound like fun?  Here we go!

1. Within the scope of the original movie, the Death Star really is the most significant advancement in War technology ever invented.  The rebels are concerned that if it is allowed to exist for more than a week, it will bring the rebellion to a swift end and will enslave the galaxy to the evil empire forever more.

    1.a. We never get a good look at how interstellar War exists in the Star Wars galaxy prior to the introduction of the Death Star... *cough*what the prequels could have done...*cough* But I think the original movie tells us that this is a mega game changer.  The ability to destroy a planet is the ability to not have wars- just to wipe your enemy out in time for tea.

2. Not building a second Death Star would be like never buying a second car.  Yes, the Rebels found a flaw and exploited it to destroy the Death Star.  Yes, it must have cost trillions of space bucks, and the loss of life must have been a tremendous set back...  But seriously... if the idea was this good in the first place, a little thing like having it destroyed on it's maiden voyage would not convince you the whole idea was flawed to begin with.

3. In fact, if the Empire were still around to do it, I'd expect them to build a Death Star 3 and 4 and maybe even some Mini Death Stars.  As long as they had the technology, they would make them. 

4. Unless that even accounting for all of the shortcomings of each one, that they determined its size to make it too big of a centralized target and not one worth the effort.  But I think it would take a government several attempts before they would arrive at that conclusion and give up on the idea.

5. So: Death Star II represents consistency within the universe.  If it was worth building once, it was worth building twice.  Or, to quote Carl Sagan paraphrasing gov't spending: Why build one when you can build two at twice the price?

Screw in-universe consistency!  It was boring to redo the Death Star, we had already been there- done that.  Bring on something new! 

1. Fair enough.  But how much does Death Star II really re-enact Death Star I?  If you look at the structure of the movies (and I really hope you do...) The first movie is all about the Death Star.  The threat of it, and how the Rebellion is going to overcome it.  The movie is over once the DS is destroyed.  It takes all of the Rebels, but only our heroes can steal the plans, hide the plans, accidentally buy a droid containing the plans, rescue the princess that knows where to take the plans, deliver the plans, and shoot the magic missile so that the plans can be executed.  Or flank the enemy so that said magic missile can be delivered.

   1.a. Look at DSII.  Nameless, faceless Bothan's died to get the plans.  Luke doesn't really give a flip about DSII.  Han and Leia are involved with taking it out, but they have a different battle on their immediate hands.  Who takes out DSII?  Well, it's the 2nd stringers.  Wedge, Lando, Nien Nunb (AKA wrinkle cheeks).  Is the movie over once DSII is destroyed?  No.  Is there a twist involving DSII?  Yes.  The Rebels go to the DSII, instead of it coming to them.  And the Emperor's deliberately set a trap with it, to play off of the Rebels' confidence.  Is the tunnel run too similar to the trench run?  Perhaps.  Is it different enough?  Perhaps.  Is it exactly the same?  No.

2. Depending on what version of Lucas's explanation you buy, the "original" ending to the "third part of the trilogy" involved blowing up a Death Star.  This ending was compressed into the ending of the first part, so he should have come up with a different ending for the third part.  Maybe he should have.  Afterall, it worked in Superman/Superman II.  Just have the Emperor use a Dark Side kiss to make... Vader... forget that he's... Clark Kent. 

  2.a. Okay, I'm sure that zombie is going to debunk the above paragraph, so maybe we'll just go onto the next one.

3. Related to #1 here, the DSII is not the focus of RotJ, certainly not the same way that DSI was the focus of ANH.  So whatever it could have been- DSII, Hurt Ball VI, Kill Sphere MCXXVIII, Space Dock X... it wouldn't have been the focus of the plot.  Which requires least set-up and least distraction from what the true focus is?  I present- Death Star II.

Okay, I think I've run on long enough here.

And then the DSIII blows up.

THE /END.

Ot.com!  What a wonderful town!  The Boost is up, but the Sluggo is down.

OT-dot-COM!  WHAT AN H-E-DOUBLE-HELL OF A TOWN!

CP3S said:

But Faraday wasn't able to save Charlotte, and we found out that he was the scary man Charlotte remembered talking to and being freaked out by in her childhood, indicating that everything that happened had always happened.

Despite the fact that she hadn't been born yet. :)

CP3S said:

Actually, you've probably "done" somethings WITH the DLC you just don't know about. It added quite a few new perks to the game, and some other changes/additions, likely you've taken advantage of some of those already without realizing. I'd just leave good enough alone, and youtube the ending if you feel you need that authentic experience.

Yeah, I thought that might be the case.  Hence the "'" around "done".  I deleted the Oblivion DLC from my harddrive since I needed the space and could reinstall when I wanted to... and then I wanted to see/show something so I loaded up Oblivion and it was... wonky.  Still worked, but basically said "Here be monsters, procede at your own risk."

How many endings will I have to youtube to see the one I should have gotten?  I heard there were 200 possible endings, but I have to assume it's a matrix of maybe 5 or 6 totally different endings.

I managed to finish all the main New Vegas achievements just a few days after it came out, and I really felt the need to go for 100% after putting all that hard work in (plus I have always been curious if they take away your 100% status for games that have DLC released after you got 100% on them, and it felt like a good opportunity to experiment. Turns out they don't, New Vegas still appears in my list of 100% games).

I thought I'd had one of my 100%ers redacted after the release of some DLC.  I have no proof however... so I'll have to accept your word on it.

But 100%- that means you played the "realistic mode", eh?  How did you find it? 

There's a part of me that really thinks I want to play these games that way.  I already mentioned my dislike of abusing fast travel, and I think the idea that I don't have to sleep for months on end is absurd.  And I only have to eat if I've been damaged in battle?  Do I ever shower?  I don't think I want to have to empty my bladder and bowels 4 times in the game's 24 hours... but I think I would welcome the extra layer of reality.  On the other hand, I think I'm carrying ~300 lbs of armor, guns, empty nuka bottles, tin cans, and steam works.  But I'm probably, if I'm honest, carrying about 3,000 lbs of bottle caps (jingle jangle) pre-war money, stimpacks, and ammo which all weighs an ingame weight of exactly 0 lbs.  Heck, I have ~50 bobby pins.  That's probably a full pocket right there.  Where am I carrying these 100 rockets?  And the 15 mini nukes?  And several boxes of 10 and 5mm?

Don't get me wrong- I exploit the crap out of the system.  But only because I can.  Having to do a better job of managing my ammo sounds like fun.

Maybe once the game gets to be $15 used for the GOTY edition, I'll grab it to check out the rest of the DLC.

Well, I'll let you know once it hits $15.  Assuming they make a GotY edition, that is.  ;)

Did you see the Game Informer cover art for Borderlands 2?

First!

Someone said that a long time ago, right?  That it was some kind of hallmark of the OT that was (rightfully?) upheld in the PT, or some rubbish.

You didn't have anyone to "watch it with"?  To me, the experience of the show was very social.  Perhaps you could compare it to last year's super bowl?  You know no one else is watching what you're watching or really cares about it anymore despite the fact that everyone* did a year back.

bkev said:

Yeah seriously Skyline was pathetic and I gave myself a pass on my personal "never text in movies" rule for that one. However, Donald Faison was good in it.

Really?  I'm a Faison fan, and I thought he was uncharacteristically unlikeable in this "movie". 

doubleofive said:

And we're back on topic. ;-)

And.... we're back off topic.  ;)

2/4 & Bingo-

You're both right and I'm not sure why you're arguing.

The PT & OT as they currently are depict the fact that Anakin and Vader are the same as a little known secret.  Of the living, it appears that only Vader, Palpatine, Obi-Wan and Yoda know the truth at the beginning of A New Hope, and potentially Bail.  So, having it be even more of a secret (?) to the rest of the Star Wars galaxy doesn't change/fix anything.  Making it ambiguous to the audience would be cool, but that's a discussion for another thread *cough*http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/forum.cfm/Script-Writing-and-Re-writing/forum/21/*cough*

But Anakin can still be a very famous war hero from the Clone Wars and not wreck the secret.  And, in my mind, he was well known to people who knew what was going on in the Wars.

zombie84 said:

Also, thanks Bingo for pointing out the -1 thread. I hadn't known about that, and also hadn't noticed I have a few PMs from him.

 It was an honour just being nominated.