topdawg193

doubleofive said:

Lunch with Lando - Ady has stated that he's keeping the elevator window open in all following shots.  Still have no idea how he plans to accomplish this.

Ah, that's good to hear; definitely the way to go I think, but man, I'd imagine it'd take some work!

Darth Hade said:

Excellent spot, topdawg193.

Definitely something that should be fixed. I hope Ady sees your post.

Cheers - I'm hoping, like doubleofive said, that because it'd be an easy enough shot to fix (for someone like Ady I assume, lol, having no experience in this stuff myself) then it wouldn't be too big an ask for the edit.

Was watching ESB today, and something jumped out at me (which I don't think has been mentioned before). It concerns the scene where Luke is hand-standing and levitating nearby objects, and eventually levitates R2.

What struck me as clumsy was that, in the shot where we get a close-up of R2 being lifted off the ground, once he ascends he then just suddenly stops in mid-air unconvincingly, as if he was on a lift/elevator that reached its topmost level. What I was thinking could help with the believability of this shot, was if R2 could 'dip' a little bit in the air after he is lifted up, to make it look as if he's actually floating and is not just on some platform or supported by something else.

Pedantic, I know. It's funny some of the things that catch your attention in films, though.

Also, I was wondering, what is the game-plan for the Cloud City extended window shots (when Han and co. first arrive, and then when going to lunch with Lando)? Are they being kept, or is the old set being reverted to? I really liked the open-ness those SE additions brought to Cloud City, but I also saw that they caused a lot of continuity errors (one shot featuring the new open windows, the next shot having the old windows, and such).

I think it'd be good if the SE windows could be kept, with the continuity errors somehow fixed around them, rather than going back to the closed-up windows (though I'd encourage removing or de-voluming the new 'lift-noise' in the sound mix that one of these new shots brings; intrudes a little bit too much on the dialogue, I think). Apologies, I know this particular topic has been discussed at length before, but I'm not sure what the final outcome was.

Darth Editous said:

I think I did.

I think so as well - the effect is subtle, and maintains the original art of the matte, yet at the same time makes it much more believable and very panoramic (reminds me of the zoom-in-through-the-clouds shot of Cloud City ala the last ESB:R trailer, making me think that this Vane matte effect, if included, would really be in keeping with the spruced up look/cinematography this film is getting via Revisited).

Octorox said:

I still think the best solution is the Phantom Editor's "Kamino system" dub over the Zam death scene.

Jaitea said:

As suggested by Vaderios, heres a comparison video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxy8ftlwpiA J

Those are really great changes - I particularly dig the removal of the droid in Han's first close-up. It just seems more effective, not only in terms of continuity but also in emotion, to not have that droid come bumbling through the scene where Han is stealing himself to say goodbye to Luke. And the scale-correction looks seamless!

The latest clip looks great - astounded by the colour correction which will, alone, make this a very desirable edit.

Am also pleased to see the improvements made to the apparition of Obi Wan, making him appear more 'Force-Ghost-ish', which was something I always wanted to see done.

I was wondering though, can the glowing blue line around Obi Wan here be made to 'shimmer' even more? Or else have the figure of Obi Wan shimmer to some extent? I'm sure that on Dagobah Obi Wan's Force Ghost is more 'sparkly', with the hazy blue line around his figure more pronounced, and so thought that adding such elements to his manifestation on Hoth might bring about some nice visual consistency.

Regardless, 'twas a belter of a preview!

Darth Venal said:

And seriously, some of your ideas are ridiculous: revamp Luke's garage to make it like Attack of the Clones? Why would you want to do that? This place is supposed to be run down, grimey. It's a garage. And it was all a real set. Half of the AOTC garage is CGI - all the backgrounds beyond the main room where Anakin and Padme talk are fake, including the room Anakin throws something into. And replacing a static background to improve the set is one thing, but changing a set when the camera is moving is entirely different and virtually impossible to pull off with footage that wasn't shot for such purposes.

^ Ah yes - I was really only meaning Bingowing's suggestion of matching up the light display there.

Having re-watched ANH:R lately, I found myself compiling my own definitive list of further revisions. What with Ady's version already being so encompassing with regards to its fixing of technical errors and its modernising of special effects, some of my suggestions may seem VERY nitpicky/obsessive, but I'll vent them regardless!


~ ~ ~


Firstly, I agree with the general suggestions previously voiced by other members in respect to the actual editing of ANH:R:

- During Obi Wan and Vader's duel aboard the death star, make Obi Wan activate his lightsabre second. Have Vader's sabre already lit, as in the original version, and have Obi Wan light his only after the first shot of Vader standing with his ignited sabre.

- Restore the shot of Tarkin just before the Death Star explodes. This could potentially be inserted just after the shot of the laser shooting down the internal channel with the two Imperial officers to screen left, and just before the outside shot of the laser charging in the outer dish/indent. This way, the Death-Star-Exploding-While-Charging sequence could be retained.

- Restore 3PO's reaction shot to R2 being blasted during the trench run.

- Restore the spinning star field when the Falcon makes the jump to light-speed after the Imperial pursuit at Tatooine.

- Restore the Special Edition canyon matte, which opens the 'R2-and-the-Jawas' sequence.


~ ~ ~


The following suggestions are perhaps more superficial, relating to the visual effects of the movie:

- In the film's opening, improve the blast flashes as the Star Destroyer shoots at the Tantive IV. By this, I mean the avoidance of the blinding white flashes that fill the whole screen (as this effect does not happen anywhere else in the saga, when we have an external view of ships firing on each other), and also 'round-out'/tart up the yellowish/golden flashes that appear on the ships' bodies when a laser bolt makes contact.

- Similarily, apply the previous suggestion to the Falcon chase at Tatooine, when the Star Destroyer fires on the vessel before it makes the jump to lightspeed.

- What with the computer displays being improved on the Falcon, the Death Star, and the Rebel Briefing Room, it always felt inconsistent and out-of-place that the computer displays were not also updated in the X-Wing cockpits and also in the Rebel War Room. I would suggest overhauling the X-Wing targeting computer, perhaps to bear some resemblance to the Revisited Death Star Schematics we saw in the briefing room, as well as adding text and holographic images to the large glass screens scattered throughout the Rebel War Room which the Rebel technicians even seem to be 'writing' or 'tracing' on with laser pens, yet which leave no marks. Additionally, colouring the 'black-and-white' screens in the Rebel Command Centre as well as aboard the X-Wings, and generally tarting all these areas up a bit, would make the HUDs sit better with the rest of the updated displays featured. To a lesser extent, I'd also update the consoles in the Imperial Control Room on the Death Star where 3PO and R2 hide out - the multi-coloured round lights at the top of the panel always felt a bit cheesy; perhaps even deleting them and just colouring in the white lights on the rest of the panel (such as the ones between Han and Obi Wan, in the image posted by Bingowings in Post 380 of this thread; some posts above this one, the first of his 'recolouring the red stripe' mock ups) would be nicer on the eyes? And again, wouldn't mind seeing some updated computer displays.

I understand that the rationale behind not updating the Rebel displays was to enforce the technological inferiority of the Rebel Alliance compared to the Empire. However, in a Galaxy where holographic displays are run-of-the-mill (even the Falcon has at least one - the chess table - and small droids such as R2 carry an array of high technological devices), it always pulled me out of the edit to see 70s computer displays and designs remain in things as important as Rebel war crafts and war rooms, with lesser locations and objects sporting better technology. Furthermore, the Rebel Alliance is a significant group, with high connections (the government of Alderaan, for one) and a growing support base - they are 'more well equipped than you realise'; there is no suggestion in the films that the Rebels' equipment is ALL that inferior to the Empire's.

- When R2 and 3PO split up, after landing on Tatooine, during 3PO's solo escapade (where he runs into the Jawa Sandcrawler) there is an odd, green discolouration which flashes on the screen, towards bottom-screen-left; can this be fixed or improved on at all?

- ANH is the only segment of the 6 part saga which features a 'fade-to-black' and a 'dissolve', instead of continuous 'wipes'. These happen when 3PO and R2 are first acquired by the Skywalkers (just before 3PO's oil bath) and just before the Millenium Falcon reveal. Is it at all possible to replace these fades/dissolves with wipes? I was thinking that, as 3PO and R2 walk on for a good few seconds before the fade-to-black happens, a screen wipe to the next scene could somehow be edited in. But is this technically possible? And if it were so, I'd suggest a downward fade from the top of the screen to the bottom, as a centred close-up of 3PO descending on a platform opens the next scene. Also, with the Falcon reveal, I'd suggest a side-ways fade from the left of the screen to the right, as the initial focus in the next scene is the gang walking down the stairs behind Chewie, with the camera panning rightwards to finally reveal the Facon. So a sideways-to-the-right wipe might flow well in that transition.

- Agree fully with Darth Venal's brilliant efforts on restoring Ben's original hut scene and using that in place of the Special Edition painting of Kenobi's home. On that front, I was wondering if a chimney (as seen on the Special Edition hut) might bring some more interest to that shot? I was really liked that feature :). If it were to be incorporated, maybe have the smoke blowing to the right of the screen, for balance?

- I'm sure this has been voiced before - while I enjoy the improved Dewbacks, the extended 'Imperials-Find-the-Escape-Pod' scene really stands out like a sore-thumb, due to the obviousness of the CGI used there. Would it be feasible to go back to the original edit of that shot, but keep the improved CG Dewbacks which are off in the distance? Due to the far off-ness of the Dewbacks, and hence the lack of detail on them, they are much more believable than either the CG Dewbacks which feature in the extended shot, or the non-CG Dewbacks which were present in the OOT.

- Ady did a great job of fixing the jump cut at Ben's hut, when Luke ignites his sabre. I've always wondered though, if it could be made even less noticeable by adding the golden-light-blast at the hilt of the sabre which accompanies its activation, as seen sometimes in the prequels (the sabre has been out of use for a while, after all, which could justify this light-flash as it's turned on)? This could distract the eye, and may even completely cover the jerkiness here (particularly on Ben's part).

- In the second new shot of the Mos Eisley reveal (with the worker droid lifting objects; before Revisited, the Special Edition had a flying droid mocking this worker droid), something always bothered me about the gang whizzing in on the speeder - like the extended Dewback scene, it just seemed too overtly fake looking somehow. But the scenery was fine - the main problem I had, was with 3PO. His colouring seems off - he seems to be a thick yellow, and not a shiny metallic gold. Could he be recoloured here to be more in keeping with his 'goldiness' which is clearly featured in the Mos Eisley shots immediately before and after this scene?

- My favourite part of the edit was the Cantina, and how the locals really seemed to come alive. I would suggest going even further here though - particularly with regards to the 'band' aliens, which I felt could also use some eye-blinks and other slight facial movements to really 'sell' them as living creatures, and get away from the plastic look I feel they currently have.

- Aboard the Falcon, during Luke's sabre training, again a great job was done on Luke's sabre rotoscoping. But can it be improved upon, particularly in the shot after Han says 'Well, you can forget your trouble...' and also in the shot where Luke successfully deflects the laser bolts with the blast shield down? The sabre appears extremely 'jaggy' in these shots.

- Update some of the outdated set designs, ala Vaderios' mockups (for example, matching Luke's garage to the Episode II version, the 'Leia-Sections' in the Tantive IV, the Imperial control room on the Death Star where 3PO and R2 hide out - making the red stripe on the consoles black - the Rebel Hangar, the interior of the Sand Crawler (maybe?), the Death Star (which has a tendency to become a bit too monochrome in places; Vaderios did a mock up of Tarkin's control room (see page 1 of this thread), where he destroys Alderaan, which was along the same lines as the recently posted Tantive IV mockup - I also thought that some of the 'chasms' (e.g. where Luke, Han and Chewie get in the lift/elevator to take them to the prison cells, where Obi Wan deactivates the Tractor Beam, and where Luke and Leia outrun the Imperials) could have their vertical white lights recoloured to add some more flavour (yellow for one and red for another, perhaps?); Obi Wan's Tractor Beam chasm has green coloured lights on its walls, but all the others have white. And yet as the three chasms are in different sections of the Death Star (presumably), as well as being aesthetically pleasing, the recoloured lights could also serve the purpose of being 'area codes' of sorts).

- The Yavin approach felt a bit protracted. Could this not be edited in such a way that it flows better, and passes faster? A thought I had was, after the shot of the Falcon emerging from hyperspace, cut straight to the shot of the Falcon passing UNDER the red planet, and lose the shot of the ship flying TOWARDS the red planet.

- Second favourite part of the edit was the revamped Battle of Yavin. Only minor niggles remain (due to my lack of screenshots, I've resorted to using the time in the movie which correlates with the suggestion I'm making):

1.) I preferred the non-CG shot of the Tie Approach (found it more visually consistent with the rest of ANH, and the original trilogy in general).

2.) Consider the shot at 1:42:57  Should a red engine core, or the haze/glow of the engine core, not be present in these shots?

3.) At 1:41:31 into the film, can the wobbly motion of the X-Wing fighters (particularly the one to screen right) be smoothed out here? There is an earlier shot (at 1:40:50) which is very similar and a lot smoother; could the elements of this smoother shot not be recycled somehow?

4.) At 1:48:47, the X-Wing fighter which speeds straight towards the screen's motion is also erratic/wobbly; can this be ironed out?

5.) At 1:52:54, can the engine glow of the X-Wing fighter be improved here? It looks inconsistent to the rear close-up shots of X-Wings which we saw prior to this one.

6.) At 1:53:57, the motion of Vader's Fighter as it approached the screen is again shaky.

7.) A continuity error was mentioned, which was along the lines of every new CG X-Wing having the Red 5 markings (?) - would be good to see another continuity error safely seen off.

- I also (controversially, I think!) really liked the Special Edition explosion of the Death Star - felt much bigger than previously. And I just didn't think the Revisited explosion felt 'big' enough, so I wouldn't mind a reversion to the Special Edition here (or if an even more updated explosion were used). And (controversially again!) I even didn't have a problem with the Special Edition Alderaan explosion - felt in keeping with the other effects of the saga, which I don't feel the Revisited Alderaan explosion does. So again, I wouldn't mind using the Special Edition effect here.


~ ~ ~


*WHEW* - apologies; that was a bit of a thesis! But that'd be my p-e-r-f-e-c-t version of ANH :D I know, I know - I 'want the impossible'. But had to get it out there!

Is there a suggestions-list being kept on a potential revamp of ANH:R? Like the one on Ady's first page of his ESB:R thread? Might be an idea to help out future editors.

- topdawg193

^ Very nice! I think I prefer that to the red now as well! Looks more 'Star Wars-ish', somehow - maybe because it looks more in-keeping with TESB?

And I also agree with the point on the cloned Storm Troopers at Mos Eisley.

The Golden Idol said:

For the ending, is it possible to keep the aliens as skeletons? The CG alien looked incredibly bad.

Yeah, I've always thought that cutting out all sightings of the CG alien, and instead just having the skeletons encircle Spalko, would be the best scenario. As well as losing poorly executed CGI, I think it would also improve the film's pacing/build-up. With the CG alien removed, it means that the UFO at the finale is the big pay-off, and the one excusable CGI spectacle at the film's end (rather than the otherwise two); also, the UFO wasn't anywhere near as poor looking as the alien was, and I didn't really mind it at all.

Plus, actually showing the alien seemed like overkill; the alien is hinted at in the warehouse at the start of the film, then is practically revealed in the tent (though is still obscured with a blanket, and then shadows, resulting in a more satisfactory and real-looking alien, and also adds some slight mystique). But revealing a fully-fledged and highly-detailed CG alien in close-up at the end was gilding the lilly, I thought, and felt unnecessary.

I'd imagine editing out the  CG alien entirely could be tricky, though.

^ Very nice, man! Well executed! With a more realistic newspaper, as you say, along with the right headline, this could be a brilliant way of tying up the Indy-under-investigation subplot!

Can't decide between your versions. Maybe the third one is a bit too slow? Then again, I suppose you do need time to take in the newspaper. But as it's only a headline/maybe a picture you'd be seeing, would you really need a lot of time?

jones1899 said:

Why do you think it would be jarring? We see him grab the bible, then we zoom on the newspaper, then we see the bible at the wedding. Am I missing something here?

Ah, okay, I get it now. I was thinking that we would only see the Dean enter the office, and walk across the office, but not actually take out the bible from the desk. It's been a long while since I've seen this fim now, and I've forgotten how that scene played out! I was thinking that, by having the newspaper, we would miss out on the bible entirely, making the Dean rushing across the office redundant (but this obviously isn't the case, then).

If the bible transition was lost, would it not seem jarring? Why was the Dean going into his office in such a rush in the first place? And if, in the next immediate scene, he is shown to be sitting in a Church, it may seem out of the blue, and slightly sudden, with no link.

Instead, is there no way to 'freeze-frame' the camera when it is over the desk and then add an artificial zoom, so that after the newspaper is shown the sequence can then be 'unfrozen' and we can see the subsequent bible transition. Or is that not technically feasible? Would freezing the scene over the desk look too unnatural, with no other movement going on? But I was thinking that, as it is an office filled with inanimate furniture, pausing over the desk may not seem too unnatural.

^ Yeah, just wanna say thanks to all those who made it possible to grab the PAL DVD9. Finally, ANH:R on a big ass TV screen is within my reach!

Have burned the disc, but am yet to pop it in the DVD player; the ISO worked perfectly fine on the comp (checked the special features, navigated around the menus, jumped to chapters in the film; no probs), so hopefully it'll do the trick.

Thanks again, seeders!

shanerjedi said:

I have to respectfully disagree. They chopped the score up with the new cuts for one. Secondly, when Vader says "bring my shuttle", we know where he's headed and it aint on vacation.

And Vader disembarking from the shuttle.......did Lucas really think we wouldn't spot Jerjerrod at the bottom of the ramp?

And the shuttle landing scene takes way too much time and completely disrupts the flow of the Falcon-Tie chase...and the music behind it.

Sometimes less really is more.

 

^ Oh, no, I agree - I'm completely against the landing scene of Vader's shuttle in the Death Star II's hangar bay! That scene does clutter the Falcon chase and destroy the pace here. I was just talking about the landing-platform on Bespin shot and the shot of Vader's shuttle flying to the Executor (but not landing inside of it!); the shot of Vader's shuttle flying to the Executor happens before the Falcon chase, and before Luke is even picked up by the Falcon, and so it doesn't really infringe on the flow at this point in the movie (or the music progression).

Was just looking over all the lovely Cloud City pics that Ady posted again, and I remembered a couple of issues that I know have been discussed, but it was so long ago that I can't remember exactly what's happening with them.

I think I'm right in saying that Ady is restoring the 'Bring my shuttle' line of Vader's (thankfully!), but is the SE shot of Vader and co walking out across the landing platform being scrapped? Having studied both takes, with and without the landing platform, I think that the cut away from Vader just leaving the building is harsher than the cut away from Vader walking out across the platform. I feel that, because the following scene is an outside shot (Luke under Cloud City), the landing platform scene creates a better flow within the movie (being an outside shot as well) than the other, platorm-less cut. Also, because it's so minimal (lasting a mere second or two), I didn't think that it was a gratuitous addition, but rather one which subtly and creatively expanded Cloud City further.

Of course, the scene wouldn't work if Vader's original line is being restored, but it would be feasible (I'd imagine, anyway!) to paint out the shuttle already there and have the platform empty, awaiting Vader's ship. This way, the scene could feature in ESB:R.

Also, is the scene of Vader's shuttle flying towards the Executor from Bespin being excised? I think I remember talk that this scene isn't going to make ESB:R, but I'm not overly sure.

Again, having recently studied both takes, with and without this SE addition, I feel that this addition is minimal and subtle enough that it doesn't detract from the flow established in the film at this point. The 'Falcon-Tie Fighters' chase hasn't started yet, so it doesn't clutter that sequence, and I feel that it makes the transition from 'Vader-on-Bespin' to 'Vader-on-Executor' more palatable, whereas before (due to the time apart from seeing Vader) it was slightly sudden when he appeared on the bridge of the Executor.

Any knowledge of Ady's plan of action for these sequences?

Chrille said:

According to wookipedia, the guys in that scene were art directors, conceptual artists, etc and not actors. No wonder the performance is poor!

Lol! Well, that explains a lot - even the way that they hold themselves seems awkward and unnatural; the middle-man looks especially out-of-sorts, with his arms and hands held rigidly by his sides, and with the way he fumblingly turns away from the camera when the other two Rebel officers have left the scene.

EyeShotFirst said:

I've seen acting in video games that dominated that scene. I am really referring to topdawg's avatar when i am saying that. Dark Forces 2 was epic.

Ha, yeah, the live-action cutscenes in that game were pretty nicely handled, and I would also say that the acting on show there is better than that displayed in the Rebel-Transport-Bay scene. Unfortunately!

ImperialFighter said:

While I can see that a direct 'wipe' from the shot showing Ozzel glowering at Captain Needa, straight to the one of Han atop the Falcon, fixing it, could work out okay....

I too think, having gone back and rewatched that sequence of the film, that wiping straight into Han and Chewie working on the Falcon from the Needa/Ozzel scene would be sufficient, and work well. Having watched this part of the film in that order (skipping over the Rebel-officers scene on the media player), I also feel that it has a better flow to it as well.

ImperialFighter said:

We get to see a lot more of the Base, including seeing some of the actual large 'Transports', in this establishing shot.

We'd miss out on the exposition about the intentions for the 'snowspeeders' which Leia doesn't cover later on, since we hear "Groups 7 and 10 will stay behind to fly the speeders...."

And most of all we'd miss out on Adywan's intentions to totally re-do this shot in his own inimitable way, which has GOT to be worth seeing!

And I also agree that, with improved visuals and offering a more expansive view of the Rebel Base, this scene does (or could) have its merits. However, I feel that, in balance, these merits are insignificant, next to the power of the piss-poor acting on show in this segment :P. Will visuals truly distract and make up for the needless, poorly produced exposition and weak acting contained in this scene?

Also, while the exposition may indeed add more to the events than I had previously thought, I still don't see the exposition as required, or even all that interesting (and definitely not well delivered!), to such an extent that it should stay. When watching the speeders in action, it is not necessary that we know about their tactics or game-plan.

Docta Nick said:

The scene with the officers never relly bothered me, besides the fact that you hear a ship go by but see nothing, and the matte looks kinda fake, and it doesn't add anything to the story, kinda like the scene in ANH with 3PO and R2 in the doorway and the soldiers walk up to the door, knock on it, and then move on (some1 please explain that scene, lol) but ya...

I myself always thought that the 3PO and R2 scene in question served to enhance the tension, and drive home the point that the Imperials are about and out to get our heroes (they're in the cantina, searching door-to-door for the droids, and then finally they close in on them when they excitingly blast off in the Falcon). So, that scene serves as a link, in the chain of events with the purpose to build up tension and then resolve in the daring Falon escape. But the Rebel-officers scene, as well as not adding anything to the movie in terms of plot, also adds nothing in the way of theme or mood. To me, it is the wart on the otherwise clear face of TESB ;)

Food for thought.

^ That scene always stuck out like a sore thumb to me - not necessarily because of the matte, but because of the highly dubious acting. Do they not just explain what Leia explains to the Rebel pilots a few moments later in the film? I, personally, wouldn't mind seeing that scene axed completely - it just seems to stick out from the rest of the movie at this point, by not adding anything to the plot, and showcasing some pretty poor performances.

adywan said:

oh yeh. i've also added the "jedi ghost" glow to the scene where Obi-Wan appears to Luke on Hoth.

Ah, great!

I was wondering, what 'style' of Force Ghost is appearing in the 'Revisited' saga? In ROTJ, the force ghosts that appear there (Obi-Wan on Dagobah, Yoda, Obi-Wan and Anakin on Endor) are all quite consistent; overall blue glow/hue, a shimmering frame, and transparrent.

But in ESB, the Force Ghost design seemed inconsistent - on Hoth, Obi-Wan looked practically like his living self, but slightly transparrent, while on Endor he had a thick blue glowing line around his frame (similar to the blue atmosphere line around the planets).

I personally always thought that the ROTJ Force Ghost appearance was the definitive one - it was certainly the most consistent, and the most ghost-like to my eyes, as well.

I have to say, I was sceptical about including a cut-away shot to a view-screen or even having a hologram pop up in that scene, as I was thinking that it may be too distracting. But davnes' video mock-up has really changed my mind on this - it is tastefully done (really liked the cloud-city and the mining-platform holographic images popping up when they were mentioned in the conversation), already looks good (and could potentially look better with certain refinements; perhaps adjusting its position, etc), and is surprisingly subtle (it looks as if that holoram has always been there, what with Han and Leia reading the text, and it popping on and off perfectly in time with Han's switch-flipping; when I compared it to the original scene, I actually missed it!).

And I definitely don't see it as a distraction - if needs be, the hologram could be made slightly smaller, or else slightly fainter, to be better placed in the scene.

But great stuff! Here's hoping that something like this makes it into ESB:R.

While on the topic of Lando, a common complaint of ROTJ is that Lando's betrayal of Han in the previous movie is never really dealt with, or talked about. It's just glossed over, and they are all-of-a-sudden good friends again.

Of course, the most likely reason for this is that this is because Lando played a big part in rescuing Han from Jabba's Palace (by infiltrating the Palace, and previously tracking down the bounty hunter who escaped from Bespin with Han), and so Han is grateful for this. But in the film, we never really see Han acknowledge Lando's role in his rescue; this is just assumed (interestingly, in the cut 'landing-area-sand-storm-scene' after the Sail Barge resuce, Han does thank Lando, awkwardly and almost bitterly, and we can see somewhat of a reconciliation between the two characters).

I was thinking, though, that it may be possible to strengthen Han and Lando's character relations, and explain clearer why they are suddenly on good terms after such a monumental betrayal, by rearranging some dialogue in two key scenes.

Immediately after the Sail Barge rescue, there is a space shot of the Falcon and Luke's X-Wing leaving Tatooine. Here, Han thanks Luke for his role in the rescue operation:

HAN     (over comlink)
Hey, Luke, thanks. Thanks for comin' after me. Now I owe you one.

What I'm thinking is, would it not be possible to trim this to just 'Hey, Luke, thanks. Now I owe you one'? Maybe by inserting a pause in between the two sentences (and this could even make Han's appreciation pack a greater emotional punch), and, if necessary, by employing certain audio edits if the inflection of the statements needs amended?

By doing this, we can then take the cut statement ('Thanks for comin' after me') and insert it into the 'Han-and-Lando-in-the-Rebel-Hangar' scene from slightly later on in the film. In this way, Han would appear to be thanking Lando, specifically, and we could understand that he has forgiven him for his previous misdeed due to the act of bravery and loyalty he showed in 'comin' after' him. Because of the pauses, and sheepish nature of that scene (with Han worried about giving the Falcon to Lando), it might not be overly problematic to effectively insert this audio line in somewhere. For example, right at the end of their conversation, before they part ways:

LANDO
Look, would you get going, you pirate.

Han and Lando pause, then exchange salutes.

This could become:


LANDO
Look, would you get going, you pirate.

Han and Lando pause.

HAN
[Hey]...Thanks...for comin' after me.

Then they exchange salutes.

Notice here that I'm changing the inflection slightly with some minor pauses, and maybe even lifting an appropriate 'hey' from Han (he says this word numerous times throughout the trilogy, including in ROTJ, so it hopefully shouldn't be too hard to find the right one) to initiate the thanks. This way, we get a a better resolution on the betrayal-redemption-gratitude-forgiveness arc of these characters' story.

The only issue I can see is, Han's dialogue is heard over a com-link in Luke's X-Wing, and so sounds a little quiet and slightly garbled. But sufficient audio editing could solve this problem, I'd imagine.

^ Interesting edit - and watching that video reminded me of a suggestion I raised many moons ago, but am not too sure what (if anything) is being done about it: is Ady planning on adjusting the motion of the nose of the X-Wing as it comes down to rest on the ground in this sequence? To make it looks less plastic-y and model-y, and more like a heavy spacecraft? Maybe if the nose-tip buckled, slightly, when it first touches down, for example?

Nice DVD cover Sluggo! The film poster lends itself nicely to that classic Indy DVD look!

Yeah jones1899, the other two files were in the RAR archive that I downloaded as well. Hmm, hope you get them in the end, and I'll be looking forward to that .avi!

Very illuminating hearing those sound extracts again - they really are much better delivered than the lines that made the final cut. It would be fantastic if they featured in an Indy 4 fan edit.

Not long back there was talk of designing DVD menus. I was always hoping that when the KOTCS DVD first came out, it would feature a consistent design with the original Indy box set which was first released, instead of going for a whole new menu and cover look. I was able to find on Google Images and Youtube exactly what I'm meaning - I can't take credit for either, as much as I'd like to!:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fG56_1cKO00 = Indy 4 DVD Menu in same vein as original DVD release.

I'm thinking that if someone was up to producing something of this kind (and indeed, it seems some people already have!), it'd really help tie this film to the others in terms of its physical appearance, and make it look a whole lot nicer when sitting beside the original trilogy (which is also what the main goal of the fan edits is as well; making the film more consistent in quality with the originals!). Of course, hopefully with a better film title in place! Personally, I'm still holding out for City of Gods!

Oh, and I've thought before - would it be at all possible to cut the CG alien out entirely at the film's conclusion? Including the skeletons merging? So that we only see the skeletons bearing down on Spalko? That way, bad CGI would be removed, and the UFO at the end would be the main pay off, and not seem like overkill (CG set-piece on top of a CG-set piece)? The film may build more effectively towards its finale in this way. Besides, we've already seen a better-looking alien in Spalko's tent, so it could be best to have the UFO as the next big reveal. Or would this not work out?

Nice pic Laser (although I still prefer the 'City of Gods' title myself - 'city' is a lot less cumbersome than 'kingdom', in my opinion).

I always wanted to see the title-cards unified for all the Indy films - the Raiders and Last Crusade title-cards did look similar, but of course the TOD one broke that style. So I'm either way on changing the title-card text - at present, it harks back to Last Crusade, which harked back to Raiders, so there is unity there. But also, if the style was changed to the TOD text, it may probably balance the title-cards out more, and make TOD's title-card seem less random (when compared to the others in the series at least; I for one did like that typical Indy font). Also, a very nice idea on having the car appear infront of the text, ala Willy in TOD - just how feasable it would be, of course, is a different matter.

And looking forward to your cut of this film jones1899! Resurrecting some old Indy themes for certain sequences of the film could be very effective in tying KOTCS to the OT.