I do like the idea of the 451236 order, as a sort of... well, it's the best we can do.
As for plans like Bingo's & Ady's... I'll believe it when I see it. So please, I'd love to see it!
Well, this thread has gone to crap. sigh
And there was rejoicing.
Bingowings said:
It didn't sound like any British accent I'm familiar with but it did sound posh.
Here in America, anything you'd call posh, we call British. Heck, we don't even use the word "posh".
Alexrd said:
If they hadn't shown Owen and Beru, the audience wouldn't understand how are the Lars and Anakin related.
As folks have pointed out, the explanation found in pre-PT-EU (oh wow) was that the Lars were relatives of Obi's, and Luke just called them Uncle and Aunt either because he believed they were or because that's what people call each other sometimes. It worked. I can easily imagine Obi-Wan saying "I have a brother on Tatooine who might be willing to take him in.", though I think an earlier mention of this would be good.
That being said, the current setup has never bothered me. Anakin has dreams about his mom. He tracks down his mom. His mom is married. He has a step-brother. None of that is implausible. It's really just the part where they decide to put Luke on Tatooine at all that irks, but... well, if there's a bright center to the galaxy, it's farthest from it.
Those of you think you can preserve the surprise and the I->VI viewing order, how do you respond to Puggo's statement? I'll quote it again:
Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:
Furthermore, it would be impossible to hide the reveal... when Ben talks about Anakin being a good friend that he was tutoring, who ELSE could he be talking about? He also says that Vader helped the empire destroy the Jedi. In ep.3 we watch Anakin do all those things, and then become Vader. You'd have to ditch pretty much all of ep.3. Hmm, not a bad idea, now that I think of it.
As much as it's risky opening this up to a prequel-rewrite topic (oh god it never ends)... How do you think it's possible?
Alternatively, if someone knows where in the monstrous, unnavigable Prequel Redux thread this has been sufficiently covered, I'd be grateful for links.
Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:
Furthermore, it would be impossible to hide the reveal... when Ben talks about Anakin being a good friend that he was tutoring, who ELSE could he be talking about? He also says that Vader helped the empire destroy the Jedi. In ep.3 we watch Anakin do all those things, and then become Vader. You'd have to ditch pretty much all of ep.3. Hmm, not a bad idea, now that I think of it.
You have indeed stated my concerns with Ady's Revisited plans. Leaving out the "Rise...NOOOOOooooooo" scene is easy enough, but it's all that other Vader-stuff that Ani does that really... well, I don't see how it's doable.
First word: fuck
"No. I am your father."
I've seen people say on here that, when editing ROTS, they want to preserve the Vader-is-Anakin reveal. Why?
I ask, because I don't remember ever not knowing this fact (disclosure: born in 1987). I don't remember ever being surprised by Vader's statement. I understand that, for 1980 audiences, this was a huge revelation, and it may have been the most memorable thing about the film, but does a surprise here really make ESB a better film?
So I guess part of the trees in the SE version are fake replacements?
Do you mean the forest, or the sky? If you mean the forest...it's the same forest. If you mean the sky... In the original, the clouds in the sky of Yavin IV are somehow behind Yavin. It's one of the 2004 changes that really, really made a lot of sense.
Music replacement might help make the approach to Otoh Gunga better. Mario Underwater music or something?
For me, I haven't had problems with audio echo... but I have had distraction issues with the audio jumps, particularly where you've looped or repeated a few seconds. It really takes you out of the film, if that makes sense.
The soundtrack, I assume he means.
Jay said:
The point of the avatars is to make it easier to see who started the topic
True, that's their current official purpose.
Avatars also serve as a visual reminder as to which threads are which, which is (for me, at least) quicker than reading the title. I get different threads confused when people switch avatars.
I think this is a great idea.
Yeah, but for some reason it's never mentioned in the films. So weird!
Anyway, back on subject...
And furthermore, woudln't you be able to have anti-lightsabre shielding pretty easily, then? Let's just give up on the physics of Star Wars right now, okay?
(Although you have to admit that blasters can't be lasers, given their projectile nature. But I digress)
How many people here are familiar with the term "circlejerk"?
I would love to see you try that. Partly because I don't think you'll be convinced that it won't work until you see it for yourself and partly because I'd love for you to be right, for it to be easy & cheap.
I think there's a reason the folks at openmoco.org talk about servos and stepper motors. It's just not simple.
ibleedspeed said:
hmm sounds like a cheap shot at somebody.... who could that be? i wonder..
Sorry man, I hope you're not too offended.
As for Motion Control and model work, it's more complex than it sounds at first.
building camera tracks to film model ships you could do that with some construx dude
It's not just having tracks. As I understand it, in order to composite multiple model shots together, you film each model separately (or maybe a group of them....maybe) and then stick the shots together. The camera has to either move in exactly the same way for each different model if the ships (assuming these are ships) are moving together or in very precisely different ways in order to achieve the illusion of motion. Having tracks is a good start, but then the motion along those tracks has to be the exact same constant speed each time, or the speed has to very in exactly the same way for each pass. You need precise, repeatable control.
Furthermore, it's not just a matter of a track - Optimally you want several axes of control so you can roll, tilt, etc your camera in any direction. Otherwise your ships are going to be very limited in how they move. And of course each of those axes needs to be precisely controlled.
we are talking about 1970's style film making here
We're talking about groundbreaking 70s special effects with a budget. Their camera had 7 axes of control, which is a lot more than 1 track.
duct tape a tripod to a beagle and teach him to walk in circles. instant 360 degree pan shots. and for tai fighter scenes teach him to roll over...
I don't even....
I couldn't find a better photo than that, unfortunately, but the model is completely still, on a rod, and the camera does all the motion. There's a track, and on the track is a platform, and on the platform looks to be a second, shorter track, and on that is a turntable, and on that is the counterweighted-arm system, and at the end of that are more axes of movement.
If this project doesn't get more attention, it's cancelled!
I'm kidding, I'm kidding!
Found this today - http://openmoco.org/ - Looks like just the sort of thing I wanted.
greenpenguino said:
But I can't stand the audience at the beginning. WHAT THE FUCK ARE THEY LAUGHING AT?? HE HASN'T DONE ANYTHING.
In their defense, the moment the show starts on tv/youtube is not the first moment the audience sees/interacts with Craig. I think there's usually comedian before him, to warm the audience up, so they're already in a silly mood, and then Craig comes out. He's already been talking to them, being funny, for a little bit before they turn on the cameras. Does that help make it make sense?
Admittedly, the shiny new Y-Wings with the original outer coverings is done correctly in The Clone Wars : http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/BTL-B_Y-wing_starfighter
TIL that we can address our thanks to Ady without even seeing his presence.
Ray, I definitely saw those criticisms coming, and I agree with them, to a certain extent. I think there's something to be said for the level of detail and complexity that CG allows, but perhaps sometimes it goes too far. It may just be a problem with what we're used to - We're so used to only certain kinds of shots being possible that anything too far beyond that seems terrible, in which case the children of the future (what a phrase!) will have no problem with it. I, however, suspect this is not the case.
I don't know if you're UK or USA or what, but here in Amurica, they introduced a camera rig to football (you know what kind I mean) that swings over the field on ropes, swooping, capturing some really great views of plays. At first, it was slightly disconcerting, because I had never seen such a thing before, but I quickly got used to it and now love when they use it, even though it does come close to mimicking the camera moves in video games. I suspect that there are two reasons
Perhaps the problem with the ROTS sequence isn't that the CG isn't realistic enough or that we're un-used to it, but that the camera isn't (which yes, is part of the CG process, but bear with me). I'm reminded of some part of a behind-the-scenes thing for Wall-E that I saw, where the good folks at Pixar talked about all the work they put into the camera system for that film, simulating different lenses, cameras, shutters, etc. If they didn't (I don't remember), I'd also lump in camera-movement into that. Even in films where the camera is apparently traveling through the vacuum of space, there should be some realism to its movements, some limits on what it can do.
On the other hand, I had no problem with rushing forward and plunging over the edge of the abyss with Gandalf and the Balrog and thought it was fantastic, which perhaps goes to show that even impossible shots have their place - in moderation. The ROTS battle just goes on and on and on.
Thus, I suggest that the ROTS battle needs less dynamic shots and maybe even some model-shot-replacements, while the ROTJ battle would benefit from more shots of gunners, a heck of a lot more capital-ship action, even some shots in the style of the ROTS battle... but not too many.
For the record: I would love a modern remake of X-Wing.
It's hard to deny that the battle between capital ships at the beginning of ROTS is superb, if superfluous to the plot. I'm not quite sure how one would go about making the ROTJ battle a bit more like this (ie time consuming & expensive to do it right), but that's really the direction I'd like to see the ROTJ battle go.
