Here you are the screenshot comparison of Blu-ray, ColourMatch'ed Blu-ray and DVD:
Many CM'ed images are almost perfect, while few must be corrected; probably I'll use another script to regrade those shots.
Here you are the usual screenshot comparison - top Blu-ray, bottom DVD:
,^…^, presents Minority Report [spoRv] - special preserved or Restored version
| Released projects | Projects in progress | Future projects | Mission & Setup |
updated: 2014-01-17
Mission: to restore Minority Report color grading.
Video sources: Blu-ray, DVD.
Audio sources: Blu-ray, DVD.
Subtitles sources: Blu-ray, DVD.
Project info:
“Minority Report” Blu-ray has a very natural color grading… a bit too much natural, for a sci-fi movie like this. The DVD has a different color palette, colder in most scenes, but sometimes more colorful than the Blu-ray.
So the Blu-ray will be regraded using the DVD as color reference.
Some references about colors:
<div>
<div>For Minority Report, Spielberg once again allocated the skills of Janusz Kaminski, a rather ingenious Cinematographer who knows how to put DVD’s capabilities to the test. Minority Report is not a very colorful film, and is in fact quite the opposite. The look is hard, drab and cold.
…
I would say that grain is a problem, but the grain visible is obviously a product of the bleach-bypass process used to achieve the film’s amazing look.</div>
</div>
http://www.dvdactive.com/reviews/dvd/minority-report2.html (about DVD)
<div>
<div>Kaminski’s most interesting trick, however, was to desaturate and mute the film’s colors by employing a “bleach bypass” system. Normally in negative processing, the film emulsion is bleached. By skipping this step, the film ends up looking like a simultaneous color and black-and-white image, resulting in increased grain and contrast. Kaminski said, “The process pulled about 40 percent of the color out of the image, but we worked to get that back in by adding more color to the lights. Overall, the image has a bleached-out quality with deep shadows and blown highlights.”</div>
</div>
http://www.tcm.com/this-month/article.html?isPreview=&id=650696|648300&name=Minority-Report (about DVD)
<div>
<div>The grading process began with Levinson matching an answer print. The answer print consisted of individual reels that Steven Spielberg had selected as best representing how he wanted the movie to be seen. At that point, Janusz Kaminski came in to work with Levinson. The grading was done while viewing the 4K files rather than a lower resolution proxy.
Steven Spielberg was also closely involved in the remastering and the resulting HDCAM-SR master represents how the creative team want the movie to be seen by viewers today.</div>
</div>
http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=4078 (about BD) - bold added by me, you know why…
Source Material
Video:
Audio:
Subtitles:
**Project status: just started.
**
**
Final format: BD-25**
(further info will be added to this post following the project status)
TEST COVERS (do not print as soon final ones will be available)
Yesterday I watched "Minority Report" on BD, and I agree that colors looks very natural... a bit too much natural! (^^,)
I mean, I don't love the Teal&Orange trend, where all the movies color palette look the same, but this time I think the DVD has the right colors, even if they are not natural... it's like "Halloween": the 35th Anniversary BD has natural colors, and they are not wrong, but the THX DVD color grading serves better the mood of the movie. Got what I mean?
Plus, it's not only my opinion; there are many that praise "Minority Report" as a very good edition, *except* the color grading that, even if very good, looses a bit the mood of a sci-fi movie like this.
Just my 2¢... (€0.02!)
I agree with you that there are many other movies with ugly color grading that need a restoration, but "Minority Report" is one I like, I have both on BD and DVD, and it's not on any restoration list, so...
Of course, any other title that should be restored could be posted here!
EDIT: I started the new Minority Report [spoRv] project right now!
I worked alot with MultiAVCHD the last week... I obtained an almost working BD with menus, but where chapters are OK, the setting menu - with soundtrack and subtitles - don't work at all... I'm desperate!
Can someone help me authoring a BD with menu using MultiAVCHD?!? I need a step-by-step guide, because now I'm completely lost... but still decided to release EFNY with a simple menu, as I'm so near the solution now!
I have a new entry for future projects:
MINORITY REPORT
BD has a different color grading in comparison to DVD and HDTV - avsforum
also, look at this screenshot comparison: in the HDTV version, should those reflections on the computer screen be there, or they are only MPEG2 noise?
I have both DVD and BD, but didn't find (yet) the exact frame...
Does it worth a preservation?
@Stamper: you know you are my "soundtrack pusher"! (^^,)
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Even if I have not updated the thread in the last days, I worked A LOT on it... infact, this time I wanted to make a surprise, and release a BD-25 with menus!
I worked two days with MultiAVCHD, trying to obtain a simple but good result - just a menu for languages and subtitles, and the other for chapters, plus a trailer at the end of the movie - and after several trial, I thought I reached the final result.
But MPC didn't play the menus, and when I tried to open the folder as BD disc with VLC, it suddenly quit... so, I decided to burn a BD-25 to test it with my BD player and PS3... and guess what? My first BD coaster! (^^,)
So, I don't know if I must try to do it until I will (eventually) win the battle, or throw the towel and make a simple BD-25 without any menu? And, maybe when (if) I will be able to make a working BD with menus - or find someone who will and could make it for me - I could always release a version 1.1...Can you wait some days for further tests - maybe with any good result - or do you want a plain release (almost) right now? Almost, because I'm trying to fix Windows - some problems, don't know what it is, maybe a virus - so I can't release it RIGHT now; so, meanwhile, post your opinions here!The year 2014 started on the wrong foot...
Jerry, first of all a big THANK YOU!
I can tell, and I'm sure everyone will agree with me, that with this final work, now you could be considered as a proud member of the fan restoration family, to all intents and purposes! Welcome aboard! (^^,)
I read every word, and now you know how I felt when I finished my first project... don't worry, you don't need to pat your back by yourself; just take a plane to Italy, and I'll pat it... (-^,)
Great job indeed, and now that I luckily found a "spare" Barracuda HDD (250GB) I think I will devote it only for "The Matrix", even if I'm not sure if I could do a perfect job using the HDTV overlaid to DVD or color corrected BD; we'll see.
Happy 2014 to everybody!
This are two screenshots from my projects - PAL laserdiscs as sources - top OT, bottom '97:
not the same frame, but I took them from the finished compressed file, as I was forced to delete lossless source months ago… (**/)
don’t know if this could be useful for some kind of comparison, though!
I use avisynth and virtualdub - mainly to play avisynth script.
I need some reference - don't matter if it's too compressed/misses parts/redrawn backgrounds etc. - it should have good contrast/brightness/contrast.
No at the moment... too much work with EFNY (and its fan edit version), plus BATB is on the go... when I could afford a new 2TB HDD, then we will talk about it - next year at least... (^^,)
HAPPY NEW YEAR!
As I will probably release my BATB preservation project in the next weeks, if I must lower brightness, or something else to improve colors/brightness/contrast, it will be helpful if someone could post here his tips. Thanks in advance!
Molly, great title! I love this song...
Back to topic: opinions are, well... opinable! So, there is none who's right or wrong... you could agree with someone's opinion, or disagree...
Well, I gave my opinion there, and also a disclaimer that I find interesting to put before my projects. If someone would like to grab it, and use it for his/her project, well; if someone would like to improve it, s/he's welcome!
HAPPY NEW YEAR to all the members of this great forum! Thanks to all, I learned a lot during the last year, and hope to improve further during the next!
And I want to add that I found here many polite persons, who's willing to help, and even if sometimes we "agree to disagree", we have always constructive talks - food for thought!
My HDDs are almost full, I can't delete more files anymore... I need a new 2TB internal disc; plus, I finished EFNY lately and I spent a lot of time trying to do it using the Slice Technique, but failed... so I promised to do also an EFNY fan-edit to be forgiven... but BATB is still here, (almost) ready to be released... don't worry, it will see the day of light, even if... I read lately that it seems the laserdisc is too bright, so maybe I should make some "darkening" test to see if it will look better...
When I wrote "set in the stone", I wanted to mean that once we (forum user) will decide for one disclaimer, this will be the standard to use, but of course this will be not mandatory... the fact is that I'd like to set some "things" to be standard, like the fact that DVD/BD/HDTV all have standard features - and I think fan edit community should have ones too.
It will be something like the FBI warning... reversed! I love standards! (^^,)
this is my disclaimer, that will follow my project video logo; here I offer it to the community, with the Creative Commons Non-Commercial Share Alike (CC BY-NC-SA) license. Feel free to use it for your own fan project - no need to mention the attribution in the video of course, just in your info file and/or web page, forum post etc.
Text also is CC BY-NC-SA, so you could use every graphic you want with this text, or if you like the graphic I could send you the small clip with fade-in/out.
Enjoy!
P.S. Attribution will be a simpe "by _,,,^..^,,,_"
revision 1.1:
DISCLAIMER
This is a fan preservation project; it was created for criticism, research,
and is completely nonprofit, and should be considered fair use as stated
in the Copyright Act of 1976, 17 U.S.C. section 107.
It is not an official product, and it should not be sold nor bought; this is
intended for private use and any public screening is not recommended.
To have this version, you must own the original, unaltered retail release.
Please, respect the rights of the copyright holders and purchase a copy
of the original product if you do not own one already.
Hello everybody!
I take the occasion of 1000th thread in this forum to start this one! This will be my first attempt at doing a fan edit…
It will be extremely simple: just the extended scene at the beginning - enhanced and upscaled, new credits I found on the net - adapted to fit the screen frame, and then the whole movie - without the credits part that will be replaced by the new one.
Pretty simple, I know, but I think there are nothing more to touch in this film, except, perhaps, a shot that seems to be repeated - when Plissken awake with the thugs, but maybe it was only a director choice…
Final release will be a BD-25; I will use the HDTV version as main video. Still not sure if I want to include all the languages I used for my main project, with only subtitels for the extended scene - or only an english (or more) soundtrack.
Opinions are welcome.
(I’ll edit this post soon to reflect my other releases…)
Even if the BD has much of grain removed, if there is no alternative (like HDTV) it will be interesting to use LD as color reference... count me in! (^^,)
prologue: DON'T (always) TRUST COMPANIES!
Following many HDTV and internet broadcaster advices, a "studio quality" transmission for an H.264 1080p transmission could be achieved with a bitrate of a mere 6mbps; if we use the Kush Gauge formula, we can see that this is true only if the motion factor is lower than medium... for 16/9 sport material at 29.97fps, for example, a 17.4mbps bitrate is needed!
ANDREA'S COROLLARY TO THE KUSH GAUGE™
To calculate video bitrate for a codec different from H.264, the Kush Gauge costant value should be changed accordingly to the codec used.
Other lossy video codecs (apart H.264/MPEG-4 part 10, or AVC)
Even if AVC is widely used, also thanks to the x.264 open source encoder, there are many other codecs still in use nowadays; the main ones are:
There are also many other ones - H.263 (divx/xvid), MPEG-1 (VCD), WMV9 - that are slowly replaced by newer (or better) ones.
So, let's focus on the main three alternative codecs to AVC.
VC-1
Quality is really similar to AVC; but it has some technical features missing or worst than AVC; the constant will therefore be set at 0.075 - sligthly worse than AVC.
HEVC
New codec, still in development; few serious comparisons were made, and it seems that bitrate gain could vary from 35% to over 70%; based on past studies, it could be difficult to believe that; if an AVC encoded video had a bitrate factor of 100, HEVC could achieve the same video quality at 30... so, to be fair, I'll put it at 60 - 40% gain - so the constant will be set for the moment at 0.042; this is obviously a value that will change in time, whenever more deep comparisons will be conducted, and newer encoders will be developed.
MPEG-2
This is the most known and valid alternative to AVC; widely used aroud the globe thanks mostly to DVD and DVB, it will be used for many years to come.
And it's the most difficult to rate in comparison to AVC... According to many, AVC have the same quality of MPEG-2 at half the bitrate; so, if MPEG-2 bitrate factor is 100, AVC should be 50 - setting the constant at 0.14.
Is it true? Well, probably in many cases it could be, but there are so many variables that plays against or in favour of this, that a simple, unique value is difficult to set at the moment.
Comparison papers state that average AVC bitrate gain is around 55.4%; this value is mainly calculated using PSNR as main video quality valutation. But it's known now that modern video codecs (including MPEG-2) rely on the fact that human vision could be "tricked" more easily than measurement; therefore, this value should not be taken as an absolute truth; infact, following tests results that used SSIM, when MPEG-2 and AVC have the same subjective quality, AVC gain is lower.
Some HDTV stations claims that their MPEG-2 1080i broadcasting have a perfect quality at 6/8mpbs; obviously it's not true; even if in some cases this bitrate is more than enough - news, weather reports, soap operas, studio transmissions - it is not the case for movies, or worst for sport!
In their defense, there were great improvements in the latest year in MPEG-2 encoders, gaining more than 30% in bitrate Vs. the first encoders; plus, some technique "borrowed" from the H.264 format helped to achieve extraordinary results - in comparison to old MPEG-2 encoders, of course.
Speaking about software encoders, these is not always true; despite the fact that there were improvements, they were not so outstanding as hardware encoders of broadcast level...
So, at the end, I think it's fair to set the constant for MPEG-2 at 0.136 - considering AVC bitrate gain between 40 and 55%: this constant could be lowered to 0.116 - setting the AVC gain at 40% - only for evaluating existing encoded material that was produced with industry level hardware encoders, like DVD, BD or HDTV material, as it's a matter of fact that those kind of encoders work better than available software ones that we could use at home.
FINAL NOTES:
As the Kush Gauge is a "rule of thumb" and not a law, of course also these constants are approximate; nevertheless, this rule should be used with the most part of video sources, but must still be used with a grain of salt!
ANDREA'S COROLLARY TO THE KUSH GAUGE™
To calculate video bitrate for a codec different from H.264, the Kush Gauge costant value should be changed accordingly to the codec used.
To obtain a good quality video:
width x height x FPS x motion rank x
- 0.045 for HEVC
- 0.075 for VC-1
- 0.136 for MPEG-2
= final bitrate in bps
or higher should be used* to obtain a good quality result.
exception: a source material, made using industry standard MPEG-2 hardware decoder, must have a bitrate* higher than
width x height x FPS x motion rank x 0.116
to be considered of good quality.
*CBR or VBR average bitrate
CHECKING QUALITY OF A GIVEN VIDEO MPEG-2 ENCODED SOURCE:
HD-NET is known to have a fairly good quality; let's take "Escape from New York": its actual resolution is 1920x804, FPS is 29.97fps and motion factor could be set at 2, so:
1920 x 804 x 29.97 x 2 x 0.116 = 10,733,268 = ~10.73mbps
or, according to higher constant value,
1920 x 804 x 29.97 x 2 x 0.136 = 12,583,832 = ~12.58mbps
as it's bitrate is 17.2mbps, its quality could be considered very good!
***
Also WOWOW, a japanese HDTV station, has a good quality; "Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom" has an actual resolution of 1920x816, FPS is 23.976fps and motion factor could be set at 2, so:
1920 x 816 x 23.976 x 2 x 0.116 = 8,714,773 = ~8.71mbps
or, according to higher constant value,
1920 x 816 x 23.976 x 2 x 0.136 = 10,217,320 = ~10.22mbps
as its bitrate is 19.9mbps, its quality could be considered really high!
***
"Matrix Reloaded" is a movie full of action; so a motion factor of 4 is considered - even if probably a 3 should be quite good.
NTSC DVD:
720 x 480 x 29.97 x 4 x 0.136 = 5,634,551 = ~5.63mbps
average bitrate is 6.34mbps, so its quality is good.
PAL DVD:
720 x 576 x 25 x 4 x 0.136 = 5,640,192 = ~5.64mbps
average bitrate is 6.5mbps, so its quality is slightly better than the NTSC DVD.
Comments, improvements, corrections are welcome!
*** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** ***
References:
PDF documents
The Kush Gauge - H.264 FOR THE REST OF US (page 21)
SUBJECTIVE QUALITY ASSESSMENT OF THE EMERGING
AVC/H.264 VIDEO CODING STANDARD
EBU Technical Report 008 - HDTV Contribution Codecs
Using AVC/H.264 and H.265 expertise to boost MPEG-2 efficiency
BBC Guidelines - Technical and Delivery Standards for Worldwide
Comparison of the Coding Efficiency of Video Coding Standards
KUSH GAUGE™
What is the Kush Gauge™?
It's a rule of thumb to calculate the needed bitrate for H.264 encoded video; it was written by Kush Amerasinghe, a computer scientist. In this context, the word "gauge" means "a device used to make measurements"
How does it work?
Quoting Kush's document:
"to estimate the optimal H.264 bit rate value that would give what is considered “good quality” results for a given video, you could multiply the target pixel count by the frame rate; then multiply the result by a factor of 1, 2 or 4, depending on its motion rank; and then multiply that result by 0.07 (the constant, Ed.) to get the bit rate in bps (divide that by 1,000 to get a kbps estimate or by 1,000,000 to get a Mbps estimate)."
The Kush Gauge™ formula:
width x height x FPS x motion rank x constant = final bitrate in bps
Practical example:
1280 × 720 @24fps, medium motion (rank 2):
1280 × 720 × 24 × 2 × 0.07 = 3,096,576 bps = ~ 3000 kbps
"In case of CBR, a value close to this estimate can be used. In case of VBR, a value that is about 75% of the estimate can be used as a target and a value about 150% of it can be used as the maximum rate. This VBR gap greatly depends on the nature of the content and the ability to absorb the bit rate spikes in the target playback environment."
What is the motion rank?
The amount of motion could be called “motion rank”; from Kush's document:
"As a general rule, try to simplify it into three ranks: Low, Medium, High. To define these ranks in real-world terms:
• Low motion is a video that has minimal movement. For example, a person talking in front of a camera without moving much while the camera itself and the background is not moving at all.
• Medium motion would be some degree of movement, but in a more predictable and orderly manner, which means some relatively slow camera and subject movements, but not many scene changes or cuts or sudden snap camera movements or zooms where the entire picture changes into something completely different instantaneously.
• High motion would be something like the most challenging action movie trailer, where not only the movements are fast and unpredictable but the scenes also change very rapidly."
What's about the constant:
from Kush's document:
"I sought to develop a base number ... (that) can produce real-world bit-rate estimates. After numerous experiments, I noticed a certain pattern of what could be considered a “constant” or base value (for most commonly used video frame-size and frame-rate ranges). When rounded off, that value is 0.07 bps per pixel, per frame, per motion rank value."
Andrea's Corollary to the Kush Gauge™:
To calculate video bitrate for a codec different from H.264, the Kush Gauge costant value should be changed accordingly to the codec used.
(these constant values will be threated in the next post)
Comments, improvements, corrections are welcome!
*** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** ***
Reference (PDF documents):
H.264 FOR THE REST OF US (page 21)
Molly said:
I usually use something along the lines of "Technically, this is flat-out illegal and there is no legal justification, but I feel the need to preserve this is more important than the letter of the law."
(^^,)
Don't worry! Meanwhile, I finished another project, so... Happy New Year!
I'd like to set a standard disclaimer message that could be used for any project, by any fan; it must be written on the disc cover, or in a video logo or presentation, or in websites, forums, blogs etc.
It should be short, general, applicable to several kind of things - restorations, preservations, extended editions etc. - my mission is to create a "set in the stone" disclaimer.
This is my attempt:
Disclaimer: This is a fan preservation project; it was created for criticism, research, and is completely nonprofit; it falls under the Copyright Act of 1976, 17 U.S.C. section 107.
To have this version, you must own the original, unaltered retail release. Please, respect the rights of the copyright holders and purchase a copy of the original release if you do not own one already.
Your help is needed and really appreciated!
Thank you for the hint; cover updated - error fixed, spine white lines removed, spine icon replaced, h.264 logo replaced with the DTS one; it could be found in the first post, as usual.
Meanwhile, thanks also to your congratulations, I had a "cover frenzy" and I made also "The Thing" cover (at the end of this post)... hope you will appreciate it!
It's 4:20 a.m. here, it's "almost" time to sleep... NOW!
COVER ADDED
in the first post.