It's a scene that has worked for decades.....sure, Mark Hamill is no Oscar winner, but I get drawn into the story everytime and have no problem accepting that moment.
I quite liked those shots as they did exactly what they were intended to do which was make the place feel less claustrophobic......pretty sure they're being kept...unaware if it is because Ady likes them (or doesn't mind them) or because he doesn't have an HD source to re-integrate the few seconds that were cut to make room for the new shots.
Ronster said:
What is the main motivation for replacing the canyon shot... Is it just the background Matte?
Well for one thing...the explosion is horrible......not sure if that's the ONLY motivation....but it's definitely one of them.
*EDIT* sigh...
brash_stryker said:
To be honest, it's been so long since I've watched the GOUT I wasn't even aware there had been changes like that to the pacing at all in the SE. Excuse me if this sounds dumb, but why can't Ady just use the original GOUT/Laserdisc audio to fix that segment?
The way I understood is was that there were not enough distinct channels of audio in earlier versions. Shots have been added (of the city, as Lando speaks over the PA), and the timing of R2 getting shocked has been heavily drawn out, so the original audio wouldn't work as is.......meaning that Ady would need all the different parts in separate channels to be able to remix them in a completely new order (not original, and not SE either).
Johannus said:
Rather than imagine replacing Yoda with another small character wouldn't it be easier to replace him with a character witha large silhouette. For example a different small character could involve masking Yoda out, then replacing the background and adding the new character in. Or just carefully matching the head angles and masking and replacing just the head (and recolouring the hands or something). Whereas if you had a human sized character with a wide cape you could just cover over Yoda in most of his scenes. This might involve rescaling certain shots and backgrounds do to the height change, but overall I think it would be less work.
My point about simply covering him up with a larger character is that it doesn't work. The angles are all wrong. In scenes where Yoda is shown interacting with others the camera angles reflect his height (or lack of it), and putting in a full sized character would mean that at the angles used we would be looking at their knees or feet.....or, in the case of the reverse angle being used, all the way up the length of their body to their face, way up at the top of the frame. The only instance where what you talk about is achievable is the scene where Yoda is talking to Obi and Mace(?) and is sitting on the hover chair.....in that one scene he is at aproximately the same height as everyone else. Everywhere else you have the problem of high or low camera angles, bad eyelines (assuming you wanted to use a full height character instead of Yoda), backgrounds being off due to the camera angles......it just doesn't work.....not simply by overlapping him with a bigger/taller character.
Akratus said:
Although I do not know if replacing taking yoda's place is best for him, I completely laud any increased screen time for Dooku, a much better potential for a villain than Grievance.
Yup.
brash_stryker said:
ray_afraid said:
muddyknees2000 said:
As much as I agree with this idea...
what about... His confrontation with Dooku for example?
And what of the end battle with Sidious?
removing Yoda from the PT would be a major overhaul.
Hmm.. I guess PT:R won't be as radical an edit as I was hoping... :/
I always figured these scenes would be on the cutting room floor in Revisited, personally. Once you remove all the crap from the PT, all that really remains Yoda-wise, is the council chamber scenes. Of course the issue still remains of the film needing padding out with all that's being cut, but that's where people like muddyknees2000 come in ;)
Again.....this was just specualtion on my part. Go look at the PT for yourselves. Yes, I know for a fact that some stuff is being cut....but go back and count all the spots that Yoda is present......what's being suggested here (while a suggestion that I DO like) (VERY much) is more or less the exact opposite of what George did....he included Yoda as much as possible. That's going to be a difficult reversal.
ray_afraid said:
Hmm.. I guess PT:R won't be as radical an edit as I was hoping... :/
Don't get me wrong....I'm not saying he WON'T be doing some of these things. BUT....I personally am seriously doubting that Yoda can be more or less excised from the PT to build an anticipation of his eventual reveal in ESB.......I just think he's too present in the PT for this to happen. This is personal guesswork....not official word from Ady.
brash_stryker said:
emanswfan said:
I'd really be interested in knowing what ideas were planned, but won't happen.
Curious about this one myself. Can't imagine what it is!
As I said....I'm not aware of anything Ady specifically planned, but then later discovered he could not achieve (not to say it never happened, but if it did, I don't know about it). There are, however, times when something would be suggested to Ady (by one of us from the inner circle) and he would explain why it could not be done (while sometimes suggesting that if things were not thus he WOULD want to do it).
An example for you (this isn't meant to stir up another debate, Ady has already said he can't do this):
I brought up the issue of R2 plugging into the power socket on Bespin and frying himself. It always bothered me in the SE that they put in such a huge delay between him deploying his interface tool (hehehe) and him actually plugging in and getting shocked. I had counted out the time, and it was something like 13 seconds that we're supposed to believe he deployed, and then just sat there....waiting for the camera to come back onto him before continuing his movement. It's ridiculous. So I had someone chop up a few different edits for me....and got the time down to half, and then to a couple of seconds....and presented Ady with the 2 options. What I had asked of my editor was that he ignore the audio aspect....I simply wanted to see if the visual could be spliced in such a way as it didn't feel off. Additionally I was hoping we could recover the few seconds of R2 that were lost in the SE edit....his interface appendage (just gets funnier everytime) has some lights on it that pulse at one point, and this was lost in the SE cut.
Ady explained to me that as much as he'd have liked to change it back to something closer to the original the audio was too heavily layered and flattened into one channel in the only available source for him to do much about it. I believe that Lando's PA announcement to Bespin was the specific source of the problem...but I do not recall if there were more constraints he mentioned.
There you go...
oh_riginal said:
I assumed they were flying around to the other side of Bespin before going out into space. Sort of flying "undercover" in a way. But when they went back and caught the attention of the TIE Fighters they lost their opportunity for an easy escape and had to get to space ASAP to go to lightspeed.
^Exactly this^
brash_stryker said:
this boy without any training is now the galaxy's last hope and being granted an audience with Yoda. THE Yoda.
As much as I agree with this idea (whether or not the promo material ruined the surprise....fan edits CAN and DO change the meaning of films all the time...that's kind of the point)......it IS a difficult one to achieve. SO much time was devoted to Yoda in the PT that removing the footage would be fairly difficult.
I think having him absent, but mentioned, (as Brash has explained) builds him up nicely for a reveal in ESB....BUT....how do you do this if you plan on removing him from the PT? Ok, sure....some shots can have him substituted with a hologram.....you can even intentionally mask his appearance and somehow explain that Yoda WANTED to hide his appearance because he could distantly sense that the Sith were possibly returning and that one day his hidden identity might serve a greater purpose (the PT needed more Force perception like this)......BUT, what about scenes where you CAN'T replace him with a hologram? His confrontation with Dooku for example? Even if you want to heavily cut into scenes, and remove much of what IS there.....the stuff that remains is shot from very specific angles, corresponding to Yoda's diminutive stature. If you're going to flat out replace with with someone else then you have to consider a Jedi like Even Piel (spelling?....am I even using the right name?) (The friggin little pink guy with the huge downturned Yoda ears). And what of the end battle with Sidious? Yoda's all over that thing......take Yoda out and you're lookin at a 30 min movie (I'm exaggerating but you get my point).
This isn't to say I wouldn't like to see it done...and I am certainly willing to shoot the required material that Ady needs for whatever he wants to do with the PT....but removing Yoda from the PT would be a major overhaul.
Johannus said:
Sure a lot of existing footage would require a lot of work to remove Yoda completely, but maybe send Liam Neeson an early copy of ESB:R or something with a persuasive note suggesting you may need him to film a few new scenes.
He's "Taken 3" desperate....not "unpaid fan-edit" desperate...
nothing was planned necessarily.....just a few things he'd like to have done, or logically WOULD have done if the original unaltered film had been available in hi-def, or the original audio in enough channels....
More frustrating than that are the ones he'd like to do, but the resources just aren't there.....
IF Ady keeps the ending as is....which he has already stated he is not. Who knows, a speech sequence like that could preface an all new dialogue-less ending...?
Mothma makes more sense.
The monitor changes nothing....he's got all kinds of gadgets he could be using to "detect" the cave....problem is, he points out the window.....
Delaying the line works perfectly as it makes it seem like he has a good feeling about the approaching crater....which he then confirms when he spots an adequate cave in said crater.......it's dead simple, and it totally solves the problem.
I think your second video works much better...and is a ridiculously simple fix for something that's also bothered me for years.
Last full day for the 3rd Unit auction to raise funds for our ROTJ:R shoot. Good luck to all bidders!
http://www.ebay.com/itm/STAR-WARS-REVISITED-EMPIRE-STRIKES-BACK-3RD-UNIT-PRODUCTION-USED-FILM-SLATE-/141001884005?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_2&hash=item20d45e0165
nope....didn't shoot that
Yes, that would be a hint......so would the fact that in another pic the title on the slate has been blurred out.....
As for the actor playing Vader, we had a gentleman from Ottawa (I'm in Montreal) who impersonates Vader, owns his own screen accurate costume....so that base was already covered. I only had to give very basic direction (as what we shot was exceedingly simplistic).
And we're saving the singing Christopher Lee for episode II.
doubleofive said:
SECRETSNiflamol said:
What other,more difficult ones, shots did you shoot?
secrets.....and the new Darth Vader tap dance number....it delves deep into his psyche and explores his softer side...all told through interpretive tap dance...yall are gonna really love it.
BTS pic of rehersal in progress.
DF Shadow said:
...did you guys shoot a few different takes of this?
I think there might have been 2 takes of this particular shot, both exactly the same (I did up to 10 takes of some of the more difficult ones, but this one is dead simple).......this was the last thing we shot that day and we were getting pressed for time with the location as they were going to charge me more if we stayed past a certain time.
Ronster said:
yeah darker.. but paint out the slits perhaps and make the base plate solid?
No need.....darkening it takes the attention away from it, and its obvious unfinished quality. It's a 2 second shot...no reason to bother re-texturing when something this simple does the trick.
