kewlfish

NeverarGreat said:

That’s a good point about Rey’s point of view. Thinking about it, it’s not impossible to combine that idea with the Mustafar vision idea. How about:

Kylo kills the cultists and comes to a stop. Before him is the stone container inserted via VFX (cut the shot of him turning). He opens the box and places his hand on the square item inside. Use shot of him turning and then his environment dissolves into the interior of the cultist’s base on Exegol. After the Exegol scene it returns to the shot of Kylo standing over the box, this time with it open and the Wayfinder still upside-down inside.

This allows for the audience to put the pieces together as Rey does.

I like this idea but would you still use the Kylo traveling to Exegol sequence?

smpearce1981 said:

stevepaynter said:

Man, hard too keep up on the discussion, but I’m with Dominic on this on. It would be a damn shame to lose that musical score when Kylo is flying through the Nebula. I think it’s need to be established that Exogel is completely hidden planet early on and the Wayfinder needs to show the audience how Kylo found it.

Here’s an excerpt from a hypothetical piece of crawl to compensate:-

Meanwhile, Supreme Leader KYLO REN journeys to the hidden Sith homeworld, EXOGOL using an ancient artifact that once belonged to his grandfather DARTH VADER, as he searches for an emergent presence in the force that whispers of forging a dark alliance…

Doesn’t have to verbatim, but you get the jist?

If an edit was to use Mustafar, Hal’s (+ plus a few edits) latest crawl is perfect, it explains the where and the why pretty effectively I think.

Episode IX
THE RISE OF SKYWALKER
Hope is reborn. To suffocate a growing uprising, the tyrannical First Order has silenced communication between neighboring systems.

While Rey, sole heir to the Jedi, continues her training, General Leia Organa has dispatched her brave agents across the galaxy to unite the disparate worlds in the name of Resistance.

Meanwhile, Supreme Leader Kylo Ren has traveled to Mustafar, chasing whispers of a hidden power that would allow him to eliminate any threat to his rule…

If using Exogol, we would def have to trim that last passage down to fit the mid-70 range crawl average word count:

Episode IX
THE RISE OF SKYWALKER
Hope is reborn. To suffocate a growing uprising, the tyrannical First Order has silenced communication between neighboring systems.

While Rey, sole heir to the Jedi, continues her training, General Leia Organa has dispatched her brave agents across the galaxy to unite the disparate worlds in the name of Resistance.

Meanwhile, Supreme Leader Kylo Ren travels to a mysterious planet using a Sith relic, chasing whispers of a hidden power that would allow him to eliminate any threat to his rule…

Something like that would probably work. A minor edit to Hal’s great crawl

jonh said:

idir_hh said:

I agree with Nev. The fundamental issue that underlines this film is that the treasure is found before the heroes even go on the treasure hunt, effectively killing all mystery and tension in the film. The reveal of the fleet rising from beneath the surface should have been saved for later on in the film, as well as Kylo finding Palpatine. In my view there needs to be a restructure of the film where palpatine’s broadcast initiates a race to Exogol between The First Order and the Resistance, with Kylo getting there first.

🙄🙄 if there was an opening in which the wayfinder was in coruscant, that would be great !!!hahahh

Maybe we can put our collective powers together and just recreate Episode IX: Duel of the Fates hahha

I think this movie just fundamentally failed at “show don’t tell…” it would appear whatever route we take we’re going to have to use exposition in the crawl (I guess that is what all crawls tho).

jarbear said:

There wouldn’t be confusion if you have a sentence in the crawl. The Mustafar minute raises more questions when you watch the movie with its crawl since it is so rushed without any narrative.

If you have a sentence at the end of the crawl that says Kylo obtained the thing to lead him to a place is far less confusing then what is presented in the movie as is.

Did the original movie cause confusion when it said the rebellion obtained the plans to the Death Star and then see a ship being chased? Was the audience like "How did they get it? What are the Death Star Plans? How hard was it?

No, we didn’t. Why? We got a simple explanation. The Mustafar minute, without any real context or good explanation still is just a lot of stuff happening. It would be better if there was more deleted scene stuff to help it out … but I don’t know if we will get it to help add to it.

The removal of it is an eloquent solution, personally.

To be technical an entire movie was made around that part of ANH’s crawl… maybe we’ll get an entire Mustafar movie from our crawl lol

poppasketti said:

Love reading the discussion (getting heated, but I think in a good way?!)

So you can better perceive the mockup of the open without Mustafar, I made a (quick) pass at the audio:
TROS - Alt Opening without Mustafar
pw: fanedit

I will admit, with that sound editing, that’s pretty awesome. I guess it really just would depend on how the theoretical crawl would explain the Wayfinder… one good thing is that it would take out the shots of the Wayfinder being hooked to the ship like it’s the flux capacitor from the daloreon. Maybe implying that only a force user can use a Wayfinder to find Exegol (then Rey gives the coordinates after she finds it)

The only other way to keep Mustafar is to have the Vader (Palpatine) communion scene and have it say something that implies going to the place of Vader’s power, which of course would be Mustafar. However, now we’ve came full circle back to the point that Kylo’s face reveal at Mustafar is incredibly powerful and having another scene with his face in it would be weird if placed before that… this is starting to make my head hurt

DominicCobb said:

This is why my alternative solution is to show him traversing the nebula, making it clear he still needed to follow the Wayfinder to get there, he didn’t just know where it was the whole time.

^^^^^This, I don’t think anyone is really fighting too hard for Mustafar at this point, but what is the problem with having an extra minute of Kylo exploring the nebula?

I feel like the only way to make Mustafar work, without all of the deleted scenes blah blah, is a vision. But from the way this forum has gone, there are going to be alot of visions in this edit as is… the original Kylo-Rey vision, a possible vision for finding the throne room secret chamber, I think Dom’s vision and transition to Kylo recreating his helmet…

Octorox said:

The only disadvantage I see to cutting Mustafar is that you just start the film and there’s Palpatine, with no build up. Would prefer to see that finding him at least took some doing on Kylo’s part. Like I know that we can infer that it happened offscreen but I think it’s better to see that effort play out onscreen.

I’ve had the same thought… one of the big complaints that many people had was that Palpatine showed up too early. It’s really gonna be picking the lesser of two evils - Palpatine shows up right away and out of nowhere, or gratuitous, flashy music video fight scene that makes no sense

DominicCobb said:

Broom Kid said:

I don’t know, nobody flying to Exegol seems particularly stressed by doing so. The “difficulty” is completely no-sold by the actors in the various cockpits, and is made apparent solely through visual noise and VFX filler substituting for storytelling.

That’s not really what I meant, the literal difficulty of flying through the nebula and all that is not that important. But what is important is properly conveying how far flung the place is, which is lost if you start the movie with Kylo already there, and yet it takes our heroes an hour and a half to reach it.

I agree, if we’re cutting Mustafar then we need to start after the weird Wayfinder transition scene with Kylo’s ship streaking towards the nebula… there is a quick pan to the Wayfinder which can either be cut or mentioned in the crawl.

I just feel like if we keep cutting there won’t be any movie left to watch because we’re not adding anything back in for balance shrug

omnimuffin said:

kewlfish said:

Man, I’ve done a little bit of work on Mustafar… but I’m kind of coming around to not having it… the novelization really shows how much better this scene was before cutting the Pryde/Hux interaction, the Oracle, Kylo becoming more unhinged and putting the First Order’s plans on hold to find this Phantom Emperor… man it sucks we don’t have those deleted scenes

Yeah. I’d pay real money to have access to, at bare minimum, the Eye of Webbish Bog Scene with the Oracle.

Alas they cut story for time… I wonder why they wouldn’t let this movie be 3 hours long? Endgame was 3 hours long and it felt like nothing… I’d watch a 3 hour long Star Wars movie as long as it was paced well

Man, I’ve done a little bit of work on Mustafar… but I’m kind of coming around to not having it… the novelization really shows how much better this scene was before cutting the Pryde/Hux interaction, the Oracle, Kylo becoming more unhinged and putting the First Order’s plans on hold to find this Phantom Emperor… man it sucks we don’t have those deleted scenes

Movies Remastered said:

kewlfish said:

Hmm, completely cutting Mustafar seems… like a radical change. I’d almost rather just have a single establishing shot, like poppasketti’s Tie Fighters than not having Mustafar at all. That was one of Kylo’s most badass scenes and it’s where we are introduced to the Wayfinder.

I must’ve reworked that scene aboyt 50 times and I can’t seem to fit the castle in anywhere that transitions well. I’ve worked everything else in though. Troopers were the cherry.

Yeah, I think Vader’s Castle may be a bust… Mustafar is just too different in Rogue One and TROS and color-grading doesn’t really sell it.

Hmm, completely cutting Mustafar seems… like a radical change. I’d almost rather just have a single establishing shot, like poppasketti’s Tie Fighters than not having Mustafar at all. That was one of Kylo’s most badass scenes and it’s where we are introduced to the Wayfinder.

jonh said:

(Post this on redux, in case someone hasn’t seen it, to download)

a little change / improvement in the force ghost part1 😃 (it is not noticeable, but I have been more satisfied with the small change)

Blue
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1uAYlkZQWiYu12pbhmA9dH3DbNrVE9hil
purple
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1UIImp9YHButrAeuHxEHrfZ4odtnnHxm4

Man this is incredible… no matter how many times I watch these, I still get goosebumps… especially on your full clip when they raise their hands… So good!

Darth Sadifous said:

Kewlfish, I personally think that video you posted with the repurposed battlefront cinematics doesn’t seem too jarring too me. It’s such a brief snippet that I don’t think your average viewer would even notice it’s rendered from a video game. I mean it certainly is up to par with the CGI clones of the prequel films.

I was thinking the exact same thing when I was watching the render lol!

Before I have to go to work, here is a real quick Coruscant that I did… basically just removed Dooku’s ship at the end of Episode II… The only thing I’m a little iffy on is the amount of traffic that is still in the atmosphere. Based on what the First Order does to Kijimi and the village on Jakku, I’m not sure how keen they would be on letting the citizens of Coruscant go about their daily business.

https://vimeo.com/419928036
pw - Ascendant

Neerb said:

Chase Adams said:

You guys have to trust me when I say that this shot is the ONLY shot that even remotely looks any good when used in the film. And it’s still not that great anyway.

(I am however strongly opposed to the idea of using video game footage)

This whole Mustafar thing is starting to border on fan film for me, personally. We have repurposed footage from Rogue One, National Geographic, and Battlefront 2, but in the end the scene is still going to be as rushed, choppy, and poorly explained as it was in the theater. If anything, it might be getting more confusing to follow (we’re currently at three very different establishing shots). None of Hal’s edits have felt this “fan film” before, and that’s not even accounting for all the other crazy special effects stuff that’s going into this fan edit.

I agree with you but the only reason we have to get all of these differing sources is because TROS lacked the much needed deleted scenes. I did a second pass on the footage just to see what color correction could do… looks decent still way too many First Order troops IMO but if the footage was used I don’t think it would distract too much.

Link if anyone wants to see: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1poPI912hxUYeh7XbjxzCm4o7MxYx60vl

Knight of Kalee said:

Hal 9000 said:

Hmmm… if Kijimi isn’t destroyed, could it feature in the mini-montage of Star Destroyers going down instead of Jakku?

Coruscant > Cloud City > Kijimi

You’d have a planet introduced in the first film of the first trilogy, second film of the second trilogy, and third film of the third trilogy.”

“Happy.”

Now that you mention it, it could be cool to have Kijimi instead of Jakku at the end. Is there any establishing shot of Kijimi that could work in that case?

That way the montage would feel more cathartic; Jakku is somewhat meh since most of its inhabitants we knew in TFA were assholes (save for the villagers from the beginning, but they are dead), but in the case of Kijimi, the audience knows this world is the home of Zorii, Babu Frik and John Williams, besides the planet was shown to be brutally oppressed and patrolled by the First Order in the middle act. Planet saved!

Shifting the topic to the Mustafar beginning, I like how the sequence plays out. Maybe that shot where the jet troopers are in the sky could go, but the rest of the Battlefront II footage looks fine (how could one make the videogame cutscenes look less “clean”?).

I agree TIE fighters would make for a nice addition to the castle shot. It’s a good way to disguise the fact that is a Rogue One mirrored/recolored take. Bonus points if somehow Kylo’s shuttle or TIE Whisper could be added.

Also I forgot how good Dom’s repurposed vision scene was. I wouldn’t mind if we keep it there instead of moving Vader’s helmet to the beginning.

Clean may not have been the best word for it but adding a slight film grain effect and maybe lowering the contrast to fit with the movie scene.

idir_hh said:

Would be cool to incorporate the Ties flying by Vader’s castle, that way we would be following a continuous thread.

Yeah a continuous shot following those Ties would be sic and if we did add Ties in, it may distract away from the blur caused by removing Krennic’s ship… although poppasketti would most likely be able to remove Krennic’s ship without the blur being there in the first place.

JKMaxx said:

I feel like Poppasketti’s alternate extended shot would fit better, and then in the Battlefront footage does anyone else think the Star Destroyer overhead may or may not need to go, since we don’t see it in any other shots? I also agree that the shots after the stormtroopers leave the shuttles look a little too much like, well, video game footage. I think it starts not with the jet troopers but with the blaster fire, though.

I also agree with the sentiment that you can tell it’s not Mustafar in the shot inside the shuttle. The lens flare also seems a little too pink in the prior shot, while the sky seems a little blue in the following.

Sorry to be pedantic!

I do also agree that this is the strongest way to start the film and first show Kylo’s face.

You’re not being pedantic lol, I totally agree… the blaster fire needs to match the cultists… which appears to be a yellowish-green color. I also had reservations about the star destroyer in the sky… I mirrored the image to make it appear to be the one from the space shot, but I think it requires a little too much suspension of disbelief.

I did a very rough cut (I’m def not good at sound or music editing, so left it out) mainly to see how Knight of Kalee’s suggestion would look. I definitely need to do a bit more work on Vader’s castle (or someone who is better at coloring).

I feel like it is still better to not have vision scene or the TLJ bridge as I think that Kylo’s face reveal is very powerful in the original shot as our first look at him in this movie. Other than that, the Battlefront II footage is a little too clean and stands out a little bit, but not bad by any means. This also incorporates poppasketti’s tie footage.

https://vimeo.com/419775737
pw - Ascendant

Neerb said:

adobewan said:

Would someone mind linking this vision? I can’t seem to find it on the thread

Here: https://vimeo.com/406328685

OOOOh, I really like this… this was honestly one of my biggest gripes with this movie, why would Kylo fix his mask if he wants to kill the past… but this scene completely fixes it. Fantastic

Delpheas said:

idir_hh said:

This guy’s Mustafar test from the radical redux thread is amazing.

LILIAN02230 said:

Hello There! here is an unfinished test to place the battle of Mustafar in TLJ, I have an idea behind my head with the voice of Vader, so that he guides Kylo to him to link the line “finish what you started” with the he story of Palpatine pulling the strings, to me it is more important that this revelation is made just after the death of Luke.

https://vimeo.com/419658296

That’s fucking wild. And to think that is partly video game footage. I wonder what else BFII could help with.

I didn’t even realize this was Battlefront II lol… with all of the talent I’ve seen on here I just figured someone was able to create this!!!

Here is a re-grade to match my second forest shot for poppasketti’s FO tie-fighter shot… fantastic work.

https://vimeo.com/419703792
pw - Ascendant

Movies Remastered said:

kewlfish said:

Thanks to Movies Remastered, I got a Blu-Ray version of Vader’s Castle, and here is my first draft for color correction. I personally think it’s a little too pink, but I’ll let y’all decide. If it’s good then I’ll throw it into the drive, but if it needs another pass I can get back into DaVinci and take another crack at it.

https://vimeo.com/419430591
password - Ascendant

Edit: I left the clip longer so that an editor can cut the parts they don’t like, the bulge at the beginning is the ship and that’s the only super noticeable part of where the ship used to be.

Just looked on the big screen and there seems to be a weird ghost shape on the ridge half way through. I’m guessing thats the autofill struggling with the clouds?

Yeah I’m going to keep working on it to see if there is an possible way to make it more smooth.