What if I ask…
…that this whole Kylo business is a parody of Star Wars fans?
Perceived/portrayed as “weaklings still living in their parents’ basement”, who need to dress up as a mighty Jedi/Sith to feel powerful?
That would be too deep for TFA.
TV’s Frink said:
I just know I enjoy TFA more than ROTJ and if I have to pick one I’d rather watch TFA.
In that case you might as well watch original instead of bad remake.
or if they just kinda stare blankly at the screen.
When the film is so bad as TFA, you cannot blame people for doing that.
If most of us can pay attention to the PT well enough to form well reasoned arguments someone like you can certainly watch TFA with some attentiveness. To at least get a moderate sense of what you’re talking about. Beyond that you could have just payed attention for the sake of not being lazy.
Do not worry, nothing escaped me. I was just stunned by the awfulness.
or if they just kinda stare blankly at the screen.
When the film is so bad as TFA, you cannot blame people for doing that.
It is not worth polluting your memory with them. Once you see them they will forever be there.
10 days till doomsday.
A good old “Nothing matters anymore”.
That’s the whole point of the character.
Well considering he is the main villain, that is bad.
“I want a badass villain who’s a master of the force and lightsaber combat, but who is not like Vader in any regard, because that would be a rip off.”
Yeah. And despite his patheticness he is still very dangerous.
To star destroyer control computers and such?
That’s the whole point of the character.
Well considering he is the main villain, that is bad.
Helmet or not, he is rather pathetic villain.
Ahh, I feel like such a great forum member today. I didn’t even go to the Myspleen thread to tell new users to get lost. Very mindful of me.
Imp’scum sock confirmed.
The first part might be me. But the second part sounds like Frink.
You either have me confused with past Frink or current not-Frink.
Admittedly, you have improved lately.
Ahh, I feel like such a great forum member today. I didn’t even go to the Myspleen thread to tell new users to get lost. Very mindful of me.
Imp’scum sock confirmed.
The first part might be me. But the second part sounds like Frink.
a single cell of an unsupported faction that has no capital ships and a single wing of fighters and an army that the government doesn’t even believe exists and is designed to specifically evoke the Empire.
If I read this without knowing TFA and how bad it is, I would think it is impossible for someone come up with such stupid plot element within post-ROTJ universe. This is yet another example how they came up with something awful just so they could rehash something; in this case good guys weak vs bad guys strong.
The films should be self sufficient.
it is safe to assume that Empire did not cease to exist at the end of ROTJ.
Oh.
ROTJ did its job. The fault is with TFA.
I will start off with the fact that I do not care about any books. The films should be self sufficient.
Of course the war could probably not last continually for 30 years. Nevertheless, it is safe to assume that Empire did not cease to exist at the end of ROTJ.
Even if we somehow play stupid and assume that practically no development was made on both side in 30 years, there are many new ships on both sides in ROTJ that are not in TFA.
It just a dirty rehash. That is the reality.
And if we still have tanks in 2017 then it’s more than reasonable that X-Wings and TIE Fighters are in TFA.
Of course. We still have Mark I tanks from WW1 as primary tanks.
No, but our primary tank, the M1 Abrams, entered service in 1980.
Yes and Soviet Union collapsed in 80s ending the arms race and any serious competition. In Star Wars case we have the exact opposite scenario; the Empire’s monopoly ended after ROTJ, making the two sides more equal, increasing the competition and arms race between Empire leftover and New Republic. By the time of TFA, dozens of models should have gone through the evolution for each role (fighter, bomber, etc.). What we have instead is the exact same things we have seen in ROTJ. Actually even one step back, since we don’t even see the newer ships from ROTJ.
But that’s not the political scene by the time of TFA (I know the film glossed it over, however). The Republic didn’t even know the First Order existed until recently (as in Bloodline whenever the First Order is brought up, it’s as a big secret that nobody’s supposed to know about) while the Novelization of TFA goes over how the Republic doesn’t consider the FO a threat, hence the Resistance.
Now, one can argue that this is stuff that should’ve been in the film in the first place (and I wouldn’t disagree, TFA really didn’t do a good job of setting the landscape), but it’ll likely be a major factor in how the sequels will play out, while also contradicting your opinion of it being a Cold War esque situation for the last 30 years.
Even if First Order was somehow a secret, of which there no indication in the film it was, you still do not account for the fact that the conflict extended beyond ROTJ (on a more equal terms) and the fact that we already see new ships in ROTJ on both sides that disappeared in TFA.
They wanted to rehash TIE vs Xwing. It is as simple as that.
The X-wings and TIE fighters in TFA are newer models.
Cool story bro.
The truth will set you free.
It is basically the same thing. In WW2 analogy, that would be 1-2 year of improvement on the same model. For example, like from A6M2 to A6M3. Not 30+ years of war-driven evolution.
And if we still have tanks in 2017 then it’s more than reasonable that X-Wings and TIE Fighters are in TFA.
Of course. We still have Mark I tanks from WW1 as primary tanks.
No, but our primary tank, the M1 Abrams, entered service in 1980.
Yes and Soviet Union collapsed in 80s ending the arms race and any serious competition. In Star Wars case we have the exact opposite scenario; the Empire’s monopoly ended after ROTJ, making the two sides more equal, increasing the competition and arms race between Empire leftover and New Republic. By the time of TFA, dozens of models should have gone through the evolution for each role (fighter, bomber, etc.). What we have instead is the exact same things we have seen in ROTJ. Actually even one step back, since we don’t even see the newer ships from ROTJ.
And if we still have tanks in 2017 then it’s more than reasonable that X-Wings and TIE Fighters are in TFA.
Of course. We still have Mark I tanks from WW1 as primary tanks.
The X-wings and TIE fighters in TFA are newer models.
Cool story bro.
i don’t understand your argument. i mean, i understand the argument you are making, but i don’t understand why. Are you saying that these star wars movies are supposed to mirror reality? did ANH? (and the answer, like it is for any leading question, is always NO. it did not fully mirror reality. that is what makes it a fun movie)
My initial argument was that seeing the exact same ship models filling the primary fighter role on BOTH sides after 30+ years is beyond stupid.
Why? I am trying to make fanboys accept the fact that this is a shameless idiotic rip off (rehash is simply too soft term for this atrocity).
Well, I am no fanboy of TFA, although I do like it, and I disagree with you. So, I might suggest to you that you are on misguided mission if you goal is to convince everyone to hate TFA.
I did not say my mission was to make anyone hate TFA. I said my mission was simply to make people accept the fact that TIE-vs-Xwing 30 years after ROTJ is a lazy stupid rip off. Nevertheless, you may even love this fact. But it is a fact.
Well it was not “something similar” because the difference is that R1 plot is in fact about stealing the plans, while TFA plot is in fact about blowing up death star.
Regardless of how you rationalize it you still accused the film of having a different plot than the one that are actually in the film just like Alderaan.
No. Alderaan accused, while I stated the fact. R1 creators intended the plot to be about stealing the plans and they actually achieved that in the film. TFA creators might have intended (pretended, to be precise) that the plot is about finding Luke, while the actual plot in the film is about destroying a death star.
i don’t understand your argument. i mean, i understand the argument you are making, but i don’t understand why. Are you saying that these star wars movies are supposed to mirror reality? did ANH? (and the answer, like it is for any leading question, is always NO. it did not fully mirror reality. that is what makes it a fun movie)
My initial argument was that seeing the exact same ship models filling the primary fighter role on BOTH sides after 30+ years is beyond stupid.
Why? I am trying to make fanboys accept the fact that this is a shameless idiotic rip off (rehash is simply too soft term for this atrocity).
Don’t forget that the F-15 (and A-10, which is still a workhorse) is older than Star Wars, the F/A-18 is older than Empire, and the F-22 is as old as the Special Editions. Plus, all of these planes serve different purposes for different branches of the military.
As I said, Soviet Union effectively collapsed in 80s.
The same is true for Star Wars: The TIE Interceptor serves as a specialized air-to-air fighter while the the normal TIE Tighter is more of a multi-role craft from all the canon I’ve ever known. Same as the TIE Bomber is a specialized bomber, or the TIE Striker is a specialized atmospheric fighter/transport.
Seeing how OT space combat is based on WW2, there are basically three main carrier-based roles: fighter, dive bomber and torpedo bomber (I guess the two are the same in OT). TIE fighter obviously filled the fighter role until it was obviously replaced by TIE interceptor. Of course, like in WW2 the replacement cannot happen immediately so we can still see some TIE fighters at that point. But the fact is that in ROTJ battle the two do exactly the same role.
No major military just has “one” model of fighter that they replace continually. In World War II there was the P-51, the P-40, the F4, F6, and F8, P-47, the F4U… and that’s just some of the American planes I can think of off the top of my head, several of these went on to fight in Korea as well and some saw active service until the late 60s and early 70s.
When it comes to WW2, there were specified roles that were continually replaced by newer models. Primary US land-based fighter: P-40 replaced P-36 and P-51 replaced P-40. Primary US carrier-borne fighter: F4F replaced F2A and F6F replaced F4F. And so on…
Well it was not “something similar” because the difference is that R1 plot is in fact about stealing the plans, while TFA plot is in fact about blowing up death star.
Who said they were phased out by TIE interceptors?
ROTJ and common sense say so.
Why does the B-52H, last built in the 1960s, still make up nearly half of the US heavy bomber force? Why does USAF still fly versions of the F-16, initially developed in the 1970s, despite the development of more advanced airframes such as the F-15, F/A-18, and F-22? Can’t seem to figure out what common sense you speak of.
Because Soviet Union collapsed (effectively in mid 80s). Besides, B-52 was militarily useless since the introduction of ICBM. It has been used for nothing but bombing farmers and 3rd world countries’ cities since Vietnam War.
If you want a good analogy, take WW2 (ANH-ROTJ) and post WW2 cold war (post ROTJ) as an example. New models had been developed and replaced the existing ones constantly.
Not that I’m surprised but you clearly don’t understand what the word “plot” means.
Not that I’m surprised either, but you clearly don’t understand something that you are trying to mock someone else about.
If you think the plot of Rogue One was to get the Rebels the Death Star plans, then time to guess again. 😉
Hmm…I remember Impscum saying something similar about TFA.
You remember incorrectly.
