It's not an issue of ability - it's lack of interest.
Lucas prefers to add rocks over R2 or make Wicket's eyes blink. He knows about the color issues - he just doesn't care because people will buy the discs anyways, since...wait for it...it's SW on blu!
What's the episode number, guys? I can't read it on the poster.
We don't care about this because we don't like the prequels anyway, right? Right?
Quick, George, confiscate this evidence of non-CGI effects in the OT so that future generations don't know how movies were made in the 70s and 80s!
WhatsMyName said:
Well? Are we talking about popularity or quality? i was under the impression we were talking about popularity.
OP suggests otherwise.
WhatsMyName said:
georgec said:
Officially, the Star Wars franchise is considerably weaker than it was 15-20 years ago.
the conventions get bigger every year and so do the charity foundations and anything else relating to SW. I doubt SW will be dying anytime soon. Especially when you got the younger generation growing up with the the saga and watching clone wars on tv.
And i think there's more to be bummed about in life then star wars.
You confuse popularity with quality.
Who's bummed out? I don't care much about anything SW-related these days other than the UOT.
TServo2049 said:
There are good and bad effects of all kinds, and there's also the ethos of "special effects are just a tool, a means of telling a story." (Can't quite remember who said that :) )
I'm still amazed at how much I "buy" the character of Gollum; I can't "buy" the Na'vi in the same way. And for all the examples Boost mentioned, you have King Kong, or the original 1954 Godzilla, the original Alien, Carpenter's The Thing, Cronenberg's The Fly...all *good* stories.
Exactly. The stop-motion effects in Carpenter's The Thing are some of my favorites. They're so real and organic. Lucas' CGI stands out like a sore thumb and can't hold a candle to those type of more natural effects.
I didn't say CGI ruins storytelling universally. I said the increased focus on CGI at the expense of storytelling has negatively affected how movies are made. 20-30 years ago you still had good movies and bad movies, some with then-cutting edge visual effects and some without. As visual effects have matured over the years the number of bad movies that rely too much on CGI (e.g. prequels, Avatar) rather than use them to supplement the storytelling in an effective fashion (e.g. Pixar movies, LOTR) has increased. LOTR is a great example of using CGI wisely. Jackson took to filming in live locations and using actors in costumes as much as possible. The story dictated the filmmaking - not the necessity to cram CGI in every frame like Lucas does.
TV's Frink said:
georgec said:
Officially, the Star Wars franchise is considerably weaker than it was 15-20 years ago.
Do you mean the official products, or is there some franchise rating board I was previously unaware of?
I mean anything that Lucas "officially" churns out currently. But, in unofficial terms we have the preservations and other things that keep the UOT alive.
I guess to some the state of SW is whatever products are on store shelves or on tv, while to others its what we keep alive from the older era.
But yes, there is a franchise rating board. You've never heard?
Luke leaving Dagobah in ESB is maybe my favorite musical track of the saga. The softness of the Force Theme gets me every time, especially at 3:15. It's filled with a combination of melancholy/sadness and hope. Absolutely brilliant.
Officially, the Star Wars franchise is considerably weaker than it was 15-20 years ago. It's diluted and pampers everything to try and make the PT look better. It's just a joke at this point beyond the egregious changes to the OT and the shoddy blu-ray color timing and other issues.
After ROTS I basically lost interest in the SW franchise in terms of anything coming out after 2005. I like some EU stuff (e.g. Thrawn), I'll always love the UOT, but at this point I don't give a shit about the current phenomenon that SW is.
I don't watch CW and have never been interested, but I read this in an EW article:
Well, mostly. Filoni acknowledges that the order to resurrect the Sith Lord came from George Lucas himself, who became more interested in his Phantom Menace creation while developing Savage Opress for the last season of The Clone Wars
Why am I not surprised? Just plain hilarious at this point. Obviously Georgie boy wants to increase fan interest in Darth Maul to boost ticket sales for the 3D release of TPM.
The guy is such a hack.
Avatar was fucking awful. Sure, the "special effects" were good, but it was a terrible, rehashed story that had no depth whatsoever. Red Letter Media reviewed that, too, and as usual hit the nail on the head.
"Your clones are very impressive. You must be very proud."
"I'm just a simple man, trying to make my way in the universe."
Decades from now film scholars will look back on this era and point to the prequels as quintessential examples of how storytelling suffered at the expense of CGI, CGI, and more CGI.
The PT scores are quite good in their main themes. I enjoy them nearly as much as the OT scores. There's a lot of incidental or filler music. It seems the PT scores are generally "faster-paced" especially in the action pieces vs those in the OT.
I always laugh about the AOTC love theme. It's a brilliant, melancholic, ominous piece of music but it can't save the awfulness of that movie's love story.
walking_carpet said:
Mr. Bungle said:
No, I think you, ahem, nailed it.
As far as "the negotiations were short", I'm not sure it was intended as a "haw haw" Kenobi *joke*. Just sort of that Obi-Wan light-hearted lines. I never minded it. I think McGregor as Obi-Wan is one of the highlights of the PT. His "Why do I have the feeling we've picked up another pathetic life form?" got chuckles. It's also an odd line as it's Lucas basically acknowledging the alien sidekick sucks.
hmmm...now that i've seen some of the padme lines, i feel like i want to re-tract because everything she said was awful. so was her delivery.
man..how much worse would the PT be without Ewan? he gave best performance in ROTS i thought. although, i also believe that he had an advantage over natalie and hayden because he had alec guiness to model off of. had it not been for that, he likely would have been in a lot of trouble too.
He was outspoken about the worthlessness of TPMs script. apologists use the standard talking point - "well, a lot of actors dont care for their expereinces on the star wars movies" - but he really wanted to be a part of these movies.
I remember when he was first cast in 1997 he said Independance Day was Hollywood crap and Star Wars was better because it had story and heart - just think about that 15 years later !! lol.
i forgot where, but i read something that he said not too long ago - "i think the original trilogy will have a special place in history, the PT...well, that was the trilogy I was in"
LOL!! i mean...if this is what he says in public, just imagine what he feels privately! :(
It's at ~1 minute into this clip. The interviewer tries to say the PT is good and Ewan shrugs it off. I guess Ewan is a h8r!
As a kid I always wondered when Han tells Luke, "Now I owe you one," in ROTJ shouldn't he be saying, "Now you only owe me one more"?
RATLSNAKE said:
kenkraly2007 said:
Mrebo said:
And as you admit here, you support anything GL does. That's simply dogmatic and blind to reason. We're not people who dislike Star Wars. We're just honest people who aren't afraid of critiquing poor decisions.
We have no reason to defend or support anything GL does. Only those who wish to maintain an income at LFL do.
Why do some of you wine and complain every time GL makes a change to the films? He has a right to change his films sure some of them are not good you can't please everyone. Sure not everyone is not going to like the changes but it the changes don't take away my enjoyment of the films.
OK, I promised myself to keep quiet, but after some decent adult attempts to make serious comments towards this person in an attempt to help them realise the problem with the majority of their posts, to then post this tells me one of two things:
1/ This guy is a troll plain and simple, or
2/ He is a young child, or an adult with the mind of a child.
Either way I ask the mods step in here, because I'm sick of seeing what this thread has become.
Just the same crap on every page going back and forth. Mods please pull out the big stick and clean up this thread.
I have drawn those conclusions as well in previous posts.
Ken is not malicious and doesn't attack anyone - I appreciate that. He is more or less respectful despite his strange views and rationalizations.
Ken, just go and enjoy the blu-rays. Why come in here knowing that most people will take issue with your opinions? You're certainly welcome to express them but at some point you should realize that nobody's mind is likely to change.
CAN'T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG!?!
I'm surprised at how many people seem to like Watto. I mean, I don't dislike him, but he never stood out to me.
walking_carpet said:
georgec said:
And on top of all that, Lucas is a delusional fool who thinks people don't like the prequels or his SE changes because that's some part of being a tortured, misunderstood artist. No, people don't like those things because they are terrible. As Phil Tippett said, it's "CGI shit."
nah...lucas knows the movies are garbage and cash-ins. and he knows that people don't like them because they are garbage and cash-ins. its the apologists that parrot the talkingpoint of lucas being a misunderstood artist that are delusional.
When Lucas said "special fx are just tools for telling a story, a special fx without a story is a pretty boring thing" he didn't mean that - he was just telling us what we wanted to hear. just like when he says hollywood suits only care about money and marketing and not storytelling. he knows he represents the most absolute extreme example of vapid cynical brand explotation. but he needs the support of apologists.
I agree 100%. You mention that quote and I think it's from "From SW to Jedi." People love that documentary and it has some merit in showing behind the scenes action, but Lucas sounds and acts like the same guy he is today. That was made after his turn to the green side, and again you see how bored he is talking about moviemaking. It's just a tool for him to put some CGI shit on a screen and sell toys and other merchandise to people who can't get enough SW.
Still, the man has demonstrated deep conviction to his "everyone hates me and my movies" mantra, even if it is inauthentic.
I said it before, I'll say it again. This cat is:
a) a superb troll
b) an irrational child
c) a mentally deficient person
I think it's a combination of (a) and (c).
It's not worth the energy to argue over and over, despite the entertainment factor.
I will never understand how someone can see Lucas as some benevolent creator whom we should adore for being gracious enough to give us scraps from his table. The man has shit all over movies that HUNDREDS of people helped create and claimed the solely as his own. Just look at the quote in my signature. He has no respect for the people who made him rich. Sadly, most of those people continue to buy whatever garbage he puts out.
And on top of all that, Lucas is a delusional fool who thinks people don't like the prequels or his SE changes because that's some part of being a tortured, misunderstood artist. No, people don't like those things because they are terrible. As Phil Tippett said, it's "CGI shit."
kenkraly2007 said:
that's your opinion georgec.
Actually it's quite well-documented fact. Here are some great articles:
http://secrethistoryofstarwars.com/marcialucas.html
http://secrethistoryofstarwars.com/beyondgeorgelucas.html
http://secrethistoryofstarwars.com/conversationswithleighbrackett.html
Kurtz, Burtt, Tippet, they've all been making comments in the last year or so with subtle jabs at Lucas' greed and lack of integrity.
Lucas has taken the cheap, lazy route with giving SW the best treatment and his lies continue to grow. I can't blame him, as many SW fans are self-loathing and will buy his products even if they disagree with their content/quality. Lucas has many SW fans by the nuts.
We all respect GL for what he envisioned and helped create, but to give him credit alone is inaccurate. He had plenty of help, and when he got rid of that help and had complete creative control the result was the prequels (and all the awful SE changes).
The man is out of control and lost his marbles a long time ago.
DuracellEnergizer said:
kenkraly2007 said:
Now I do like the original cut's of the original trilogy but my preface are the special editions because those are the ones I saw in the theaters and their is nothing wrong with that.
Then shouldn't you be compaigning for a DVD/Blu release of the SE '97 instead of drinking the Lucasfilm Kool-Aid every time George offers you a glass?
Didn't you hear? True SW fans are the ones that take whatever Lucas graciously bestows upon them unquestionably.
We need to get Obama in on this. After all, he delivered on a similar issue earlier this week.
