I don’t think it’s “finished” Wazzles.
I mean, you’re probably right, but he has at least claimed to have finished it. I’m trying to be a little careful though, since Mike is a controversial figure round these parts.
A controversial figure? How so?
OK, here’s my proposed episode VIII:
One year has passed since episode VII, the Imperial Remnant is starting to consolidate its power through more overt attacks, sowing distrust within the governments, spreading misinformation and sowing distrust within the ranks of the regional governments, undermining Leia and her allies. Rey has been training under Luke, however unbeknownst to Luke, her fateful encounter with Kylo Ren has created an unusual Force bond between her and Kylo in which Rey represents embodies the light with a touch of darkness, and Kylo the dark with a touch of light. This bond allows for communication between them just like TLJ, and just like in TLJ, these events are involuntary and spontaneous. Initially Kylo tried to turn Rey to his cause, which Rey rejected, however a growing mutual understanding develops between them.
Meanwhile Poe, Chewbacca and Finn are aiding a local resistance militia in an outer rim system, and conquering this particular system will prove key in the IR’s rise to power. We learn here that Poe used to be a Republic soldier and an ace pilot whose problem with authority led to his reassignment as an Intel gatherer and a scout who reports to Leia on IR activities. Their mission is complicated when it is revealed that one of the Knights of Ren is leading the effort, and their very presence leads to the IR’s first major victory. Our trio of friends escape with the resistance militia thanks to the help of a Bespin fleet sent by Lando and Chewie’s contacts from his smuggler days. Other Knights of Ren achieve similar, lesser victories in other outer rim systems.
As Rey’s training and mastery of the Force progresses, so does Kylo’s, and we see him exploring places powerful with the dark side, such as the cave in Dagobah, and after being informed of the accomplishments of his fellow Knights, gathers them and informs them that the time has come to attack the New Republic, but the bond with Rey inadvertently alerts her of his plan. Luke views the encounter between Rey and the Knights of Ren as inevitable, and allows her to depart on her own, cryptically saying that will join her when the time is right.
Poe, Finn and Chewie arrive on Coruscant to present irrefutable evidence of the IR’s growing threat over the past three decades before the Senate, and suddenly the Imperial Remnant launches a surprise attack and Kylo, alongside two other Knights, personally takes Leia hostage. Upon sensing Leia’s Force potential, Kylo is puzzled about a Force wielder such as Leia not using her position to exert greater control upon the population through the Force, to which Leia responds that giving up such power is the true meaning of strength. Rey arrives in the nick of time to prevent Leia’s execution at Kylo’s hands, Kylo orders the other two Knights to stay away, as he wants to deal with Rey. Rey is no match for Kylo, at which point Luke makes his entrance with a renewed sense of justice, which evens the scales prompting Kylo to call upon the other two, and Luke and Rey being outnumbered three to two, it is then that Leia unconsciously uses her battle meditation by focusing on Luke and Rey, giving them the edge over the three Knights. Luke dispatches the two lesser Knights, but Rey and Kylo are cut off from Luke and Leia, however just when Rey is at Kylo’s mercy, Kylo realizes that he can’t bring himself to finish her off, and neither can Rey, even though they are at opposite ends, and so Kylo retreats along with the fleet.
The attack on Coruscant has galvanized the Republic into freeing the oppressed systems and stopping the Imperial Remnant once and for all.
IMO The Clone Wars (2008) is a tad overrated.
Clone Wars (2003) does a way better job bridging AotC and RotS.
Totally valid. I was just thinking in the context of what could be done with a less ambitious rearrangement of existing elements.
Any thoughts on my proposed episode VII and ST setup?
Thinking smaller, the core elements of what we got could have made for a perfectly solid ST with a few tweaks. For instance…
EPISODE VII: A SHATTERED BALANCE
30 years after the Battle of Endor, the New Republic is established and a free galaxy has fallen into complacency. Leia Organa-Solo serves in the Galactic Senate, Han Solo adjusts to retirement as well as can be expected, and Luke Skywalker trains their son Ben along with a handful of students in the Jedi arts—with the help of Snoke, a surviving Jedi Master from the days of the Old Republic.
But when the deserting ex-stormtrooper Finn arrives to warn the Senate that an Imperial remnant calling itself the First Order is gathering strength in the Unknown Regions, Snoke—secretly a darksider in league with the First Order—reveals himself and accelerates his plans to retake the galaxy.
Responding to a distress call from the Jedi Temple, Han finds that Snoke has completed his seduction of Ben Solo, and in doing so decimated the Academy. The newly-christened Kylo Ren murders his father in a tense confrontation, and Chewbacca rescues the only two Jedi who haven’t been killed or captured—Luke and one student, a young orphan named Rey.
With Finn’s help, the grief-stricken heroes organize a plan of attack, infiltrating and destroying the First Order superweapon Starkiller Base…but not before it obliterates the New Republic’s capital. Leia assumes command of the New Republic’s surviving military forces, while Luke takes Rey to complete her training on the remote Jedi world of Ahch-To, just as Yoda had trained him on Dagobah decades before.
This would allow us to spend time with the heroes at peace and show a glimpse of the free galaxy they fought for in the OT. It would eliminate Han and Leia’s estrangement, give Luke a similar struggle with guilt without having to explain why he tapped out of the galaxy for years, introduce us to Ben Solo before things go to hell, and eliminate the controversy over Rey being skilled without Jedi training, all while preserving the good elements the ST gave us.
In particular, having Kylo’s turn, Han’s death (which, let’s face it, would probably be a Harrison Ford requirement no matter what), and the fall of Luke’s academy all happen simultaneously onscreen, as the immediate precursors to the trilogy’s central war, alleviates The Force Awakens’ implication that Luke, Han, and Leia’s lives all sucked before we see them again. Having characters meet tragic ends in the course of facing a new crisis is a lot easier to swallow than having them suffer losses, withdraw from their loved ones for years, regress to old habits, AND THEN meet tragic ends.
EPISODE VIII: THE LEGEND OF SKYWALKER
The broad strokes could be similar to The Last Jedi, especially the exploration on Luke’s mythic status (hence the new title). The above outline for A Shattered Balance leaves the exact circumstances of Kylo’s turn somewhat ambiguous, so there would still be room for a similar set of flashbacks as in the official TLJ. I don’t have strong feelings about whether Rey should be Luke’s daughter or remain a nobody, but this basic idea could work with either decision. Another possibility might be that Rey is the daughter of a darksider Luke was forced to kill years ago. [EDIT] I’d be fine with a version of the Canto Bight subplot pruned like Hal’s version, but for the sake of the trilogy as a whole perhaps it would be better if Finn and Rose’s mission was instead focused on finding allies to help what’s left of the New Republic regroup in the wake of the Starkiller disaster. [END EDIT]
EPISODE IX: POWER OF THE FORCE
😃 Maybe a little something like this:
https://originaltrilogy.com/topic/THE-RISE-OF-SKYWALKER-THE-TEAM-DALE-REWRITE-AVAILABLE-NOW/id/85493
I like your proposed ST, but I would take Starkiller Base out of the equation. I just don’t like the idea of an underpowered organization creating a superpowered weapon.
I still haven’t come up with any ideas for episodes VIII and IX, but at the risk of appearing needy, I would like to read some feedback on my proposed episode VII.
Sure thing. I really like the idea of the New Republic doing well while the Imperial Remnant resorts to more subtle and sinister tactics - to differentiate from the OT more, I’d have liked the sequel trilogy to have had the bad guys be the underdogs, but a growing threat which the Republic does not take seriously. The scenario in the sequels, where the FO suddenly have all this amazing military force somehow, is rather bad worldbuilding and a large contrivance.
I’m with you on keeping Luke as he is in TLJ - I think that’s a really compelling story. My issue would be that you’re cutting it in half. In TLJ, it’s crucial that Luke regains his optimism and sense of self at the end of the film, finding purpose in letting the Resistance fight another day. He is the heart of that film, but in this version he’s just a vehicle for some character conflict (Rey persuading him to train her), the necessary method of getting Rey that crucial training, and then being killed off to further the arc of the main villain. Regarding that last part, I’m fine with Snoke being treated that way in TLJ, but not Luke. He also would never get the chance to emerge from that state of pessimism and lack of self-belief that so many fans hated.
Another criticism would be that this seems like a lot to happen in one film and might be too ambitious, but that’s a minor one. It’s a structural issue, while I think the premise of your ep VII is very solid! I also like that the Knights of Ren would provide insight into the supremacist ideology of dark siders, and have a more interesting motive than ‘standing around and looking cool’. I also like that you don’t feel the need to continue the ‘Skywalker saga’ as such, making Kylo a villain not tied directly to this group of characters we’ve already been following. A complaint I have about the sequels is that too many characters feel part of this interconnected tight-knit group. In this version, Rey has no special heritage to define her, and neither does Kylo. I don’t mind him being Han and Leia’s son at all, but thematically this is much nicer. Great thoughts.
I think you’re right jedi_bendu. Killing Luke off without him overcoming his pessimism would be a terrible idea, so I’ll revise that part and have him survive until the final act of episode VIII, giving him time to restore his sense of justice.
I want to further delve into the details of my proposed ST. I previously mentioned the IR would have old Star Destroyers as mobile bases, and I want to add that they are equipped with miniaturised Death Star cannons which, while not powerful enough to destroy planets, can still raze entire cities and are quite useful at reducing the numbers of enemy fleets, their major drawback is their recharge time. The starfighters employed by the IR would have an aesthetic similar to that of the TIE Fighters, but unlike their predecessors are self-sufficient, having perks such as hyperdrives, taking off and landing on their own, all this because the IR can’t afford to mass produce TIE Fighters dependent on a base, thus we are presented with smaller fighter squadrons that make up for the numbers by their efficiency.
Although the Knights of Ren clearly draw from the Dark Side, what differentiates them from the Sith is that they aren’t concerned with proving the superiority of the dark over the light, but rather believe that Force wielders are inherently superior and should rule over what they consider to be lesser beings, and their ultimate goal is to create an Empire in which Force wielders are the ultimate authority, similar to the Tevinter Imperium from the Dragon Age games, where mages are the ruling class and everyone else is a second class citizen.
OK, now the ideas for my proposed episode VIII are starting to flow. I will post them later.
My Sequel Trilogy would have been something like this:
Episode VII: The New Republic is seemingly thriving, however there is no new Jedi Order, and Luke Skywalker has exiled himself, Leia is now Chancellor of the Republic but finds herself weighted down by the world of politics and Han died some time prior to the movie (Harrison Ford has never been enthusiastic about SW so I would leave him alone). I would have kept the Imperial Remnant title from the EU as it makes a hell of a lot more sense than the First Order, and would have portrayed them as a shadowy organisation that unlike it’s predecessor the Empire, which fought using total war, they resort to more subtle tactics, such as guerrilla warfare, espionage, deception, infiltration through senators that are still secretly loyal to the Empire, conquering seemingly unimportant worlds, using unused experimental imperial technology, and while they would use old imperial Star Destroyers as mobile bases, their main base of operations would be in the Unknown Regions. They would be lead by the Knights of Ren, who are what I would call Force supremacists, as they believe that Force wielders are inherently superior to others and should rule over everyone. Originally being students in Luke’s fledgling Jedi academy, their belief of the strong ruling over the weak is what drove them to crush the new Jedi Order before it could truly blossom and subsequently join the Imperial Remnant. Kylo Ren in this version is unrelated to the Skywalker family, he’s just a promising student with a lust for power who went renegade alongside others, and Kylo Ren is his name for real. Second to the Knights of Ren in terms of command would be a council of former imperial military leaders and senators. Rey would be a nobody and nowhere near as OP in the Force, but is fully aware of her Force sensitivity and that’s what drives her to seek out Luke, to gain a better understanding, and she’s been gathering information on Luke’s whereabouts. That’s how she meets Chewbacca, now captain of the Millennium Falcon and Poe Dameron, his copilot and Finn, first mate and renegade stormtrooper. Finn defected from the IR because he couldn’t stand the suffering he inflicted when raiding worlds and kidnapping people to be used as slave labour, and has since decided to right the wrongs of his past with helping Chewie and Poe. Throughout their journey they uncover the IR secret plan to restore the Empire, and halfway through the movie Rey meets Luke, who is pretty much the same as in TLJ, a bitter disillusioned hermit who wants no further part in the conflicts of the Galaxy, but nevertheless agrees to train Rey as she’s driven by a desire to use her power responsibly, but the training is cut short when Kylo arrives after sensing her presence and offers to teach Rey true power, being impressed by her raw potential, and proceeds to kill Luke as a display of power, yet Rey still turns him down and flees. Now guided by Luke’s Force Ghost, Rey is determined to protect the Galaxy against the growing threat of the IR.
Whew, that’s a lot of text, I think I will use different posts for episodes VIII and IX.
I still haven’t come up with any ideas for episodes VIII and IX, but at the risk of appearing needy, I would like to read some feedback on my proposed episode VII.
The last movie I watched was Jumper (2008). I mostly watched it because I wanted to see some movies with Hayden Christensen and it’s one of his better known ones. I actually liked it a lot better than I thought I would and I was surprised to see Samuel L. Jackson in it too.
During this last year in quarantine, I decided to watch all of Hayden’s movies. Very interesting journey seeing his rapid rise and just as a rapid fall from prominence. Jumper is definitely one of the better ones. A little longer than it needed to be, but nothing a motivated fan editor couldn’t fix. I often wonder if he and Samuel L Jackson got along, if they reminisced about their time together on Star Wars.
I’ll also say my other other take away from Haydenfest, as I called it, is that our boy is on the rise again! It’s a little funny (naked brag alert), but when I finished his films I said he was on the rise and predicted he would be working on bigger projects soon and then within a week, it was announced he would be on Kenobi.
If anyone is interested in seeing more Hayden, I definitely recommend his 3 most recent. Little Italy is a soft little rom-com directed by Don Petrie, who directed Mystic Pizza in the 80s. This movie may be set in the same universe and while it’s definitely not as known or beloved as it’s 80s forbearer, I think in many ways it’s the superior film.
First Kill is billed as a thriller starring him and Bruce Willis and well, I’ll be honest that’s some dishonest marketing, Bruce Willis is barely in the film. HOWEVER, it’s one of my favorite Hayden flicks, gripping as hell, sneaks up on you. Hayden’s true co-star, I forget his name, but it’s the guy who played Renly Baratheon on Game of Thrones. He’s excellent in this, well worth checking out.
The Last Man is his most recent film, I’ll be honest, it’s real slow and real weird but features great performances from Hayden and co-star Harvey Keital (random, but related: it’s Harvey Keita’s birthday today!) and if you’re looking for something with a nice dark slow burn, it’s a great watch
Actually I think the runtime for Jumper is just fine.
Alien 3 sucks but i doubt that is a controversial or unpopular opinion. Aliens is also so vastly overrated its incredible. Alien is a better film in nearly every way. Its real science fiction, its a thriller, its horror. Its not a schlocky action flick.
I agree. Everywhere I look Aliens is praised as one of the greatest sci-fi movies of all time, like it’s some sort of high art, but I find to be a pretty generic movie where a handful of marines go up against a swarm of giant dumb bugs led by an even bigger less dumb bug, and the ending is pretty much the same as in the first movie, only more bombastic.
Frankly all the praise the movie gets baffles me.
The film Much Ado About Nothing the 1993 version is a great adaptation. I highly recommend it.
I remember watching glimpses of that movie when I was a kid, and for whatever reason Robert Sean Leonard is what I remember the most about it. Over the years I’ve read that Keanu Reeves is the weakest link in terms of acting.
Anybody?
I have been looking for Akū Daisakusen Srungle, an obscure Japanese animé series from the 1980s.
When I was a little kid I recall watching a handful of episodes on a local TV channel. About twenty five years later I finally came across a YouTube channel that uploaded all 64 episodes with the caveat that they didn’t have subtitles, but the channel was taken down.
Is there a place where I can find the complete series with English subtitles?
My Sequel Trilogy would have been something like this:
Episode VII: The New Republic is seemingly thriving, however there is no new Jedi Order, and Luke Skywalker has exiled himself, Leia is now Chancellor of the Republic but finds herself weighted down by the world of politics and Han died some time prior to the movie (Harrison Ford has never been enthusiastic about SW so I would leave him alone). I would have kept the Imperial Remnant title from the EU as it makes a hell of a lot more sense than the First Order, and would have portrayed them as a shadowy organisation that unlike it’s predecessor the Empire, which fought using total war, they resort to more subtle tactics, such as guerrilla warfare, espionage, deception, infiltration through senators that are still secretly loyal to the Empire, conquering seemingly unimportant worlds, using unused experimental imperial technology, and while they would use old imperial Star Destroyers as mobile bases, their main base of operations would be in the Unknown Regions. They would be lead by the Knights of Ren, who are what I would call Force supremacists, as they believe that Force wielders are inherently superior to others and should rule over everyone. Originally being students in Luke’s fledgling Jedi academy, their belief of the strong ruling over the weak is what drove them to crush the new Jedi Order before it could truly blossom and subsequently join the Imperial Remnant. Kylo Ren in this version is unrelated to the Skywalker family, he’s just a promising student with a lust for power who went renegade alongside others, and Kylo Ren is his name for real. Second to the Knights of Ren in terms of command would be a council of former imperial military leaders and senators. Rey would be a nobody and nowhere near as OP in the Force, but is fully aware of her Force sensitivity and that’s what drives her to seek out Luke, to gain a better understanding, and she’s been gathering information on Luke’s whereabouts. That’s how she meets Chewbacca, now captain of the Millennium Falcon and Poe Dameron, his copilot and Finn, first mate and renegade stormtrooper. Finn defected from the IR because he couldn’t stand the suffering he inflicted when raiding worlds and kidnapping people to be used as slave labour, and has since decided to right the wrongs of his past with helping Chewie and Poe. Throughout their journey they uncover the IR secret plan to restore the Empire, and halfway through the movie Rey meets Luke, who is pretty much the same as in TLJ, a bitter disillusioned hermit who wants no further part in the conflicts of the Galaxy, but nevertheless agrees to train Rey as she’s driven by a desire to use her power responsibly, but the training is cut short when Kylo arrives after sensing her presence and offers to teach Rey true power, being impressed by her raw potential, and proceeds to kill Luke as a display of power, yet Rey still turns him down and flees. Now guided by Luke’s Force Ghost, Rey is determined to protect the Galaxy against the growing threat of the IR.
Whew, that’s a lot of text, I think I will use different posts for episodes VIII and IX.
Once Upon a Time in America (1984), directed by Sergio Leone.
An OK movie, however I found Ennio Morricone’s overtly sentimental score at odds with with a story that centers around Prohibition era hoodlums.
All I can say about Helen McCrory’s death is: poor Damian.
Come to think of it, I don’t know of any multimedia project that has come close to what Lucasfilm did with SotE.
Jurassic Park. It’s the movie that ignited my love for movies.
Fun fact: when I was a little kid I used to think all movies were directed by Steven Spielberg.
It’s basically the whole power must be used responsibly thing.
Not the first time I’ve heard about it, but yes, I’m a huge fan of the idea of the Force being inherently evil, which would explain why dark side powers are much more awesome than light side powers.
The SotE multimedia project holds a special place in my heart, because up until then I wasn’t really interested in Star Wars, and only had a passing familiarity with the franchise, and when my dad bought me an N64 console SotE was amongst the games he purchased, and the N64 was my first proper introduction to SW.
Because of the limitations inherent to the N64 console, they used slideshow images for the cutscenes whilst the PC version used CGI animated shorts with voice acting. I must say that the N64 slides have aged much better than the PC cinematics.
The score by Joel McNeely is awesome, especially because it captures the essence of SW without imitating John Williams. I read that McNeely himself was unhappy with the score, but I still hope he gets another chance at doing more SW music.
I’ve never read the book nor the comic book miniseries.
Over the years I have read that one of the biggest complaints fans have with the movie Alien 3 is killing the characters of Newt and Hicks in the very beginning of the movie, but after watching Aliens I must ask what exactly was so memorable about Newt and Hicks.
Hicks is a by-the-numbers military character, and Newt is an orphaned girl upon whom Ripley projects her maternal instincts, and judging by the outrage it’s like they were nuanced, profound well written characters that are essential to the story.
Snoke is nothing but another one of Abrams’ empty mystery boxes, and Johnson saw right through it.
I’ve noticed that many of the flaws in the ST were set up by Abrams, yet I hardly ever see any criticism directed at him.
Last night I saw Martin Scorsese’s The King of Comedy.
Todd Phillips took a hell of a lot of inspiration from that movie when he made Joker, and I think the reason this masterpiece was a commercial failure was because it was way ahead of its time.
I haven’t seen either of them, but I’m inclined to judge things on their own merits, not by association. Some creative people can create both brilliant and terrible works (or, to put it in terms of general opinion, well- and poorly-received ones). Tom Hooper made both Les Misérables and Cats. Largely the same team made the first season of Game of Thrones as the last. For that matter, both George Lucas and J.J. Abrams made Star Wars movies that were generally loved and generally panned.
Exactly. I have enjoyed most movies by Alfonso Cuarón, but one particular movie of his did nothing for me, Children of Men. Does that mean I should invalidate his entire filmography because of that one movie I didn’t like? Hell, no.
I am fed up with this relentless fixation on 1980s pop culture.