Sorry, I'm a bit behind you. Watching the kids at the same time. I do like it, and if you find an effective way to do it, I'd be pleased. I completely agree that he was a character that really clicked, better than any other PT character, and it's a bummer that he died so soon. This would still make him pertinent, as I feel he should be.
I like it. My concern is that the message might be confusing considering Anakin is mourning his mother at this moment. I enjoy the music and the voiceover, but I'm not sure it fits perfectly with the scene itself. Two thoughts come to mind: continue with this idea, but find ways to incorporate Qui-Gon voiceovers in at least one or two places prior to give the impression that he communicates often with him, or find a different scene to show Anakin regretting his attack on the Tuskens, maybe while confessing to Padme. I'm not sure if that would work, but it's a thought. Again, let me emphasize that I do like the music and the Neeson clip (from Batman Begins, yay!), but I simply feel it might work better elsewhere. (I always worry my critique may be offensive; if you are pleased with how it turned out, don't listen to me of course)
Well I can agree with more PT voiceover too. I liked what I saw TheCutter doing (where is that guy?). I remember him explaining Dagobah as a force magnifier via voiceover. If we follow the conventional order for the films, I feel it would be beneficial in the OT as well, though. If we rewrote all the films to follow the revised order, I think it would only be confusing.
I'd have to look at my copy, but I think they make a very generic reference to "that smuggler" or something like that. I'll get back to you.
EDIT: Looks like I'm wrong and there is one casual reference in the whole book to Han Solo by name. Also one reference to simply a "smuggler who once thought as you do." So still very minimal.
Not to my knowledge. My understanding is that George asked his ghostwriter Alan Dean Foster to pen a sequel that could be made into a film if the first Star Wars film did not succeed. It takes place on a foggy swamp planet because it would be cheaper to film in a foggy set and Han isn't even mentioned by name (I don't think) because Harrison had not signed on for a sequel. So while I'm not aware of a script being developed, the book was written with a movie in mind.
I guess we'll take it. Can't wait till its release in early 2014 :)
^Me neither, or me too, or I too, or whatever. I would love to see Splinter adapted especially, and would honestly like to see it remain faithful to the original story when there was no reason to get grossed out by Luke and Leia kissing and before we knew they were battling their own father. I'd rather have it grab the feel of the Star Wars sequel it originally was intended to be instead of being changed to better fit with present day continuity.
I really am glad. I enjoyed Renascent and the concept, but I'd love to see another flashback style edit as well. :)
timdiggerm said:
Perhaps there's a way to communicate that Padme is dying? I'm not sure why she would be dying, but that might work.
On the other hand, the fact that her husband is a powerful Sith Lord, apprenticed to the ruler of the Galaxy, who is also a Sith Lord, might be a good reason to send her and the kids into hiding. Adopting Leia doesn't seem so crazy, then, even if Padme isn't dying.
I know, too many consecutive posts. This explanation works if we show it in the..."revised" viewing order (is that an okay term to explain the out of sequence viewing?). If we go completely consecutively, it would of course assume the whole audience knows who Anakin becomes. The more I write and read in this thread, the more you have all convinced me of the right order to view these movies.
EDIT: Mrbenja, I'm not good at any sort of visuals, nor do I really have any decent software to even do a hack job. I'm glad to hear you removed some switches. I am not saying you need to do any further work on your edit because I really want to see it and I do love the look of the old Star Wars. But since we're discussing better integration, and because I do like modernization as well, I feel that more display monitors would look better, and perhaps a grey instead of red (as proposed for the Revisited wishlist) would appeal to me more. Heck, I even like the plainness of this:
over this:
EDIT: Found a better picture. Looks like there are more displays than my mind remembered, but at the same time, look at all those lights that serve no purpose but to blink. While a part of me likes it because of its nostalgic feel, I would love an updated version. I personally don't like the decay of the Empire theory and would prefer an appearance that technology had advanced in the Star Wars universe, even if the special effects are different.
Akwat Kbrana said:
From the ROTJ screenplay:
Obi-Wan Kenobi said:
When your father left, he didn't know your mother was pregnant. Your mother and I knew he would find out eventually, but we wanted to keep you both as safe as possible, for as long as possible. So I took you to live with my brother Owen on Tatooine... and your mother took Leia to live as the daughter of Senator Ogana, on Alderaan.
Of course, how a faneditor would go about communicating all that to the viewer is another matter entirely...
Is this from the novelization? It sounds pretty close if I remember correctly, though I'm at school and don't have access to it. That could be a good explanation, though more would be required, I feel, to explain it at the end of ROTS as well.
Now that I'm thinking about their being brother and sister early on, I think this makes it clear that Leia cannot be revealed to be Luke's sister when Padme gives birth or else it would both spoil the surprise as well as gross out any potential viewers learning too early on, were we to watch it in the 4,5,1-3,6 order (we have to come up with a more concise way of describing this viewing order).
EDIT: AHA! It is a direct quote from ROTJ! I'm so good.
mrbenja0618 said:
MrInsaneA said:
And you know what, damn it all, throw Padme in there to.
Poor girl either dies of a "broken heart" or (what will be in my edit) doesn't die on-screen. And then she gets a small reference in the final film?? Poo-poo. Have her next to Anakin. Maybe make her look a little bit older, I dunno. It feels wrong, but it also feels very right.
I agree! Everyone should be there!
I think there were some Muppets in Jedi, right?
Yeah, that might be a bit much. You did get an LOL from me :)
^Good, I'm glad to hear that. I'm still a little iffy about actually liking her inclusion, but as I said, I came here for variety, not the for only way to experience Star Wars. If you make it, I may like it.
As for Qui-Gon, I'm still interested in ways we could include him in the OT. For instance, hearing echoing words coming to Obi-Wan from Qui-Gon, much as Yoda heard from Obi-Wan, seem to suffice and indicate that they are still in communion. Phrases that come to mind include Liam Neeson's line from Batman Begins, "You were my greatest student." Maybe have him hearing Qui-Gon's dying words about "Train the boy" when telling Luke about his father while in the hut (and not Vader, since I would like to see a version that did not reveal that Anakin and Vader were the same when watched 1-6). I know I'm repeating a bit, but other possible line insertions could be during his pondering his own name as "Obi-Wan Kenobi...Obi-Wan," instead of Ben, and on the Death Star seeking Vader. Perhaps even while R2 is showing the computer display of the tractor beam locations, if the pause between C-3PO's line and Obi-Wan's "I don't think you boys can help me," Qui-Gon might have some important line to fill in the gap.
And now that we've brought up the unique watching order of 4, 5, 1-3, 6, perhaps some ambitious editor could even reorder the film numbers when creating the whole set so that they would be watched in that order. Indy 2 is a prequel though it never expressly says so. Perhaps saying "Episode III: The Phantom Menace," would not be such a big deal, as long as something at the end of one film or the beginning of another indicated we were going to take a journey back in time, even if in no other way than including it in the opening crawl.
Other ideas that have come to mind:
-Obi-Wan is already a Jedi Knight instead of a Jedi Tenderfoot ;) at the beginning of TPM as shown in The Coming Storm edit.
-"Your father would have wanted you to have this when you were old enough." Someone did a good job demonstrating this.
-For me personally, I'd like to see a grungier PT, while a further updated OT. For instance, I love how Adywan updated the Battle of Yavin briefing and holographic display. But other cheesiness remains, such as the Star Trek TOS style Death Star panels and displays. I'd personally like to see more holograms or at least panels that do more than have lights that blink for no apparent purpose. Simultaneously, I wouldn't want to throw it out completely, as it remains part of how Star Wars was originally defined for me. Just updating the tractor beam display monitors, maybe adding a couple of details here and there, etc. would improve it while retaining the flavor. With that, I'd like the PT to remain more consistent with that OT flavor; I love some of the shots done by bobgarcia for his Ep III edit, showing R2 accessing an OT style monitor on Death's Hand rather than a holographic display of Palpatine's location.
I know these are all extremely ambitious, and I lack the skill to even create a decent mockup still, but I at least feel I can contribute ideas for those more talented than I am to use.
I definitely agree with her not dying at the end of ROTS...makes a lot more sense...I see what you mean about ROTJ and I'd have to think about it. If you could pull it off in your edit, I'd find it interesting for sure. Would you use Hayden's or Sebastian's head?
Or with a really thick accent requiring some bad dubbing.
MrInsaneA said:
darth_ender said:
MrInsaneA said:
Qui-Gon needs to be at the end of ROTJ. I know, I know, everyone's pissed enough as it is with Hayden being there (which is totally understandable it doesn't make sense for his ghost to be younger.) but Qui-Gon is one of the few Prequel characters that actually resonates with the audience like the OT characters do, AND his role is important considering he's the one who started the whole force-ghost craze, and plucked little Anikan from obscurity.
That's as far as I would go in terms of integrating Mr. Jinn into the OT.
I've had this thought as well, but I'm not entirely positive I agree, though I think we should discuss it more, and maybe we can make it worthwhile. I completely agree that he was one of the most interesting PT characters; he had substance, was well-acted, and made the audience believe the Jedi were actually mystical and cool. I especially agree with the tie-in with the force ghost thing and as I said in my first post, he needs to communicate with Obi-Wan. My concern is that Luke has absolutely no contact with him, and he would simply wonder who this extra guy standing there is. To me, if there were some clever way for Luke to get to know him even briefly, then I would be with you 100%.
Who said Luke has to know? Luke turns away from the Trio of the Original ghosts, and Qui-Gon appears next to Anakin. Maybe puts his hand on his shoulder, if that's do-able.
And if Luke HAS to know....well I'm sure we can figure something out....
Okay, I like that.
TV's Frink said:
I never had a problem with the PT looking different that the OT, I always felt it could be explained by a general lack of decay (or malaise or whatever) once the Empire took over. Of course, that only works if you don't watch the SE versions of the OT...
My reason for disagreeing with this is mostly a stylistic thing. I always preferred Star Wars over Star Trek because it looked like a place where people actually lived. I wouldn't mind if Naboo was a more pristine planet as part of its little perfect culture, but everything PT is too slick and flashy. A nice opportunity to show a grungy place would have been in the Ep II cantina, but it still seemed too fancy and fun. Nothing ever breaks down in the PT.
MrInsaneA said:
Qui-Gon needs to be at the end of ROTJ. I know, I know, everyone's pissed enough as it is with Hayden being there (which is totally understandable it doesn't make sense for his ghost to be younger.) but Qui-Gon is one of the few Prequel characters that actually resonates with the audience like the OT characters do, AND his role is important considering he's the one who started the whole force-ghost craze, and plucked little Anikan from obscurity.
That's as far as I would go in terms of integrating Mr. Jinn into the OT.
I've had this thought as well, but I'm not entirely positive I agree, though I think we should discuss it more, and maybe we can make it worthwhile. I completely agree that he was one of the most interesting PT characters; he had substance, was well-acted, and made the audience believe the Jedi were actually mystical and cool. I especially agree with the tie-in with the force ghost thing and as I said in my first post, he needs to communicate with Obi-Wan. My concern is that Luke has absolutely no contact with him, and he would simply wonder who this extra guy standing there is. To me, if there were some clever way for Luke to get to know him even briefly, then I would be with you 100%.
I am wearing the wife beater Frink's mom gave me.
Thanks, Cobb. I don't know if this thread will get to its intended use until I (we) can justify its existence. I have to be honest that for me there is no definitive version of Star Wars. I came to this site for the opposite reason of many: I wanted to see as many different versions of Star Wars as I could. I may love Revisited and choose it when trying to keep to the original story, yet enjoying new effects, I also love watching different takes on the story. I really would like a version that fits it all together. You may not see the real OT, but ideally it would make a cohesive storyline.
mrbenja0618 said:
haha. I hear ya. I guess this thread seems odd because to me what you are proposing is the very reason any of us edit the SW films anyway. No offense though. Maybe good ideas can come from here.
Well, I suppose that is true. If this thread dies it's okay. But it seems to me that many people edit them simply to be better movies, often independent of any other story. I meant this to be the whole big picture thread where ideas could be discussed that would span the whole 6 films instead of localized single film improvements. But hey, if it's not a good thread, let it die. No worries.
While I am excited about your release mrbenja0618, let me clarify that the integration I mean is not including them in the same movie, but rather smoothing out the differences between the trilogies so they fit together better. I really do look forward to your completed project :)
You forgot who you were talking about. Math always falls short by 1 when talking about that guy.
So in advance I will make two disclaimers: 1) a similar thread may already exist, but I couldn’t find it quickly and didn’t want to pore through 20 pages or more looking for it; 2) I know a lot of people don’t like the idea of changing the OT at all, so this thread may not be for everyone.
With that, this forum has several other threads for ideas, whether they be simplistic and modest or radical and outlandish. I hope this thread can bridge the gaps between the two trilogies. As we all know, they differ in a number of ways, and I encourage any ideas to improve the continuity between the two. This can be from whatever perspective, such as only changing the PT to better mesh with the OT, only changing the OT to better mesh with the PT (I’ll bet that’s a popular category here), or compromise. This can allow for a 1-6 viewing, or a 4-6, 1-3 viewing.
I personally enjoy the PT in spite of its many shortcomings and inconsistency between the two sagas. I think that realistically it would be impossible to leave the burden of smoothing out plot holes up to the PT. Besides, there are elements of the PT that I do like. Thus, I subscribe to a compromise approach. I also think it would be nice to see a version that could be watched 1-6 or 4-6, 1-3.
My first suggestion is to incorporate some reminder of Qui-Gon into the OT. Most particularly, it seems like Obi-Wan could perhaps hear him once or twice throughout Ep IV. One of my first posts on this site included this thought. He could simply seem to be lost in thought when Qui-Gon’s voice comes to guide him, perhaps while contemplating “Now that’s a name I’ve not heard in a long time…” or on the Death Star while seeking out Vader. Just a thought, though I hope to come up with many more. Any thoughts from you guys?
Guaranteed to offend every nerd:
And the Trek version of Westboro:
I can't make out the letters very well in the upper right hand corner, but I think the first line reads, "The best quality." Under the big "Star Trek" reads, "Only quality DVD." It cracks me up that someone had enough skill to design the packaging and not know the different sources where they were getting their Star Trek and Vader material. Yep, that's high quality.
Scene from the above set:
