darklordoftech

SilverWook said:

The crux of the argument is this: Does the Empire fall in a day after ROTJ, or does it take some time? The Special Edition would have you believe in instant collapse. The original version mostly leaves it up to the mind of the viewer.

There's several sources from 1983 that suggest that the intent was always instant collapse. Making of ROTJ is full of references to the Empire dying with Palpatine and the ROTJ novelization ends with the words, "The Empire is dead."

Making of ROTJ and the ROTJ novelization confirm the death of the Empire.

imperialscum said:

darklordoftech said:

Am I the only one who understands how the Empire died with Palpatine in ROTJ?

No, you are definitely not the only one. But it seems there are not many of us.

Welcome to the club.

timdiggerm said:

darklordoftech said:

Am I the only one who understands how the Empire died with Palpatine in ROTJ?

Do you want to explain that? Because the EU perspective of a bureaucracy and military so large that it can function without its head for a long time is pretty convincing. It's not like Palpatine invented the Empire; he just militarized the existing government, and that military (and cultural change) don't disappear overnight.

1. The Empire depended on Palpatine's Force powers (as explained in the ROTJ novelization).

2. The people of the galaxy had come to hate the Empire.

3. The Empire without Palpatine is the Republic. 

Am I the only one who understands how the Empire died with Palpatine in ROTJ?

imperialscum said:

Well I don't care about the "official canon". I regard OT as completely canon. Then there are EU sources that I regards almost completely canon (by that I mean I ignore a few things I don't like within the source) such as KOTOR1/2 SWTOR, JK2 and JKA. And then there are sources from which I mostly only pick the major events and characters (example: Thrawn Trilogy - not that I dislike it, I just never got into it). And lastly there is stuff that I mostly ignore (FU, Dark Empire, PT).

Would you be ok with the ST contradicting the JK series and/or the TOR series? As for me, no matter how much I love something, I have no problem with something else contradicting it. 

I aabhor the very concept of fictional canon. It's all fiction.

There's a rumor that the Clone Wars will reveal Lama Su to be in cohorts with Sidious and in the know about Order 66. 

Although "Sith" might not technically be a prequelism, the association is still there, and there is the whole "unlimited powah" thing. In addition to that, post-ROTJ Sith would be like a dead character returning and wouldn't be very threatening.

The EU repeats the same story over and over, just like The Legend of Zelda. Specifically:

twister111 said:

 

darklordoftech said:

In addition to that, "Sith" is largely a prequelism, so Disney and Abrams might want to avoid it.

I can't speak for Abrams but after what Disney did to Power Rangers, shortly before Saban saved it, I wouldn't put it past Disney to embrace prequelisms.

 

I can't wait for "padawans" and midi-chlorians.

A personal curiosity: what (if anything) will the Jedi robe be in the ST?

I want to point out that nobody ever says, "Anakin became a Sith." (although he did). Everybody always says, "Anakin turned to the Dark Side." In addition to that, "Sith" is largely a prequelism, so Disney and Abrams might want to avoid it.

TFN goes to disturbing lengths to defend the EU and the continued existence of the Sith in it and their theoretical ST. They say "Sith is an idea." "Sith" is a sect, not an idea. They also say that users of the dark side of The Force who aren't called "Sith" will confuse non-fans, a claim so rediculous that I don't know what to say.

m_s0 said:

Baronlando said:

I fell down that rabbit hole last year and discovered that blog considers TFN too moderate and disloyal. They're about a year away from sending suicide bombers to simon pegg's house. JJ and episode 7 are already on their shit list.

What did Abrams do to deserve such fate? The nerds are pretty vocal about how he should ignore the PT, sure, but he's done a good job of avoiding passing judgement on those. There's no details on ep VII yet and Abrams has been very PC and very diplomatic so unless I've missed something they should pretty much love him for not siding with all of the people who bash the PT.

It could be that differences between the directing of Lucas and the directing of Abrams worry some fans.

Baronlando said:

I fell down that rabbit hole last year and discovered that blog considers TFN too moderate and disloyal. They're about a year away from sending suicide bombers to simon pegg's house. JJ and episode 7 are already on their shit list.

TFN keeps parroting "look at Marvel", "more Star Wars movies can only be a good thing", and "hating the ST is just like hating the PT (unless the reason for hating the ST is EU-related)". Prequel Appreciation Society (rightly) feels that TFN blindly loves anything with the "Star Wars" brand on it. TFN likes Dark Empire!

AntcuFaalb said:

CO said:

darklordoftech said:

2. Don't make any effort to be consistent with the EU.

I don't think they are going to worry about the EU, simply because the casual fan and most SW fans (including me) have never read any EU stuff so we don't know the difference.

In saying that, I expect to hear from the EU fans once the ST comes out, as I am sure they will be one of the biggest bashers of this trilogy for that reason alone.  It will be comparable to OOT fans like us bashing the SE.

I actually thought about all the battles on the internet that will probably be going on once the ST comes out:

OOT fans vs SE fans

OOT fans vs Saga 1-6 fans

Saga 1-6 fans vs Saga 1-9 fans

Saga 4-6.1-3 vs Saga 1-6

EU fans vs ST fans

Did I leave anyone out???   LOL!

lol, can we expect originalsaga.com sometime soon?

... or is that just TFN? :-D

TFN isn't originalsaga.com. On TFN, they embrace everything with the "Star Wars" brand. 

I don't care for "canon". At all. As for why I don't care about canon, why would I care about canon?

All I ask is the following:

1. No fallen Jedi.

2. Don't make any effort to be consistent with the EU.

SilverWook said:

That this was licensed and exists boggles my mind.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/THE-LADIES-OF-STAR-WARS-PLAYING-CARDS-/321169494684?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ac731929c

How do we know that it was licensed? Somebody could have illegally used the licensing logo.

Bingowings said:

I don't like the many colours of Lightsaber idea.

For me Republican Jedi (including Dooku and Windu) should have blue blades, Darths Vader and Maul should have red blades, Luke and the Jedi that spring from his teachings should have green.

Yoda and Palpatine don't need swords at all and only Palpatine can do the nifty lightning trick.

There should be a hint that the green blade of Luke is somehow not only a break with tradition but a mystical achievement (he had to think new life into the process of making his blade).

Green represents spring and rebirth so after the frosts of the decline of the Jedi and the fire of the Empire the green shoots of Luke's new Jedi Order should represent something.

If it's any colour of the rainbow Geonosis style battles just become a glowstick rave.

I'd say the battle of Geonosis is a glowstick rave as it is.

Maybe Luke's Jedi Order (assuming it is a Jedi Order) won't use lightsabers as much as the prequel Jedi Order did.

Reegar said:

Look at it this way. . . the soldiers who died in WWII saved thousands of civilian lives in the decades to come (Jews, Roma, Gays, Jehovah Witnesses, etc). If Nazi Germany returned, those lives would still have been spared those prior decades of evil.

I'll give you that.

I have found some EU that I like (provided future movies feel free to ignore it): Dawn of the Jedi. It doesn't copy the movies and I'm curious to see how the Jedi come to be.

DuracellEnergizer said:

 

skyjedi2005 said:

Bad EU idea from the 90's Palpatine's Son.

Playing devil's advocate here, I have to say that the Jedi Prince series was only written to appeal to kids and wasn't meant to be taken as a serious addition to the Star Wars canon. It's only the diehard completists who came later who decided it that it had to be shoehorned into a continuity it didn't mesh with.

 

I could not agree more.

Erikstormtrooper said:

I don't mind lightsabers and large-scale battles, as long as they're done right.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjhJcm-lpjc

 

I can't stand the Old Republic. I think it's one of the worst parts of the EU. It copies the movies to the point of being inconsistent with them.