chyron8472

michaelkirschner said:

chyron8472 said:

To be perfectly honest, I might prefer for the BD's main menu to not say "Despecialized" on it.

I would love to be able to give this to people (ie. everyone I know who remotely cares about Star Wars like I do) and for them to have no initial indication that it's not official.

Because I have said before that the best thing that can be said about a fanedit (though this is not an "edit") is that it doesn't look like it's fan made. And also, for me, Harmy is restoring Star Wars to what it should be, not making it his own, so I feel it fitting that this ought to be made to look as official as possible.

 

EDIT: Although, the idea of a Harmy title card before the Fox Fanfare starts at the beginning of the film, or else maybe at the opening of the main menu (a la Adywan) wouldn't bother me at all.)

 

Maybe I'm just not keen on the word "Despecialized" being written next to the movie title.

You would also have to label the disc to make it look professional. Do you know how to do that?

I can try.

I'd have to know what the special features are first in order to do it properly.

Then again, the AVCHDs of ESB and ROTJ have no special features, so they'd look different, and consistency between labels is a good thing.

I have been making some labels for the DeEd trilogy, but it seems the backs need work.

Yeah, like small unobtrusive text in the bottom right corner of the menu. Many games put version numbers in the bottom right corner of the menu.

To be perfectly honest, I might prefer for the BD's main menu to not say "Despecialized" on it.

I would love to be able to give this to people (ie. everyone I know who remotely cares about Star Wars like I do) and for them to have no initial indication that it's not official.

Because I have said before that the best thing that can be said about a fanedit (though this is not an "edit") is that it doesn't look like it's fan made. And also, for me, Harmy is restoring Star Wars to what it should be, not making it his own, so I feel it fitting that this ought to be made to look as official as possible.

EDIT: Although, the idea of a Harmy title card before the Fox Fanfare starts at the beginning of the film, or else maybe at the opening of the main menu (a la Adywan) wouldn't bother me at all.)

Maybe I'm just not keen on the word "Despecialized" being written next to the movie title.

pittrek said:

Guys, for the offtopic discussion you should really check these pages :

https://picasaweb.google.com/102542760950977079734/StarWarsSpecialEditionChangesHD?noredirect=1

https://picasaweb.google.com/102542760950977079734/EmpireSpecialEditionChangesHD?noredirect=1

https://picasaweb.google.com/102542760950977079734/JediSpecialEditionChangesHD?noredirect=1

Okay, yes. My memory is shot.

I remember the speeder being pink (especially the racing stripes), and I noticed that the whole dang thing is brown in the DeEd.

Then I see this in that comparison gallery (bottom is SE):

And my suspicion is confirmed. It's not pink. It's not supposed to be pink.

Damn you Lucas.

I have a (new) signature.

Thanks, Harmy. :)

I'm not saying the tan is wrong. I'm saying I didn't remember him being tan at all really. At least not significantly enough to notice the difference in skin tone between him and Leia.

But like I said, I saw this, and realized my memory must really be shot or else the 1995 VHS remasters just don't show this level of detail:

I only use the 1995 VHS's as a reference point for basing my memory on because I fully realize the GOUT is crap. That being said, between the GOUT and the SE's, I think my memories have been ruined.

I don't even think I paused the movie when I screenied that, if it would have made an difference.

I don't know. I may have screwed it up somehow in MSPaint.

Seriously though, I love what you've done here. There are places where I look at your remaster and then at Adywan's edit, and I ponder as to which is better color-wise (or even if the original version's colors were somehow off to begin with, as I assume Adywan does quite a bit of guessing, given you now have access to resources he may not have had) but I'm not really trying to nitpick and point out inadequacies.

One thing I noticed a lot at first as I watched v2.1 it is that Luke looks way more tan than I seem to remember. But then I was watching a certain scene with Luke and Leia together ("find the controls that extend the bridge") and I noticed how she looks absolutely like she should while he still looks very tan, even when they're both in the same shot.

So then I figured either the SE's have ruined my memory or else VHS quality is so comparatively bad that you can't really tell.

Well, maybe not yelling, but at the very least I got told off.

chyron8472 said:

Harmy, in this shot, there seems to be a lot of purple going on:

Harmy said:

Seriously, I'm not touching the colors any more. And why is the quality of that screenshot so god-awful?

Like I said. It's no fun.

Anyways, how goes the BD extras?

ray_afraid said:

Chyron- ...I've no idea what you are talking about.

Does anybody know what/who "Sith" really is supposed to be in Star Wars? I know episode 3 was called "Revenge Of Sith" but I don't know what that's referring to and I never really cared. Then I read in the Ep. 7 thread that someone doesn't want "any more Sith in the movies!" and I suddenly realized that I didn't know Sith was ever even in the movies. Can anybody clear this one up for me?

I was just extending Harmy's joke.

The Sith are the opposite of the Jedi.

Jedi are good; Sith are evil.
Jedi use the light side of the force; Sith use the dark side.

The Sith are also generally known to only exist in pairs: one master, one apprentice. The reason why is because they are treacherous and power-hungry. If there are too many Sith, then they fight each other, drawing their focus away from the Jedi, and so they keep their numbers small. This lust for power is also evident in that when a Sith apprentice becomes powerful enough, he likely kills his master and recruits his own apprentice (just as Palpatine explained in Revenge of the Sith).

Also, if the Expanded Universe is to be believed (ie. the movies and shows don't say this, only unofficial stuff like books), a strength of the light side comes from strength in numbers (ie. friendship), and so more Jedi means more overall light-side force power. Whereas the dark side has a limited overall quantity of power, so the more dark-side users there are, the more diluted their individual powers become (I read this in the Darth Bane books). So the Sith established the "rule of two" in an effort to keep the dark side concentrated into fewer people, giving them greater individual power.

There are people who sometimes use the term "Dark Jedi". I would think the original reason was because the term "Sith" was never used in the original trilogy, and so back then "Sith and "Dark Jedi" were somewhat interchangeable terms or else confused to mean the same thing. However, it seems that the currently held stance is that the Sith have their own code and history and such, while Dark Jedi are rogue dark-side force users.

Okay then. On-topic it is.

So long as I don't get yelled at by Harmy again. That's no fun.

valinkrai said:

I picked up the [GOUT] cut of Empire since I read time wise, the most had changed.  I honestly didn't care much about the differences, and for the most part, I still don't believe they change the films, though I love that you guys here are able to compensate for LucasFilm not giving options to those who don't think the same way as I do.

Personally, I'd like a copy of the original cuts, but not enough to deter me from purchasing Blu-rays when my DVDs have long since been scratched. Plus, the Blu-rays got me interested in at least seeing the historical cuts at least once, even if I was okay with changes myself. Unfortunately, I never figured out how to download Harmy's cuts, save for whatever is available through torrents, which I'm getting now

Empire had the least number of changes, so obviously your understanding of the films and their history is rather limited.

And you don't think that Lapti Nek is better than  Jedi Rocks*? Jedi Rocks changes the tone of the entire first act of Return of the Jedi. It's a stupid pop song CGI-fest which in no way improves the film--if anything the film is cheapened by it.

You don't think that Jabba being shown in A New Hope is a significant change? In the original versions, he was only mentioned in conversation until Jedi when we get to actually see him. When we do, he appears as this menacing, sadistic, grotesque creature. If he appears in A New Hope, he looks small (much smaller than the puppet in Jedi), fake, and in no way menacing at all. Heck, Han even steps on his tail and gets away with it. Not to mention that the conversation Han has with him is a repeat of that with Greedo and so does nothing to help the story or character development.

There is no reason for many of the changes as they do nothing to improve the films; and many of the inconsistencies and errors in the original versions have never been fixed by ILM---only unofficially by fans such as Adywan.

I'm sorry, but your argument is invalid.

* = for the love of God and your own sanity, OTer's should not click this.

ray_afraid said:

hey, I have a question I'm sure you folks can clear up for me...

What is "sith"?

Harmy said:

It is an anagram of the word shit.

Revenge of the Sith = Thong Shit Fee Ever

I can see both sides of the argument, and in the end I kind of come down on the side of indifference.

In ESB, Boba Fett didn't do much really. He was smart enough to realize Han was still in the area and only hiding, but beyond that he only told Vader where they were going in time for Vader to get there first.

I can see the problem with a slapstick death, but more because it's slapstick--not because it cheapens Fett as a character.

...I suppose where I really come down on it is that I like the original theatrical versions of the OOT, and so for me the issue is more about whether arbitrary changes to the death of an obscure character are warranted when they do nothing to help the plot or else fix inconsistencies. That is to say, Fett's death can be changed, but only if it doesn't change the film to feel different than it did originally. For example, putting more AT-STs at the Battle of Hoth not only fixes inconsistencies, but it also makes sense. And yet it doesn't really change anything with regard to the story.

Unlike the prequels, I don't feel that the OOT needs improving or fixing in order to become good films. They're great the way they are. Ady can change Fett's death to something that might make more sense, but if he makes changes to the story, then I don't want it.

Bingowings said:

Double Noon on the Dune Sea.

I would so totally watch that.

Harmy, in this shot, there seems to be a lot of purple going on:

I really just noticed it on Ben's left hand (right of frame) when he was moving his hands during "it surrounds us and penetrates us; it binds the galaxy together" when I was watching the other day. But when I went back to screenie the frame, I noticed it more on/around the table behind his hand, and on the metal stove.

TV's Frink said:

Socks with sandals break the rules.

fixed.

CatBus said:

I find the theatrical subs to be harder to read than font-generated subs.  But readability and pleasing appearance are not the point.  Chyron wants theatrically accurate subs, which I don't think is unreasonable for a theatrical reconstruction.  The only way to achieve theatrical accuracy is PGS or burnt-in, and PGS doesn't work everywhere.  You can't work around this by changing the format of a text file.

Ehh... I'm not so intransigent as to only accept one possible answer and be a jerk otherwise. And after reading the Project Threepio readme, it seems it would be possible (perhaps even fairly simple) to mux the "matching" subtitles into the film. If this were a DVD, it would just be a matter of encoding the film to a file while including said muxed subtitles; but this project involves PGS files, which from what I'm reading requires an AVISynth plugin to be able to properly use, and even then people still recommend using AVISynth to burn them in, which defeats the purpose of the whole idea.

I know Handbrake has a nightly build that supposedly supports PGS, but I tried that (with a different film on bluray ) and it doesn't really work.

I've been ripping my parents' movie library to put on their NAS, and my inability to work with Bluray subtitles led me to start using Subtitle Edit, which OCRs them and writes them to SRT.

But I agree that DVD subtitles do look jagged-y, and not as good as the theatrical burned-in subs for SW and ROTJ.

Yeah, I read that Harmy said it would. I was just sort of continuing the conversation.

The issue for me really seems to be specifically with Bluray subtitles (PGS) when converting to MKV. DVD subs would work fine.

Chewtobacca said:

chyron8472 said: This is what I was concerned about. If I convert the movie to a file to watch on such as an AppleTV, then the subtitles may not look right if they're not burned-in.

If you are converting what Harmy uploads anyway, you could burn in whatever subtitles you want.

Not with the proper typeface.

PGS files and SUP files don't seem to play well with the software I'm using... nor most other software, from what I can see from a quick Google search. Most software seems to want you to use SRT files, and that's just time-coded text. It doesn't retain the original typeface.

Not that I'm nitpicky about any other movie with regard to this, but I am about Star Wars and Return of the Jedi.

CatBus said:

Also this method would only work reliably on Blu-ray and AVCHD, it may not work on MKV, and it wouldn't necessarily work on software players at all, and it would also suck when scaled down to DVD because DVD subtitles don't have the necessary color palette (or alpha) to be convincing.

This is what I was concerned about. If I convert the movie to a file to watch on such as an AppleTV, then the subtitles may not look right if they're not burned-in.

yoda-sama said:

Since you mentioned Greedo subs, I still think alien subtitles should be featured in a forced subtitle track rather than burned in to our pristine picture (for the sake of foreign viewers, if nothing else), but Harmy says he wants it this way, so I guess I've lost out on this hope.

The Project Threepio subtitles (which Harmy is using) are positioned on the screen with burned-in alien subtitles in mind.

CatBus said:

Foreign subs for alien subtitles are also moved to the top of the frame.  In rapid back-and-forth dialogue like Han and Greedo, all dialogue is shifted to the top to prevent the viewer from having to repeatedly switch from reading the top to the bottom of the screen.

Also, I want burned-in subtitles for Greedo and Jabba, because I always remember that one particular typeface being used. The SE's and the GOUT don't have burned in subtitles for them, and it bothers the crap out of me that the typeface/position of the text doesn't match the theatrical release (The GOUT especially is annoying because it's letterboxed so the subs don't show when zoomed).

For me, those subs are part of the movie. They belong there.

Harmy said:

I was actually thinking about sometime doing my own personal SE using Ady's ANH:R (PAL DVD9 of course) and HD-fying it and undoing some of the changes I don't really like all that much.

I think I would like that. That is, having a "purist" edition that actually is purist and not just kinda.

Sort of a hybrid between yours and his, where we get rid of the errors, fix shot inconsistencies, update the look, and recolor the engines/lasers/lightsabers but undo some major changes.

Although, I'm not sure where I stand on the destruction of Alderaan being taken from SG-1. On the one hand, it's a cool explosion that really has the feel of an entire planet being blown up. On the other hand, it makes the Death Star explosion look comparatively weak.

You know, Harmy, I just can't say it enough that you've won me over with this new remaster. I was watching ANH:R some time last week, and part way through I actually switched over to SW:DE v2.1 to watch instead.

Ronster said:

I think it could be better to make the whole PT into one film and butcher the hell out of it (coming in under 2 hours)... There is so much stuff worth cutting out of them and just keep the main plot points.

1 decent movie or 3 rubbish ones.. That's the only way I see it to be honest

He can't do that because ANH:R is already called "Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope:Revisited". This means there are episodes 1, 2 and 3.

Fixing the prequels is certainly possible. Maybe not to make them wonderful films as are those of the OOT, but certainly good. I've watched Q2's, L8wrtr's, Stankpac's, Phantom Editor's, and Seciors' prequel edits, and some of them do a pretty bang up job at weeding out most of the tripe. (My personal preference being Q2's Fall of the Jedi trilogy, though L8wrtr's Episode II is very good.)

yoda-sama said:

[I] happen to live within 10 miles of what seriously is/could be the best theater in the USA (at the very minimum, it has the largest digital projection IMAX in the world... and it is in Oklahoma, go figure).

Do you mean the IMAX in Moore, OK?

I live in Tulsa. =p