Absolutely fantastic. You are a true master of dialogue. I felt tension and emotion the whole way through.
aalenfae said:
Right - it's either a mistake, or it's just really pathetically weak.
But... again, I really don't think there's a GOOD way to fix it. The whole end of the movie kind of falls apart if you take out Padme's death.
If somebody has a compelling idea of how to fix it, I'm all for that.
Why does it fall apart, exactly?
Trooperman said:
To be honest, I wish I could just cut out that entire part of the movie with Obi-Wan. It is completely pointless and literally serves no other function than giving Obi-Wan something to do while Anakin turns bad. But I'm already removing Yoda vs. Palpatine. If you take this out too, what is there left?
You're right, there's not much left. If the Doctor Maul idea (which I love) doesn't work out, you could leave out large portions of both Episodes 2 and 3, put them together, and call it a "Double Feature." Just an idea.
Consultor said:
What if... Every mention to Padme's pregnancy was cut out. So the audience would be wondering: "Is she pregnant or this is just fat?"
The true reveal after Return of the Jedi is that it was just fat. Luke and Leia are actually completely unrelated to Darth Vader, who cared entirely too much about a woman who had chub implants.
The problem with Yoda using a lightsaber isn't the lightsaber, it's the intense physical effort that he's exerting. Flipping around without a weapon is just as unnecessary.
The problem isn't what it's supposed to do in the story - develop Anakin's character - it's the ineptitude with which it was handled. It makes Anakin look dumb.
RedLetterMedia explains it well
19:36 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1MqksXm6Zs
SilverKey said:
- Personally, I like the part where Anakin says he wants to go help out the pilot who has fighters on his tail. It makes him a bit sympathetic, and shows that the Jedi and their troops have gotten closer.
But he's a clone. They're meant to die in droves, and the whole point for them coming along was to allow the Jedi to get to Grievous's ship. There is no reason for Anakin to waste time doing that.
That's how it happens in Kerr's Dark Force Rising, which I think is the gold standard of visual and sound editing for episode 3.
Just in case I never fully implement my ideas, I will lay it all out right here.
Make the prequels all one big movie. Call it Revenge of the Jedi, Star Wars: Obi Wan, or nickname it “The Hair Edit” since the main characters keep changing their hair. If you want you can identify Maul and Grievous as the first “Vader”or you can just call Maul Grievous or any combination of it. The references below are just for visual reasons. Dialogue changes are needed for Grievous and some droids but that’s mostly it, plus some rearranging of lines. The rest is existing footage.
Use the good parts of each film - use the podrace, duel of the fates, relationship between Obi Wan and Qui Gon, Palpatine rising to power, clones being created, with episode 3 being the bulk since it’s the best one. Honestly the only reason people watch the prequels, for those who do, is for Palpatine and Obi Wan. The goal is to take the emphasis off of Anakin, make Obi Wan a more conflicted character, give a character an actual arc, and arrange events in a way that makes sense (e.g. Red Letter Media would not complain that much.)
Jake Lloyd Anakin becomes young Obi-Wan. (bear with me.) Though Obi Wan was apprenticed to Yoda, Qui Gon was either his father or just the one who "discovered" him. Either way they have a close relationship, as shown by the podrace and freeing Obi Wan from slavery. Cut it down quite a bit to just the essentials, including the race.
Enter purely visual and musical storytelling (in my current form, it uses Duel of the Fates.)
Anakin (the real ep 2 one) has a somber moment at his parents' funeral (his mom's funeral, but there's two headstones there anyway... wth) which is the darker equivalent of Luke looking into the binary sunset. Then he rides away to find himself. Padme is just a local girlfriend he has at this point, nothing dumb with her being this “girls can fight too” sort of character.
Little does he know that his movement sets off Darth Maul (landing on Tatooine.) This is either because there is some prophecy, or Jedi are just really rare and any faction who wants them needs to snatch them up quickly. (also no Anakin Nazi march into the Jedi Temple) Through purely visual storytelling, we learn that Darth Maul has an army to call in, he calls it in, Palpatine is the leader of the Republic, he creates an army in response with the clones grown right away, and a battle starts on Tatooine/Geonosis. Darth Maul leads the Jedi on his little speeder bike, using the footage for Count Dooku doing the same in ep 2. They reach the hangar and the duel of the fates happens. Obi Wan has a genuine revenge motive now that Qui Gon actually became his father figure. Qui Gon still gets Obi Wan to take Anakin into his care, Obi Wan petitions Yoda, etc. Then we show Anakin floating the little ball thing and riding in an elevator with Obi Wan (no dialogue, just music,) so we know that he followed through on it. Maybe the elevator is reversed so they’re going down to a night on the town.
They go to a bar to drink. (part at beginning of ep 2.) Obi Wan looks sort of unorthodox, a “loose cannon cop” kind of guy. Keep in every fun character moment – “for a drink,”deathsticks, he’s a she “in that case be extra careful.”Zam was genuinely trying to kill him and no one else. This is his first clue that Maul is back. Maybe insert a little flashback.
Treat the previous section as a sort of cold open, like how the new Star Trek movie starts. Big explosions, tons of stuff going on, and then the logo comes up. For extra audience cheering and nerd joy, put in the monologue to Luke in ANH. “I was once a Jedi Knight, the same as your father. Before the dark times. Before the Empire.”BOOM, huge musical cue.
Do a short montage of Obi Wan tracking down Jango (ep 2), before he arrives at Utapau (ep 3.)
After that it starts with Padme telling Anakin that she’s pregnant (Grievous ship sequence is in the middle, not here,) and goes from there. Use her line “what about Obi Wan”here, and we see Obi Wan is captured by Count Dooku. Dooku delivers some exposition on what’s been going on, maybe insert his lines with “how could the Jedi come up with an army so quickly,””the Republic cannot be fixed,” and things like that, along with the extra sting of Qui Gon was his apprentice. Maybe use the lines “still alive”or “came to me for help, told me everything” in reference to Darth Maul. This place is actually in some sinkhole in Utapau from ep 3. His rescue in ep 2 proceeds as normal (with Jedi) with some of the dumber lines taken out, the action shortened, and the land battle not happening. Maybe Obi Wan actually calls in the coordinates or something via hologram. “Saving your skin for the tenth time”scene happens when they come back.
ep 3 proceeds as normal, except that Obi Wan researches Grievous on his own (use the Ep 2 scene of the locator droids or equivalent) and finds out he’s Darth Maul. He decides to avenge Qui Gon by himself without the Jedi Council’s approval.
While he is gone, Palpatine does his thing with Anakin, as it was before. Now it’s because Obi Wan was focused on revenge, and not just Anakin’s lack of foresight. Most of the Anakin/Palpatine scenes are cut a little bit, because the focus is still on Obi Wan. Also, the Mace Windu scene doesn’t happen yet.
Obi Wan finishes off Grievous.
Palpatine is kidnapped, either established by radio chatter or some scene. However, this is ALSO over Utapau instead of Coruscant. Anakin and Obi Wan are called in, as in the original. They have a less lighthearted adventure (no Grievous) where they find Palpatine, Obi Wan is knocked out temporarily, and Anakin kills Dooku – this time though, it’s his “turning moment,” not Mace Windu. Now he’s made the decision and has started being Darth Vader.
They take the ship down and the battle resumes separately (maybe Anakin boards a shuttle and Obi Wan gets on the lizard thing,) then Order 66 happens in earnest with the montage.
Ep 3 continues at a much faster pace. Mace Windu breaks into Palpatine’s office right away as he suspects him as being involved in the plot. Anakin takes him out with less hesitation. Proceed as normal from there (sans Order 66, Jedi Temple attack, and Yoda attacking the emperor) and make cuts where necessary. Explicitly attach the way Obi Wan “killed” Darth Maul with Anakin’s attempt to leap at him, and explicitly attach the Grievous revival with the Darth Vader revival. We feel sad for Obi Wan, but hopeful for the child he bears in his arms. Everything comes full circle and Obi Wan seems a much wiser man. Maybe even have Qui Gon as a force ghost or something.
Short version for core ideas: Jake Lloyd Anakin is "Young Obi Wan," skip over all of the political stuff, ignore continuity problems with the characters' hair, Darth Maul as Grievous, less emphasis on Anakin, more emphasis on Obi Wan, use flashbacks to get points across
It's from bondukkevin's Star Wars: The Beginning. I've been keeping track of it for a while, myself.
Yeah, Star Wars is not exactly about subtlety in character design. That's not a weakness, I would say it's a strength.
Keep up the good work! There's too many of these "ambitious" projects that go under.
As much as I love the visual changes, do you have any updates on how the movie is different plot-wise, anything to do with dialogue changes, etc.?
Certain scenes with Anakin and Padme (you know the ones...) are still painful to watch and should be cut or reworked, but this is hardly your fault. On the whole it's a fantastic improvement and I've taken the main characters seriously for the first time.
That sounds great!
Even if you think certain parts are silly, George Lucas had a grain of truth when he said Star Wars was for kids. I really want to be able to show my kids the "full story," and if that means using other cheesy movies, or putting in voices that don't sound quite right, then so be it.
emanswfan said:
Vladius said:
Hunger Games is great actually.
not when you've read the book
I have and I just watched the movie and it rules and it's a faithful adaptation. It doesn't have an indie soundtrack either - no lyrics unless you get the CD. Not comparable to Twilight.
Hunger Games is great actually.
My name is Topher, so I've always had some connection to this guy even though I know very little about him. This is pretty exciting, it's kind of what I would do.
Amen to that.
Hauh hauhh hauhh no noo, I'd be much too frightened to tease a rescorer.
Sounds an awful lot like a dictatorship to me...
fishmanlee said:
Vladius said:
By who, who's going to make them?
Someone wise.
You?
By who, who's going to make them?
Saw this on FE, I'm pretty pumped.
Does anyone know of good footage of Ian McDiarmid outside of Star Wars? My plan is to restructure everything into one defend-the-planet movie, with the kidnapping of Palpatine taking place near the end and the killing of Dooku becoming the true turn to the dark side event.