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Trooperman

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15-Feb-2005
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15-Jun-2015
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Post
#101949
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101949/action/topic#101949
Time
Erm, isn't that illegal?


Ha ha! Not if all you want to do is make a backup copy for yourself. And if I want to do more than that, I justify it to myself by knowing that since I already bought their disc, I'm not causing them to lose any money whatsoever.

And I didn't realize you lived in England, in PAL land. But that's OK; I can convert it to 30 frames/sec. easily.

As for the title? I think I'm going to use "Shroud of the Dark Side." I think that should fit across the screen (using the normal font).

Thanks!

Post
#101995
Topic
I have to write a Letter to George Lucas...
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101995/action/topic#101995
Time
But all you George Lucas haters out there: would you change your mind if Revenge of the Sith turns out to be a masterpiece, he releases the OT on DVD, and then he makes SE's of the prequels, fixing all the stupid plot points, and denies that the original prequels ever existed?

I think that when he gets some time to really think about things, he'll release the OT on DVD. If there's one thing he is, he's very clever at marketing. I think he's just waiting and waiting for demand to build up, and he has no need to release it now, with his prequels. He needs a way to make money later on (despite the millions he has already).
Post
#101943
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101943/action/topic#101943
Time
I can't post it here, but I can look into free filespace in the future. That would be really neat, though.

And as far as getting the original footage, if you wanted to do it for your personal benefit but I was not able to get the footage to you, then you could use "interlibrary loan" at your local library to request the official DVD. Basically how it works is if the library does not have what you want, then it mails out requests to every library in the state until it gets a copy. Then, they loan it to you for free. That's how I came to have fullscreen copies of the original OT, and also widescreen copies of the SE's.
Post
#101927
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101927/action/topic#101927
Time
But regarding the opening scroll issue -- You must have thought of this already, but I have to ask why can't you just use the opening scroll from MagFan's "The Clone War"? I guess I would like this because I really like MagFan's work on "Balance of the Force" but suspect your Episode II cut will supercede his in my book.

I don't really care for that title. The film really isn't about the Clone War, it's about bigger things. Plus, you don't really see much of it in this movie.

Also, I don't have a DVD quality copy of MagnoliaFan's film (and I don't want to try to get it through the mail, because I'm kind of paranoid about personal information being attached to this.)

If you find a way to re-do it, Shroud of the Dark Side would be best, I think.


I like it, too, partly because it's the only one I came up with myself! I just thought it tied everything up nicely, when Yoda said, "The shroud of the Dark Side has fallen. Begun, the Clone War has." It's more of a "big picture" title, like "A New Hope."

I'm 13 and I could do the title in about 2 mins in after effects. Just keyframe a mask with a bit of feathering and put the original footage in track 2, with a random starfield as a mask. Thne put your title "Shroud of the dark side" on top of everything and keyframe it with a bit of 3d perspective.


Could you do it for me and post it for download, perhaps


And again, I'm very interested in establishing at the beginning that Obi-Wan is keeping Anakin from saving his mother. Keep in mind when thinking about this that I can make Anakin say whatever I want, when he is not facing camera straight-on.

Therefore, here are some changes in how the scene in the garage will run:

Anakin: I'm good at fixing things. I always was.

Anakin: It’s all Kenobi’s fault. He’s jealous. He held me back!

Anakin: I killed them. (suddenly quiet, lamenting). I killed them all. (getting angry). They're dead. Every damned one of them.

The lines will be read differently, as well. Anakin is really, really agitated at this point.

“And not just the men.” (read with higher voice, intense). “but the women.” (snarling). “and the children, too. They’re like animals” (building) “and I slaughtered them like animals.” (screaming).

The "To be angry is to be human...I know I'm better than this" exchange is cut. Actually, it was never in the original film to begin with. But I don't want Anakin to be sorry about what he has done. I want him to scream, "I hate them, at the camera, and go to the next scene as he sits down.



Another kind of fun dialogue addition to the beginning of the saber duel:

Obi-Wan: We'll take him together. CUT to shot of Dooku looking at them. Voice-over:
Anakin: As you wish.

He loved to say that in the OT; why not tie it into this movie?

And as a final note, the scene on Naboo with the new queen has been cut. There was no critical plot info there, and while it would have been a problem were the romance scenes in their current order, we now have the scene with Padme's family to establish the pair's location.

Thanks for all the interest, everyone! You guys are really motivating me to work on this and to get it done.
Post
#101938
Topic
The Pope
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101938/action/topic#101938
Time
I apologize in advance for anyone I may offend below:

Quote
And by the way, the 'fetus' is a blobby cluster of cells for a good long while before birth


And by the way, what has that got to do with the question of whether it's alive or not? But don't let me stop you if you'd like to justify this slaughter with the argument that it doesn't LOOK human yet.

Quote
Why should a woman be forced to deliver a baby when she was raped?


Because KILLING it would make her guilty of murder.

Quote
THINK about if it actually happened to you. She didn't ask for it, she wasn't ready for it; but it happened. Will you welcome the new baby as your own or as your nephew/niece, grandchild, etc., knowing that s/he was the result of rape, one of the worst things that can happen to a woman?


Not neccessarily. I might put the baby up for adoption.

Quote
That's why I'm so glad that the right to choose forms of reproductive healthcare such as abortion remains protected. I certainly don't want the fate of my womb decided by people who make statements like the "can't keep her legs closed" routine seen here.


The "right to choose" to kill. The only thing we want to decide is that there IS a fate for the baby.

Quote
As for the guy who said that homosexuality was unnatural: I've a pet male peacock that regularly mounts a male rooster. The peacock doesn't like the hens ... just the rooster. My neighbor has two male lop-eared bunnies that also engage in homosexual behavior. Homosexuality is quite common in the natural world.


Well thanks for letting me know; that makes everything all right. If there are enough people doing something, that makes it natural. So my dog runs naked in our backyard and runs around on all fours. Heck, that makes it NATURAL for humans, too!

I think it shows how desperate you're getting if your opinions on the natural behavior of humans are based upon the behavior of your pet PEACOCK.

Quote

I've read all sorts of people who've tried to distort the bible to cover abortion. The fact of the matter is: the bible doesn't address the issue


MURDER is wrong. The Bible DOES say that, it's one of the commandments. That's hardly a distortion.

Quote
and there are as many comments in the bible which support terminating pregnancy as there are glorifying human life at every stage


The Bible does not support killing the unborn out of convenience. I can guarantee that.

Quote
Even though the people who posted the "can't keep her legs closed" comments will probably *say* they are merely championing personal responsibility, their words belie utter contempt for women and female sexuality.


Heck, you know, I really have to think about that. Because after all, it's your God-given right as a woman to be able to murder someone because it is CONVENIENT. Which is why most abortions take place, not because of rape. And it's not "personal responsibility" so much as the right for all human beings to live.

Quote
Ever know a woman who miscarried in the first month or two of pregnancy? I have -- there's no loss of human life involved.


There sure as heck is. Only in this case, it's a tragedy and the woman is obviously not to blame.

Quote
In my opinion life begins once an organium can begin to preform all of its internal opertation independantly, that is if it were to be left alone and no one aided it life by getting food or would starve to death. that is why i consider a baby life and a fetus a fetus. if you were to leave a fetus alone it would not be able to function properly with out the aid of a mothers womb. to grow a fetus needs already digested food, to function a fetus needs a blood supply that is not its own. that is why i dont consider contraception the begining of life. the birth is, thats why we celebrate birthdays not contraception days, cus your birthday it is the anniversary of your life begining. your only commiting murder if you forcefully take a life of something that would have been able to survive by itself had you not acted upon it. thats jsut the way i see it.


What about old people in the hospital on temporary life-support? Are they NO LONGER ALIVE because they are not living independently? Are they NO LONGER HUMAN? If I walked to their bed and shot them to death, would I be innocent of murder because they were unable to function independently?

Quote
When does life begin?...I can't answer that one

I can. It begins at conception, when the sperm meets the egg and completely different DNA is created. That's scientific fact.

From the MOMENT OF CONCEPTION, that baby has completely different DNA from the mother. It's another person.

It's alive, correct? Yes, the fetus has life. Plant life? No. Animal life? No. Guess what? It's HUMAN life.

And when you "abort" or end this human life, and it was INNOCENT human life, that constitutes MURDER, whether you like the sound of the word or not.
Post
#101910
Topic
I have to write a Letter to George Lucas...
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101910/action/topic#101910
Time
I had to do a similar thing back in junior high. We had to write a letter in block format to a celebrity. I wrote a very nice letter to John Williams, praising him and asking him some questions. I asked if he would write back personally.

I got a form letter from one of his secretaries, along with a little question and answer packet.

So if I couldn't even get a reply from John Williams, I doubt George Lucas even thinks about reading fan mail.
Post
#101734
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101734/action/topic#101734
Time
That's great. I wonder if it would work in the Coruscant chase scene.

It does work very well in that scene, for toning down the bright yellow and green speeders.

As a matter of fact, this desaturation looks great on every scene; I'm tempted to just apply it to the whole movie (but I won't).

BTW, I still say leave the muzzle flash out entirely. It isn't really realistic to have a bright white flash everytime a blaster fires. It's not like they have any powder to burn. The only light from a blaster should come from the beam itself.

I'll think about this.

MTHaslett: I would love your specific suggestions on how to pull this off. If it could be established early on that Obi-Wan is actually preventing Anakin from rescuing his mother, then the whole film would make more sense and become more powerful. I'm very interested.

Have you decided on a name yet?


It's "Attack of the Clones" unless someone else can help me out and do a new crawl for "Attack of the Separatists", "Dark Force Rising", or "Shroud of the Dark Side", all of which are titles I would use. But at this time, I don't have the means to do a new crawl.

Which of the CGI shots are you going to desaturate?


All of the ones that stand out to me as looking "CG", with overly bright colors. If it doesn't irritate me, then it will most likely not be changed. But definite changes are the first scene with Palpatine and the council, the Coruscant chase scene, the Jedi Council scene, the Palpatine/Anakin scene, and the droid factory scene.

Of the "half bluescreen half CG" shots, are you going to desaturate parts of the shot?


No, that would get really difficult really quickly.

And for the record, I dubbed the first bit of Anakin dialogue today and synchronized it with the film to see how it would work. Just a tiny clip in the garage scene, when Anakin says, "I hate them!" at the end. Man, my voice is hoarse after doing that a dozen times! But I'm really pleased and encouraged with the results.

I'm reconsidering and thinking that perhaps I'll do the dubbing first, mix that into the original film, and then start editing after I know what I've got to work with. Then, I can always redo some lines if I need to. But I don't really need to edit the whole film before recording the dialogue; I've almost got everything cut, color change, or dialogue change I'm going to do on paper.
Post
#101735
Topic
The Pope
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101735/action/topic#101735
Time
Quote
All I know is I heard that Ratzinger is 100% against female clergy, contraception, abortion, homosexuality, and many other things that groups have been fighting for for years.


Thank God for that. Homosexuality is not normal, it's a disorder. It's not something to be "proud" of. So are homosexuals automatically evil and guilty of grave sin? Of course not. They're human beings like the rest of us and should be respected as such. It's the actions (like marriage to one another, anal sex, etc.) that make them sinful.

And abortion is MURDER. Somehow, killing innocent human life before they even leave a woman's womb doesn't quite fit in with the Christian beliefs. A woman's right to choose? Heck, she already chose when she had sex in the first place. Makes me sick.
Post
#101589
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101589/action/topic#101589
Time
No no no! Sorry I didn't explain myself well enough.

Nothing is going to be black-and-white at all, but for certain scenes where the computer graphics looked too bright and phony looking, I have desaturated the colors by about 60% (differently depending on the scene), so as to mute the color palette and make it look more realistic. There is no loss of brightness, detail, or clarity, and I'm not changing any of the FX (aside from the flashes we were talking about). I simply experimented with putting it about halfway between full-color and black-and-white, and it looks more gritty and more like the OT.
Post
#101549
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101549/action/topic#101549
Time
The comment was made a while back (in another thread) that watching the CG computer graphics of the prequels in black-in-white made the effects look more realistic. I tried it and it was absolutely true- the black-and-white actually looked better.

I recently began to wonder, though, how well it would work to de-saturate the colors on some obviously CG scenes to make them look more realistic (like the Jedi Council room and the Droid Factory). It makes an amazing difference. It looks like you're actually in a real room- the bright, phony looking colors are muted and realistic. I am so pleased with how this simple adjustment improved these scenes that I am probably going to use it a lot in the time to come.

Another change, pertaining to the moment when Boba Fett says: "Get him. Fire!" If there was ever a moment when dramatic music was needed, that was it. So what I've done is taken a dramatic cue from "The Wrath of Khan" and started it when Slave I races towards camera, firing. And it was an amazing feeling to watch it. It felt like Star Wars again! (ironically enough, by using a musical clip from Star Trek). I've done it so that the brass hit two dramatic chords as the ship races towards camera, and it's synchronized so that the following orchestral crash coincides with the cut to Obi-Wan's cockpit. It works beautifully, and is really an amazing moment.

Why don't you just make a white "muzzle flash" picture in photoshop with a blue background, then chroma key it until you get a nice feathered effect, and put the opacity right down. Make this 6 frames long, and key frame the opacity and the shape to go up then down as the shot progresses. Then just put that over all the blaster nozzles. You can adjust the opacity depending on your view. also, you might want to make it more yellow.


Good advice! Thank you very much; I think I'll do that.

Technical stuff: The finished film will not contain 5.1 surround sound. I simply don't feel as though I can do a very good job on it, considering the new character voices and the amount of stereo-only material I'm putting in. So it will be PCM stereo, and I will actually probably use the audio from the pan-scan VHS (filtered) for the base, because not only is it uncompressed, it's Pro-Logic encoded. So the final mix might actually wind up with 4 matrixed channels; I don't know.

Post
#101558
Topic
A Big Debate for the New Century
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101558/action/topic#101558
Time
Exactly. Understand that much of what is in the Bible is symbolic and not meant to be taken literally at all. I am a Christian but do not believe that we were created literally in 6 days (with 7 being a day of rest). It may have been an expression for "a long time" (as was "forty days") at the time Genesis was written. It may have been more noteworthy had it said, "64 days" or 103 days". But "7" is a perfect and symbolic number in the Church, which leads me to believe that it is not meant to be a literal fact. Who was around back then to keep track, anyway?

And the Bible doesn't tell us how the universe was created; it could very well have been done with a "Big Bang". But the theory that there was just a "Big Bang", air, water, the Earth, and everything else just popped out of a void (for scientific reasons), and that little single-celled organisms "evolved" into humans with souls and the ability to reason is ridiculous, IMO.

I do, however, believe in the part of evolution stating that species unable to adapt die, and that species can improve over time.
Post
#101263
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101263/action/topic#101263
Time
Understand that I haven't actually cropped it yet. What I do is I use the unaltered shots for the rough cut, and then I make a list of the shots I need to crop for the final version. And what I'll be doing is taking just the widescreen, cropping it so as to preserve the exact dimensions, and then insert the anamorphic bars afterwards. I'll encode these shots separately as anamorphic before I splice them in with the rest.

I know that this is little stuff, but I'm going to try to raise the brightness on specific frames in shots when blasters are fired, to make it look more like the original SW. I think it'll look more realistic and not as "CG".
Post
#101215
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101215/action/topic#101215
Time
Hi Jeten San Hett; welcome to the forum.

When is the release date?

I don't know. I'm a busy guy! With any luck, though, it will come out late this year.

Is it going to be available to the general public? Will we have to pay for it?

I think what I'm going to do is mail a copy to Rikter (with no return address), and then let him distribute it as he pleases. I don't want to be selfish with this, but I also know that this is of questionable legality, and I don't want any personal information attached to it. I'll also probably include a message that says that the user must own the official AOTC DVD, for extra cover. But this whole thread is kind of neat, because you're influencing me as I'm creating this. At the end, there may be specific changes that can specifically be credited to one person or another, which I'd imagine would be fun to watch.

Also I watched the film a couple of times and noticed the bit on Kamino, where Lama Su is talking to Obi Wan, and it just slowed the entire film down.

I actually liked that part. However, I have muted one or two lines of Lama-Su's dialogue.

Oh, and another thing which I don't like is on Geonosis, there are a couple of shots of the Geonosians looking at Obi Wan. I watched the film and tried skipping through those shots. It worked a lot better without them.


Maybe you should think about putting some shots of the Anakin from Ep3 (if you can)? But I guess this wouldn't be loyal to the OT.


Please explain; not specific enough for me to figure out.

Are you going to keep the entire scene where Dooku is interrogating Obi Wan?


I haven't cut any of it yet; is there a specific part you'd like cut? Please suggest.



Lust leave Dokuu's duels as they are but cut out the lighting and Yoda's Aerobatics.


The whole duel is still a work-in-progress, so I'll let you know when I figure out exactly what I'm going to do.


-----------------------------
Another change I have just integrated: I always hated how Padme bossed Anakin around inside the ship on Tatooine (before they left for Geonosis). Especially cringeworthy was the line, "If you want to protect me...you'll just have to come along." And Anakin, who's supposed to be so cocky and strong-willed, smiles passively and gives in a few seconds after having argued the other side very strongly. I couldn't stomach the scene. But- here's where completely re-dubbing Anakin comes in really handy.

Anakin: But you heard Master Windu. He gave me strict orders to stay here. (very serious).

I've spliced in a shot of Padme's hand pushing a button- only I've cropped it so that her white sleeve does not show, making it Anakin's hand. And during this shot,

Anakin: Therefore, we're leaving immediately. Cut to shot of Padme staring at Anakin disbelievingly. Cut to the shot of Anakin smiling (which has different meaning now) and they take off.

A bit of humour, and also establishes that Anakin made believe he would follow Windu's orders, only to turn around 3 seconds later and break them. Padme also contributes; she just no longer completely bosses Anakin around.

Thanks for the input!
Post
#101175
Topic
Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released)
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/101175/action/topic#101175
Time
I'll invite him to comment on the specifics, but as I understand it, he gradually flipped the starfield during the length of the crawl so that at the beginning, it matched the background behind the title card and by the pan down, it was flipped vertically. It's almost perfect. I'm having some recompression issues in Womble that's making it look less than perfect, but once we resolve those, it'll be well-worth posting.

Oh boy! This is really exciting. I just have a couple questions:

1. Was this accomplished by taking frames of the regular starfield and the vertical starfield and slowly fading them together throughout the crawl?

2. By posting, do you mean through file download or torrent?

This is great; if I can get my hands on this, I'll definitely use it for my edit.

And now to the edit:

-drop the "I think" from when Anakin says it's a short cut. He's supposed to be cocky, right?

That's a good point. Why would he display a lack of confidence in his own judgement? He wants to reassure Obi-Wan that he knows what he's doing.

-drop Obi-Wan's "Good call, my young padawan" line

It has been shortened to "Good call."

-drop Padme's "R2 what are you doing here?" line and just have Threepio tell them he has a message.

Very good idea.

-drop the seperatist dialogue/scene on Geonosis. I think it's unnecessary (not to mention poorly done). The seperatists are already there. Why do they need to pledge their allegiance? I would only leave in Dooku speaking.


Definitely. I hated the CG creatures (especially the robot), and it wouldn't make sense for them to pledge their alleigance, already being there. This is a definite change.

-When Obi-Wan picks up the dart, I would overdub "Kamino". While it might not work perfectly, it would eliminate any need for Dex's "diner". I would still leave in Obi-Wan's search for information on Kamino. I know Cleveland is in northern Ohio, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't need directions to get there.


Earlier in this thread, I explained that I will be solving that problem by dubbing the analysis robot in the deleted scene found on the DVD. The robot will identify the dart for Obi-Wan, eliminating Dex and the diner.

-drop the assembly line scene. Show Padme landing and riding the conveyor belt away, then show her being caught by Geonosians. Show Anakin jumping down and being surrounded by Jango and droidekas. I'd even go as far to drop the R2 and Threepio all together from Geonosis (assumably they'd stay on Padme's ship) but this might cue music problems during the arena battle. I know that might be blasphemous considering the droids are always in the think of things in every movie, but I feel they added very little to the Geonosis scenes.


Look earlier in this thread. I have solved the problems with that scene. R2 does save Padme, but the whole incident with 3PO is cut, as is the droid's action in the arena.

I'm not sure what I would do about the Dooku duel(s).

Ditto.

Good suggestions though!