TheBoost

Bingowings said:

 

It ties in with Leia now being 'the other' that she would become impatient waiting for Luke and end up need rescuing herself.

I doubt that Chewie and Lando would need to spend long looking for Jabba (his Palace looks a bit obvious on a middle of nowhere planet like Tatooine).

 I think the Leia character we know would go rescue Han regardless of her status as "other" or not. I don't see any real tie.

Given that if Tatooine has no oceans, and is apparently near Earth-sized, if the location of Jabba's palace is secret, they'd need to search approximately 511,000,000 square kilometers.

Just finished this.

Honestly, it was hardly readable. And I dug the first one (and "Fatal Alliance" by the same author).

SPOILERS abound.

It's based on a video game. I felt the authors pain as he tried to describe endless variations of "Starkiller walked forward, killing everything and approaching the boss monster" Once he even wrote it from the boss monsters perspective, just to shake things up.

The action scenes went on FOREVER. I think a third of the book was about Starkiller trying to crash a ship, and falling down a pit took 20 pages.

There was a "character just died montage." I've never seen that in print before. After we think Juno died, he actually REWRITES THE SCENES FROM EARLIER IN THE STORY. He literally describes the film montage we would see as if we were seeing it, not reading it. I had to restart the page 3 or 4 times to make sure I was understanding what was going on. It didn't work for me as a reader.

Add to all that the fact there's no ending or resolution at all, and I was more than a little disapointed in it.

Well, I finished this book (months ago) but thought I should comment on it now for some reason.

Despite its derivative characters and settings, the final bit was actually a lot of fun, largely because I didn't know how it was going to end (ie: all the film characters survive and nothing changes, like the rest of the EU).

I'm looking forward to more in the Old Republic series.

Sluggo said:

I can't believe I'm joining this argument, but when 3PO says to R2 that they are trying to save Han from the bounty hunter, keep in mind that he was addressing R2.  If ol' goldenrod was talking to a human, he may have used 'Captian Solo' instead.

 To the extent I ever thought of it (very small) it seems to be a little pay off to the bonding going on in the movie. It starts with Han leaving the Rebellion, but ends with "You have to take care of her now" and 3PO is part of that family that was formed. So in the moment he calls him "Han."

TV's Frink said:

TheBoost said:

TV's Frink said:

But wait a minute - how was it a prequel?

It's John Conner meeting young wacky Kyle Reese... setting up "Terminator" (1985).

It may set up Terminator, but the event takes place after Terminator, hence it is not a prequel.

Stop thinking to three dimensionally.

TV's Frink said:

I reject the strict definition for Terminator.  While we are shown glimpses of the future, the majority (if not all) of each movie takes place during the present, making T4 clearly a sequel and not a prequel.

 Ah... but following T4 will lead immediatly to the beginning of "The Terminator." It's like a fucked up movie moebius strip.

TV's Frink said:

I agree.  T4 was much better than I expected.  It's fun, regardless of flaws.  And Q2's fanedit fixes some (not all) of those flaws in a nice looking AVCHD.

But wait a minute - how was it a prequel?

It's John Conner meeting young wacky Kyle Reese... setting up "Terminator" (1985).

But it's also a sequol because he knows he has to save Reese because of the events of the first film.

Ouch, my head. 

xhonzi said:

I haven't seen a lot of them (the horror genre seems to be over representin')

 Because a great horror film comes up with something really cool and iconic, and some shmuck says, "shucks, that needs one of dem oreejens."

"Solomon Kane" one of my favorite literary characters recently got a 'movie' and the director decided instead of actually doing anything like the many classic works the character was in, he'd completely invent an origin story that's basically the opposite of what the character was, because, in his words, "it's not fair to the audience" to not give an origin.

Here's Kane's origin from the book, paraphrased:

Kane was walking along and found a dying girl.
'The bandit Le Loup did this!' she said and died.
'Men will die for this.' said Kane

It wasn't much, but it was enough.

The following characters became loved by millions without origins.

• Conan
• Wolverine
• Indiana Jones
• Han Solo
• The Man With No Name/Blondie/Joe/Manco
• James Bond
• Shane
• Leatherface
• The Cenobite from "Hellraiser"

Sometimes origins are integral to the character and the story (Spider-Man, Luke Skywalker) but othertimes they are simply unneccesary.

Johnny Ringo said:

I snapped his yesterday on my phone.

...Catholic Royalist... ...anarchist... I guess I can see the confusion.

• Alien vs. Predator
  An American Tail: The Treasure of Manhattan Island
  Amityville II: The Possession
  Apocalypse III: Tribulation
  Butch and Sundance: The Early Days
  Carlito's Way: Rise to Power
  Dominion: Prequel to the Exorcist
  Dumb and Dumberer: When Harry Met Lloyd
  Exorcist: The Beginning
  Hannibal Rising
  Hellraiser: Bloodline
  Kermit's Swamp Years
  The Lion King 1½
  The Little Mermaid: Ariel's Beginning
  Psycho IV: The Beginning
  Retro Puppet Master
  Ring 0: Birthday
  The Scorpion King 2: Rise of a Warrior
  Star Wars Episode I: The Phantom Menace
  Star Wars Episode II: Attack of the Clones
  Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith
  Terminator Salvation
  The Texas Chainsaw Massacre: The Beginning
  Tremors 4: The Legend Begins
  Underworld: Rise of the Lycans
  X-Men Origins: Wolverine
  Zulu Dawn
   

Went throught the list of film prequals at Wikipedia. Of the one's I've seen (above), the only ones I thought were any good were the origin story of Kermit the Frog, and Zulu Dawn, which like Temple of Doom, is hardly a prequal. The rest, IMHO of course, vary between 'meh' to 'dear god why!?'

I think it's funny a religious terrorist like Fawkes has become a bizarre icon of freedom to some people (laregly based on the comic book).  I wonder if he and Che Guevara are giggling together in hell.

xhonzi said:

 

Boost says:

Godfather II is not a prequAl.

Anchorhead, the legend of Brian Daley said:

Godfather II is the gold standard of prequAls.

I'll leave this to you two to sort out. 

 Godfather II is not a prequAl, which is why it's so good. The parralel storytelling strengthens the sequAl.

If the flashbacks were by themselves (they'd be maybe 40 minutes long) and released as "Godfather: The Begginning!" I think we'd all think they wern't so good.

If, semantically, we had to call it a prequaal, then lets at least recognize that it might be the only good one because of how UNpreqaaly it is.

xhonzi said:

Which brings me back to the question: How do you know when you have enough?

 Its a question of mood.

Objectivly, there's rarely a need editing wise to show travel. A quick establishing shot and a character entering would usually be enough. But

Silverado's a fine example, because

• A significant part of that movie is the epic feel of the American West. It's a very self-aware Western.
• Traveling together is one of the main ways it establishes the bond between the four heroes, especially the end then they rejoin up.

So it has LOADS of horseriding with heroic music.

Easy Rider is a film whose main purpose is long shots of riding motorcycles with desert scenery. The sheer SCOPE of LOTR justifies much of its walking/running shots. You could probably cut 10 minutes from each movie easily just by trimming the traveling sequences, but something indefinable would be lost.

In Silence of the Lambs Starling travels all over the place investigating, but they don't show any of it because it would be counter to the mood of the film. Same with all the Indiana Jones films. Nothing would be gained by a 90 second mood piece of Indiana Jones in the car driving to Donovan's house.

Like with a fight scene or a sex scene, the real question is how invested is the audience to want to see this sequence go on compared to the rest of the movie.

Gaffer Tape said:

Well, actually, Temple does have one truly prequel moment, and that's the failed gun reach. 

 Actually, since that gag only is funny if it happened after Raiders, both to the audience and to Indy's expectations, I think that further weakens Temple as a 'prequel'

I'm willing to concede that the 1920 film "The Golem" is in fact a prequel and brilliant.... but its a prequel to a film that no one has seen in almost a century, and the 1915 Golem film is lost.

So I don't know if that should count.

xhonzi said:

I think your personal definition is too narrow.  A prequel is a sequel that takes place chronologically before the other movie.

Temple of Doom takes place prior to Raiders: Prequel.  QED.

Casablanca and Close Encounters aren't sequels, and therefore aren't prequels, but I think you knew this.

And, as to an earlier question: Godfather II?

 Since Temple's "prequelhood' rests entirely on that the date at the start is earlier than the date at the start of Raiders, and were those numbers different, it could have been a sequal, a sidequal, or a gritty reboot, I think Temple's status as a prequel is weak at best.

I'd also say Godfather 2 has a pretty weak claim to being a prequel. It's a sequel, that has some flashbacks in it.  Is "The English Patient" a prequel to itself? Is "Last Crusade" a prequel?

I'm still straining my brain to think of any actual prequels worth a damn.

Sluggo said:

 By that logic, Casablanca was a prequel to Close Encounters.

 It all makes perfect sense now!

doubleofive said:

I like how many different names the sets have had (Saga, Quadrilogy, Anthology). And that the newest one makes the most sense, with "quadrilogy" not even close to being a real word.

 Tetrology?

Has there ever really been a GOOD prequel to anything? Given their very nature aren't they as a storytelling device doomed to mediocrity at best?

JediTray said:

I humbly apologize for any rudeness I may have performed during my tenure as a discontent and rabble-rouser on these boards. My huge ideas and lack of follow through should not be blamed on others, and my sense of entitlement was unfair to all of you.

In closing all I can say is that of all of you, I will miss TheBoost most. His chipper attitude and great performance on Ripplin's trivia game was an inspiration to me.

I hope someday you might all find it in your hearts to forgive me.

Namaste.

 Gee man, thanks.

EDIT: This is what he was meaning to post before he deleted it.

\

 I never realized the table was kinda sci-fy designy. Just goes to show how well the OT stuck to the philosophy of 'tell the story, don't show the sets'

Next weekend my brother and I and our wives are doing a "I hate remakes" marathon.

Watching my favorite horror flick, Black Xmas, and my sister-in-laws favorite, The Wicker Man, and then their attrocius remakes.

The Haunting and Cat People. (the originals)

Two great horror films that show nothing.

And Simone Simon is smoking hot.

generalfrevious said:

Sansweet was complicit in the drowning of the OOT.

 Complicit?

I know he was a paid schill and mouthpiece for Lucas, but 'complicit?'

It's not as if ANYTHING HE COULD HAVE DONE would have changed the outcome. At most he could have stood up and lost his job over it, but at no point did he have any real say. 

none said:

But isn't it safe to say that Lucasfilm is also the organization which has done the most (#s) to preserve the original version. The GOUT copies sold in stores far out number the bootlegs and fan preservation copies ever created.

 If I stole all the food from an orphanage, put armed guards to keep other people from giving them food, and then give the children back a few handfuls of stale bread, I'm not exactly an altruist, no matter the #s.

Besides the quality issue, how else did the GOUT not help people remember the essence of the originals?

Taking some of the best looking movies of all time, with then cutting edge effects that still look amazing,  and making them look like poop is fairly damaging to their essence.