TavorX

Tantive3+1 said:

suspiciouscoffee said:

Tantive3+1 said:

There was a moment while watching Kylo and Rey’s scenes together where I believed they were going to become the next star-crossed lovers like Han & Leia and Anakin & Padme. Fortunately, it was nothing like that, and I could continue to enjoy the movie without walking out in disgust.

FTFM

I wouldn’t have walked out in disgust. I would have just seen it as another cliché repeated in the ST.

Even if it were the case, you have the film dragged into some love triangle square. Rose chasing Finn, Finn chasing Rey, and Rey chasing Kylo. Just no, please.

NeverarGreat said:
What if Han’s freighter was stolen from the First Order?
That would make Finn’s assertion something other than completely wrong, and it might just give the scene some suspense.

I think adding the First Order symbol a bit excessive in terms of suspense. I remember when I first watched it, my immediate thought was, “Oh no, the First Order caught the Falcon!” so that suspense already is there.
Having it where Han stole a FO ship just opens a can of worms that I don’t think you can fanedit and justify.

StarWarsReviewer said:

TavorX said:

I can only go as far to say that ROTJ is the weakest OT film.

Yep, weakest of the OT but the OT is still better than the other movies.

I didn’t like The Force Awakens or Rogue One. I think they are at best mediocre if not bad movies, but they are not in the terrible category. The Last Jedi is just an abomination, I can’t describe it any other way. Even the prequels look like good movies in comparison. My god, this was one of the worst movies I’ve ever seen.

I low-key think Rogue One belongs in the terrible category, basically alongside the prequels. However much I dislike The Last Jedi, I give it some credibility simply because whether I like it or not, I’m still interested in these new characters (but at the same time disappointed because I think they don’t move forward much when I last saw them in TFA). Prequel and Rogue One characters are simply boring to watch, and leave much to desire. TFA/TLJ give me more things to think about at least.

I can only go as far to say that ROTJ is the weakest OT film; the second half elevates it to surpass anything done in the SW films to come after.

MalàStrana said:

LuckyGungan2001 said:

StarWarsReviewer said:

I did not think it was possible for a Star Wars movie to be worse than Attack of the Clones, but there it is.

There are like, four Star Wars movies worse than Attack of the Clones.

I only count 3 ! What’s the fourth one ?

Maybe the animated Clone Wars one?

Both those reviews are terrible.
"The beautiful Princess Leia’s message was urgent. Her desperation was a call for immediate action, to save her, to save everyone in the galaxy, and Luke was ready and able to accept that heroic task."
Uh no, Luke told Ben he had to stay on Tatooine and help Uncle Owen. Wasn’t until Aunt Beru and Owen died did he decide to follow Obi-Wan. His main motivation wasn’t even to save the Princess, it was to learn the ways of the Force like his father. Like jeez, yeah the OT is amazing, but some of these journalists are embarrassing themselves by increasing the tint of those rosey glasses.
The second review is just plain awful too.
"No. Owen and Beru get killed, Luke arrives just in time to find their charred bodies, looks sad for a second and tells Obi Wan, “I want to learn the ways of the Force and become a Jedi like my father.” Then he f***ing gets on with it and doesn’t cry like a [non-gender-specific person] for two-and-a-half hours."
It’s as if the writer is implying Star Wars is some macho manly series devoid of emotional pull. I mean, Luke is whiney in ANH about wanting to get off the rock, but still wish washy about going with Obi-Wan to Alderaan prior to seeing his family die. God forbid I mention Luke’s “NOOOOO” in ESB.

I’m not a fan of the Last Jedi currently, and maybe that’ll change. Sure, point out the tonal and comedic differences, or how more market-heavy these films have become, but you can do that without this silly commentary that raises the OT to this untouched masterpiece, at least to the extent where it’s misplaced as pointed out above.

Canto side plot bothers me because the whole point of going there just seems so off. It really feels like, “Huh, what, you’re going to some planet you’ve never been to, to find some random person you’ve never met before, to do this really important thing; meanwhile you’re on a tight schedule because your ship is low on fuel?” Wouldn’t the smarter course of action to follow would be to fetch for reinforcements? I don’t know, it’s hard for me to rationalize the reason the story went in that direction. BB-8 sure was a miracle worker in this film, so it might as well had found some way to download codes. You know what?! Why wasn’t the plan to begin with? R2D2 saved the cast so many times because of its hacking/decoding skills. BB-8 looks just as capable. The plan should had been Rose’s job to cloak the shuttle or whatever, and sneak BB-8 aboard. Risky? Yep. But hell a lot less traveling and best of all, you have a trusty droid aboard the big bad ship to do some real damage internally, and maybe even give the heroes some time to stall the attack.

Going to some unknown place for this unknown person just doesn’t work.

SilverWook said:

I think I heard audible gasps in the theater during that shot.

I was one of those people! It was worth the theater experience just for that moment. Kinda similar to when the Falcon is first revealed in full view in TFA, but this scene was way more satisfying for the “gasp” effect from me and many other audience members. Loved it!

MalàStrana said:

TavorX said:
he is definitely the best Yoda on-screen since the OT.

The PT CGI model is very good. So the best Yoda since the OT is in ROTS.

The best puppet representation of Yoda since ESB & ROTJ if that sounds better to you.

natedeug said:

I enjoyed the movie more on second viewing, which was a pleasant surprise. I also seem to be in the minority when I say that I loved Yoda here. Maybe he looked a little too muppety in order to invoke nostalgia, but I think this is the best he’s looked since RotJ. And his mannerisms were way more on point. He felt old and goofy again, instead of moody and slick. On the whole, I’m happy to see the series testing new waters instead of re-treading the same pool. Mixed metaphors aside, I didn’t enjoy it as much as TFA, but thought it far outshined Rogue One.

I actually applaud for the effort done with Yoda in that scene. That said, when he first appears, it looks really bad for some reason, but I’ve only seen it once so I can’t say why it appeared so off. Maybe it was simply the bright(?) green color of him standing out so much under the dark. But once the bright fire is behind him, he is definitely the best Yoda on-screen since the OT.

After mulling over it some more, my view this film inches even more towards disappointment. The main crux for me all comes down to Luke and Kylo’s past. Okay so, Vader has tortured Leia, has blown up Leia’s home planet, has killed many of his fellow Rebel friends, has tortured Han and sent to Jabba’s, has sliced Luke’s hand off, etc. Vader has done some really horrible and twisted deeds, and Luke’s idealism never faltered, even when he was being electrocuted by the Emperor. "Father please!"
Luke’s unwavering determination and faith in his father to have the capacity to turn to the light was what finally convinced Vader to overthrow his master.
NOW…
An older, supposed wiser, Luke wants to murder his nephew in his sleep because he ‘felt’ some darkness in Kylo’s mind?? This isn’t even some random padawaan; his own family! Leia’s and Han’s! How the hell was he going to rationalize this act of murder to them?? Not without lying you couldn’t! I’m not even convinced or shown how Kylo was an issue in Luke’s academy prior to scary Luke the executioner shows up at Kylo’s bedside.
I mean, how backwards is it to consider now that of all people, HAN SOLO, was the one that held onto the idea that his son was still there? I just don’t think Luke was written correctly. The ‘correct’ Luke would do anything, I mean anything, to figure out how to redeem Kylo. Fine, Luke goes into Exile, and studies the teachings of the Force even further during this time. But no, Luke does nothing for all these years. You can still have an interesting element of how legends aren’t always great, just from the fact alone that he failed to train Kylo properly, but oh gosh, it doesn’t have to go against his character!

Due to this, I really think almost everything in TLJ starts to fall apart at the seams. TFA, though criticize for legitimate reasons, was overall received with praise. So it almost feels like a slap in face for the people like me that stood behind TFA. I truly thought the new trilogy was heading into something interesting, and even if it was old-retreads, I could at the very least enjoy seeing these new characters, like Rey, develop. But as I mentioned in another post, it doesn’t really feel like any of these main characters moved forward. The second act should be a smaller contained movie that pushes the characters to suffering and agony until they rise stronger than before with new wisdom; here our characters, especially apparent in Finn’s arc, they basically struggle with pretty much the same issues they had in TFA. Why?

Jackpumpkinhead said:
Your one of those…

Curious what you imply by that.

It’s so odd to say it, but AOTC sold me on Star Warsy gambling hub; TLJ’s casino was like we took a time machine to the 1920’s and dropped aliens into it.
Also, I would LOVE to see someone fanedit podracers into the scene where the initial space horses are revealed.

Ryan said:

The prequels are terrible movies. And I even knew that back at the time even though most people seemed to love them at the time. But the terrible prequels never RUINED the Original Trilogy for me.

Funny enough though, the mantra for many fans has been that Lucas ruined their childhood because of the prequels. Anakin is whiney, Yoda is a CGI jumping frog, Padme dying too soon in the timeline, Jedi are idiots, etc. Things that undercut the things the OT had.

Personally, I think this new trilogy at least makes an effort to honor the OT; little things such as getting close to OT’s Yoda way of moving like a puppet. They also know to hold back, like with Luke. Inner child me wanted to see Luke actually duel with a lightsaber. Many people wanted badass Vader, which they got in Rogue One, but count me in the minority that didn’t like it. So I’m glad the writers didn’t give into temptation to show Luke go ape-shit, a la prequel Yoda.

My main issue is that they don’t seem to do well in moving the overall story forward surrounding the new characters. As some point out, it feels like we’re in the same spot when we left off in TFA. We already had the whole Finn struggling to fight or flee plotline. We already had Rey and Kylo face each other and leaving each other with basically the same mindsets. Rey is a ray of sunshine goodness, and Kylo is a black pit of anger and power hungry as always. The main highlights for me were the OT characters like Luke and Yoda. Leia, well, I’m not sure what to think given she lives.

Yoda Is Your Father said:

Does anybody have anything good to say about the finale in which the star destroyer gets totalled by Laura Dern light-speeding through it and Finn/Rose/Phasma being the only survivors then BB8 piloting an AT-ST?

Come at me with positivity about that whole scene, I could do with a laugh.

I was absolutely left stunned with that sacrifice scene; I could feel the whole theater in such awe of that visual! That’s the first time a movie visually surprised me in that way. Usually, eye candy to me makes my eye roll because it’s just there for a cool factor with little purpose. Here, there was more emotion behind it, so I really loved that moment.

Oh and BB-8 with the Walker caught me by surprise too; I really thought it was going to be the codebreaker.

So I belonged to the camp that didn’t mind TFA. I believed TFA set up very interesting high stakes for TLJ. For one, given that the Republic was eradicated by the First Order, I was hoping it would show the true terror First Order would have over the galaxy. However, I’m not really feeling its presence or threat. Because of this, I don’t feel that invested into this “war”. Where’s the race against time to desperately stop the FO
from occupying former Republic territories? I know that the FO is supposed to be much smaller than the Empire, but there’s no indication that they’re much of a threat. In ANH, Stormtroopers are occupying Tatooine. You learn that they have a terrible weapon that spreads fear across the galaxy. In ESB, they snuff out the Rebels, cause them to scatter, and they also infiltrate Bespin; all civilians flee in panic when they know the Empire is present. In ROTJ, the Empire is using Endor for resources and not giving a shit about the present population of Ewoks.

I would go as far to say that TFA showed a much fierce First Order. Hell, they killed an entire camp of people in the first 10min or so, and then later on invade Maz’s castle. Most of all, they wiped out the current seat of government for most of the galaxy.

TLJ? All that tension building up went away because they only posed a threat to the Resistance. They seriously sent their best toys all at once against another faction. First we’re stuck for almost the entire film in space in a boring slog of Snoke’s ship shooting the Resistance cruiser. Finally near the end, they bring out the other fun toys to an abandoned Rebel base. Seriously feels like I’m watching a movie where two kids are playing with their Lego sets. Here’s the bad guys cause they’re bad, and here’s the good guys cause they’re good. Now shoot!

It just leaves a sour taste in my mouth cause TFA set up this power vacuum that basically put the First Order on top once the Republic vanished. I wanted to see how far and wide their power was. The closest we got was that Casino planet but I don’t think it directly tied anything to the First Order. Just some random aristocrat planet that supplied weapons to both sides. I suppose the only interesting aspect is that it’s not simply the First Order that’s the problem, but it’s the actual war between the two sides that cause poverty. But er… We’re supposed to feel good about the Resistance given how that kid at the end looks up to the stars admiring them even though they play a role in his place in society.

DuracellEnergizer said:

TavorX said:

God, I really never bought the chemistry between Superman and Louis here at all; it was more like, “Hey this is Superman, and this Louis. Remember how they’re supposed to be together? Well, they just are!”

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lois

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_(given_name)

You got me.

Count me in as yet another, overall satisfied, viewer of Wonder Woman!

THIS is how the DC line up of movies should had been, as we lead up to Justice League. I really felt that there was an emotional core to this film not really ever expressed in Man of Steel or Batman vs Superman. God, I really never bought the chemistry between Superman and Louis here at all; it was more like, “Hey this is Superman, and this Louis. Remember how they’re supposed to be together? Well, they just are!” In Wonder Woman, I was WAY more invested in the chemistry between Diana and Steve here. They’re talking to each other, working together, FIGHTING together, or DOING WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE!
Was this film flawless? No, not really. It could do less with some annoying slow-mo scenes (just let the scene play out in real time for crying out loud), or how underwhelming certain villains were (the fight at the end is rather cheesy, but I’ll take it over the mess in Man of Steel where CITY DESTRUCTION porn is everywhere or in BvS where it’s CITY DESTRUCTION AND BIG CGI MONSTER FIGHT). But what saves this movie, is that emotional draw to it. I was so worried that Wonder Woman would be too perfect and that nothing really horrible would happen to her here, but I’m pleased to say that there was enough that happens where you can see the shift in character development take form. It isn’t super AMAZING, but it’s sufficient to where there was investment in the character.

7/10.

suspiciouscoffee said:
I’m probably still going to skip the JL movie though, and any other DCEU movie without Patty Jenkins’ name on it 😛

Yeah, all things considered, I’m not really psyched for Justice League either. Gleaning from the trailers, it looks like more or less the same of what we’ve seen in Man of Steel or Batman vs Superman; just your typical and goofy action popcorn flick. Wonder Woman works so well because it’s a lot more personal and doesn’t rely on symbols to sell the heroes; the actions and values of Wonder Woman were far more convincing to me without it feeling ham-fisted with “THIS IS OUR SAVIOR CAUSE HE HAS A HOPE SYMBOL” schlock.

DuracellEnergizer said:

Lord Haseo said:

Being a Sith is far more than using the Dark Side; it’s being committed to it until the last sliver of life leaves a Sith’s body.

Precisely why the Sith from TPM-onward bore me.

How dare you think Darth Vader boring! /s

dahmage said:

TavorX said:

yhwx said:

The prequels will be terrible

I believe you really meant, ridiculous.

I don’t believe in anything anymore.

Well, since hope is officially dead because of the inevitable doomsday upon us, I don’t blame you. Why do you deserve this? Ask yourself this until your last breath, preferably on a Wednesday to make it that more painful.

yhwx said:

The prequels will be terrible

I believe you really meant, ridiculous.

Can’t wait for the sequels and prequels to emerge from this crafty tailor.

Lord Haseo said:

TavorX said:

Lord Haseo said:

TavorX said:

Rogue One’s Vader is the kind of Vader I expect in the timeline closer to RotS. It’s too jarring to see nimble Vader so close to ANH. But I mean, I wouldn’t mind a Vader film around that timeline, hunting Jedi.

Using one handed blade work isn’t being nimble; jumping all over the place and running swiftly is being nimble as far as the dictionary is concerned.

You’re right.
Fluid would be the better word.

I would probably agree with you if we had a scene of slaughtering Rebels in the OT. Such a scene would have been shot in a completely different from the Vader vs Ben duel for a myriad of reasons. The most pertinent of which is that you don’t have to develop the choreography around Sir Alec Guinness.

I see where you’re coming from, but it’s not so much having to do with the Ben duel. And true, there isn’t a Vader-Rebel slaughter fest in the OT, however, there’s much to be said in how Vader deals with normal infantry. From the start of ANH, who takes out a band of Rebels, no larger than the amount from Rogue One? Stormtroopers. Vader strangles only one Rebel and tosses him aside through sheer strength (not even using the Force overtly!)
In ESB, while it’s unclear if Vader and his ground troopers came across any Rebel resistance, the fact remains Vader took a group of troopers with him to take out remaining forces on Hoth. Then with his encounter with Han Solo, he never even used his saber to block blaster fire. He’s really restrained in his tactics.

What I’m trying to get at is that I’m more fond of the idea of OT Vader that only used his saber against force users. If there are normal Rebels to take care of, he uses stormtroopers. The fluid combat shown in Rogue One just begs the question why didn’t Vader use his one-hit wonder skills against a similar number of foes, like in ANH? I would like to think that as Vader aged, the more limited his skill with a lightsaber diminished but sufficient enough to go against other duelists and not so much against overwhelming and disposable forces. That’s what the stormtroopers are for and seems pretty evident that this is the case for the OT and should had also applied to RO given the extremely tiny time gap between the films. This is why it’s jarring to me, especially watching them back to back. Again, RO’s Vader is suited better for a timeline closer to RotS, IMO.

Lord Haseo said:

TavorX said:

Rogue One’s Vader is the kind of Vader I expect in the timeline closer to RotS. It’s too jarring to see nimble Vader so close to ANH. But I mean, I wouldn’t mind a Vader film around that timeline, hunting Jedi.

Using one handed blade work isn’t being nimble; jumping all over the place and running swiftly is being nimble as far as the dictionary is concerned.

You’re right.
Fluid would be the better word.

Rogue One’s Vader is the kind of Vader I expect in the timeline closer to RotS. It’s too jarring to see nimble Vader so close to ANH. But I mean, I wouldn’t mind a Vader film around that timeline, hunting Jedi.