This user has been banned.
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| 35mm straightened & stretched & normalized from the previously posted sample |
Looks good!
Kingherb said:
… if you look at the close up of luke with the jpg dnr applied he has plastic hair.
Dek Rollins said:
I was thinking the same thing, … rather I thought Owen’s beard looked like smeared paint.
Just for clarification:
The Luke picture was applied JPEG-DNR to the full size. The Uncle Owen picture used the newer technique of applied JPEG-DNR to double it’s size (and then reduced back to normal size). Note the results difference.
A different matter is Owen’s beard, which has Blu-ray crush problems. In the beard’s shadow area, it’s a flat color missing most of the BLUE and GREEN components (unrelated to any application).
Whoa!! I can hardly wait to peruse those …
… Hey! I can’t see the frames clearly!! Who’s got the shaky hands?!?
Mr. Spock, what can your Vulcanian eyes tell us?
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| “Hmmmph … poor photography …” |
| “Now, if you’ll excuse me, I must attend to the underwear changing.” |
Wazzles said:
Maybe that’s why Owen looks so off to me. Could you try it on that shot at the dinner table?
Sure! With the same settings . .
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@ DrDre
While doing the above, I tried different instances of JPEG-DNR: 1 application on “high”; 4 repeat applications on “low”; a split-RGB application – RED on low, GREEN on normal, BLUE on high (for progressively worse damage). Unfortunately, all the instances looked identical when inspecting pixels at high magnification.
Thanks for the integer/double explanation. In reconsideration of color-depth, although it’s good for number precision, it would be a lost cause due to down-rez rounding or truncation that would lose most or all that pixel precision anyway.
Rather, how about the resolution approach? If resolution were doubled (not pixel-doubling, but a standard averaging [not “smart resize”] for minimal processing to the original pixels), the new pixels between the original pixels would better catch your color regrade. Then, on downsizing, that new pixel information would distributed into the neighboring, original pixels. (If that would prove workable but insufficient, various resizers could be tested for both up-rez & down-rez to a best result.)
Here’s a test using that approach – with JPEG Artifact Remover on “maxium”, and using weighted average for both up and down resizing . .
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| . . . . . . . . . . . . . . color regrade . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . with up-rez / JPEG-DNR max / down-rez |
See how this up-rez/down-rez method keeps more detail, even at the highest DNR setting, than the previous, direct application at the next lower DNR setting.
(Note that the original Blu-ray has R/G/B-crush on this shot, which results in only the red showing in the beard shadow, looking quite flat. Also, a DNR-pass [a la Spaced Ranger?] on the Blu-ray to reduce or eliminate those anomalies will prevent your regrade-pass from bringing them out even stronger.)
DrDre said:
The corrections with the algorithm are always done at an “infinite” color depth.
So, does that mean from a 24-bit (R-8, G-8, B-8), the color-depth is increased to, for example, 48-bit (R-16, G-16, B-16)? [Details are beyond me and this laptop.] 😃
… in some cases “stressed” color may be a problem, especially with color crush, blown out colors, and compressed images, … you may have actually smoothed skin texture reconstructed by the color correction algorithm.
I looked at the original Blu-ray (posted previously) and saw that you were starting off with Lucasfilm stressed color®. Your regrade just brought it out stronger (mostly from the contrast, it seems) . .
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| . . . . . . . . original Blu-ray . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . color regrade . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . color regrade w/JPEG-DNR |
Since it’s damaged to begin with, maybe a first step could be JPEG-DNR to the original, and then the regrade?
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| . . . . . . . . original Blu-ray . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . original Blu-ray w/JPEG-DNR |
Just an observation . .
I’ve found that color correction, especially where color results vary widely from the source, cause stressed color. That is, there are large “steps” between neighboring-pixel colors – from those that are affected a little to those that are affected allot. This effect may also vary across the individual R-G-B layers. It almost looks like artificial grain has been applied. I tried the JPEG Artifact Removal function in my paint program that I surmise looks for out-of-place pixels normally found in jpeg compression and massages them back into place . .
I like this particular “noise reduction” because it does it’s job with very little effect on actual (as opposed to perceived) sharpness. However, this whole problem might be avoided by first expanding the color-depth, then doing the corrections, and finally reducing back to the original color-depth. (I don’t have the hardware/software to test the effectiveness of that procedure. Can anyone try it?)
I guess you read early on in this thread about Smilebox®? Oops, those pictures are no longer there – THANK YOU, Imageshack! : P
It is just a wrong simulation of the real thing, because . .
captainsolo said:
The screen curvature should not cause distortion, stretching or cropping, especially since this is a single projector/single film Cinerama release.
I had suggested using a 3D rendering program (also back there) to map out a theater screen as viewed from the best seat in the house, for a more accurate Cinerama experience (I never did it … didn’t have the time … but linked to a really good program, now freeware, that could do the job).
Any way could you find and post the SK Archives pictures, too, which you used to adjust those 3 Blu-ray snapshots, for comparison? I only ask because the opening-titles-comparison text isn’t white, as I think it would be. The rest look good, needing only touch-ups to make the greys non-tinted.
@ DrDre
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And hopefully not too manual-work-intensive …
Without knowing the source of this 70mm clip (from a picture search, to a 2015 article that doesn’t specify it’s vintage; although those edge marks may say) . .
. . see how closely the colors of this particular shot (minus source-light tinting) matches a picture from the Taschen book (again, from a picture search, to a 2013 article with the picture not credited; but I saw it in Taschen book articles) . .
What I usually do, is that I correct the same frame on the print to this reference frame, and then correct the other frames in the scene with that color correction model, which should then yield the references for the other shots in the scene. This way the color grading for the scene will be consistent …
That’s an excellent approach! (I missed it, if previously stated.)
Just a personal taste observation: Tatooine is a desert planet (yes, the whole planet – this is sci-fi after all). It is a light-blue sky & hot during the day. It goes sunset-red to darkness & cold at night. Aqua skies would just look wrong to me. (I eye-dropper’d that last shot and noticed blue is anemic in the stormtrooper’s shadows. If blue was boosted, that might also produce a better sky – more like that on-the-set shot.)
DrDre said:
It is possible to closely match the Senator photo …
The Senator photos screeners (taken by some guy with a new camera and still fiddling with it while trying to take pictures in the dark of the theatre) are better than nothing but they’re very far from any kind of color reference, as I once demonstrated in The Matrix thread …
If the Star Wars sequence cross-cut shots look good together … all having the same sky color … then that’s what to go with.
That was pretty quick! Well, now, DVDMaiku, time to brush up on your Japanese!
Any chance to compare colors to determine of the orange-cast we saw on samples was their own artistic finger in Slipstream's pie? Or just film color-damage to parts or all the movie?
Maybe, but the best example might not be when she’s standing under a red light. 😃
LOL! Not that side of her head … the other side! The other side is lit by the same white light splashing (white) on her space dress.
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Here’s the first Tatooine shot.
Wow! R2-D2 looks appropriately dusty now!
Since you’re color correcting the SE, that would mean not de-fixing the SE. So the funny blue blob goes, right?
These new pictures are looking better – the less omnipresent bluish, the more the background separates from the foreground.
I know I’m kind of guessing when doing anything visual on this laptop. But I only do “proof of concept” work with a paint program anyway. Yeah, viewing at a particular angle, I did get the impression Leia’s hair needed more contrast and/or less saturation – but that’s only fine-tuning. That said, a case could be made for the stronger reddish-brown hair color . .
It would necessarily mean stronger skin tones, too. (Again, you must judge as I can’t.) 😃
I think this shot worked out pretty well. … I love the contrast of the deep black of Vader’s cape, against the bright hall of the Tantive IV. Also, check out the lights on Vader’s belt…
GL is going to be so mad at you … undoing all his new, messy colorings. 😄
Three observations though. One is I still see some Blu-ray blueness trying to peek through, ever more as areas darken. Another is the deep darks have little breathing room and tend to blend together (like Vader and the Commander). And the last is that Star Wars was a Technicolor film with colors that should “pop” a bit more, which I can do with my “Technicolor-izer” (emphasizes the purer-primary colors). So I tried a manual color correction of that Blu-ray snapshot, aiming towards your auto-cc, with my 3 ideas incorporated.
What do you think of this (top is auto-cc, bottom is manual-cc w/3_ideas) . .
WARNING: This was worked up on an older LCD laptop. It appeared to change just by moving my head. 😃 Hopefully, your mileage may will vary from that.
I am going to be withdrawing from the forums here, …
Thanks again to everyone here that has enriched my knowledge and life in so many ways, it has been a joy and priveledge to call you my friends, even though I never met a single one of you in the real world 😃
Cheers, and goodbye
| /me teary-eyed & feels a song coming on . . . |  |
| ♫ Happy Trails To You ♫ | |
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'Til we meet again, poita!
This one (cropped to an affected area) has both blow-outs and crush (minimal) . .
[updated]
But this one looks good with no source blown/crushed showing (top/Blu-ray bottom/processed for each picture pair; 1st group = pictures, 2nd group = blown displayed, 3rd group = crushed displayed) . .
Keep in mind that “flattened” crushed/blown areas are still flat (no info therein) even though pushed into legal range. The crushed/blown areas would need to be reconstructed or otherwise fudged on a plane-by-plane basis to restore the appearance of intact information.
skoal said:
… what do you get in the book that isn’t already available via documentaries and the web?
First of all, it’s all in one place. Secondly, I think all the pictures on the web are probably from this book (or from the same pictures of the Time-Life online picture-set a couple of years ago). Third, the book’s pictures have been cleaned-up to magazine quality. With access to the Kubrick estate, they were able to do it right (a reason I favor using the Taschen book as color-key for 2001 – which, BTW, matches the laserdisc captures when brightness/contrast is normalized).
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While I’m gushing on sales . .
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. . be sure to check out eBay for the 5x7" Senitype 2001: A Space Odyssey Deluxe Collection Set placard. (Yes, there’s lots of them for sale.) The best prices I’ve seen are in the $4-5 range. Perfect for framing if you figure out adding an LED light-box in the back to illuminate the cell. Cool. |
@ skoal
I did a quick search, too. Hated the chain-links, obscured information, and more advertising than website space. Too bad there isn’t some website where one punches in a movie name . . .
| . . . and up pops everywhere the movie was/is/will-be playing. | |
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Something happened! … What happened? … Something wonderful!
That can only mean … Taschen's The Making Of Stanley Kubrick’s 2001: A Space Odyssey can now be attained by we mere mortals!
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I’ve been checking it’s Amazon sales webpage. It’s price, for both new [sealed] and used [used:“like new” or used:“very good”], bounces down one week and up the next. New and used editions differ only by a few $$ (at most) to a few ¢¢ (at least). Thus far, I’ve noted $40 as the high and $22 as the low – and that’s for new! Plus with Amazon's free shipping, just fill out your order with another free shipping item to top $35 and save on one heavy package! (Note: have a couple of filler items located and ready to add so you can quick-grab the book when it hits it’s best price.)
| Don’t let H.A.L. say … “I think you missed it, Frank.” | |
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… I’ve upgraded the ColorCorrect tool I’ve developed, … so I’m going to go ahead with regrading the entire Star Wars Trilogy [blu-ray] shot by shot.
I haven’t examined the blu-ray, but all the Lucas, et al, tinkerings usually end with blown & crushed colors. You might want to pre-check your source. This resultant sceenshot doesn’t show any blow-out but it does show crush (hopefully not from your process) . .
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| R/G/B’s of “0” are increased to “255” to highlight the crush and the |
| remaining “1- 255” are reduced by 3/4’s (to “64” max) for ease of review |
Just came across a really indepth Stanley Kubrick & 2001: A Space Odyssey resource in the 2001Italia Blog, packed with 5 very long pages of entries (okay, so it’s duplicated with English/Italian) . .
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2001Italia – A Blog Devoted To Stanley Kubrick’s 2001: A Space Odyssey |
Speaking of the 2001:ASO and Blade Runner connection (Taschen books), how’s this one …
Rachael: Do you like our owl?
Deckard: It’s artificial?
Rachael: Of course it is.
Deckard: Must be expensive.
Rachael: Very.
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Did you notice it? Here’s a clue …
2001Italia blog - “Ivor Powell shares his memories of ‘2001’ and beyond” wrote:
“It’s possible, although not 100% sure, that it was him, drawing from his experience in 2001, that suggested Ridley Scott to use a front-light technique in order to achieve that eye-glowing effect for the replicant’s eyes in Blade Runner.”
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@ PDB
| I was wondering … may I make more work for you? | |
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I was searching for other books Taschen had published, like their The Making Of Stanley Kubrick 2001: A Space Odyssey. (A really excellent book! Staff professionals had full access to Kubrick’s archives and produced high quality, spot-on, true-color photos of things never released before.) While looking quickly through the myriad of pictured book covers, this grabbed my eye …
This wasn’t a dedicated book like the 2001:ASO one, but it sure could show how film and sets really looked without all the lost-in-time versions with which we have to deal. Hopefully, there are pictures from the book floating around the Internet to determine it’s use as a color key.
poita said:
Just a quick note to say I have had a rather catastrophic power supply/hardware failure here, it has taken out my workstation, the internal RAID, the external RAID, my Titan, Motherboard, Xeon CPU, SSDs and pretty much everything that was plugged in at the time. Chips blown off drives, tracks burned off the motherboard, it is a disaster.
poita said:
… I am currently deciding whether to take it as a sign from the gods and bow out of the hobby, or start over.
As Jason once bitterly complained: “The gods want their entertainment. The gods are cruel! In time all men shall learn to live without them.”
Or Conan's sage philosophy about the gods: “So grant me one request. Grant me revenge! And if you do not listen, then to hell with you!”
BTW, as a snub to the gods, your hard drives may still be salvageable. It’s only the electronics that were fried, not necessarily damage to the platens, too. It may be worth the gamble/expense to have the drives platens physically moved into the working case of an identical drive (same make/model/controller-chip) in a “clean room”, of course.
jsonthegreat said (1-Oct-2015, 12:02 PM):
My house was hit by a lightning strike which fried my computer AND my backup drive.
I’m a little late to this thread, but … wow! Count your blessings on what else might have happened but didn’t.
Your hard drive may still be salvageable. It’s only the electronics that were fried, not necessarily damage to the platens, too. It may be worth a gamble & the expense to have the drive platens physically moved into the working case of an identical drive (same make/model/controller-chip) in a “clean room”, of course.