Sluggo

Bingowings said:

While mentioning hangers there was my old idea of adding bombers to the ground battle taking off from a hanger on the other side of the hill :

This would be cool.

darth_ender said:

So we're a month and a day into this project, and it has proven popular thus far.  I thought I'd include this picture to illustrate Ronster's idea.

This would be cool to see if it could be done convincingly.  My only concern is that it would mess up the timing already in the movie.  The rebels discover that it is a trap, they turn to avoid the shields, find themselves in front of the Imperial fleet and the fighters appear.  Adding this shot would be an interruption to the pacing.  

Unless we are okay with the audience knowing about the trap and have the storm of ties launch as the Falcon is coming out of hyperspace, making it past the DS shield (is that a concern?  How would an audience watching the edit be ok with the tie fighters leaving the DS, but the rebels would be stopped by the shield?) and flying from behind the fleet of Star Destroyers to then engage the rebels?

Ok, here's something I'd like an opinion about.  

Moments before the sail barge explodes, the Luke and the rest of the rebels are able to find some magnets on hoses on a skiff, manage to deploy them to pull the droids out of the sand, pull them up on deck and sail away as the barge explodes behind them.  

I'd really like to see this scene tightened up a bit.   Something more like this:

EXTERIOR: UPPER DECK - SAIL BARGE

 

Luke is warding off laser blasts with his lightsaber, surrounded by guards and fighting like a demon. Leia emerges onto the deck as Luke turns to face another guard.

 

LUKE: (to Leia) Get the gun! Point it at the deck!

 

Leia turns toward the barge cannon, climbs on the platform, and swivels the gun around.

 

LUKE: Point it at the deck!

 

A laser blast hits Luke's mechanical hand and he bends over in pain, but manages to swing his lightsaber upward and take out the last of the guards. He looks at the wounded hand, which reveals the mechanism. He flexes the hand; it still works.

 

Luke runs along the empty deck toward Leia and the barge gun, which she has brought around to point down at the deck.

 

LUKE: Come on!

 

Luke has hold on one of the rigging ropes from the mast. He gathers Leia in his other arm and kicks the trigger of the deck gun. The gun explodes into the deck as Luke and Leia swing out toward the skiff.

 

EXTERIOR: SKIFF

 

Han leans panting against the rail as Chewie helps Lando onto the deck. Luke and Leia land on the skiff with flair.

 

LUKE: Let's go! And don't forget the droids.

The skiff moves in towards the burning barge

EXTERIOR: UPPER DECK - SAIL BARGE

 

Near the rail of the upper deck, Artoo and Threepio steady themselves as Threepio gets ready to jump. Artoo beeps wildly.

 

THREEPIO: Artoo, where are we going? I couldn't possibly jump.

 

Artoo butts the golden droid over the edge and steps off himself; both falling off screen landing the skiff with an enormous thud.

 

EXTERIOR: SKIFF

 

LANDO: We're on our way.

 

The skiff races away as the Sail Barge is exploding in stages in the distance. Half of the huge craft is on fire.

darth_ender said:

Well, aalenfae is the one who'd be including most of the ships with his CGI skills, and I think he has access to many that he's interested in via the aforementioned 3d model site.  But yes, there are other hurdles.  We'll figure this out.  Even the vote isn't the final say, only a guide, and in the end we simply have to trust the editors to follow the will of the people as much as possible.

As for plot hurdles, what suggestions do you have, Sluggo?  I've been smoothing out the story, but I hope it reflects the views of the majority.

I've only had time to dig into the script this weekend.

ray_afraid said:

MrInsaneA said:

ray_afraid said:

MrInsaneA said:

The Rebellion shouldn't feel like an organized military so much as a ragtag militia. 

But they are an organized military. I think what you guys are discussing would work better for a pre-ANH rebellion. At this point (RotJ), they've had some BIG victories (the ANH opening text refers to the fact that they have already had some big wins and are growing) and would have gained much more mainstream support.

That may make sense realistically but thematically it would be good to separate the Rebels from the Empire. Empire: Big military force of humans. Rebels: Rag tag group of aliens and humans. 

And that is exactly what is represented on screen as the film stands. The rebels are out numbered, out gunned, and out classed. Just not as much as they were during the battle of Yavin, nor would they be as I've pointed out already. We see that they are a cobbled together group of aliens and humans alike (unlike the Empire). The only reason the Rebels are launching such a daring assault on the DSII is because they think it isn't working yet- not because they've become such a big military force that they are confident in their abilities and machinery. When they find out the DSII is operational, they collectively shit themselves and without Landos courage and faith in his buddies, they would have turned tail and ran.

I don't wanna be "that guy" here, but the stakes were ever bit as high in ANH as in RotJ and the Rebels in ANH only had two types of ships as opposed to Jedi's four. Why wouldn't they pull all stops during the battle of Yavin?

Ray is absolutely right.  ROTJ has a crapload of spaceships already.  I think it would be best to suspend the pipe-dream of adding all these ships when we don't know if we can actually do it.  Adding background spaceships is a rather small plot point.  There are so much bigger hurdles to jump over than this.  

We should wait for mock-ups to be made before we decide to include something we don't know are possible yet.  Right now we have the cart before the horse.

Now, are we talking about Bikini-clad Leia or Hoth Leia or...

I supposed I don't mind extra ships in the background, but I still like the idea of the rebels having dedicated wings of ships, like Gold group, Red group, etc.  These need to be their main forces.

That phantom menace ship looks a lot better with the new texturing, but I'd rather not have the reminder of the prequels.

TV's Frink said:

Sluggo said:

This wins the topic.

I thought I won?  Why is the topic still going?

:-D

(that's supposed to be a smiley with a beard.  It doesn't look as cool as I was hoping.)

Had we talked about moving the fire after the celebration?  It would be an interesting experiment, but it may be too anti-climatic after the big party.

Bingowings said:

At the risk of needlessly arguing the toss so this will be my last word on the subject in this thread, the audience has already played that game in ESB.

...

That's fair.  I'll concede that it could work.  I think that just on the whole, there are better ways to get the plans to the rebels.

Now, where were we?

Bingowings said:

Sluggo said:

I say stick with the Bothans and the plans.  The audience knows Boba Fett is a bad guy.  Surely, the rebels would know this also. 

I think Fett's character is best suited by dying.  It just needs to be from a deliberate swipe by Han, not an Anakin-style "Oops!".

Is he really a bad guy?

He isn't to be trusted but the same was true of Lando in ESB.

I don't know if I see it that way.  I think we as an audience can bring a gray area to our understanding of the character, but I think the movies are pretty simple in their presentation.

Also note that I am relying on old memory for the WEG source.  The memory is known to cheat. 

And I don't look things up on any star wars wiki.  That stuff is all made up.

If we use footage from another movie, then it will be what it will be.  I guess there is freedom and limitations in that solution, depending on how you look at it.

darth_ender said:

...Sluggo, I really feel it fortunate that you are here. 

 

Me gusta.

darth_ender said:

As for Bothan acting, I thought it might be easier to simply use costumes and human dubbing.  That way we don't have to pay their outrageous contractual demands either.  I tried to write the scene so we would actually see very little of the Bothan himself, only revealing his hands (can be decent costume gloves) and eyes (probably not too hard for CGI, and possibly even reused from some other film).

Smart.  To be fair, the Bothan Actors Guild (B.A.G.) does make it tough to get any kind of contract signed.  That's why I work on Sullust.

Do we have to use the previously established West End Games (W.E.G.) design for the Bothans or would you want something new?  Personally, I'd love a new design because I enjoy when the fanboys get their panties in a bunch.

I say stick with the Bothans and the plans.  The audience knows Boba Fett is a bad guy.  Surely, the rebels would know this also. 

I think Fett's character is best suited by dying.  It just needs to be from a deliberate swipe by Han, not an Anakin-style "Oops!".

That isn't a bad little scene.  Most Bothan's I know can't really act, so It may be tough to film.

The biggest problem is that now the scene doesn't really give enough time for the rebellion to gather their plan.

I think it would fit in with a re-arranged story (one of the Dagobah-first edits, for instance), but it seems out of place as the movie currently stands.

Angel said:

...

Shouldnt the endor as have its own theme?like Bespin's/Lando's theme? I guess the celebration can have endor's theme in bittersweet tones.

...

-Angel

Now I understand why I disliked the Yub Yub song. 

Star Wars ended with the medal ceremony and music that was built on Luke's/the Force theme.  It brought a great feeling of completion to the adventure.  ROTJ needs to have a similiar treatment.  Yub Yub and the new Jedi Celebration song (is that what it is called?) don't use the earlier motifs.

That said, I like how ADM scored his ROTJ edit back in the day.

You can curve bullets around objects by wildly swinging your gun.

Unless Vader is arriving "covertly" as it were.  Jerjerrod was surprised at his arrival.

Can I link the trailer on my Facebook page?

I can only watch things go bang from inside of my lead-lined fridge.

Courtesy of Sluggo:

I'm only watching it if it has Chewie's family avoiding Imperial troops while preparing for some type of wookiee holiday.

I haven't watched the blu-rays or maybe I could tell you.

And the post on the MFdotcom link about sebulba was hilarious.  "It's fake!  It has to be."  I remember saying that about Hayden in ROTJ.

I care!

Oh snap!

*sigh*

You catch on pretty quick.