Has anyone been able to compare THE FORCE AWAKENS on D+ to the Blu-ray? I’m curious if the new HDR grade has finally eliminated the oversaturated red channel. The SDR grade looks virtually identical, with Han Solo looking like a lobster throughout most of the film.
It still looked rather greenish/reddish to me.
Does anyone have a D+ subscription and the hardware to stream it in 4k (even if it’s only in sdr)? I’d be very curious what the OT looks like at full 2160p res. The compression probably cancels out some of the extra detail, but I would still think this looks better than what we’ve had to live with for the last 15 years.
Rogue One was also finished in 4k IIRC, so there should be some increase in detail, compression notwithstanding. TFA was only finished in 2k AFAIK, but the hdr should impress.
It’s the stuck-in-2k PT that I’m maybe the most curious about, both in terms of the 4k upscale and how it fares in hdr.
I posted my thoughts earlier, watched these 4K LED display with Dolby Vision via an Apple TV device.
I sampled the 4K versions of the OT on Disney+ earlier. They share a lot of the same issues as the 2004/2011 masters. Colors are the biggest improvement. Colors are better and they’ve dropped the blue and pink color casts from the SE and previous DVD/Blu-ray releases. Unfortunately, it looks like another job from Lowry/Reliance Mediaworks. Moderate digital noise reduction, edge enhancement, frozen grain. Close ups look pretty solid, if not a bit soft. But anything wider and you start to see the issues. Basically, a huge disappointment if you’re a videophile and have been waiting for these 4K masters for years.
I think they’re fairly poor remasters. Casual viewers may think they’re fine, but technically they’re pretty bad especially compared to some of the stellar 4K releases of “Blade Runner”, “2001: A Space Odyssey”, “Close Encounters of the Third Kind”, etc. we’ve gotten in recent years. Basically, the remastering team degrained the whole thing and detail was taken off as a result. They then sharpen the image and then add some light homogeneous digital grain so it doesn’t look too mushy. It all results in a splotchy, filtered look with new digital artifacts do to all the noise reduction and grain manipulation. They essentially freeze frame the backgrounds so the film grain doesn’t move. It’s almost as if the actors are standing in front of photographs rather than real locations/sets. If you have any appreciation for how film should look, it’s really weird. These are basically the same tricks Lowry/Reliance has been using for years and it was fine on the DVD days and passable in 1080p, but in 4K, it really shows. Hell, what’s the point of scanning the original camera negatives in 4K if you’re just going to filter off all the detail and mess it up with your own digital artifacts?
So you’re saying that film grain is a good thing and should never be touched?
Film grain is part of the look of the film. When it’s managed well, you shouldn’t notice. Problem is, messing around with the grain structure usually results in its own digital artifacts and issues which are far more distracting than the grain itself.
Take a look at 4K77. Personally, I think the grain is too heavy in many scenes but the DNR versions aren’t really improvements to me. The noise reduction introduces its own issues.
Does anyone have a D+ subscription and the hardware to stream it in 4k (even if it’s only in sdr)? I’d be very curious what the OT looks like at full 2160p res. The compression probably cancels out some of the extra detail, but I would still think this looks better than what we’ve had to live with for the last 15 years.
Rogue One was also finished in 4k IIRC, so there should be some increase in detail, compression notwithstanding. TFA was only finished in 2k AFAIK, but the hdr should impress.
It’s the stuck-in-2k PT that I’m maybe the most curious about, both in terms of the 4k upscale and how it fares in hdr.
I posted my thoughts earlier, watched these 4K LED display with Dolby Vision via an Apple TV device.
I sampled the 4K versions of the OT on Disney+ earlier. They share a lot of the same issues as the 2004/2011 masters. Colors are the biggest improvement. Colors are better and they’ve dropped the blue and pink color casts from the SE and previous DVD/Blu-ray releases. Unfortunately, it looks like another job from Lowry/Reliance Mediaworks. Moderate digital noise reduction, edge enhancement, frozen grain. Close ups look pretty solid, if not a bit soft. But anything wider and you start to see the issues. Basically, a huge disappointment if you’re a videophile and have been waiting for these 4K masters for years.
I think they’re fairly poor remasters. Casual viewers may think they’re fine, but technically they’re pretty bad especially compared to some of the stellar 4K releases of “Blade Runner”, “2001: A Space Odyssey”, “Close Encounters of the Third Kind”, etc. we’ve gotten in recent years. Basically, the remastering team degrained the whole thing and detail was taken off as a result. They then sharpen the image and then add some light homogeneous digital grain so it doesn’t look too mushy. It all results in a splotchy, filtered look with new digital artifacts do to all the noise reduction and grain manipulation. They essentially freeze frame the backgrounds so the film grain doesn’t move. It’s almost as if the actors are standing in front of photographs rather than real locations/sets. If you have any appreciation for how film should look, it’s really weird. These are basically the same tricks Lowry/Reliance has been using for years and it was fine on the DVD days and passable in 1080p, but in 4K, it really shows. Hell, what’s the point of scanning the original camera negatives in 4K if you’re just going to filter off all the detail and mess it up with your own digital artifacts?
I sampled the 4K versions of the OT on Disney+ earlier. They share a lot of the same issues as the 2004/2011 masters. Colors are the biggest improvement. Colors are better and they’ve dropped the blue and pink color casts from the SE and previous DVD/Blu-ray releases. Unfortunately, it looks like another job from Lowry/Reliance Mediaworks. Moderate digital noise reduction, edge enhancement, frozen grain. Close ups look pretty solid, if not a bit soft. But anything wider and you start to see the issues. Basically, a huge disappointment if you’re a videophile and have been waiting for these 4K masters for years.
The new batch of screenshots look good!
Only shots from the sample that bother me are the ones of Han and Leia on the barge. They look a bit too washed out to me.
Dreamastered V2 is impressive but it’s still got a lot of issues. Some of the colors (especially the lightsaber duel in the carbon freeze chamber) are still very… odd looking. And there’s a LOT of digital cleaning artifacts. Lots of partly or completely erased laserbolts. And things that move quickly, especially in the foreground, can be quite weird as random parts get erased. It’s incredibly impressive what he was able to do with such a rough and faded source, but personally I prefer either the original grindhouse or Harmy’s latest version (V2 still I think?) of despecialized. But that’s largely because I personally prefer a recreation or slightly faded colors over digital artifacts and erasures.
Still, dreamaster’s work is incredibly interesting and I do enjoy having it as another option when I get the itch to watch ESB.
As for finding dreamaster’s V1 or 2, eh… you’ll probably have to track him down and ask him. They’re hard to find on purpose from what I understand.
A lot of work seems to have gone into the Dreamastered version, but I much prefer the Grindhouse version even with all the dirt, noise, scratches, etc. Dreamastered is filtered within an inch of its life. All the texture of the 35mm print is gone and kinda defeats the point in a way. As said, the cleanup has left a lot of digital artifacts that I find more distracting than the dirt it cleaned up. And the colors seem overcooked to me.
Started watching the trilogy again this weekend with 4K77 v1.4 and thought I’d continue with the Dreamastered version of ESB but just couldn’t get into it. I’ll continue with the Grindhouse version instead.
Hello, could I get a link to the latest release? Thanks!
It’s actually easiest to put it on an external drive and plug it directly into the 4K TV and play it that way. It won’t work on a PS4 (overly restrictive requirements for 4K media, such as it has to be h264, which the 4K releases from TN1 are h265), and I dunno about an Xbox.
Thanks! Will take a look.
Hello, what’s the best way to watch the 4K file on a 4K TV? Can the 4K MKV be burned as data to a BD-R and played via a PS4 or X-Box One?
Looks good!
I downloaded V2 off of Myspleen and tried making a Blu-ray copy of it using TS Muxer, but the resulting disc wouldn’t play (got only audio). Any ideas?
What about the behind the scenes segment from “60 Minutes”? I’ve been looking for it online but only found SD recordings.
Would love the link as well if anyone could help. 😃
Sounds like a great project. Anyone know where to find this?
After 9 years, I'd still love to see a reconstructed version of this. :)
Interesting! The George Eastman House seems to be shitting all over Kubrick's intentions recently. Everything from planning to release Fear and Desire on home video to screening versions of his movies that he didn't want to be seen.
Not that I mind, of course. :) Too bad Warner probably won't release the coda on video.
skyjedi2005 said:
The making of raiders and great movie stunts was released on USA laserdisc, did DFNYC do that one ?
Yes, DFNYC released The Making of Raiders, Great Movie Stunts, The Making of Temple of Doom, and Great Adventurers and their Quests.
Jambe Davdar, do you have the single disc DVD re-releases of the movies which came with additional extras?
The Blu-ray with a new restoration should be out by the end of the year. Just be patient.
Could I possibly get a pm to check these out as well? Thanks.
Thanks for finally posting these!
Any sort of update on this? I'd love to get a hold of this version. I'm currently watching a recording of the "Novel for Television" version I made off of Bravo. But those damn ads are killing me. It's certainly a project that deserves preservation.
I know the comic often quotes songs and stuff at the end of each chapter, but I wouldn't use them in the movie - maybe credits or whatever. Even if a quoted lyric has relevance to the story, more often than not, the song just doesn't fit the mood of the scene. For example, I really can't see any version of "All Along the Watchtower" fitting that scene from the movie that Snyder placed it in.
Sounds great so far. I'd also trim some of the other violence as well. Rorschach putting the cleaver into the dude's head was not only over the top, the effect was bad. Additionally, during the prison riot, there's the moment where they cut the dude's arms off. Not that these acts of violence shouldn't be suggested, they're just too gruesome.
I agree with you on the songs. I love most of them individually, but I didn't feel any of them worked in the movie. They all just seemed distracting and out of place despite some of the subtext being correct.
I'd also suggest dialing back on Richard Nixon. The makeup looked god awful.
I would love to see the Motion Comic with the voices redone. Using just one guy for all the parts was really awkward.
Ziz said:Ok, I didn't think of it that way. I figured the Joker was so confident that it wouldn't matter which one Batman or the cops went for.
Where was it mentioned that Joker swapped the addresses?
As others have stated, it's more implied than explicitly stated. The closest they come to doing so is when Batman and Gordon are mobilizing to save the two. Gordon asks Batman who he's going after. He says Rachel. Gordon tells his men that they're going after Dent. So when Batman opens the door and sees Dent, you're supposed to go, "Oh, shit. The Joker switched addresses on him."
Unfortunately, I don't think we'll ever see definitive releases of these films on DVD. The way I see it, LFL just doesn't have the manpower or the resources to give these movies the time and love they deserve. LFL is an independent company, so unlike major studios that release hundreds of titles on DVD each year and have the whole thing down pat, I get the feeling that LFL is always scrambling to get a release out. They might have one or two guys sitting standing by at a computer to do whatever change Lucas thinks up on a whim, but to really get the process down, they just don't have the time nor do they really care enough to get it right.
As another example, look at American Zoetrope, Francis Ford Coppola's company. Like LFL, they independently produce their own DVDs. Their efforts are decent, but, like LFL, they have problems ranging from quality control (shitting color timing on Dracula/the SW films), leaving obvious extras off the DVDs, and bad creative decisions (cropping Apocalypse Now/Lucas's revisionism). It's also the reason why The Godfather series still doesn't have that comprehensive DVD set it deserves. Sure Paramount recently ponied up for a new restoration, but in terms of extras, the new releases will barely be an improvement over the last release. Moving over to Star Wars, the possibilities are probably endless. They have vaults full of great material that could be used for extras. But assembling new extras require time and money and a great deal of effort. If I recall correctly, the extras for the 2004 set weren't even announced til the summer since they were still scrambling to put everything together.
That brings me back to the quality control issues. It seemed as though Lucas just greenlit the 2004 releases at the last possible minute in order to make the release window. And so everything, including the digital restoration, color timing, sound mix, etc. were all rushed into production. It didn't help that Lucas likes to change things as they go along, adding new CGI shots, etc. When color timing the film, they probably didn't use a source print as reference and instead asked Lucas what he wanted in each shot. After working on the prequels, he probably saw the opportunity to make the OT look more modern and hence the crazy color timing.