Ronster

Interesting that it was added and removed....

Although i would not want to see anything over the top i think the chase feels a bit disjointed in the the middle and especially when they first head into the asteroid field.

from like 1:14 to 2:12 in the clip we could do with being reminded that the tie fighters are there still either through sounds (blast hits) and mild shakes when they are trying to fix the hyperdrive or visually through cockpit flashes and or lasers on the swoop manouvre the falcon does.

It's about a minute of disconnect that they are still being chased.

Found that clip you mentioned Oh_riginal

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sp5zRs9-PF0

And I actually think that it is over the top (I actually like the first edited shot of the ties) but would not mind a toned down version of the this and the others or like the original. Basically to me it's more the part before the chase through the asteroids I think needs the padding and reminding that the tie fighters are still there while fixing the hyperdrive talking in the cockpit and the falcon swooping through.

I think it was removed so as to not interfere with the music and if any lasers were re-added it would have to be done in a way that complimented the music and it's rhythm.

Ok back to empire strikes back...

In the asteroid chase the tie fighters stop firing at the falcon for quite a long part of the chase is there any plans to keep the tie fighters shooting and chasing for the duration and not just chasing? They only start shooting towrds the end of the chase again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTp8mKFxmbg

Also on scenes of the falcon manouvreing laser hits or misses on these scenes?

Perhaps some cockpit shield hit flashes also?

It as if the pursuing tie fighters are forgotten about to introduce the asteroid field and not they are being chased by tie fighters into the asteroid field.

I think it would add more continuity to the chase.

I have had an idea of how to perhaps improve the prequal trilogy.

What if it was cell shaded like a scanner darkly or ralph baski's lord of the rings.

I think this could perhaps lend to it a unique style whilst making the actual footage which is cartoon like an actual cartoon.

It could also make it easirr to change it far more radically while bolstering bad performances in a cartoon setting.

I think this could go in it's favour

No Anakin ghost Imo

Are you now or have you ever been?

There is much better unnatural ways to redeem vader that would have more emotional impact i think.

It's sentimental to see anakin/vader become a good guy ghost.

But what if he actually used the dark side to do something with far more impact.

sith force ghosts nah i don't think we see the emperor or maul as ghosts. Vader did not become a jedi all of a sudden. I think there is a better way to handle vaders redemption.

Yeah but he still looks more pale in rotj than in esb.

Whatever works best really for continuity.

Without watching the scene of the chamber where his helmet is put back on theres a good excuse for a pressurised air sound effect or some enhancement to when the helmet is fixed back on to vader.

Without watching it i don't recall any sound effect when the helmet is put back on in the chamber

So does anything happen when we get to page 1138?

Considering we are on page 1137 we'll find out soon enough....

Anyway without getting my hopes up for any media or anything it seems a worthy milestone for perhaps something if only tidbits of info.

And good point mac i am digging your view on Vader unmasked

How about Captain Turnip?

Sorry the special edition score added to the fly through sounds a bit whimsy..

The mock-up I did sounds a bit more foreboding and draws more attention to Leia pacing up and down by the window.

But I think it would be quite easy to make an improvement on this special edition scoring that was added in 2004 DVD or Special Edition Version.

However music is personal taste so I thought I would throw this idea out there that I think the music could be improved on the fly through using this example or other John Williams scoring.

I was watching this clip

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=2315729530479&set=vb.223279371020986&type=3&theater

When we are shown the Cloud city shot the cloud car flying through Cloud city... We can clearly hear the musical score was a special edition addition because of the music the score that is used feels a bit tacked on.

Now some may think the music that was used in this scene is perfect.

I myself feel it was just a piece of music that got used perhaps without cloud city in mind as we are hearing lukes theme while a cloud car flys through cloud city.

I am just wondering if there is any plans to re-score this scene and try to improve the scene using score from the cloud city score or something else.

I think the music in this fly through could be improved that is all. And it sticks out a bit as not up to the same heights much of the other scored visuals get.

I'd be all for keeping the score from the OUT scenes and bridging it with something else on the Cloud city Matte and fly through.

City in the clouds score

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79I7sLihjDw

Perhaps the small harp piece from 1.50

I did a rough mock up

http://www.mediafire.com/watch/qf819hrqlnb7ahz/Fly_through_mock_up.mp4

I think it sounds a bit more foreboding like this but without sounding like this is how I want it to be... I just think that it would not be hard to improve this small music section that is all.

Is there an extended cut out there of the thing using the deleted scenes or some of them?

Not only that but the prequal has some potential scenes to extend the introduction.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kj_57s-8y9w

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEpNqw450Ac

I have not seen the prequal and actually don't want to... But I ran across these and thought hmmmmm....

I would remove the subs though for sure... And only a quick flash of the burnt thing in the ice.

The original deleted scenes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Xu2cFljkPw

Although I think the film is fine as it is... It's just conjecture.

For any fans of the thing though this is a must watch
Part 1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SppG-I_Dhxw

Part 2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgRWMbGSUec

Ha :) I never thought about it like that and would obviously put you in a bit of an awkward position....

Well 208 changes still does not come close to actual changes when you break it down shot by shot or frame by frame.

But thanks for the answer that you have given

There is only one section for scene re-arrangement in empire strikes back of any real worth...not counting special edition scenes up for the chop

So I respect that decision

muddyknees2000 said:

Ronster said:

I would be surprised if it all looked exactly the same as all the clips that have been released thus far... 

Changes HAVE been made. Ady's a perfectionist...always tweaking little details.

while that is great and that drive to improve it just a bit more... There is a danger in that so much as you never feel like your truly finished it...

I used to get that when I used to write music... Making a great intro and middle section but never really knowing how to create the end...I'd often end up in a whole other piece of music in the same track sometimes But not always sometimes the end just falls in to place naturally It is a strange thing that with any artisitic or creative process..

DarkRha said:

I really want to see this edit real bad! I know they have said by the end of the year but thats still too long, how about by the end of the month? lol

It's done when it's done... But I would be surprised if it all looked exactly the same as all the clips that have been released thus far... 

some you can no longer see as they have been removed from youtube and where ever else.

I am really excited to see it.... But I don't want to raise expectations any higher than the original film... This way when I watch it I'll treat it like watching the original and just notice the differences and changes as they occur (And with help from the change list too).

I wonder what the final change list will actually be.... I Hope doubleofive presents this one the same as Star wars revisited and well I am a believer in that, that list in the first post is a mere shadow on the actually individual changes so far even.

First post says 208 changes.

What number of changes we on now doubleofive (without joking please) or rough guestimation on your last count? 

Check the last shot again... This is the best I can do to put the case forward that I think you have misinterpreted the orientation on the last shot. I can be wrong but something does not feel right.

If you disagree then that is fine...But I'll try this one last time to show you what I am getting at for your benefit I am not being pushy or looking for an argument.. I am trying to cover all bases.

I think the prequal cockpit differs heavily from the Empire Strikes Back version.

As you have said ady the scene is pretty much self explanatory... That is why I don't think anything from the original film needs to be altered it is fine as it is in the original.

Boba does not go anywhere... The space junk is spinning around the falcon is moving off in the cockpit shot. or Boba has slowed to the same speed as the junk on the outer edge.

This infers Boba has stopped within the bounds of the junk field to remain hidden.

What ever else he does happens off screen and rightly so.

I like the idea of the extra distance but it further accentuates why Boba is weirdly not detected.

In the original he is right on the falcons ass possibly so close he is out of range of detection what with all the junk debris also.

There is also a lot more skill in that manouvre he pulls of the close pursuit than the skulking far behind.

I'd say Slave 1 is at a dead stop more or less in the cockpit shot so Boba is able to do an accurate calcultaion... This is a fault on the film makers part for not conveying this change via sound or visually expressing Slave 1 coming to a halt.

Close Asterisk... Very close but no cigar.

I did miss an important piece of detail in the final shot.

When we are looking out of slave 1 cockpit window... We see the falcon and a piece of space junk.

This says to me that the film makers felt that Boba not leaving and straying outside of the space junk debris was a plausible explaination for not being detected... And for Slave 1 to remain inside the debris and not leave. At least not at this time. He stays inside the junk debris doing a triangulation calculation of where the falcon is going. Using the periscope to get a point directly infront of him and where he is situated at this current time to calculate where the falcon is travelling to. You only need 2 point in space to calculate where the third will be.

In Revisited Clip the space junk has been removed from this final shot. This changes our perception of the scene quite a bit.

This also leads me to believe that the technique Boba uses to pursue the falcon is so close you cannot see it or detect it. There is a reason for this close proximity pursuit through the junk.

Forgetting about any previous suggestions I have made I see this scene totally different now and If I were to add anything it would be a sound effect of Bobba Fetts engines shutting down to better communicate what is happening on the cockpit shot and I would ask that the scene be restored to it's original form.

asterisk8 said:

This is one of those cases where the movie expects the audience to be smart enough to take these pieces and assemble them into a coherent whole without needing to be spoon-fed.

You see to be trying to find holes so that they can be plugged up by new shots and changes, but this isn't a case of holes, it's breathing room for the story to come alive in the viewer's imagination.

 

To do an orientation on the last shot in this sequence is important... Sorry but I think you are being a bit pedantic and your observation level is nowhere near as high as mine.

You seem to think it's more important to pooh pooh me than to examine the facts and the detail that is in the footage.

If the viewer has to make up little bit's of story as trivial as Slave 1 has sophisticated Jamming and tracking capabilities... Sorry but the film has then failed in this part. Nowhere in the footage shown does anything suggest that Slave 1 has these capabilities somone on here made it up.

It's a reasonable explaination... But why are we having to explain it... There is a big difference between being spoon fed and missing detail.

Anyway the main point was an orientation nothing more nothing less no suggestions no plug holes just an orientation... So please.

we don't have any concrete details of exactly what Boba fett is doing. But it appears he is triangulating the way the shot is laid out.

I don't really want to babble on about this but here is what I see in the Bobba fett scene.

1. The Falcon fires it's engines and flys through the junk.

2. Slave 1 fires it's engines and follows the falcon in close pursuit through the junk but with no intention to attack.

3. We are shown another shot of the falcon being pursued in close proximity by Slave 1 and both ships are now exiting the junk.

4. We are now inside the cockpit of Slave 1 Boba fett is looking through a periscope of sorts. We then see Boba fett swivel in his cockpit chair while the falcon gets further away suggesting he is no longer following them.

now on point 4... is the periscope forward facing or is it off to the side as in are we seeing a side shot of Boba fett facing forward in the cockpit of slave 1 or are we behind Boba fetts chair and he has turned 90 degrees to the right only to swivel back to forward facing?

In my mind the periscope is forward facing for ergonomics.. Meaning he has cut off pursuit and this is a side view of the cockpit.

There is nothing that suggests he does not detect them considering the first in cockpit shot we see is Han having a Radio conversation with one of the cloud car pilots I'd say he has detected them alright.

This a fine example of the all too conveinent star wars problem "it works because we need it to here but forget about everything else"

So you can add a contradiction to episode 4 Alderaan / Deathstar approach + death star escape and episode 5 in Cloud city approach

And later on when they leave cloud city and have to go back Lando also mentions tie fighters when they are miles away from cloud city that they have detected.

I just watched the clip on facebook again... And whilst I like the increased distance It's a shame to lose the falcon leaving the junk also as a consequence but nevermind.

If that periscope view of the falcon were added to explain Jamming the sensors and perhaps hacking the Nav computer then perhaps we could have both Falcon and Slave 1 both leave the junk seperately.... And that is my very last final thought.

I don't care about cloaking devices I just want the scene to make sense and not contradict what we have seen previously

Ok this is the only other idea that I can come up with that does not contradict the Falcons scanners from episode 4.

Also I would rather Boba hyperspace remained ambiguous like in the original... And these are my final thoughts on it.

@bendanger

yes it makes sense to show the pursuit out of the junk.

It does not make sense he is following him through deep space undetected.

Jumping to hyperspace to bespin before the falcon also makes no sense... Or atleast in my opinion.

does it matter? no not really.

Is it stupid? Yes it is a stupid scene

Well I can dig that the Empire got there before the falcon ..But getting the trajectory from straight after leaving the junk again it's a ??? Initially a bit far fetched. And there is no evidence that Fett got to Bespin before the Falcon it is ambiguous.

Wether or not you trust wookiepedia I found this so you can make of it what you will.

 Before the rise of the Galactic Empire, cloaking devices were virtually unknown but not unheard of. Around 32 BBY, Sienar Design Systems developed and built a cloaking field generator for Darth Maul's Scimitar, powered by stygium crystals. Boba Fett also had one, which had been added onto Slave I by Mentis Qinx, a dockyard owner on Tatooine, in 22 BBY.

If you choose to Hang on Needahs words fine... But there seems to be plenty of contradictory claims of the technology and that it's plausible he was not up to date of current technological advancement.

I'd prefer to think of Boba Fett as a Hunter that stalks his prey I guess... 

The problem is the approach on the Alderaan / death star in ANH...

The falcon can track a ship following it in a group of inanimate asteroids... Bobba fetts ship is no different from this scenario in ESB.

So without using any logic at all the magic cloak solves it all... No matter what anyone says.

And then we don't have to make guesses about how what who where or why... It just is that way. Rather than ????

I always thought Boba fett reached Bespin after the Falcon

Oh yeah I thought it was from ANH....

Well then it makes no sense that Slave 1 could possibly follow the falcon without detection what a ridiculous predicament.

So Captain Needah is a buffoon who get's force choked a few moments later... I actually don't care what he says... He actually believes that they used a cloaking device and is shocked by this.

The Deathstar was "Too big to be a spacestation"

The x-wing in the swamp was "Too big" to lift with the force

Darth Vader killed Anakin until he became "I am your Father" plot

So Captain Needah saying that line don't mean squat.

Also considering he also says "we don't need their kind" in reference to the bounty hunters when obviously Boba Fett is the only one crafty enough to catch Han out... Do you think we should remove Boba Fett chasing the falcon?

Of course not... Nothing that guy says matters he is a fall guy who gets it all wrong no problem with it.