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NeverarGreat

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11-Sep-2012
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8-Jul-2025
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Post
#719895
Topic
Other than Jar Jar and midichlorians, what don't you want in episode 7?
Time

I don't want JJ to listen to Disney if they tell him to tone down the gore or make it more "kid friendly". Star Wars had an onscreen neck snapping, a bloody dismemberment, the smoking corpses of a married couple and the onscreen deaths of most of the members of a fighter squadron, as well as the destruction of an entire planet's population. It didn't need to be kid friendly, and neither does this.

I don't want JJ to include anything in the movie purely because previous episodes also contained said things. If the story can more naturally be told without a single lightsaber fight, so be it.

In fact, I don't want to see many references at all to previous episodes. To quote Steve Jobs: "A lot of times, people don't know what they want until you show it to them". If there is a choice between showing me something that I've seen before and something new, surprise me.

I DO want Star Wars to surprise me again. I want to be left not knowing what will happen next, and being interested in the outcome. I want JJ and Kasdan to have thought deeply about what the primary message of Star Wars really is, and if the saga is to end with episodes 7, 8, and 9, to make this final installment in the trilogy of trilogies be a revelation that deepens and redefines the previous trilogies as well.

A guy can dream.

Post
#719296
Topic
<strong>STAR WARS: REBELS</strong> (animated tv series) - a general discussion thread
Time

New /Film interview:

/Film: Without spoilers, can we safely say this band of characters is beginning of a growing thing that’ll lead to Princess Leia and the creation of the Death Star? Is this the beginning of the snowball effect?

Dave Filoni: I think the way to look at it, Simon said this beautifully. He described the American Revolution as if this was a show that was about five guys that were locked up in a farmhouse somewhere fighting against the local British military and without any real knowledge of the larger political movements or what’s going on. I think that that’s really how you look at the truth of it with the Rebels. How do you get all these people together? We’re looking at one little small group that’s trying to stand on their own and how does that hook up to what you know is a rebel alliance in A New Hope?  I think that’s one of the things that we’re gonna reveal as this story moves forward.

Although I don't care for the look of this show, this is a good way to approach prequel writing in general. I was using this method to construct a prequel storyline at one point. It allows for the audience to care about the characters while understanding that history as a whole cannot be changed by them. That was a big problem with the Lucas Prequels, they thought galactically instead of locally. So props to Filoni on this.

Post
#718987
Topic
Episode VII: The Force Awakens - Discussion * <strong>SPOILER THREAD</strong> *
Time

darklordoftech said:

unamochilla2 said:

Abrams wanted them have to larger roles, so their roles were expanded

In that case, thank you Abrams! Star Wars is Luke and Vader, not these random "new" characters who episodes 7-9 plan to introduce.

Well now that Vader is dead, I guess Star Wars for you is just Luke then?

For me, Yoda is as important to Star Wars as any other character, and he was introduced in a sequel. If Episode 7 injects new life into the franchise, I highly doubt that it will be in the form of the aging OT leads.

Post
#718848
Topic
Star Wars: Episode VII to be directed by J.J. Abrams **NON SPOILER THREAD**
Time

Anchorhead said:


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2709106/An-island-far-far-away-Filming-Star-Wars-Episode-7-takes-place-remote-Irish-island-veil-secrecy.html

Dont know how trusted a source the Dailymail is, but it looks interesting as a location alright.  Might be some place where you could discover an old Jedi hermit.

The two weeks of location shooting in Tunisia produced almost 18 minutes of footage for the first film. Of course every location shoot is different, but a simple extrapolation would suggest that this location would provide no more than five minutes of footage in Episode 7. Nerd speculation aside, it looks like a fantastic location.

Post
#717788
Topic
Ways to Do the Prequels with No Spoilers for the OT.
Time

Perhaps the story doesn't need to be done vastly differently than the prequels to have no spoilers. As I've posted incarnations of this story elsewhere, this will be draft three of an evolving set of ideas forced into formation. Make of it what you will:

It is a time of galactic war. Vicious cloned warriors, striking from the Great Rift, have attacked the Galactic Republic and are now moving directly to its heart. The bright center of the Republic lies exposed. Countless star systems lie in ruin.

 

The final hope for the Republic lies the hands of an ancient and powerful order of holy warriors - the JEDI KNIGHTS - who alone have the strength to repel the relentless clones. However, their venerable order is not what it once was. Few in the galaxy have faith in the Force - the mystical field of energy that give the Jedi their power - so the Jedi have dwindled in numbers and power. Like the embers of a dying fire roused to brilliance by a searing wind, they now fight desperately to regain their former glory.

 

The Jedi Knight Obi-wan Kenobi is among the fiercest of the order. Being the last student of an old master of the Force, he knows that the Jedi once took and trained disciples from an early age, and this gave them great numbers and power. But it also led to bitter dissent and rivalry, and strained the unity of the order. Yet Commander Kenobi has need of both of these things if the Republic is to survive the clones, and so when he sees the presence of the Force in one of his new recruits, he selects this young man - Anakin Skywalker - to fly with him against the clones in his newly formed fighter squadron.

 

Skywalker, he discovers, is only sixteen, having faked his identity to fight with for the Republic. Impressed both by his audacity and his skill as a pilot, Obi-wan decides to train Anakin in the ways of the Jedi. Anakin soon becomes a formidable warrior, learning quickly and bringing Commander Kenobi victory after victory for the Republic. Soon Kenobi is advanced to the rank of General, due in no small part to Anakin's heroics. However, Kenobi's reliance on young Skywalker takes its toll on the young man. Anakin soon tires of war, and falls in love with a woman from the peaceful planet of Alderaan, which is liberated from clone forces by Skywalker and General Kenobi.

 

Yet the war rages on, and there are personnel shortages within the military. Suddenly the Chancellor of the Republic is captured and taken to a clone stronghold, and so the Kenobi sends Skywalker in to rescue him. Anakin discovers that behind the clones lies a power which is a corruption of the Force, one that seems far more powerful. In the darkness of the clone stronghold, Anakin draws his laser sword against a mysterious warrior guarding the Chancellor, one who has this dark side of the Force as his power. The warrior seems to know the young Jedi's training, matching him move for move. Anakin cannot overcome this terror shrouded in darkness, and so he flees. The clones gain a decisive victory, and the Republic remains in mortal peril.

 

Anakin is haunted by his defeat by the mysterious warrior and his failure to rescue the Chancellor. He immerses himself in strategy and training, knowing every secret movement of Republic forces under the command of the Jedi knights. His mission is to find the Chancellor. However, every rescue mission turns into a rout. Jedi who should have lived now die. The Jedi suspect treachery in their midst, and so they turn to their bravest, whom they know to be Anakin, to seek out the traitor. Anakin knows that this traitor was once trained as a Jedi, perhaps even by Kenobi himself, for he knows Anakin's every technique. He is convinced that this traitor is the mysterious warrior he battled in the clone stronghold, but he cannot find this warrior among the Jedi.

 

Then Obi-wan discovers that the woman Anakin fell in love with is actually a clone. She was fighting on Alderaan but threw down her weapons and posed as a native of that world. Obi-wan asks her why she defected, as it is not in a clone's nature to betray their comrades. She explains that the DNA of the Clones is incomplete, and so they receive a genetically formulated antidote at their strongholds. Clones that do not will slowly weaken and die, and this is why they are so ferocious, with no defectors. They are literally fighting for their lives. Yet she would rather spend a few years in peace than a lifetime at war. But she is pregnant, and fears that she will not be strong enough to bear Anakin's child.

 

Meanwhile, the Jedi have discovered the location of the captured Chancellor, and they all mount a final attack on the primary stronghold. Kenobi and Skywalker are selected to lead the covert mission to rescue the Chancellor while the rest of the Jedi lead the ground and fighter attacks. But Anakin, mistrustful of Obi-wan and suspecting him of treachery, decides to go alone.

 

The final assault begins. As the Jedi and the Republic forces open a way through the massed clone forces, Anakin slips by, and winds his way to the very center of clone stronghold. There he finds the Chancellor, who is unguarded and surveying the battle from atop his tower. Surrounding him are six figures cloaked in red, seated as if watching the proceedings. The Chancellor bids Anakin watch the final destruction of the Jedi, and Anakin realizes that the Chancellor is the mastermind of the war. Anakin demands to have the genetic antidote, and the Chancellor responds:

 

"Whoever controls the antidote controls the clones, Anakin. If this is what you seek, here he stands, the antidote to all war."

 

"It's in you?"

 

"The Clones are me, young Skywalker. Incomplete without me, male and female I created them. They are my children. Do you know the true power of my family? It was my grandfather who first understood. His father was a Jedi, and he was strong in the Force. His son was strong in it as well, as was I. The Force chose our family above all others to rule the galaxy."

 

This is the first that any Jedi has heard of the Force being with an entire family rather than a single individual, and it shakes Anakin to his core. As starships incinerate each other in the blackness before him, the Chancellor continues:

 

"Though you are the greatest of the Jedi, you are not my son. Therefore it is time for you to meet an old friend, though you haven't yet been properly introduced."

 

The shadow warrior steps out of the blackness.

 

"Meet my apprentice, Darth Vader."

 

The warrior again fights Anakin, again drives him back.

 

"This is Obi-wan's greatest student. I have simply continued his training. Soon, Darth Vader will be a master of the Force, and shall join me as my loyal servant. That is, unless the great Anakin Skywalker can defeat him."

 

Anakin grows angry, and the warrior seems to gain power. Anakin attacks ferociously, hating this figure who betrayed and killed so many of his brethren.

 

"You killed Jedi! Because of you millions are dead! How can you remain silent? You will answer for this!"

 

The warrior yet advances, forcing Anakin back.

 

"Can you not see, Skywalker? Anger only makes my apprentice stronger."

 

Meanwhile, the battle rages. General Kenobi, who is in a Republic warship, orders an evacuation of the skeleton crew as the ship loses shields. He races to his personal fighter, but along the way runs into Anakin's wife, who had joined the cause as a gunner because of the lack of trained personnel. The ship breaks apart as they both escape in the fighter. They maneuver through the battle, and Anakin's wife realizes that Obi-wan isn't half the pilot that people think he is, for Anakin had been doing much of the heroics. The ship gets blasted and shields go down, but Obi-wan manages to take it to hyperspace.

 

Anakin takes one of the red-robed figures hostage. The Chancellor chuckles:

 

"How un-Jedilike of you, Anakin. You cannot defeat Darth Vader, so you threaten a woman."

 

The figure removes her mask. The Chancellor crows:

 

"These are some of my many daughters. With the blood of the Force, they will birth a dynasty that shall rule the galaxy forever."

 

Anakin is horrified to discover that they all have the face of his wife.

 

Meanwhile in hyperspace, Obi-wan realizes that Anakin's wife has taken a piece of shrapnel, and as he attempts to tend to her, she remarks on Obi-wan leaving the battle, claiming that it is cowardice. She says that she doesn't fear death, having made the choice to die when she defected. Obi-wan however still fears death, and always admired the way Anakin would brave all odds to save the day, risking his life countless times. But Anakin's wife shares a different story, saying that Anakin couldn't understand her reason for choosing death. Anakin in fact acted bravely because he secretly feared death, and didn't want people to think him a coward.

 

Anakin meanwhile stares at the face of what looks like his wife. As fear overcomes him, the darkness seems to deepen, and the shadow warrior approaches Anakin from behind. Anakin realizes that he has not the strength to defeat the Chancellor, nor even the ability to defeat Vader. He realizes that death awaits him. The Chancellor sees his resolve:

 

"You accept your death, Skywalker? You may be a Jedi yet."

 

"A Jedi never dies."

 

Vader swings his lightsaber, and the scene ends.

 

The Republic surrenders to the Clones and the Chancellor, now made Emperor. He addresses the Senate, claiming that in his mercy he has allowed it to endure, if only to serve his will. A black-robed figure stands beside him along with the new military cabal the Emperor has created.

 

Obi-wan and Anakin's wife survey the stars from space, adrift aboard a space station surrounded by the refugees of a thousand decimated worlds. Around them life finds a way to endure, as ships arrive and return to parts unknown.

Post
#717696
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

Ryan McAvoy said:

Not wishing to end the debate but the wikipedia article on RMW (If you choose to trust it) states clearly...

"Recent Film Credits: Star Wars Trilogy – Restoration and 3D Conversion"

Should have checked Wikipedia earlier but that seems fairly conclusively to point towards this being part of the aborted 3D post-convert business. Sad face.

That was already the only logical answer, considering when it was done. The question now is what Disney is going to do with it; whether to go through with the 3D release, use the materials for an OUT Blu-ray, or do nothing.

Post
#717635
Topic
Rank The Indiana Jones Films
Time

Wow, I have an entirely different ranking than anyone so far:

The Last Crusade

Raiders of the Lost Ark

Kingdom of the Crystal Skull

Temple of Doom

I actually saw The Last Crusade first of all the films, and as it opens with Indy's backstory, I always just assumed that it was the first in the series (the Ark reference confused me at the time!). People say it's weak, but I thought Connery was excellent as the father, and the entire Grail quest is enthralling. And the music!

Anyway, If I'd watched Raiders first as a kid, I probably would have ranked it highest. But as I was spoiled by the effects of Crusade, this didn't have as big an effect on me as Crusade.

I went to see KOTCS in the theater, and distinctly remember giving the above ranking to all the movies upon leaving. There are some atrocious moments in the film, like Shia swinging on vines, but overall it was different enough from the others to be interesting, something that I cannot say of Temple of Doom.

Temple of Doom is the pits. I don't care about the opening dance number, the inflatable raft escape is laughably absurd, the magic stones are parochial and dull, Short Round is annoying, Willie Scott is more so. It is thoroughly unpleasant throughout, gross for the sake of being gross, cruel (child slavery?!) for the sake of being cruel, and justly deserves the scorn shown to movie prequels on these forums.

Post
#717444
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

darklordoftech said:

gizzy2000 said:

Harmy said:

We do know, that those aren't the original sabers in that video, which means, that it isn't the '97SE either and apart from color, they look an awful lot like the 2004SE sabers. But since evidence points towards this new transfer having been done in 2012, which would co-inside with the time the 3D releases were still part of the plan, Disney may have nothing to do with it and since Lucas was still running things, they probably would have bothered to add all the other changes for a Lucas-sanctioned 3D re-release.

 Thank you. So Disney will probably just kind of abandon this restoration since there isn't a plan for Star Wars 3D anymore, unless they release it before Episode VII.

Why not use it in place of the existing Blu-Ray versions in future SE releases?

That's probably what they will do, with or without alterations. And that's good news for the folks here on this site!

Post
#717359
Topic
All Things Star Trek
Time

Tobar said:

Welcome to the forum! =)

So does that mean Nemesis is among the best of the franchise? Trek 09 was basically just a rehash of the last Trek film that had come out with a layer of stomping on continuity thrown on top with a sprinkling of style. Though it was well paced.

 The difference between Trek 09 and Nemesis was that the "Romulan" villains were the primary focus, whereas in 09 the Romulan villains were not the focus of the film. Both sets of villains fail at being compelling characters, and fail at being an insurmountable threat to the heroes. But since the 09 film is focused on being an origin story for an entirely new parallel universe, the baddie doesn't matter that much. It ends on an uplifting note of exploration and new beginnings, in contrast to Nemesis, which ends with Picard killing everyone in the forward decks of his ship and murdering a terminally ill young man while Data sacrifices himself in the process (which needn't have happened if Picard had thought to take the portable transporter with him in the first place). There's no lesson to be learned, no sense of excitement or accomplishment. It's just depressing.

Post
#717333
Topic
Star Wars: Episode VII to be directed by J.J. Abrams **NON SPOILER THREAD**
Time

Fang Zei said:

Oh wow, I didn't even notice that "over/under" design of how the s-foils fold up.

Yeah, that's really clever. I can imagine people looking at it in the movie as it goes into combat and thinking: "Ah, a single wing desig....whaaaa?!"

Also, I wonder if small things like the mouse droid are just misdirection on the part of Abrams. I'd like to think that they wouldn't include everything from the previous movies just because it's recognizable as being from Star Wars.

Post
#717116
Topic
General Star Wars <strong>Random Thoughts</strong> Thread
Time

bttfbrasilfan said:

NeverarGreat said:

I have a new theory about the folks at Lucasfilm that colortimed the 2004/2011 master. They were trying to save the originals by making the SE so bad that people would rise up and demand justice. Think about it. It's actually quite difficult to accidentally crush blacks and blow out whites on professional color correction systems (especially correcting with scopes), so they had to know what they were doing. Having gotten away with it on Star Wars, they went crazy with Empire.  "Surely people won't stand for this and demand refunds" they said. "Surely they will demand a proper restoration after this" they said.

Nope.

 The colorist of the 2004 master talks about it in this podcast...

http://www.fxguide.com/thevfxshow/the-vfx-show-133-star-wars-blu-ray-release/

...and he doesn't seem to think he did a bad job at all. In fact, most of the time, they discuss about how great this BD release is.

Although, I think your theory might be right in some aspects. We have countless examples, but what stands out the most for me is the fact that all of the 2011 changes are so bad and lazily made that I can't believe they were done by professionals.  

Ah, I remember this podcast! He distances himself from the Blu-ray at the beginning of the podcast by saying that he doesn't remember making the Tantive corridors that inconsistent. Hmm.

Post
#717100
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

Beatleboy99 said:

NeverarGreat said:

http://rmwimages.files.wordpress.com/2011/06/rmw-article-p3-update-june1.pdf

A link to an article discussing RMW's projects and tools. From the article:

"After RMW bought Lowry Digital, the company has completely restored over 50 commercially released classic films and DVDs over the past decade, including Casablanca, Citizen Kane, Singing in the Rain, the James Bond library, the Star Wars trilogy and numerous Disney films."

More evidence to consider.

 Well, they did restore the Star Wars trilogy for dvd and blu ray

But it wasn't RMW that did the restoration for those releases as far as we know.

Here's another comparison using a higher quality promotional image I found next to the Blu-ray:

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/84310

They look quite similar, and the final result doesn't display the same warping that the other video examples show. That lends credence to the idea that it is simply the old Lowry work. But the warping on C-3PO (perhaps caused by different temporal smoothing) is quite different than the Blu-ray, and that combined with the damage differences shown earlier make it clear that this is something other than the old work. The lack of overall warping in this comparison is odd though. Perhaps they simply used the old Lowry scan for this work, and applied a new cleanup algorithm on top of it. But why not just re-scan the O-neg in 4K to do this new work?

I'd guess that either the original film didn't warp or significantly change in the 6-7 years since the last scan, or it degraded so severely that it was unusable and they needed to revert to an older scan.

Post
#717094
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

http://rmwimages.files.wordpress.com/2011/06/rmw-article-p3-update-june1.pdf

A link to an article discussing RMW's projects and tools. From the article:

"After RMW bought Lowry Digital, the company has completely restored over 50 commercially released classic films and DVDs over the past decade, including Casablanca, Citizen Kane, Singing in the Rain, the James Bond library, the Star Wars trilogy and numerous Disney films."

More evidence to consider.

Post
#717080
Topic
General Star Wars <strong>Random Thoughts</strong> Thread
Time

I have a new theory about the folks at Lucasfilm that colortimed the 2004/2011 master. They were trying to save the originals by making the SE so bad that people would rise up and demand justice. Think about it. It's actually quite difficult to accidentally crush blacks and blow out whites on professional color correction systems (especially correcting with scopes), so they had to know what they were doing. Having gotten away with it on Star Wars, they went crazy with Empire.  "Surely people won't stand for this and demand refunds" they said. "Surely they will demand a proper restoration after this" they said.

Nope.

Post
#717048
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

msycamore said:


It should be noted that the before and after sample with the droids in the desert seems to be the old 2004 Lowry fiasco. It's old.

 I disagree. It looks like a new cleanup. Here's why:

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/84284/picture:0

The damage in the red circle of the first comparison is completely dealt with in the RMW cleanup. However, this same cleanup seems to add a peculiar bit of damage in the green circle of the first comparison.

Moving to the comparison with the Blu-ray, there now appears to be damage in the red circle which was supposedly dealt with in the RMW cleanup. In the green circle of the Blu-ray, the spot of damage near R2 which is present in the cleanup is gone in the Blu-ray (and there's a different green artifact apparent in the Blu-ray). Also, I reduced the quality of the Blu-ray to match the RMW video, and the discrepancy remains, so the video resolution can hold this damage information.

There are several such damage discrepancies in this shot. I really don't think that this is the original Lowry work.

Post
#717002
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

gizzy2000 said:

I also went back to page 2 of this thread and looked at the lightsaber flash comparisons and you can tell that (other than color) the flashes are identical to the blu ray and not the GOUT. The only possibility is that they color corrected the blu ray and edited out SE changes and re-added the real scenes, which honestly, I could live with, if they do it right

I am sure that this is a different scan than the Blu-ray, because if you look at my comparisons the new version has a different warping pattern than the Blu-ray:

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/83700/picture:1

My conclusions:

This is a new 4K scan of the original negatives and elements, with an improved dirt and scratches detection and elimination algorithm (they boast on their website that manual cleanup is not done on the films they process). It has new colortiming, similar but not always identical to the '97 version of the film (see the running stormtroopers and the green C-3PO). There is no evidence for or against '97 SE changes, but as this is not a simple scan of the '97 interpositive, such changes seem unlikely to be included. The evidence leans in favor of an OUT release which has yet to be announced by Disney.

Post
#716992
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

gizzy2000 said:

I think the RMW looks more like the '97 SE than the blu ray

 In terms of overall color balance, absolutely.

However, I don't think that color would be much of a factor when determining the origin of a particular element, as any scan of the original negative would require new colortiming, which could look like whatever they wanted it to look like. The area of interest to me would be the lightsaber effects, as these are the only parts of the shot which would need to be scanned from separate low quality (and thus probably more degraded) originals. If you look at the progression of Vader's saber from the GOUT to the RMW version, it gets progressively wider and blurrier. If the RMW shot was simply scanned from the SE interpositive made in '97, there would be no need to re-composite the lightsabers and Vader's saber would be as sharp as it is in the '97 screenshot. As it appears even more degraded than in the Blu-ray, the logical answer is that it couldn't possibly be a simple scan of the '97 SE.

Short answer: A '97 SE scan would have identical lightsabers to the '97 screenshot. They don't, so it's not a scan of the '97 print.

Post
#716989
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

DarthShackleford said:

Does this mean there's now a better chance that the RMW scan could be OOT? Weren't we assuming '97 because we thought it tied into the Plaza? Or did the screenshot comparison rule out OOT?

It was only a hunch that the Plaza was showing the RMW work, a hunch that was clearly wrong if the colors were the same as the 2011 release.

Here's another comparison between releases:

Top Blu-ray, Bottom RMW.

Top corrected GOUT, bottom corrected 97 SE:

It seems like the lightsaber compositing of the RMW matches the Blu-ray, but that could simply be because the original lightsaber elements are faded, accounting for similar results in both shots. If they simply scanned the '97 version, it would seem to me that the compositing would match the bottom shot. So I'm still thinking that the RMW is a new 4K scan of the original elements which have been assembled in a way which is similar to the 2011 version.