Mavimao

Smoking Lizard said:

I really don’t want to sound argumentative or terribly cynical, and I understand that so many fans really want to like this movie, but seriously, I have to say, at this point, knowing what we know how can anyone suggest this movie is good?

I wonder at times if everyone in society has collectively lost his mind.

This movie is clearly a cheap ripoff. A con. A money grab. A bait and switch.

• The Empire was defeated in the original trilogy. No problem! We have a new, improved empire! Complete with an evil guy in black robes, scary mask, and red light saber!

• You like cool stormtroopers? Snowtroopers? WE GOT 'EM! The Empire 2.0 has got oodles of stormtroopers!

• How did the Republic allow the Empire 2.0 to come into existence? Who cares! It’s a movie! Please don’t answer, “How did the original empire come into existence?” Because the answer is simple – a corrupt politician seized the existing legal republican government, a la Adolf Hitler, that’s how. So did the new Republic make the same mistake? No, because the new Republic still exists in this new universe. So WTF? Oh well…who needs things to make sense?

• So we have a cute, plucky little beachball droid carrying a secret message being hunted by the bad guys. Uh, wait…isn’t that just a straight, cheap ripoff?

• So we have an Force-sensitive, unknown orphan who grew up on an entirely desert planet who is unaware of her vast potential. Um, hello? Again, cheap ripoff copycat?

• By the way, I thought even Force-sensitives had to be TRAINED to use the Force before they can?

• So the Empire 2.0 has stormtroopers, but they’re not clones…and they’re not conscripts or recruits. So the Empire 2.0 breeds them? From birth? So the Empire 2.0 has some vast wing of babies being birthed to become stormtroopers somewhere? How else do you explain that “Finn” does not have a name?

• Why is it that in a galaxy populated by trillions of people, we keep bumping into the same four or five over and over, no matter where we go? And the same goes for spaceships, too. How awfully convenient that the Millenium Falcon just happens to be on the desert planet that Rey is on? And how awfully convenient that Han Solo decides it’s a good idea to take back ownership of the Falcon at the age of, what, 70?

• So the Empire 2.0 has an even bigger, badder Death Star. It blows up stars! But it’s on a planet…so it cannot travel from place to place in the galaxy…so it shoots its laser or plasma or whatever blasts from light years away and the blast travels and travels and travels across the galaxy to hit its target? What does the laser blast make the jump to hyperspace itself to get to its target in due time?

• I mean, really? The Death Star thing all over again? Really? And somehow the First Order/Empire 2.0 is capable of making a weapon even more powerful that the Death Stars, despite the fact that it’s not the ruling government of the entire galaxy?!

• And really, like, say, 10 or 20 years before this movie is set there was NO ONE in the Republic saying, “Hey, guys! A bunch of copycats are restarting the Empire! They’re building star destroyers and TIE fighters and maybe a planet killing machine thing! We need to stop them!”?!

• And really, Rey thinks the Jedi and all that jazz is “legend.” Um, hello? That war was only 30 years ago! That would be like saying the events of 1985 are just perceived as “legends” today in 2015. Please. Yeah, WWII was just a legend. Right.

• SURPRISE! The bad guy is Han and Leia’s son! Wow! Never saw that coming! What a huge reveal!

• Luke Skywalker’s Jedi Academy is wiped out, SO HE LEAVES?!? GOES INTO HIDING?! When there’s a perfectly safe Resistance planet he could have gone to to help out in the fight?! Don’t tell me Obi Wan went into hiding, because he didn’t. He took Luke to safety on Tatooine and then guarded over him because he knew that the only person who could possibly sway Darth Vader back to the light was Vader’s son.

• Leia gets word that there’s a lead as to where her brother is…so she sends her best PILOT to collect the intel? Yeah, because when there’s important information to be collected in Iraq or Syria or Russia, President Obama sends his best F-16 pilot.

• Han Solo: “Hey, Finn, I hear you have some really important information to get to Leia. I mean, we could just, you know, do one of those video chats that we do all the time, but, nah. We’ll go there in person. In the Millenium Falcon. BUT FIRST! We have to make a pitstop at a bar in a castle so you can meet my old Force sensitive mentor!” Finn: “But Han! In the first movie released in 1977, you told Obi Wan that you didn’t believe in the Force! That you had traveled from one end of the galaxy to the other and just concluded it was just ‘simple tricks and nonsense.’” Han: “Um…oh yeah.”

Stupid. Effing stupid. Completely cheap and stupid. Insulting to the intelligence. There should a huge public outcry. Outrage! Instead? 99% Fresh on Rotten Tomatoes!

If I’m reading your message correctly, it seems like you haven’t seen the film? While you’re right on some points (ie: the Starkiller - they really couldn’t come up with anything else?), others aren’t quite so.

The First Order isn’t a “New Empire” - it feels much like the Thrawn trilogy with the remains hiding out far away from the Republic. They’re described as having “risen from the ashes” and their stormtroopers seem to have actually been kidnapped at young ages (as per Finn’s dialogue) and brought up with propaganda and training (slave labor troops?). Nothing is really sure about the politics of this universe. It might be like the USA in the 1860s: split with two different governments. Or perhaps the Resistance is a separate military branch with some independence from the Republic?

Luke set up a Jedi school, but Kylo Ren and his knights destroyed it. There seems to be some reason as to why he went into hiding because…

Rey has an interesting flashback which suggests that she’s had Jedi training and was sent to Jakku to be safe (possibly from the Knights of Ren?). Her presence sets off a series of events - like R2 telling the Resistance where Luke is hiding. So perhaps, she was Luke’s last hope but was too young when Ren destroyed the Jedi school?

DuracellEnergizer said:

csd79 said:

The whole story is not designed to make all that much sense, good luck for the authors of the sequels to tie everything up. Some basic things are just left hanging in the air (if there is a new Republic now, how the First Order and the Resistance came to be etc). First I thought that Rey was a Jedi student as well and after Kylo’s turn to the dark side she was placed on Jakuu with her memories suppressed to hide and protect her, and the Falcon was there as sort of an escape option in case she gets in trouble. But no, it’s all just a coincidence.

The Force works in contrived ways.

Do you plan on watching the movie with an open mind? I’m getting an angry old man, yelling at sky vibe here.

csd79 said:

Just got home from a midnight screening (in the UK). I was ready to fall in love with everything SW again, but actually this movie got me angry more than anything. There are many great moments in it, but then it constantly switches back to meh.

The whole story is not designed to make all that much sense, good luck for the authors of the sequels to tie everything up. Some basic things are just left hanging in the air (if there is a new Republic now, how the First Order and the Resistance came to be etc). First I thought that Rey was a Jedi student as well and after Kylo’s turn to the dark side she was placed on Jakuu with her memories suppressed to hide and protect her, and the Falcon was there as sort of an escape option in case she gets in trouble. But no, it’s all just a coincidence.

All in all it felt like scenes from a never-before-seen SW movie cut into a long episode of Dr Who. After every good moment there comes a letdown. Can I have my money back? Also how is that OT restoration comming?

While I agree that some plot points fell flat, I don’t agree that the whole movie suffers because of it.

I also don’t agree that leaving things up in the air is necessarily a bad idea. I thought it was great that they DIDN’T go into some exposition-ladden dialogue about how the First Order and Resistance came to be. We get enough information to move the plot along but the rest is left up to our imaginations - much like the original Star Wars.

I think it’s also quite obvious that Rey has had some Jedi training and has been “awakened” by her interaction with Kylo Ren. As far and I can make out, she was put on Jakku to stay when the Knights of Ren came into power because she was too young to be a Jedi. (Notice that R2 ‘awakens’ when Rey arrives on the Resistance base and only then does he spill the beans about Luke’s whereabouts). Perhaps there are more Jedi spread across the galaxy and their powers are awakening as well! Lots of questions and lots of material for the other directors to tackle.

living420 said:

I feel like this is…bad news?

http://epicstream.com/news/Disney-To-Release-Original-Unaltered-Cut-Of-Star-Wars-Trilogy-On-Blu-ray

Although, knowing them, it won’t be perfect. I’m sure you guys will find and endless number of things to fix.

Old rumor.

I am positive at this point that Disney has to release the OT. If that happens, I’ll thank them more than I would spite them.

Harmy said:

Well, seen it - I’m not gonna say anything here but I’ll post a video review later.

Having already seen it, I’d love to hear what you thought!

Oh, fyi, no Fox fanfare. Just a silent Lucasfilm logo -> A long Time Ago… And then the Star Wars theme kicks in.

Bad robot logo is at the end of the credits.

No hidden scenes in credits.

CatBus said:

I’ve seen a couple reviews (neither I’d really trust, though) that say TFA is better than ROTJ. I can easily believe it’s better then ROTJ:SE, and am open to the possibility that it may even be better than ANH:SE, but if it actually surpasses any of the actual original trilogy, I’d be very pleasantly surprised and may give it a rental after all.

Then again, one of those reviewers also said ROTS was the best of the prequels, so that’s pretty disqualifying. Still waiting for more reviews to come in (mostly from friends).

I would say it equals or slightly beats Rotj (original). Like Jedi, it stumbles from time to time, but it’s still a great film on the whole. Go see it in theaters!

I hated the PT in theaters, so this isn’t just SW nostalgia. Ironically enough, it’s the nostalgia that bogs the film down the most. Its original content is great.

towne32 said:

TK428 said:

My favorite critic loves the film.

Mick LaSalle (San Francisco Chronicle)

http://www.sfgate.com/movies/article/Star-Wars-The-Force-Awakens-is-the-best-6700735.php

How spoilery does the review get? I started reading it, but after seeing how long it goes on (i.e., a real article instead of a blurb), I imagine there must be enough substance to refer to specifics…

It’s pretty spoilery. Avoid.

Oh and the lightsaber battles are really great. They’re very brutal and you feel how powerful these contraptions are. The aerobics of the PT are no more.

Just got back from the theatre. I hate NuTrek, the prequels, but this film was great. If you read the plot, you will be disappointed but the execution is excellent and the leads really carry the film.

But I would be lying if it wasn’t flawless. A THIRD planet destroyer is ridiculous and some of the pacing is a bit off. The film is much stronger playing off its original parts.

Just saw it (in France). As someone who hates NuTrek, the prequels and doesn’t have too much love for ROTJ: it’s awesome. Not perfect, but just awesome.

I’ll be going to the Bellecour Pathé theatre in Lyon tonight at 7:15. My friends and I are puumped!

theMaestro said:

It would be so awesome if they used Mike’s version and then paid him to do ESB and ROTJ.

Afaik, the materials for ESB and ROTJ are in much better shape than Star Wars so it wouldn’t need as arduous a restoration as Legacy.

Harmy said:

I’ve just heard from a guy who made one pretty well known Star Wars fanfilm and wrote for Clone Wars and he says he just watched Despecialized with a bunch of writers from Rebels 😃

That’s really awesome, Harmy! It’s crazy to see how mainstream this project has become and how grateful people are to actually have the original trilogy in HD. Disney would have to be completely blind to not see what the public are craving.

towne32 said:

clutchins said:

What were the differences in ESB mono?

Isn’t it similar to the 70mm?

I don’t know about the 70mm, but the biggest differences I can remember between the Mono and the Stereo mix are the following:

• the voice announcing “The First Transport is away” is different and is shifted in time.
• You can hear C-3PO arguing louder and more clearly with Chewbacca when they’re entering the Freezing Chamber.

I’m sure there’s other stuff as well, but I can’t remember. I do have a L/R comparison MP3 lying around somewhere if you’re interested.

clutchins said:

Harmy, will you be able to include the 16mm mono mix from Puggo like in ESB 2.0?

AFAIK the sound mix on Puggo’s 16mm print is just a fold down of the stereo mix. The mono mix on Star Wars and Empire were unique in their content and were worth including. Perhaps his print does have a unique mix, but no one can verify it since Puggo hasn’t released it yet.

dolceespress said:

Hi. Is there a download link for the Despecialized versions? I’m interested in those in great quality if available.

Thanks.

As per Internet protocol: read first post of this thread. Then Google if answer is not fully satisfied. Don’t just jump in asking for a link.

dolceespress said:

This editor uses Markdown syntax, which makes it easy to add formatting like italics, bold, and lists:

Brace yourselves.

StarChewyWar said:

Harmy said:

I don’t know what to answer first 😄
The nostril thing, I guess - there is a problem with the animation, though I don’t think is so much with the nostrils, as it is that it changes directions too fast. But since TN1 already released an HD sample of the complete scene, even if I didn’t get a better source, there would be no reason to keep the animated version in a potential new release of SW - I’d just use a 35mm source for the lizard.

Now that brings me to the next step after Jedi 2.0 and the posibility of a v3.0 release - the next step is ESB and the ROTJ v2.5. I might do 3.0 eventually but it would be a release of the entire trilogy at once, where ESB and ROTJ would be pretty much just 1080p upgrades of v2.5s (all of despecializing was still done at 720p for ESB v2.0, so all those shots would have to be redone and I’d have to redo the color correction and the cut at 1080p as well) but for Star Wars, it would have to be a complete new version from scratch, so don’t expect v3.0 or the upgrade to 1080p any time soon, if ever - seriously, I’m not promissing anything and I’ve had these plans for a long time but plans can change and I didn’t want to get anyone’s hopes up too high and I still don’t. It’s the same thing with this ROTJ workprint - I’ve been putting it together for quite a while now but I kept it under wraps, because I had no idea when the circumstances would allow me to finish it in a presentable state.

Concerning 4K, that would be just redundant without a new, very good 4K scan of the original negative - Scanning theatrical prints in 4K is great, because it allows for nice 2K results after the necessary resizing, cropping and other manipulation, but the detail present in a 4K scan of a print still doesn’t come anywhere near the detail seen on the BD, which is a shitty 1080p scan of the negative, and even this scan doesn’t resolve much beyond 720p. The BD does resolve a little bit beyond 720p, so there would still be some small merrit to a 1080p version but it doesn’t resolve all the detail possible with 1080p and 4K scans of prints resolve even less detail, so 4K would have no merrit at all, even sourced from a 4K scan of a print.

As to the GOUT sync, thanks for the info - the cut is not locked down yet, so I think I will still be able to make sure it’s NTSC synced, which, as CatBut correctly pointed out, has always been the plan for the final v2.0 version but it was just easier to keep the WP synced with v1.0, because I used v1.0 quite a lot when making it - most of the color-correction is just v1.0’s chroma with a bit of a tweak, and all the Jabba subs shots are just inserted in from v1.0. This is very much temporary and neither will be the case in v2.0 but it was a great way to expedite the proces to get the WP out in time for TFA.

Wait, I’m confused. How can a 4K scan of a print have less quality than the terrible 720p Blu Rays?

Take a picture of the raising of the flag at Iwo Jima with a Nintendo DSi/3DS (or other low quality camera) and print it out on a normal print size photo. Then try to scan that in 8k, 10k, 1 000 000k, whatever. Will you get the same quality as the original large format negative at even 300 dpi? No. Because the quality of the Nintendo camera is crap to begin with, there’s no detail to squeeze out of it despite the resolution you’re scanning it at.

It’s a bit of the same here. A negative scanned at 1080p will have more detail than a 4k scan of a film print that’s about 4 generations away from the negative (4 generations = an ANALOGUE copy of a copy of a copy).

GlastoEls said:

Harmy, you’re getting good at the YouTube videos.

Is there anything you CAN’T do?

Eat his own head?

canofhumdingers said:

So I’m watching the despecialized trilogy as a prelude to TFA this month. I was watching Star Wars tonight and a thought occurred to me. I vaguely remember seeing something about the edits made to the SE that mentioned a lot of the actual pyrotechnic explosions on the actors in the various shootouts on the Death Star were cut out. I remember it being that they wouldn’t cut the whole shot, but just snip the few frames that actually showed the blast.

Watching the DE it appears that, if these frames really were cut, they’ve been added back (thank goodness!). I’m just curious what source was used for this b/c it blends seamlessly as far as I could see.

Sorry if this has been answered before, it’s been a long time since I’ve bothered with anything detailing the SE, and I’ve long lost track of all the various minute things done to the DE to bring it back to its original glory.

It’s on the googleplus comparison page. According to that: custom matte and the GOUT

Awesome news Harmy! Signed up right away!

timdiggerm said:

pittrek said:

• some of the scenes are much “noisier” than others. I think it’s because of the optical wipes, the scene gets noisy always before and after an optical wipe, after the next cut it gets cleaner.

Wouldn’t this just be because sections involving wipes have been through an extra layer of compositing?

This is exactly the reason. Watch an older film from the 30s and this effect is much more obvious.

Darth Lucas said:

towne32 said:

He means the theatrical versions of porn, obviously.

So much debate over those original colors. Some insist her boobs are supposed to be more on the red side, but given the filmstock used, in the lighting of that motel, would produce a slightly more peachy colour to said breasts.

I’ve procured technicolor reference and am waiting for delivery.

Nowadays, these kids can just use cumputer generated imagery to enhance certain scenes! When I was a young whippersnapper we had to use models and be creative.

towne32 said:

He means the theatrical versions of porn, obviously.

And don’t gimme any of those teal and orange, DNR jobs on bluray!