MalàStrana

CHEWBAKAspelledwrong said:

I keep meaning to ask this and keep forgetting–is it just me, or did the effect on C-3PO’s voice sound a little different in TFA than in the OT and PT? like, a little more tinny or something?

And he also looks plastic (even in EpII and III he was metal looking). Something went wrong with the lighting of his scenes I guess.

(Leia also looks plastic, don’t know why they tried that hard to cover the fact that in 32 years she got older…)

So Rey would be the grand-daugther of Satine, the former Mandalore ruler ? It would surely be less boring than making her a Skywalker (and it would add a little something to the final rematch Ren vs Rey, with a new version of “Battle of the heroes”). But I would like her not to be blood-related to anyone we know (shrinking such a huge galaxy to a simple family feud over 9 movies is lame). Some kind of “New Chosen One” in order to explain her stunning abilities, and to extend (finish ?) the balance of the Force subplot (like it on not, it “feeds” the entire saga, even EpVII makes a reference to that).

Rian Johnson is a good director and even if his Akira-like “Looper” wasn’t that great the man knows how to build suspense and characters. That being said, TFA flaws are not really JJ Abrams faults, in the way a creative producer is needed to make a good movie (Gary Kurtz: yes ; McCallum: no ; Kennedy: surprinsingly no).

edit: by the way everybody is wishing (expecting ?) to see some training montage, but don’t you think this is déjà-vu stuff ? Even needed stuff ? It’s time to see something new, otherwise EpVIII is going to be a rehash ot EpV. EpVII is weak because (among many other flaws) they put things the fan base wanted to see, basically a rehash/remake/EpVI part 2, with nothing new added (only Finn is a never seen character in the saga, but they used him most of the time as a simple comic relief…). I want to be surprised, that Rian Johnson goes elsewhere to find inspiration, “Star Wars” Bible is not “Star Wars” itself (the main issue with most of 2015 blockbusters, this nostalgia trend which is killing creativity), it’s much more, way much more. Get inspirations from Robert Howard, Frank Herbert, David Gemmell, and so on. I know this is wishful thinking…

INSERT HERE “face palm meme” of your choice

Dude… really… anyway, if you have issues with that there is a magic tool called “start a private topic” you can use (or you can start trying to understand that there are things you don’t get and that you should grow up to let them go, instead of posting such a whining message you should be ashamed of).

Gift for you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GgOF1jQbTns

Now, again, if you have issues the place to deal with is not here, so stop contaminating unrelated threads.

EDIT: so it seems you really don’t get it. Well, if you don’t care/mind/whatever, just stop posting about it…

Density said:

ray_afraid said:

I really can’t understand why anyone would want to squeeze two (or three!) terrible films into the middle of a trilogy of good films. They add nothing to the original story and have nothing good going for them in any edit (other than Frinks!). All they could possibly add to the marathon is several boring ours and lots of eye rolling and groans.
So what’s you guys reason for including them?

I don’t entirely agree that they add nothing. The best thing they did was give Vader’s actions in ROTJ a bit more power and clear up some of the hanging threads at the end of ESB, which is why the Machete Order places them right between them. (I also think the Leia reveal actually has a bit more punch when seen at the end of ROTS, before Luke finds out, rather than at the beginning of ROTJ.) It’s just a shame that it could have been done so much better and really added a lot to it, instead of ruining so many other things at the same time.

And even then, you only have to watch ROTS to get that. The other two add nothing at all and are total wastes of (digital) celluloid. The story of ROTS should have been spread out over the entire trilogy. That’s why I don’t think the Machete Order even needs to include AOTC. You don’t really even need to see Anakin and Padme “fall in love.” You just gotta know they were married and had kids on the way. Despite some cringey romance dialogue in ROTS, there’s not nearly as much as in AOTC so the love story isn’t nearly as awful actually when you cut out AOTC and can fill in the blanks yourself. Also, skipping AOTC gives you a bit less crazy emo Anakin and you can fill in the blanks about his relationship with Obi-Wan too, so they may actually be seen as the “good friends” he described in ANH. I think watching it this way actually improves both ROTS and, to a lesser degree, ROTJ. But AOTC is beyond redemption and pointless to watch.

EpI is not digital. And EpII contains the death of Anakin’s mother (I guess it’s important to see Anakin falling to the dark side ?). EpII gets really better in a proper fan edit. I’m even beginning to think it is slightly better than EpIII, because in EpII Anakin still can embrace the dark side by choice, and not by being tricked to. But anyway the thread is about a SW marathon, so it means all 7 films. If you skip 1-2-3 it’s a semi-marathon.

jedimasterobiwan said:

MalàStrana said:

jedimasterobiwan said:

i was wondering if he thought it was an error

Was just joking dude. Don’t quite remember the Rebels sequence, but Obi-Wan does not record this message in EpIII (at least, not on screen).

it was the part in episode 3 where they use the thing in that room to warn any surviving jedi

Not sure: Obi-Wan just recalibrates the fake clone message so the surviving Jedi wouldn’t fall into the trap.
It’s unclear in Rebels when he recorded his message (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaEG6c2LZic). So it might be a continuity issue between EpIII and Rebels, but I think he does record it later.

TV’s Frink said:

Not anything that won’t get me banned.

Please be my guest ! But it would surely end up in a drop in your impressive message per day ratio (quantity, not quality, unfortunately…).

jedimasterobiwan said:

i was wondering if he thought it was an error

Was just joking dude. Don’t quite remember the Rebels sequence, but Obi-Wan does not record this message in EpIII (at least, not on screen).

TV’s Frink said:

Lame Signature, was Lame.

Very interesting. More to say you have ?

Seems Octorox wasn’t aware of that when he wrote the screenplays for “Rebels”…

imperialscum said:

Tobar said:

I mean, if you have to include the prequels you might as well do it machete order:
Star Wars
The Empire Strikes Back
Attack of the Clones
Revenge of the Sith
Return of the Jedi

This is the WORST thing you can actually do. Putting PT in the middle of OT contaminates the OT and its feel. Especially since ESB flows into ROTJ so nicely.

I agree: the PT is visually too different (EpI is ok, but EpII is too digital, even if Schorman’s HDTV preservation is a more enjoyable video source). The machete order idea is nice but it does not feel right. 4-5-6-1-2-3 would be my prefered order to discover the movies with the PT in a edited shape (Q2 for the pacing, Hal for a more conservative point of view - except for EpIII ending -, or L8): 1-2-3-4-5-6 if you already know them (again, PT re-edited). With 7-8-9 (if we assume the next two installments are going to deliver a good trilogy, which is still possible with Rian Johnson), chronological order (1 to 9) seems to be the right way.

Possessed said:

Sure they arent masterpieces,but with the worst of the bad acting and dialogue edited out they are quite enjoyable.

Especially EpI, which is by far the strongest movie among them (and the only one you can really watch with your kids and nephews, 'cause EpIII is way too violent for kids). It’s the only one that can work as a stand alone, it can even be watched without 2-3: 1-4-5-6, that way you keep all the reveals, and you even keep the Clone Wars mysterious. If you need to fill the gap, ROGUE ONE might do the job, so : 1-RO-4-5-6-(7-8-9)

TV’s Frink said:

MalàStrana said:

TV’s Frink said:

You really have some peculiar complaints.

Just to be sure: are you supposed to be some kind of moderator or something like that around ?

Relevance?

http://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/906929

TMBTM said:

it is also a “cliffhanger” in the way that the audience does not know how Luke will react to Rey giving him the lightsaber.

Such a great and thrilling ending…

TMBTM said:

and who does not even seem to be in need to be trained anyway!

It’s more logical to assume she’s going to train Luke. But she could at least get acting lessons.

The point of your post being… ? You’re point of commenting everything being… ?

@ Lord Haseo
Hem… kiddo, your opinion… no point.

TV’s Frink said:

You really have some peculiar complaints.

Just to be sure: are you supposed to be some kind of moderator or something like that around ?

Unfortunately L8 has cut the entire Opera entrance. Hal left it but has cut the corridor shot. I don’t know why: the theatrical version of the Opera entrance is good.

dkeighobadi said:
I’m guessing you’ve watched that viral video on “How TFA is worse than the Prequels”, which, whilst again having a few good points, irritates me greatly.

I haven’t watched this youtube video (if you understand french here is nevertheless a well made video to be watched, which is different than a video showing some bloke sharing his life and thoughts : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qpx1yM7liLA).

I’m not saying TFA is worse than the prequels, I’m saying this is basically the same stuff (the same stuff since RETURN OF THE JEDI to be correct), same strengths and (almost) same weaknesses, but with a OT nostalgia cloak on it (“oh it’s the Falcon, it’s got to be awesome !”). It looks good, it seems less offensive than the PT, but in the end there is the same DNA failure, and even new issues with the characters: What do they want ? What are their conflicts ? What have they learnt and what have they lost ? Rey in alreay filled with the Force and once she’s “unlocked” she is even more powerful (at least Superman has kryptonite…). This issue is new in Star Wars : you don’t like Anakin in the PT ? Ok, but in each film Anakin has a conflict and has to make strong choices that determine his nature and his link with the Force (leaving his mother, avenging her death, falling to the dark side). Rey, on the other hand, never makes a single strong decision: she just wants to stay on Jakku for cloudy reasons : she’s waiting for her family to go back… what family ? who are they ? why doesn’t she try to search them since she so good at stick fighting, saber fighting, piloting, climbing, Jedi Mind tricking, fixing unfixable ships, understanding the network door system in seconds of a ship when has never seen before ?, etc. When adventure calls, she just says that she wants to go back on Jakku. Yeah, to my view this is the worst main character in a Star Wars film: she’s not interesting at all. It was up to Ep VII to answer most of these questions, not the following movies (it’s “Star Wars”, not “Lost” !). It’s a very weak leading character. Finn is by far more interesting, but Abrams and Kasdan don’t use him well (when Finn confronts Phasma - shouldn’t be something important for him ? - the scene is really awkward and tries to be funny), and in the end Finn is just a comic relief in the movie and a guy who has a crush on Rey. So, basically it does not feed the plot with his characterization (oh, yeah, there is: he was cleaning the toilet on Starkiller base…). Not to mention the treatment of OT main characters.

It’s the 7th in a saga, and a sequel (it’s easier to do than a prequel): new ideas and characters are underdeveloped, recycled ideas are boring, and embarrassing “fan service” are the final stroke. Ep VIII & IX can’t fix that. Ep VII is supposed to be a movie with enough material to work on its own (Ep V ends on a cliffhanger but it has a complete story), and it’s not. No fan edit can fix it, but with a few things removed it could almost be a decent installment of the saga (I really like most of the first 30 minutes of the movie - until Han Solo shows up in fact -, some action shots, and the Han/Ben scene, even if really lazy in its writting : so to my view it’s average).

The appartment scene is, I believe, the scene that comes just after the second nightmare (“i’m not the Jedi I should be”).

ThomasBolt said:
Kamino landing. NEW SHOT
Seriously CG WATER! in 2002! WTF
and they built a model of the city, why didn’t they just stick it in a tank of water?

I think you can’t miniaturize water (and fire as well). I personnaly like the Kamino shots, they are pretty close to Ralph McQuarrie’s concepts for Bespin. It’s beautiful and I don’t mind the CGI here.

EpI & II done. EpIII should get its final check very (very) soon.

I’m sure Octorox is not only going to leave intact all midichlorians references, but he’s also going to add more of these in EpII. In the theatrical release of EpII there is no mention at all of midichlorians, so Octorox surely intends to recut Qui-Gon Jinn’s dialogues of EpI as voice-over Yoda’s meditation scenes. Thanks to a subtle montage of different audio sources from EpI, here is the line you’ll probably hear :
“a midi-chlorian count of 20.007 wupiwupi”. I believe this is consistent with the Clone Wars tv series.

Am I right Octorox ?

What’s the point in replying in this thread if you think this movie is perfect ? I really wonder… SW fans are really the worst (along with Zack Snyder fans 😃). Praising so much a 2 hours SW-Disney commercial, well… you’ve got what you were asking for (2015 was such a shitty cinematographic year: Jurassic World, Terminator 5, Star Wars 7… only Miller did it well with Mad Max 4. But the man has talent and knows how to write and direct a mythological movie…). So let’s change the thread title : “TFA is fucking awesome. No edit ideas because it’s so fucking perfect I would even have sex with the blu ray set”.

@ dkeighobadi
If you don’t know where to begin with, just… don’t… i’m not asking anything to you.

Lord Haseo said:

MalàStrana said:
If possible it would be cool to remove the inappropriate and unfunny humor (especially during Poe/Ren scenes)

Even Reti4 liked that…

Then ? If you like your main vilain in a movie be ridiculous in the opening scene (à la Grievous…), that’s your call.

the ridiculous “fan service” elements “oh, you’re General Han Solo !”

Did you miss the point of that interaction? Rey believes that Han was a smuggler and Finn believes he was a General. It established that where you live in the Galaxy determines what your view on history is. It’s not fanservice at all; it’s something we call world building.

I call it lame dialogues, and it builds absolutely nothing for any character involved in it (Finn’s backstory is already well established). It’s tv series storytelling, and I hate that.

and most of “Jar Jar” Finn characterisation (this character is so stupid… why isn’t he killed ?)

This has the sweaty smell of 4chan all over it.

Gné ?

The same goes with the line establishing that stormtroopers are conditioned kids who hence don’t join the Empire by choice.

Why? Just why?

Because it’s stupid and it removes the political depth of the First Order, which is just a weird Borg collective/body snatchers threat. Soviets and nazis believed in something, First Order stormtroopers believe in… nothing (well, they believe in the speech of a 30 yo ginger with non charisma, so I guess all stormtroopers and First Order officers are moron : so the main threats of the movie are… morons…).

his terrible line “Chewie, we are home” is also something to definitely cut

I mean I have problems with the film and in general I tend to nitpick but you’re trying way WAY too hard to find faults with the film

Not really: when one of your favorite character is introduced in such a lame way, I’m not nitpicking at all. Are people nitpicking about Anakin’s deep knowledge of sand ? Tell me.

Saddly it seems impossible to cut the terrible “Rey’s Jedi Mind Trick found in your magic pocket because the script needs you to use it now” scene

Can’t you kids wait until Rey’s full origins are reveled before jumping to conclusions? Is that too much to ask for?

There is no point in waiting: the movie is very clear about Rey. It’s lazy and it’s tv series storytelling at its worse, but with the flashback and what is said about Rey by Snoke and Maz I think everyone can understand she had some kind of Jedi training when she was 5 or 6 yo… (younglings are back !). The scene is just a complete failure, deux ex machina using Jedi Mind trick very conveniently. She’s so powerful she does not even need to use her hands like other Jedi had to (“New Chosen One full abilities unlocked”… faceplam powa…).

But the scene cannot be removed. Rey is the worst main character ever written in the saga, nothing can save her. Perhaps the screenwriter of Ep VIII & IX can manage to dosomething with this very weak material (I really hope so).

Most of Kylo Donald Duck Ren characterisation should also be removed in order to let the main villain look like a real threat and not a whining piece of shit kid who’s mad a his parents for grounding him.

Very potent meme my friend.

On a serious note Kylo Ren’s violent outbursts distinguishes him from every Dark Sider we’ve seen thus far and makes perfect sense considering he hasn’t completed his training in the Dark Side so he wouldn’t know how to reserve his anger for times it can be used more effectively. Furthermore, his outbursts makes him seem more unpredictable which adds a level of fear that can’t be attributed to the cold and calculating Darth Vader.

IMHO the guy looks like a dick when he does his donald duck things. There is even a joke to make fun of him when he does that (again, no vilain in this movie is taken seriously by anyone). It’s sad because the actor is good and his scene with Han Solo is strong, but this character is layered with teen movie characterization (tv series storytelling… again…).

The deleted scene explaining the political background really needs to be reinstalled.

I have been purposefully avoiding any details on the deleted scenes until I saw them in person but if a scene such as this was deleted it needs to be reimplemented into the film for sure.

There seems to be a scene involving Leia. Let’s hope it ends up to be a finished scene in the bonus section.

edit:

And did I mention the awful “Who’s the boss now ?” ? Glorious Finn, again… “Do you have a boyfriend” stuff is also painful.

Damn… the more I think about this movie the more I believe it’s a failure… “A new disappointment”… Good thing Jar Jar Abrams is not going to make VIII (but the director of “Jurassic World” on IX, seriously, do you have any ambitions Disney ?).

TV’s Frink said:
The one that made me laugh was the crawl one. I guess you haven’t seen ROTS.

Hum… yep, I can agree on this one: so it’s a share title. Both have lame opening scrawl.

So it’s still a 25% agreement 😃 Better than nothing ! I’m pretty sure when the hype goes down people will start to think that TFA is not that great (it happened before… like… 4 times…). On the other hand, I wouldn’t mind to change my view when the last 2 installments get released (“Ok, I get it now, it’s awesome”, I doubt that but I would be so happy to have been wrong).

Hard to say what should be corrected. TFA has a shitty script but is nicely done on the surface.

If possible it would be cool to remove the inappropriate and unfunny humor (especially during Poe/Ren scenes), the ridiculous “fan service” elements (“oh, you’re General Han Solo !”, “12 parsecs” and stuff like that: it’s “Star Wars”, not “Last Action Hero”…), and most of “Jar Jar” Finn characterisation (this character is so stupid… why isn’t he killed ?). The same goes with the line establishing that stormtroopers are conditioned kids who hence don’t join the Empire by choice.

The scene with the space monsters aboard Han’s ship is so lame that it should be trimmed to basically nothing. Talking about Han, his terrible line “Chewie, we are home” is also something to definitely cut. Most of the really painful interaction between Leia and Han (has Lucas written those lines ?) must be trimmed.

There might be lots of other things but I must confess that I don’t quite remember a single scene free of lame elements in this (very) average movie. The Maz cantina thing, yep, also something to consider erasing (her “HAN SOLOOOOOOO” line… gosh, so lame…). Saddly it seems impossible to cut the terrible “Rey’s Jedi Mind Trick found in your magic pocket because the script needs you to use it now” scene. Close ups on General Hux during his speech (when he is almost crying like a little nazi doll) are to be removed as well. Most of Kylo Donald Duck Ren characterisation should also be removed in order to let the main villain look like a real threat and not a whining piece of shit kid who’s mad a his parents for grounding him.

ALL the opening crawl (the worst ever written in the saga so far) has to be rewritten to focus on the real heart and background of the movie: the Empire is back and going to strike harder than ever. Luke’s to be found should be only in the last paragraph, 'cause it starts the movie plot.

And at the near end, it would be better to wake up R2 before the script tells him to wake up (when Ren leaves the planet for instance ?), and to trim the shitty “let’s complete the puzzle map together” sequence so it wouldn’t look so dumb (well, it would still be a very dumb sequence anyway). The pathetic “National Geographic” final shot is to be put in a trash.

The deleted scene explaining the political background really needs to be reinstalled.
I guess it would end up being a 100/110 minutes movie, which is fine. It could be a good movie with those changes.

edit: the Han Solo/Kylo Ren scene should stay untouched. Even if the scene itself is lazy, there is a very beautiful direction idea with the lights getting down. The dialogue between Han and his son is also very good. Rey almost ruins everything with her “acting skills” in the aftermath, but Chewie going berserk is fine, so I guess it might be one of the very few good scenes that don’t need to be re-edited.

You really believe that the ENTIRE ORIGINAL TRILOGY was supposed, back in 1974-1977, to be a single movie ?!?

I don’t know where you’ve read that (but it’s possible you’ve heard some bullshit like that, because GL never tells the truth), but there is absolutely no proof to suppot such a theory.

Take a look at these interviews :

http://uk.ign.com/articles/2002/11/11/an-interview-with-gary-kurtz

https://web.archive.org/web/20091128200044/http://www.filmthreat.com/index.php?section=interviews&Id=8