Lord Haseo

Tyrphanax said:

Lord Haseo said:

DominicCobb said:

Lord Haseo said:

Even if you didn’t care for TFA and Rogue One you can’t deny Episode VIII has a lot of potential…ESB like potential.

• Rey and Kylo Ren’s training (first time seeing a Dark Sider being trained in a SW film)

• Finn trying to fit into The Resistance

• Finn possibly finding out Poe shot his friend

• Phasma going after Finn

• Knights of Ren

• Leia and/or Chewie confronting Kylo Ren

• Possible learning at least something about Rey’s past or Snoke’s identity

• The possible power vacuum left after the destruction of the Hosnian System

• Learning about the ancient Jedi

I would be surprised if the film was anything less than great.

You forgot the obvious - Luke mofucking Skywalker, Jedi master.

I can’t believe I forgot about that…

If Luke can beat Vader’s ass imagine what he can do with 30 years of training.

I like to think that Luke has transcended to an OT-Yoda-like state where he won’t be whipping out his saber to backflip all around.

I would like him to use his saber but I would prefer him to use Makashi like Dooku. I also wouldn’t mind him using Forced Based Physical Augmentation; I think he should just use it sparingly and with less potency than he had in his prime.

darthrush said:

Like the badass scene we got of Vader in Rogue One, I really want something like that for Luke. Not him slaughtering soldiers, just him being a absolute badass. I can compeletly imagine him single-handedly taking on the Knights of Ren with rain pouring down on his green blade.

And then I want him to whip Kylo’s ass. I want him to toy with Kylo as Vader once did to him and when he thinks it’s safe or he has the upper hand Luke just gives to his ass. I want there to be a shot of Luke with his hood over his head walking towards a terrified Kylo and the only visible part of Luke’s face is his beard. The rest of the movie could suck but I could take solace in the fact that Luke became that badass.

imperialscum said:

Lord Haseo said:

I would be surprised if the film was anything less than great.

You will most likely be surprised.

Maybe…I thought TFA was going to be decent at best and now it’s in my top 3. The only thing that would surprise me is if were somehow better than ESB. That’s a surprise I’d welcome.

DominicCobb said:

Lord Haseo said:

Even if you didn’t care for TFA and Rogue One you can’t deny Episode VIII has a lot of potential…ESB like potential.

• Rey and Kylo Ren’s training (first time seeing a Dark Sider being trained in a SW film)

• Finn trying to fit into The Resistance

• Finn possibly finding out Poe shot his friend

• Phasma going after Finn

• Knights of Ren

• Leia and/or Chewie confronting Kylo Ren

• Possible learning at least something about Rey’s past or Snoke’s identity

• The possible power vacuum left after the destruction of the Hosnian System

• Learning about the ancient Jedi

I would be surprised if the film was anything less than great.

You forgot the obvious - Luke mofucking Skywalker, Jedi master.

I can’t believe I forgot about that…

If Luke can beat Vader’s ass imagine what he can do with 30 years of training.

Even if you didn’t care for TFA and Rogue One you can’t deny Episode VIII has a lot of potential…ESB like potential.

• Rey and Kylo Ren’s training (first time seeing a Dark Sider being trained in a SW film)

• Finn trying to fit into The Resistance

• Finn possibly finding out Poe shot his friend

• Phasma going after Finn

• Knights of Ren

• Leia and/or Chewie confronting Kylo Ren

• Possible learning at least something about Rey’s past or Snoke’s identity

• The possible power vacuum left after the destruction of the Hosnian System

• Learning about the ancient Jedi

I would be surprised if the film was anything less than great.

Gorillaz - Last Living Souls

Candlemass - Dark Are The Veils of Death

Marty Robbins - Cool Water

Anchorhead said:

Ren isn’t interesting

This is a complaint I haven’t heard very often. May I ask why you feel this way? I find him wanting to fulfill the “wishes” of his Grandfather while being pulled by the Light and possibly lunacy to be extremely compelling. And aside from that like that Kylo is a bit of a smartass and his temper was both frightening and humorous.
There are a few more things I could mention but I think he has a lot going on as a character. Certainly more than Vader in STAR WARS, Maul in TPM and Palpatine in general.

darth_ender said:

MalàStrana said:

It’s a fan film: the story is pointless and filled with various elements that make no sense (a walker within the city ? Is it the best weapon for this kind of environnement ?) just because they want to put a “SW skin” on it. But on the other hand it’s technically well made; it costed quite a lot so this is the minimum we can expect. It’s a well made fan film if you want. The actors… let’s say they try their best, which is not enough since the screenwriter didn’t do his job to develop correctly the characters.

A walker doesn’t make sense in any context. If you are going to criticize what is actually logical and congruent with other movies taking place in the same era, you might as well be fair. Walkers are slow and unstable, and when you have hover technology and speedy engines, why would you rely on quadrupedal machines? Heck, the ancient wheel is a more logical means of mobility for large machines. What advantage do walkers have? They are visually interesting for movie-goers. We are watching a fictional movie, and a little fan-service that also happens to make perfect military sense (the artillery was called in from an external area when the destruction of the facility on Scarif outweighed preserving the schematics for all those secret projects). If you’re going to be a party-pooper, might as well take it to its logical conclusions and point out how dumb walkers are in the first place.

Couldn’t have said this better. It’s crazy how fanaticism can lead one to love something but hate it when the context is different. This is another reason why being anything more than a casual fan is a bad idea.

Tyrphanax said:

Lord Haseo said:

Why? Just why?

I know she’s in stable condition but there’s no logical reason such a thing should happen to someone like her.

I mean there’s the heavy heavy drug abuse in her past.

I know but it sucks that could have bounced back and hit her this late in her life. That’s like talking to some dude’s sister and 30 years later he randomly beats the shit out of you for it. It’s just not fair.

It’s hard to tell genuine opinions from trolling these days. Someone like Mala is a fucking enigma to me.

Why? Just why?

I know she’s in stable condition but there’s no logical reason such a thing should happen to someone like her.

I would probably start with Knights of The Old Republic. Gameplay is dated but the story and characters are ESB level. This will tie into the Darth Bane trilogy which ties into the Darth Plagueis novel and that ties into the Labyrinth of Evil and the PT novelizations.

You could play KOTOR II, read the Revan novel or even play SWTOR but it’s not needed for the story at large.

No one is arguing because I refuse to let you suck me in. We just got done getting into it yesterday so why not do something different and actually discuss Star Wars?

We’re trying to have a discussion about Star Wars here. If you want to argue take it to Off Topic.

But he did act brutish towards…I give up.

Handman said:

Lord Haseo said:

Handman said:

Hi again, first chance to chime in about Vader again despite the topic having kind of shifted from that. So if that’s an issue I apologize.

In regards to the Bespin duel in ESB, comparing that to Vader going apeshit isn’t really the same. There’s so much context to that duel, so much feeling, so much shifting motivations, how Vader just toys with Luke for awhile and then goes all out by the end that it’s not even a fair comparison.

That’s not the point of the comparison. The point of the comparison is to prove Vader can be brutish sometimes. You’re looking too deep into it.

My point was that it’s not the same. Glad I’m able to look too deep into things.

It’s always good to look deep but in the context of the conversation it’s no more complex than the fact that Vader gets down when he deems it necessary.

In the new one, he just goes apeshit to a level only seen in something like The Force Unleashed

Starkiller was turning people into ash and crushing AT-ST’s with the Force so no.

It still looked like a video game, and might as well have been as ridiculous.

To say that is to say that any Force Based action scene is like a video game. A claim that is kind of true but he hasn’t showcased anything in that scene that we haven’t seen. We’ve seen Luke use blast deflection so it’s obvious that a master of the lightsaber like Darth Vader would know how to use blast deflection as well. We’ve seen people be cut down by lightsabers in every film and have seen Vader do it to more than a few people. We have seen him Force choke, Force pull blasters away from people and while we didn’t see Vader Force push people in the OT (which is another thing that is missing in the OT) doesn’t mean we haven’t seen other Force Sensitives ragdoll people before. So exactly what is so off or video gamey about this? This seems pretty par for the course and generic on paper but the way the scene was shot is what gives the scene it’s umph. Also let’s not forget that the Rebels were dead as soon as Vader Force pulled their blasters away which is something he did relatively early into his slaughter.

and it’s the only time he pulls out a lightsaber for anyone not wielding the same, calling to question numerous times he could have done so in the original films.

Well, I’ve been calling this into question for years so this seems more like a personal problem.

It’s entirely a personal problem, it’s my opinion isn’t it? 😛

It is but I was speaking more about you not noticing or caring that Vader didn’t kill any Rebels with his lightsaber and Force Abilities in the OT.

In this way, the use of Tarkin was much more faithful to the character, he never does anything we wouldn’t expect him to. But Vader has changed from all the video games and the prequel films reframing his character since the OT that it somehow influenced how he is portrayed right before the events of the original film. It doesn’t mesh. Why would he be okay with sending in the troops onto the Tantive later on when he could just deal with them himself much more effectively? Why wouldn’t he use more effective means to torture the rebel commander on the ship, instead of accidentally kill him clumsily?

We should have gotten a scene like this in the OT. I don’t think Rogue One should be scolded for the OT’s mistakes. Also isn’t it a little more than implausible to assume Vader has never done something like this before?

I think DominicCobb said the same thing, but I wouldn’t call it an OT mistake and more Rogue One not doing enough to mesh with Vader’s portrayal there.

One film shouldn’t have to be contorted for leaps in logic or things being missing in the other one. Just like how the OT shouldn’t have been changed for the sake of the PT.

Anyway, most everything I had to say about it has already been said in the following posts. What did you think of those?

This is stuff I’ve all heard before the main point of contention is already being discussed in our chain of comments. That being how the temperaments of these two Vader’s are supposedly different.

In the end the movie would have worked just as well without Vader, and for me personally, it would have benefited from it.

It would have worked fine without Vader; it just works better with him as writing him out of the film at such a time would have been weird. Vader wouldn’t have that much to do given the Great Jedi Purge was complete in their eyes and having him MIA during such a pivotal time could seemed contrived. I suppose you could have built up that Vader was coming and right as he arrives the Rebels get the plans and escape about that would have been a massive tease. After TFA’s ending that would have been brutal.

Handman said:

Hi again, first chance to chime in about Vader again despite the topic having kind of shifted from that. So if that’s an issue I apologize.

In regards to the Bespin duel in ESB, comparing that to Vader going apeshit isn’t really the same. There’s so much context to that duel, so much feeling, so much shifting motivations, how Vader just toys with Luke for awhile and then goes all out by the end that it’s not even a fair comparison.

That’s not the point of the comparison. The point of the comparison is to prove Vader can be brutish sometimes. You’re looking too deep into it.

In the new one, he just goes apeshit to a level only seen in something like The Force Unleashed

Starkiller was turning people into ash and crushing AT-ST’s with the Force so no.

and it’s the only time he pulls out a lightsaber for anyone not wielding the same, calling to question numerous times he could have done so in the original films.

Well, I’ve been calling this into question for years so this seems more like a personal problem.

The end of ESB shows Vader does have limitations, Luke was still incredibly inexperienced, why couldn’t Vader just lift him up at any point like he does the Rebels? Why does Vader suddenly seem so much more limitless in what he’s capable of doing with the Force in Rogue One and come across as sort of a putz in the original by comparison? His line in ESB, “Bring my shuttle”, shows just how much rage he was just trying to keep in after having his plans foiled. That’s not the same kind of guy who would just go apeshit to no-name rebels.

For one, Vader was facing against regular beings and not Force Sensitives. Secondly, he seemed just as imposing in ESB especially considering that Luke was a somewhat trained Force sensitive

In this way, the use of Tarkin was much more faithful to the character, he never does anything we wouldn’t expect him to. But Vader has changed from all the video games and the prequel films reframing his character since the OT that it somehow influenced how he is portrayed right before the events of the original film. It doesn’t mesh. Why would he be okay with sending in the troops onto the Tantive later on when he could just deal with them himself much more effectively? Why wouldn’t he use more effective means to torture the rebel commander on the ship, instead of accidentally kill him clumsily?

We should have gotten a scene like this in the OT. I don’t think Rogue One should be scolded for the OT’s mistakes. Also isn’t it a little more than implausible to assume Vader has never done something like this before?

I love you. This is in no way hyperbole.

ZkinandBonez said:

Well, the opening flash-back has a bald Whitaker, meaning that it most likely was from before the re-shoots (trailers had a bald Whitaker on Jedha as well). And from what Edwards has described it seems that it was Jedha, and mostly Scarif that was re-shot.

There is of course the whole thing about Edwards initially assuming that Disney wouldn’t let them kill off all the main characters, but I don’t know if that only affected the script or if they actually changed the shooting of the Scarif scenes that drastically.

Jeebus said:

ZkinandBonez said:

Why does so many people not like Bodhi? I though he was one of the more identifiable of the characters. He has much more character development than say, Chirrut (which has basically none), and even Baze.

Out of all the characters, I definitely think Bodhi was the most developed. He had the clearest character arc; an Imperial defector who finds new life in the Rebellion and eventually gives his life for the cause. Baze also had an arc, but it was more of a sudden turning point than an arc that was subtly built up over the course of the movie. I got the impression that they were supposed to be secondary characters, and that Jyn and Cassian were the real protagonists, but at the end of the day I liked Bodhi, Chirrut and Baze a lot more than either Jyn or Cassian.

Like I said I don’t remember any of that shit. Perhaps my 3rd viewing will give me clarity.

All of this is subjective dude; you outta know that. Personally I don’t see how anyone could make the case that ROTJ is better than SW or ESB but hey, that’s their opinion. No one is really right in this situation even if you bring forth a stronger argument.

I don’t remember anything about him though…he may have been a coward but I may just be thinking of Finn.

I mean…

Handman said:

Lord Haseo said:

People have been wanting to see Vader kill Rebels with his own hands for decades. If anything Gareth knew exactly what most people wanted.

This is exactly why it felt like a fan film to me. It’s not something Vader would have done in the original films, it’s what the fans wanted him to do. It’s the same reasoning we had CGI Yoda bounce around in Attack of the Clones.

As Ronster said before no one wanted that but George and secondly given the limited time he had yes he would. It can definitely be for fan pleasing purposes, consistency with his character and to add tension and a sense of urgency to the climax of the film. Also let’s not forget that Vader got brutish with Luke in ESB.

There is no misunderstanding of Vader worship. People have been wanting to see Vader kill Rebels with his own hands for decades. If anything Gareth knew exactly what most people wanted.

There’s no doubt Lord Vader wad reveling in their suffering but he was killing the Rebels so fast after the first volley of Blaster fire that I can’t imagine him being more proficient. I felt a real sense of urgency on his part even to the last frame before the ship takes off.

I reiterate:

Lord Haseo said:
Now, I think it’d be better if we got back to talking about Star Wars.

TV’s Frink said:

Well this has been fun. Especially the part where I don’t like people expressing their sexuality, whatever that means.

That’s old news. I was just bringing it up for the sake of the argument.