Laserschwert

The Golden Idol said:

Laserschwert said:

Here's the current state of my so far edited sequences (no CGI-changes or color-correction yet, just plain editing):

Jungle Chase
Waterfall

Video is in DivX (crappy), audio in AC3 (5.1 surround, not so crappy)

I have no sound when I watch these videos.

 

That's why I've linked to AC3filter... you need it installed.

Regarding the changes:

I wasn't sure about how to handle the pants-rip-gag...I've shown my edit to a friend and he thought that Mutt's "Oh shit..." wasn't necessary, since he threw the knife onto Indy's shoulder on purpose. And that's where I'm unsure, as I thought that maybe he didn't do it on purpose, and he almost threw it too far and out of the truck, so that's why his heart skipped a beat ("Oh shit..."). I even thought of making the "shock" a little longer, and affecting both Mutt and Indy by intercutting his reaction shot (or reaction-"shit"), and then going back to Indy dropping the knife behind him. This makes the pause a little longer, making it look like both freeze for a second, out of shock. So, what do you guys think: Did Mutt hit Indy's shoulder on purpose, or not?

I must say, Mutt going for the blade of the sword first never bothered me... it made me think that he wanted to test if the blade is sharp, and that the thing is not just decoration (since it came in such a nice box ;) ). I'll have a look into the shot to see if it could be changed. By they way, complimenting myself I must say that I like the way we now cut from Spalko drawing her sword directly to Mutt finding the other sword. Nice analogy there.

The monkeys... ah, those damn monkeys. I think we definitely need the shot of Mutt jumping from Spalko's jeep onto Indy's, otherwise the logical gap is too big. We've already lost him grabbing the skull-bag, so I think at least this part needs to be there. I'll try to either paint out the remaining monkey(s), or crop the image to lose them.

Other digital changes (like adding missing muzzle-flashes) will be done later.

Here's the current state of my so far edited sequences (no CGI-changes or color-correction yet, just plain editing):

Jungle Chase
Waterfall

Video is in DivX (crappy), audio in AC3 (5.1 surround, not so crappy)

Try THIS link for some "HowTo"s.

I guess you'll be especially interested in THIS one.

I favor of a better flow I'd definitely vote against the removal of the gunpowder-bit... removing it just brings up other questions.

jones1899 said:

Despite the fact that a bit of graphite was added to gunpowder after WW1 still doesn't account for the "swarm of bees" it creates through the warehouse.

Well, according to Wikipedia, it's not entirely far fetched:

"It is also highly diamagnetic, thus it will float in mid-air above a strong magnet." (This refers to graphite, not gunpowder)

Of course, the "swarm"-effect is just a stylized and exaggerated version of this effect, and I agree that the whole magnetism-idea was actually too complex to be realized in the movie without compromises (sometimes the box is more magnetic than some other times), but it would've been impossible to include all effects the magnetism would have.

Having the junk roll on the floor, the gun-straps and dog-tags attracted to the crate and those other things that WERE in the movie and showed the magnetism were enough to sell the idea. It's Hollywood-logic, but it's enough.... just like the "leap of faith" in LC, which worked in its own realm.

jones1899 said:

Sounds great Laser. Looking forward to it. 

As for the line switch, I'm going to ask the audio guy here if he could clean up the two bits of dialog from the trailer ("not as easy..." and "part time"). I'll post it if I have any luck with this. 

 

"Part time!" seems to be a lot cleaner in the "Making of" documentary (and I think it's the same take used in the trailer).

By the way, the user SandiegoJones on the TheRaider.net-forums corrected me on my assumption that gunpowder isn't magenetic, and thus Indy's way of finding the Alien in the warehouse wouldn't work. But: After World War I graphite was added to gunpowder (to avoid random ignition by electrostatic charge), which is highly magnetic. So, I thought that bit of the movie was plainly wrong (and so I wanted to cut it), but in fact I was.

Sadly in the movie it's not just one plant hitting his private parts but like twenty... they really went overboard with that gag. But yeah, it's gone. There's just one plant nearly hitting him, and that's it.

Adding camera shake would only compromise image quality (at least on the 1080p-version of the edit) and framing, and no, I'm not gonna add that.

So, the jungle chase is about 95% complete as well. Except for the one real monkey all other monkey and all the vine swinging is gone (except for Mutt swinging back into Spalko's jeep). Furthermore I've swapped some Mutt/Indy-shots around, so that they don't get intercut as much and each of them receives more continuous screen-time. While doing this I've noticed that two of Mutt's shots (his 180° after picking up the sword, and him observing Spalko's jeep going by) are a split that perfectly merges into one longer shot (and I mean perfect down to the frame).

The next step will be the fight scene with the ants (not sure if anything needs to be trimmed or re-arranged there), inlcuding the digital changes I'm making, plus the shot of the jeep going down the cliff for the waterfall-sequence.

As soon as all those three sequences are done, I'm gonna combine them and try my color correction on them.

I've tried a couple of things from the list, and some probably won't be possible. Taking "Not as easy as it used to be" and "Part time" from the trailers probably won't work, because the sound-quality differs considerably from the movie-versions (I assume it was on-set audio), plus there's parts of the "Raiders March" playing under the first one. On the other hand, I'm not at all familiar with sound-engineering, so I don't know how clean those can be made with some filtering.

I've almost finished editing the waterfall-scene (minus the CG-additions) with audio being in 5.1 ... but as I've never edited in surround before, I'm not sure how well that worked.

I'm gonna make an edit, but as my work-times are pretty unpredictable, I'm not gonna set a deadline for it.

skyjedi2005 said:

The real question should be whether or not the 1080i bonus features are upscaled or true high definition.

Often these companies upscale the dvd resolution, you know if it is really 480i.

Probably not upscaled, as people are already gushing about how awesome the (HD-)clips from the old Indy movies look in the BluRay-versions of the documentaries.

They are in 1080i ... good enough to use.

Damn, I've found the perfect way to get rid of the prarie dog in the opening-shot, but I need someone who a) has the BluRay-DVD and b) is able to rip a portion of it (so that we have the full thing in 1080-res):

The visual-effects featurette contains the clean plate used for the opening shot, until the point of the car driving through the mound of dirt and the camera being covered with dust, so that the blend could be made right there.

And to make it even clearer:

BAM!!!

:p

The Golden Idol said:

Sometimes her lines are OK, but sometimes it sounds like she's speaking gibberish (yes, I'm fluent in Russian). The other soldiers speak perfect Russian, but Spalko sometimes really fails at her pronunciation, which makes it sound jarring for Russian speakers like me. This probably isn't a priority for you guys, since you don't understand Russian, so w/e.

To me that's the case with most of the "Germans" in Raiders and Crusade :-)

topdawg193 said:

- When Spalko walks up to Indy, after she asks 'where were they found' and is told 'they were found in Mexico, digging in the dirt', and after she walks up to Indy, it should cut to her holding out her hand and introducing herself to him. This would eliminate Indy's 'you're not from around here, are you?' line, which seems totally superflous after Indy's first line in the film was '...Russians', so he's obviously established prior to this that they're 'not from around here', and so has the audience. Also, the delivery of his 'from the way you're sticking your teeth into your...etc.' line seems strange, and very out of character.

He notices that she's not "from around here", and not Russian either. To be exact, managing to distinguish her from being from the Eastern-Ukraine and not from Russia just by her accent (or the way she's "sinking her teeth into those wubbleyous") shows how educated Indy really is, and that he really has seen the world in all his years of adventure. I would definitely keep that line.

cyclades said:

Well to be fair, it's not like they were ever that clear. :lol:

Well, I think the guy with the charge itself makes it VERY clear that it wasn't telepathic powers ;)

jones1899 said:

So how goes the edit, Laser?

Not at all right now... I've got a deadline on Monday, so I'm working my ass off since last week, including several 24 hour shifts. I hope I can get on it next week.

GoldStone9 said:

What type of audio are we looking at for these edits?

English 5.1 Surround and German 5.1 Surround, as far as I am concerned.

cyclades said:

Here's an edit I'd like to see someone put in.

Indy should be dragged out of the car at the beginning FIRST.

It weakens him having him come out second.

I've done a quick edit here to show what I mean

http://fileload.us/767258323-Sequence_1.avi

I don't have the time or mad skills to do an entire movie overhaul myself so if anyone likes this change, do please include it in your masterpiece :D

Mh, not sure yet, as right now I don't feel much difference of him being out first or second... him being second at least means, that he had been thrown in first :-P

jones1899 said:

Was listening to the soundtracks for the OT - definitely needthe map room and grail theme and lsave children theme from TOD in here. At least touches of them. Lord knows there's no classic theme in KOTCS. Thoughts?

Do I get you wrong here? Both the ark/map room theme and the grail theme are in KotCS... furthermore the beginning of "Ah, rats!" is quoted somewhere in the warehouse.

I dare to say, I think I can remove the tree from both shots.

By the way, I've found a way to make my edit of the waterfall-sequence work: As I was missing an establishment shot for the jeep going off the cliff, I had to use the wide-shot of the second drop. This caused a problem, since I was missing that inbetween-shot after the second drop. Looking through the trailers, I've found that the first trailer (not the teaser) opens with an unused wide-shot of the cliff, and that's the one I'm going to use for showing the jeep go over the cliff (adding a digital jeep, a digital version of Spalko's truck and - if possible - digital soldiers and Spalko climbing down the cliff-face).

Nothing to show yet though, as this is only in idea-form right now. My job is keeping me busy for the rest of the week, so there's no tinkering with the fight seen either for the next few days.

jones1899 said:

So, Laser, where are you heading to next in your amazing edits?

Well, I think the main scenes to be edited - the chase and waterfall sequences - have now been covered for the most part.

Right now I'm doing some extensive digital manipulation on the ants/fight-sequence, not only adding digital blood, spit and sweat, but also changing some obviously pulled punches (or mis-timed reactions to punches) to clear hits. It looks a LOT more violent that way... I'll post some clips later. I'm still unsure about the sound effects... some of them are the classic Indy-hit-sounds, which could also be heard in the old movies, but they sound "movie-like", taking a bit of the gritty violence away again.

About the warehouse... I've tried messing with the "Damn, I thought that was closer..."-part, basically leaving in the "Damn..." and then having Indy look at the soldier immediately.What can I say... there's so much movement and change in lighting between those moments, that a seamless blend/morph inbetween is virtually impossible. I'll keep trying though.

And right now I don't see a way to fix the continuity error with Mac's arms either, other than reframing that shot and getting rid of him completely (and losing resolution on the 1080p version).

By the way, from now on I'm doing all my digital changes on the 1080p version, so those will have the best quality possible for everybody's edits. I only have to re-do the match-moving of the two photo-replacement shots (I've only done the first one anyway).

topdawg193 said:

I was just wondering, would it be possible to give a little more time to Spalko's closeup? It seemed to last longer in the last edit you did, and feel more fluid.

Also, when they go over the second fall, how would it be to cut the shot of the jeep-actually-emerging from the water completely, and instead cut straight to the shot where the jeep is floating on top of the water and the gang are climbing back into it? The cut from the-jeep-actually-emerging to the-gang-climbing-back-into-the-jeep felt like a big jump.

Yeah, for the first version I've slowed Spalko's closeup down towards the end, as I thought I need more time to sell the fact that the jeep drops all the way down the cliff. No that I've inserted the shot showing it go over the cliff (from below), I think I got enough time with that. I'm still unsure about the cliff-jump though... either I add a digital jeep going over the cliff (and splashing into the water) in the wide-shot, and use the "jeep-actually-emerging"-shot afterwards , or I keep it is now, with only having the splash as a sound effect during Spalko's close up, and showing the emerging of the jeep in the wide-shot (which is there... I wouldn't need to create a digital jeep, and I prefer that solution).

This leads to your second question, how about losing the "emerging-jeep"-shot after the second drop. The problem is, cutting from the drop directly to the gang climbing back in feels like an even bigger jump. In the original they've inserted the cliff-wide-shot inbetween to suggest the passing of a couple of seconds, but as I've used that wide-shot to get rid of the tree, the "emerging jeep"-shot is the only thing left to insert here that somewhat fits (but really only "somewhat", you're right, as it still feels like a jump between those two shots).

About keeping his "reverse!"-lines, I think they don't fit before the third fall... as soon as he says "three" and takes his hat down, you can see he's resigned... ready for the unavoidable... and I'm also unsure if they fit after his "One... two...!" lines...

negative1 said:

the 2nd is only slightly better, but the title is not very good..

That one wasn't meant to be serious... I was even thinking about calling it "Indiana Jones and the Big Boom" or "the Big Bang of Doom" or something. ;)

I've found an alternative:

The gang skips the first waterfall by driving off the cliff instead... Indy remembers Ox talking about the three drops back at the camp (we don't have him saying it right before the waterfalls anymore... not sure if it's a problem or not) and he notices this by "One..." and pointing back at the waterfall (and cliff) behind them.

This is what it looks like:

http://fileload.us/1026497336-waterfall_cut2_divx.avi

Yet, this edit is still lacking two things: First I'd like to add the car driving off the cliff in the wide shot of the cliff (after Spalko's closeup) and second, I still need an establishment shot after the second drop. The first thing should be doable, but I have no idea what to do about the second problem.

EDIT: Here's a slightly reworked version. I've tried to fix the mentioned problems through different editing: http://fileload.us/288449025-waterfall_cut2b_divx.avi

Oh, and just for the fun of it:

I don't see a way to keep all three waterfalls WITHOUT keeping the branch as well. After all we only have scenes of them before the first waterfall with the gang being completely dry, something impossible if they'd just driven off the cliff into the water.

My edit has another problem... the first wide shot showing the car going towards the waterfall shows it surrounded by water... no cliff in sight, where they might have come from.