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Jumpman

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Join date
20-Sep-2006
Last activity
11-May-2007
Posts
150

Post History

Post
#247148
Topic
Lucasfilm to sell Physical Effects Unit
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247148/action/topic#247148
Time
Well, Lucas' budget on wasn't that much higher than Jackson. The Rings films started out budgeted at 94 million a piece but then had to ask for me to finish them so its reasonable to assume that each film cost a bit more than 100 million.

Episode I costed 115 million. Episodes II and III were made for 100 million a piece instead of the 115 million that's been reported.

So, essentially both trilogies were made for reasonably the same amount.
Post
#247116
Topic
The Merits of the Prequel Trilogy and the "Saga"
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247116/action/topic#247116
Time
CO,

The problem with your way of thinking is that if Lucas would've gone that route, he would get accussed, as he does now for the Prequels, with have little to no substance in terms of character.

What it essentially comes to down to is that there are two versions of the Prequels that would've essentially worked, your idea which I think reflects the majority of the Star Wars fanbase who aren't too crazy about the Prequels and the version we have now.

And for you, you don't want to sacrifice the Original Trilogy, whereas Lucas wanted to turn the Original Trilogy, especially Vader, on it's head.

Hell, I even questioned why he didn't have Anakin as a teen in Episode I but I saw the thematic devices he used that were the starting point of him sliding to the Darkside and I agreed with every point because it was exactly the opposite I think people were thinking when they wondered what young Darth Vader was like.

Man, that was an amazing run-on sentence.
Post
#247107
Topic
The Merits of the Prequel Trilogy and the "Saga"
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247107/action/topic#247107
Time
CO,

Yeah, it's going to be ironic. And yes, Episode IV will stick out but at least it gets the storyline somewhat back on track when Episode V arrives.

It is going to be interesting with the new generation of kids. I will tell my kids (when me and the wife have them) about the history of Star Wars but I'm not going to lie to you...I'm going to show them in numerical order first just to see how they respond to it. I mean, that's when we'll really know if Lucas is right.

I'm a Lucas guy who also realizes that he talks out the side of his mouth ever now and again. But, instead of saying the Saga is about Anakin, I wish he would've just stated that the Saga is about "the Skywalker family." With that, I think people would be okay with it. And what's funny about that is that Rick McCallum sees it that way and Lucas really doesn't.

Post
#247094
Topic
The Merits of the Prequel Trilogy and the "Saga"
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247094/action/topic#247094
Time
CO,

"My point is that Lucas chose to make the story about Anakin, and that was a huge risk, cause some people just arent' interested in a character like that, some fans love to root for the good guy. I love Rocky more than Raging Bull, even though they are both classics, but Rocky is as Apple Pie as movies come."

Totally agree. I guess the reason I have no problem with the story of the Prequels was because I always preferred the character of Darth Vader and Obi-Wan more than Han, Luke, and Leia. And once we found out that Vader was Luke's father, I was more focused on Vader, even as a kid, than Luke.
Post
#247091
Topic
The Merits of the Prequel Trilogy and the "Saga"
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247091/action/topic#247091
Time
CO,

I would totally agree with you if the human story was lost. Yes, the details matter and having aliens occupying your universe more than humans does make it difficult. But, he still focuses on the humans at the end of it all and for me, that's all that matter.

I'm not saying you're wrong. It's just that it doesn't bother me as it seems to bother you.
Post
#247086
Topic
The Merits of the Prequel Trilogy and the "Saga"
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247086/action/topic#247086
Time
I don't either me or Go-Mer stated that the twins are working to "resurrect" their father, although that does become Luke's focus in Episode VI.

Yes, the Original Trilogy is Luke's story but looking at them numerically, it does in the end come back to Anakin. It is the Skywalker story with Anakin and Luke as the figure heads, with Anakin having a bit more emphasis once we get to the end of it all. I don't think Go-Mer stated that the Original Trilogy isn't about Luke Skywalker.

Post
#247061
Topic
The Merits of the Prequel Trilogy and the "Saga"
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247061/action/topic#247061
Time
Scruffy,

It was a figure of speech. Give me a break....

And why is it Gary Kurtz gets all the credit for Star Wars instead of the creator? I mean, this is the guy who ballooned the Episode V budget and thought that he was the real force behind Star Wars.

I mean, what has he done since then if he's so great and was the real force behind Star Wars?
Post
#247057
Topic
The Merits of the Prequel Trilogy and the "Saga"
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247057/action/topic#247057
Time
CO,

Interesting points. I chalk this up to Lucas trying to make the Star Wars universe more vast than what we've previously seen because, we are in the golden age of the Republic where the interactions of all the civilizations is normal.

But, I do see where you're coming from. The Kaminoans are cool as hell. The Trade Federation is a joke, but I think that's the point. Dex, I can go back and forth on. I mean, it's cool to see Obi-Wan have a hint of a life outside the Jedi Order, yet at the same time, I wanted Obi-Wan to get the info quicker to move the story quicker. (The way Episode II is edited still pisses me off. I'll never let Burtt off the hook for how that film is put together, eventhough it's my 3rd favorite Star Wars film.) I'm actually a Jar Jar guy but I can understand everyone's problems with him. I like Grevious only because he's a plot point for the Clone Wars aspect of the story. But yes, the humans are always the best.

Post
#247049
Topic
The Merits of the Prequel Trilogy and the "Saga"
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247049/action/topic#247049
Time
CO,

Excellent points. Episode I is the biggest culprit but it still works. I don't really think Episodes II and III cater to kids at all. I mean, in tone, those two films together are a bit more serious than Episodes V and VI. But, again, that has alot to do with the fact that good guys get their asses handed to them at the end of Episode III.
Post
#247043
Topic
The Merits of the Prequel Trilogy and the "Saga"
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247043/action/topic#247043
Time
CO,

I get your assertions about Episode I, but I would have to say because I think he knew he was going to some pretty dark places in Episode III. On top of that, the tone of Episode I, I believe, is that way for another reason and that's to mask how deceptive Episode I really is in the context of the Saga.

I mean, if you strip away everything in Episode I, it's really about Palpatine's machinations to get to the highest office in the Republic. That's serious stuff. And the celebration is a false one because they technically won but didn't really win in the grande scheme of things.
Post
#247028
Topic
The Merits of the Prequel Trilogy and the "Saga"
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247028/action/topic#247028
Time
Go-Mer,

CO's right. Episode IV was only meant to mimic the Saturday serial's he loved. He never really had anything but a backstory outline for the Prequels, just to give weight and context to the Original Trilogy.

He did mention that if he ever would go back and tell the backstory that they would be different in tone and style. But, he didn't have it all planned out. He had the highlights in outline form as CO said. But, there are hints in his outlines and drafts for the Original Star Wars of what the Prequels could shape up to be like if he made them. The biggest hint was the Prologue to the original Star Wars novel.

Still, I think you and I, are the only ones at the moment who believe that he made it work quite well, even if he didn't have it all planned out to the letter.

And what's this issue about the word youngling? It's just a word.
Post
#247021
Topic
Lucasfilm to sell Physical Effects Unit
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247021/action/topic#247021
Time
Mike,

In Kazadum where the steps break apart and they have to get across, the comp work isn't good at all, even if they are minatures. It's the same with the closeups of Merry and Pippin on Treebeard. When they go wide on Treebeard, he looks great just as the wide shots on Kazadum are great.

I like the Balrog too...even if you can't make out most of it. But, that's not a knock against it. I mean, they're in a dark environment so you can't change that. Still, I like the Balrog in The Fellowship.
Post
#247016
Topic
Lucasfilm to sell Physical Effects Unit
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247016/action/topic#247016
Time
Mike O,

Wargs. Merry and Pippin on Treebeard. Shots in Kazadum. Numerous riding shots that were reshoots. The entire dinosaur stampede in Kong. I could go on.

I will say this. The Fellowship of the Ring Extended, out of all the new trilogy films that have been out recently, is the best. It's a masterpiece.

I will not comment on Kong.

The Rings Trilogy is more inconsistent but again, I personally see that in all of Weta's work aside from the main visual effect (ie, Kong or Gollum).
Post
#247008
Topic
Lucasfilm to sell Physical Effects Unit
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/247008/action/topic#247008
Time
Gaffer,

Now, how many regular fans know the age of the characters or the time period between films? It's never really stated. It is logical to try and make Yoda younger during a different time period, whether it's ten years or thirty years. The idea is in the right place.

Either way, I just don't see how you can have a story about the fall of the Jedi Order and the Republic and not have Yoda do some action....

And Mike O, yes, ILM has. Between the two trilogies, there's just spectacular work across the board. But, if I had to choose, I'm choosing ILM over Weta. There are some shots in the Rings Trilogy that are just unforgiveable. It's the same with Kong. There's less of that in the Prequels or any other film ILM works on. Just look at Pearl Harbor, Minority Report, War of the Worlds.
Post
#246997
Topic
Lucasfilm to sell Physical Effects Unit
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/246997/action/topic#246997
Time
Then, there's no other side to Yoda in the Prequels if we've already seen what he can do in his semi-younger days. Lucas had to do somethign to give Yoda a bit more to do. I'm glad he went toe to toe with Sidious. And it cements the reasons why he is the way he is in the Original Trilogy.

And Mike O, I think Weta does deserves alot of credit on Gollum. But, that doesn't change the fact that at times, they didn't get him totally right with interaction in his environment.

That's one of the main reasons why Dennis Murren made it a point of emphasis during his work on Hulk to make sure that Hulk blends in and interacts with his environment and he pulled it off wonderfully with that film.
Post
#246975
Topic
The Merits of the Prequel Trilogy and the "Saga"
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/246975/action/topic#246975
Time
How was the production design all over the place? It's just different from the production design of the Original Trilogy which mainly consists of a ship corridor, another ship corridor, large, claustrophic rooms, another corridor, maybe go outside once in a while, and then finally another ship corridor.....

And this is coming from a guy who thinks that they're hasn't been a set of films to match the Original Trilogy yet...and that includes the Rings Trilogy.
Post
#246956
Topic
Lucasfilm to sell Physical Effects Unit
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/246956/action/topic#246956
Time
Well, was Yoda not suppose to fight while the Republic and the Jedi Order crumbled around him?

"The reason why all these methods are used instead of actually filming them is purely cost savings. Its a $250 million movie made for $115 million."

And this is the real rub right here. Personally, budgets have gotten way out of control. What Lucas wanted to achieve with the Prequels would've just cost way too much. He had to develop some other way to achieve the results without compromising his vision.

Post
#246939
Topic
Lucasfilm to sell Physical Effects Unit
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/246939/action/topic#246939
Time
About matching Oz's performance, is not an excuse. Watch "From Puppet's to Pixels" and listen to the audio commentary of Episode II and Rob Coleman specifically states that after talking with Oz, the animators came to the realization that they technically could go beyond what Oz did, performance wise, but that would be a mistake. He wouldn't be Yoda. They purposely tried to match every move, every nuance that Oz did with that puppet, while "loosening" him up just a tad around the lips.

ILM and Weta both had difficult tasks because those two character had to intergrate with the live actors they came into contact with. Look at every scene with the two characters, they're always with a live actor for the most part.

I just personally feel that ILM did it better than Weta mainly because of lighting. As good as they are, Weta can't light for shit. Just look at the Rings Trilogy and Kong. They get it half right and half wrong all the time. With ILM, they tend to get it right 85% of the time.
Post
#246935
Topic
Lucasfilm to sell Physical Effects Unit
Link
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/246935/action/topic#246935
Time
Again, from a performance standpoint, ILM was limited to what they could really do with Yoda. If Yoda hadn't been introduced via Oz's performance all those years ago, Yoda would've been different.

As it is, they had to match as close as possible to Oz's performance while enhance it every-so-slightly when it came to mouth region. And that's where you can tell he's CG, not anything else.