FrederikOlsen

Well, since that conclusion beckons some speculation, it is possible that there is a perfectly-preserved print in the vaults of LucasFilm that we aren't meant to know about. We can see from the Blu-ray that they store a lot of prototype props that never made it into the films, so actually physically destroying what George apparently thinks is the workprint doesn't make much sense.

"Empire of Dreams" included the pre-ANH crawl in great quality as well. If we assume the GOUT-crawl was done around the same time, those two clips could be from the same "secret" source.

Mavimao said:

Which then begs the question...where did this crawl come from? From a whole print or perhaps just a small reel of negative cut from the A/B roll in 81?

Maybe they once considered releasing a VHS or Laserdisc edition containing the original crawl (as a special feature, perhaps?) and conveniently had an old master sitting there.

Could be. But I get the feeling that 3D is still somewhat controversial. I keep reading that some of the most hyped 3D films aren't really worth it after all. And then there's the matter of people who can't watch anything in 3D without getting headache and nausea. The latter issue means we may finally get to see people actually throwing up while watching TPM.

Hmm, I may just go see that one so I get to vomit in sympathy whenever Jar-Jar shows up.

Yeah. The outcry probably isn't going to change anything right now, but I'm not sure how the 3D versions will be received if some of these almost universally loathed changes stay in it.

Bear in mind that the Blu-ray box probably hasn't been very expensive to produce. The master has been sitting there since 2004, the deleted scenes seem to be unrestored scans, a lot of the SD bonus material is merely footage shot for the '04 docs. This was probably done on the cheap, making it very easy for this set to gain revenue.

However 3D conversion, theatrial promotion and such are all very costly. Sure, I can still imagine a lot of moviegoers going to watch these, but I can also imagine a lot of people choosing to pass it up because we'll inevitably see a lot of the current bad press reappear when these versions are released. It's actually a lot easier for the public to protest here. I'm sure the financial outcome of the 97SE theatrical release would have been different if more people had known back then that the originals were going to disappear completely.

I, for one, got the Blu-ray box, but I have no intention to go watch the saga in 3D.

The OT just wouldn't have been the same if Luke and Leia had been a pair of inbred hillbillies.

Pretty much all reviews of the Blu-ray box I've read are stating that the original versions are not included, and that some of these more recent changes are indeed for the worse.

There may be TF.Net users that are in love with the "NOOOOO", but most professional reviewers seem to hate it. Despite high sales numbers, the bad press could be harmful in the long run. Especially when it comes to the 3D re-releases...

That's very odd - the savestarwars.com editorial on GOUT states in the afterword that the PAL version is a conversion of the NTSC version, but the thread you linked to indicates that's not the case.

Once again, thanks for your input. I guess I'll be getting the 2006 DVDs sometime soon, imperfect as they might be.

Yeah, I realise the colour timings have seemingly always been off on the home video releases. Those Technicolor caps look fantastic, so I'll be sure to look at getting DarkJedi's V3 project - thanks for bringing that to my attention.

Thing is... I'm looking to own the best possible legal version of the OOT, flawed as they all are. Now, I have actually been a bastard and torrented Harmy's Despecialized versions even though I've never paid Lucasfilm for the OOT (I do have the Blu-rays), but I'd still like to legally own as good home video versions of the OOT as possible. And I can't really tell whether I should get the Laserdiscs (and a decent player, obviously) or the GOUT. Especially since I'm in a PAL territory here, and I've read that the PAL version of GOUT is nothing but a converted NTSC transfer.

So my question still stands. I do get that if I want a 100% accurate representation of the original theatrical versions, there are multiple great restorations here. But if I want the best possible legal home video presentation of the OOT, what should I get?

Hmm. I thought I'd subscribed to this thread - apparently I haven't, hence my late reply.

I do realise GOUT is the easiest solution. If you think it's also the best legit representation of the OOT available in terms of A/V quality, I may just go with those discs. They'll probably keep me satisfied until the day I choose to cave in to nostalgia and actually get an LD player anyway.

Thanks for your reply, man!

Wow, this article was a disturbing read. Can ANYTHING be done at this point?

I feel tempted to write Martin Scorsese via that "Ask the Director"-feature on the site of the Film Foundation, but at the same time, it seems this is primarily a job for American citizens as they actually have a say in the matter of preserving the country's cultural heritage.

Wait, I think I know how to fix this. I was looking over the blue prints of Skywalker Ranch a few days ago and noticed that they have a small thermal exhaust port right below the main port.

 

It's only two meters wide though...

That's no thermal exhaust port. That's the drain for Lucas' toilet. He had it installed in 1997, when he suddenly got obsessed by the idea of unleashing his shit onto the unsuspecting world.

First of all, I’m aware this isn’t exactly a new discussion here, so I’m sorry if this thread comes across as unneccessary. I’ve tried Googling for this question and searching on these forums, but I haven’t really found anything concrete.

Having bought the Blu-ray box, I’d like to have a good, legit presentation of the OOT. I’ve read a lot about GOUT and its weaknesses, and seen a lot of LD capture screencaps, but I’m still not really sure what to get. In the light of GOUTs sub-par standards, I’m tempted to get a decent Laserdisc player (definitely a Pioneer - I’ve read that much) and a set of OOT LDs. But is blowing a Laserdisc up to 42" even worth it?

Ultimately, my question is simple. Do you guys think I should buy GOUT and deal with the ugliness of that transfer, or will the more difficult and more expensive approach - getting the LD gear and the discs themselves - be more worthwhile? And on the subject, which discs (out of those that are relatively easy to obtain) do you recommend?

First of all, I'm aware this isn't exactly a new discussion here, so I'm sorry if this thread comes across as unneccessary. I've tried Googling for this question and searching on these forums, but I haven't really found anything concrete.

Having bought the Blu-ray box, I'd like to have a good, legit presentation of the OOT. I've read a lot about GOUT and its weaknesses, and seen a lot of LD capture screencaps, but I'm still not really sure what to get. In the light of GOUTs sub-par standards, I'm tempted to get a decent Laserdisc player (definitely a Pioneer - I've read that much) and a set of OOT LDs. But is blowing a Laserdisc up to 42" even worth it?

Ultimately, my question is simple. Do you guys think I should buy GOUT and deal with the ugliness of that transfer, or will the more difficult and more expensive approach - getting the LD gear and the discs themselves - be more worthwhile? And on the subject, which discs (out of those that are relatively easy to obtain) do you recommend?

Dunno how your respective systems handle surround downmixing, but I'm quite certain I heard it, and I'm just getting stereo audio from my BD player via my TV.

If only I could somehow lose the "NOOOOO" like you're apparently losing "You could use a good kiss!", I'd be content!

May I suggest Dropbox? Basically, it's a program that creates a sharable folder on your system. You do have to register, but you get 2 GB of storage for free. It's a lot less clunky to share files directly between each other, rather than having to upload them to a file sharing site first.

Ah, yeah. It was EyeShotFirst!

I've found the thread for his "Hybrid Edition". Molly posted the link to the ac3-file in post 9. It's dead now, though, and I haven't had the file for a long time. Maybe you can ask for it?

You can read the thread here.

Well, we do know for sure that the Leia/Tarkin-dialogue now uses different audio elements. All lines in that scene are now clear as day, whereas a lot of Cushing's lines had that "crappy ADR"-quality to them before.

They don't sound like different takes, though, and I doubt they were able to somehow mess with the original tapes - those lines have sounded tinny on every release up till now. I wonder if they were somehow able to clean up the original on-set dialogue?

I know I once found an ac3-track of the 1991 mix which contains the surviving narration by Deems Taylor. If I'm not mistaken, there was another Fantasia-project like yours here on the boards, and the link could be found in that thread.

Apart from that, I'm not really into the technical stuff of ripping and muxing. But I do wish you good luck on this project - the result should definitely be worthwhile!

WhatsMyName said:

I'm not surprised. I'm one of them. I think its worth it. I just can't figure out if i liked the added "No" in ROTJ.

I'm one of them as well, and I don't really regret my purchase. I really do hate the "NOOOOOOO", though.

Fan backlash got rid of Luke's 97SE scream, though, so I'm hoping this will eventually disappear as well.

Finally watched ROTJ, so I've now watched the entire saga. No other changes apart from what I already knew. So the guy who's talking about an added midichlorian line is bullshitting.

ROTJ is definitely the best looking of the OT BDs, in my opinion. Yes, it still has its share of pink sabers and possibly the most abominable changes, but I still really enjoyed it. I sure hope the Darth Vader's cries of "NOOO" go the way of Luke's ESB scream, though...

Heilemann said:

I find it hard to believe that the 'You could use a good kiss' line is gone... Will check when I get home.

Watched ESB recently, and as far as I remember, it's still there. It's one of my favourite lines (Ford's delivery is priceless), so I definitely think I would've noticed...

The Blu-rays are definitely better than the DVDs - changes aside, there's no way around around that. The recent DVDActive review of ANH sums things up nicely, I think; had this been the release of a less culturally significant film series, this release would have been pretty nifty. However, as we've been blessed with fantastic BD sets of the "Alien"-series, the extended "Lord of the Rings"-films and "Blade Runner", one cannot help being a little disappointed. They're still fantastic films (again, not accounting for the changes), but they do deserve better.

Oh, and seeing how I never got around to replying to you, none...

At this point, all that doesn't matter, the color changes have been released twice, they are no longer errors made by the color blind, they are definitive deliberate creative decisions, that's the way George Lucas and Lucasfilm want these films to look.

I'd agree with you if it wasn't for the fact that certain issues that resulted in an outcry among fans have been fixed. Luke's saber still reveals its prop-origins, but it isn't ROTJ-green anymore. The ADR is still all over the place as it always was, but at least better audio elements have been instated for the infamous Tarkin/Leia-exchange. The blue hatch has been recoloured, although they missed a shot.

Okay, the guys at Lucasfilm are only human. I suppose everyone could miss a few shots. It's when you combine those human errors with Lucas' obnoxious attitude regarding this historial revisionism and the PR-crap about "the best available quality" that things turn sour. Anyone can make a mistake, but these guys are apparently unable to admit them.

Evidently, Lucasfilm is just not the well-oiled machine we're supposed to believe it is. When it comes to handling their legacy, Lucas has the business mannerisms of Jabbe the Hutt, and his new staff have apparently been told not to actually give a shit. A damn shame. 

It must seem as if I regret getting this release. I actually don't, cause it is still Star Wars, at least for a child of the 97 SE like me. But I am a bit bummed by the fact that I have lots of lesser films sitting on my shelf that have been treated better. But, by all means, those of you want to get it - make an informed purchase. Cause you won't be getting the "Ultimate Edition", sadly.

The guys at LucasFilm must be colourblind, then. I've downloaded Harmy's Despecialized editions to get my OOT fix, though. I feel less guilty doing that now that I actually own the Blu-rays.

The colours of the sabres in ESB are still all over the place. Vader's saber is orange, purple and pink, but never really red, as it should be.

I was relieved to see a lot of the saber mistakes corrected in ANH. Luke's lightsaber aboard the Milennium Falcon looks more white than anything, but that was always one of the crappiest saber effects in that film.

The sabres in ESB, however, disappointed me. I mean, goddammit - how hard can it be to colour-correct all of them?!

Whoa, that looks awesome! Great job, Magnoliafan. I think a lot of fan editors just wet themselves right now.

While I own the 2004 DVD set and the Blu-ray set, there's no doubt I'll buy a Laserdisc player and a set of OT LDs at some point. I'm not really interested in GOUT given that I own a widescreen LCD TV and would rather not like to mess with the upscaling settings for my BD player everytime I want to watch the OT. I'm aware that blowing a Laserdisc up to 42" will probably make things look a little rough around the edges, but if that's what it takes...

Besides, there's a certain charm to Laserdisc. I live in Denmark which was never a major LD market - there's only ever been one single LD release here. So I'm very curious about these discs. Never even seen one in action before. Main issue is negotiations with my girlfriend about where to put the damn thing, though! I'm sure a lot of the guys here can relate to that ;)