Father Skywalker

Tyrphanax said:

The concept of the Death Star did not come about until Raith Sienar conceived of it after Palpatine was elected Supreme Chancellor, which could only be any time after Episode I, and Darth Plagueis was murdered during Episode I (the day before Palpatine became Supreme Chancellor, in fact), so no.

Beyond that, you can have as many fanciful scenarios as you wish about Darth Vader being the suddenly-benevolent Emperor of a suddenly-good Empire. All I know is that the Empire is portrayed as very explicitly and obviously evil in the films.

Again, and this will be the final time I attempt to explain this; no matter how many times you repost that quote, or how many others are like it, no matter what Lucas himself says, the official word from Lucas Licensing is that every piece of Star Wars material is on the exact same timeline. The movies, the books, the comics, the games, all of it. It's all on one timeline, it's all part of the same canon, it's all part of the same continuity. The only parallel universe in Star Wars continuity is anything that is marked with the "Infinities" label; if it does not have that label, it is officially on the same timeline, in the same universe, as the films, and therefore part of the same continuity.

The first four paragraphs of this article make that all very clear.

Again, you are welcome to create your own canon in your head; many people here have done so. But the official story is that it is all on one timeline, and that is what I will refer to for all discussions pertaining to the Star Wars canon, whether I like it or not.

Some user on the jedi Council Forums told me that Darth Plageius discussed the idea of the Death Stars with Darth Sidious

If I am enjoying a series, especially an awesome science fictions, I do not want to make up my own fantasized canon, but rather, listen to what the official-copyright owning people say about their series which they made and which I happen to enjoy very much.....

Don't U get my analogies about the spiderman films/movies????

How would you explain that quote that I kept posting???

The EU and the films are two different timelines/storylines, and they do not overlap with each other. What about the sith lords in post ROTJ episode 6 stories after anakin skywalker brought balance to the force???

Tyrphanax said:

Father Skywalker said:

High taxes, trade rescritions, no personal rights and freedoms, are what Darth Vader/Anakin Skywalker's epic and dramatic redemption is about???? No!!!!!!!

So, millions of people with families that they loved and cared about and who grieved for their losses were horribly burned to death in two fiery explosions

Just so people could have lower taxes????? What the????????

What about all the innocents who died on Alderaan, a civilian target? Did nobody there have families? Those attacks were unprovoked. If Princess Leia stole the plans, shouldn't they have killed her instead of blowing up a whole planet full of people who had nothing to do with the stolen plans and were peaceful, happy citizens of the Empire?

The Death Stars, however, were military targets, controlled and manned by military personnel, all of whom joined the military knowing the risks of being in the military. No peaceful innocent citizens on those at all.

Did you not read my post above WW2/the second world war and allied war crimes????

Yes, the destruction of alderaan was a war crime, but just because one side commits a war crime doesn't mean anything on who's the good guys or the bad guys, the big picture does.......

Whats ur point by saying that the death star was a military target???

In the EU, women and children, not to mention the contractors and construction workers, were on it. What about the drafted stormtroopers and imperials??? The rebels soldiers should've been kind to them and helped them escape......

You just contradicted yourself, too........

Tyrphanax said:

I don't think his looks are anyone's issue with him in terms of his role in Star Wars.

Whaddya mean????

Darth Vader was once a normal looking, super-godlike handsome long-haired handsome man, without james earl jone's voice, with a kinda effitimate feminine whiny angsty voice......

I meant that people were/are biased against Darth Vader looking like a normal person........

SilverWook said:

How many times are you going to post the same photos over and over again? That borders on spamming...

I was not trying to be off-topic, so I was not thinking that I was spamming when I posted them, I apologize if what I posted happened to break the forum rules........

Whoever thinks that this guy has an ugly face has no idea what They're R talking about!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Tyrphanax said:

Father Skywalker said:

Tyrphanax said:

Davnes007 said:

How come Lucas doesn't have a problem with Princess Leia shooting first?

 

Because ladies first.

Guys First!!!!!!

Especially sexy, handsome, long-haired, topless Hayden Christensen.

Why R U even mentioning him being topless??????????

What does that have to do with this, or anything else for that matter???????

Tyrphanax said:

Father Skywalker said:

Tyrphanax said:

Father Skywalker said:

You can mention the EU expanded universe in your posts, just tell me if it's EU or not.....

Please mention the EU a bit in these discussions, but don't rely on it 100%, don't rely on the films 100% either, I use both of em!!!!!!

Please give me a quote to prove where Han Solo said that nobody lived on the icy planet of Hoth. Maybe in the Expanded Universe they live on Hoth.....

Meh, I don't all that much about cloud city, so I can't say anything or respond to ur posts about it.....

"There's not enough life on this ice cube to fill a space cruiser."

Maybe the EU (the expanded universe) mentions that there is life on the planet of Hoth

What the hell/heck does Hoth have to do with anything in our discussions????

I don't even know, you brought it up!

Oh, now I remember. We were discussing what life was like in the empire, and the examples that the star wars movies/films, showed us.........

CapableMetal said:

Father Skywalker said:

CapableMetal said:

Father Skywalker said:

No. After Alderaan was destroyed by the first death star (and despayre too, if U count the EU/the Expanded Universe)

However the empire tried to destroy Yavin IV, Endor, and Chandrila (senator mon mothma's home-planet) and the planet Mon Calamari (home to the mon calamari aliens), as self defense, a retaliation to the rebels. They destroyed 2 planets-the planets alderaan and depsayre, to test out the first death star and keep the galaxy (not just the rebels, but ordinary civilians too) in line with fear of its power. After the destruction of the first death star, the second death star was never used, or even attempted to be used, in an offensive attack/strike on an innocent civilian planet.....

Surely though the DSII was never used because it was never finished... Why would the Empire build a Death Star (the name alone should show that the Empire aren't exactly understanding of those it rules over) just to have it fly around the galaxy on the off-chance of finding some capital ships to blast away? It's not the most manoeuvrable or subtle craft. Destroying planets, or at least having the ability to destroy planets, is all part of its purpose; it is a weapon of fear to keep systems from defying the oppression of the Empire. The fact that both Death Stars were defeated before they got a chance to be properly used (Alderaan excluded) doesn't mean that they were never going to be used!

The point of the rebels wanting to blow both Death Star's up isn't just one of self defence, but also of necessity in their crusade to defeat the Empire and bring freedom back to the galaxy.

Sometimes, having interesting discussions with people, especially if it's about detailed or deep conversations (not small talk!!!!!) can be very hard and confusing, not only because of circular arguements and keeping track of what everybody is saying, but because understanding and interpeting what somebody means or is trying to say, especially if it's all really vague and stuff, or u dont get exactly what they're are talking about.

For instance, I said self defense. By self defense I meant defending innocent civilian planets, you could be interperting what I said as defending rebel military bases-too totally different topics and discussions.

What exactly was the point of blowing up the two death stars, beyond the obvious??? Exactly, the obvious!!!!!!

The DS2 almost tried to destroy 3 rebel planets, and I'll admit here that destroying any planet, regardless of whatever military enemies are on it, is evil, because it destroys the enviornment, plants, animals, and innocent life that is one that planet, however, just because one side does an evil deed, doesn't mean that their enemies are good.

Either the rebels defeated the empire before they could do anything evil on a large scale

And, most/all of the Star Wars SW fans will claim that the death star made the Galactic Sith Empire (duh it was ruled by two dark lords of the sith), and that was the reason that it was evil. However, you just implied that the death star was built to keep rebel terrorists in line. Defying the opression of the empire is another way of saying joining the rebel alliance and becoming a traitor to the imperial state, committing treason........

The empire's evil deeds were a response to the rebels alliance.......

I implied no such thing. You misunderstand my point. The Death Star was built to keep the systems under the Empire's territories in line. The Empire is obviously an undesirable element to most or all of the systems it controls.

Grand Moff Tarkin implies as much ("Fear will keep the local systems in line; fear of this battle station.") He makes no mention of 'rebel terrorists' in that instance. The rebels exist to help free the galaxy from the oppression of the Empire. It says this in plain English at the start of the film ('Rebel ships striking from a hidden base have won their first victory against the evil Galactic Empire'). The fact that it is led by two Sith lords may have little/nothing to do with why those under the control of the Empire are disliking it; its likely due to trade restrictions, taxes, and the removal of personal liberties and other such things that such regimes enforce. Either way, the fact that they need to build a planet-destroying space station clearly shows that they're obviously aware that more people will want to break free from their control and they want to stop them from doing so. That must mean the populations under their control aren't happy and the Empire knows this, otherwise you wouldn't need a Death Star!?

High taxes, trade rescritions, no personal rights and freedoms, are what Darth Vader/Anakin Skywalker's epic and dramatic redemption is about???? No!!!!!!!

So, millions of people with families that they loved and cared about and who grieved for their losses were horribly burned to death in two fiery explosions

Just so people could have lower taxes????? What the????????

Tyrphanax said:

Father Skywalker said:

You can mention the EU expanded universe in your posts, just tell me if it's EU or not.....

Please mention the EU a bit in these discussions, but don't rely on it 100%, don't rely on the films 100% either, I use both of em!!!!!!

Please give me a quote to prove where Han Solo said that nobody lived on the icy planet of Hoth. Maybe in the Expanded Universe they live on Hoth.....

Meh, I don't all that much about cloud city, so I can't say anything or respond to ur posts about it.....

"There's not enough life on this ice cube to fill a space cruiser."

Maybe the EU (the expanded universe) mentions that there is life on the planet of Hoth

What the hell/heck does Hoth have to do with anything in our discussions????

SilverWook said:

"There are no good wars, with the following exceptions: the American Revolution, World War II, and the Star Wars Trilogy. "

-Bart Simpson 1990

Define a "good war"

From a religious perspective, war is evil because when people die, some of them go to hell...........

The American Revolution was not a just war............

The Second World War (WW2) saved many tens of millions of innocent lives from Adolf Hitler's evil government, so it was a just war...........

Tyrphanax said:

Davnes007 said:

How come Lucas doesn't have a problem with Princess Leia shooting first?

 

Because ladies first.

Guys First!!!!!!

adywan said:

I'm starting to realise that father Skywalker is actually a 12 year old girl, which would explain the immature posts and the fact that they thing that episode 3 is better than the OT. Puberty can do strange things to people ;)

OK, big deal, Im obsessed with hayden christensen's handsomeness and godlike good looks......

Well, you most certainly have a huge double standard, along with the rest of our society........

Tyrphanax said:

Father Skywalker said:

Tyrphanax said:

Father Skywalker said:

SilverWook said:

Missed the joke by a mile.

An Empire founded before there was even a Rebellion, and killed lots of people in the process of an orchestrated war to create it.

I know that already, they started the clone wars to get to power. That doesn't explain anything about what life was like for imperial citizens. They all seemed pretty happy, very happy, regardless of the unjust methods that their leader came to power with.

Do you have any examples of how happy they were?

While democracy is the most ideal form of government, the lack of democracy, ie, a dictatorship, is not all that terribly and mythically evil, just some dictators and tyrants are......

Tattoine, everybody was walking around and living a normal life....

The same thing with Cloud City....

The same thing with Hoth....

The same thing with Endor-no Ewok genocides or massacres going on there.....

Going from the movies alone, with no EU:

The Empire did not control Tatooine, the Hutts control Tatooine. The Imperial presence there was looking for the droids only.

The Empire did not control Cloud City, it was neutral, as Lando said; and when the Empire started to take Cloud City over, you'll remember that everyone ran for their lives.

Nothing lived on Hoth, as Han said. The only people living there were Rebels.

Nothing but Ewoks lived on the Sanctuary Moon; and they were a primitive civilization and weren't even a concern of the Empire, the Empire just put a base there.

You can mention the EU expanded universe in your posts, just tell me if it's EU or not.....

Please mention the EU a bit in these discussions, but don't rely on it 100%, don't rely on the films 100% either, I use both of em!!!!!!

Please give me a quote to prove where Han Solo said that nobody lived on the icy planet of Hoth. Maybe in the Expanded Universe they live on Hoth.....

Meh, I don't all that much about cloud city, so I can't say anything or respond to ur posts about it.....

CapableMetal said:

Father Skywalker said:

Tyrphanax said:

Father Skywalker said:

SilverWook said:

Missed the joke by a mile.

An Empire founded before there was even a Rebellion, and killed lots of people in the process of an orchestrated war to create it.

I know that already, they started the clone wars to get to power. That doesn't explain anything about what life was like for imperial citizens. They all seemed pretty happy, very happy, regardless of the unjust methods that their leader came to power with.

Do you have any examples of how happy they were?

While democracy is the most ideal form of government, the lack of democracy, ie, a dictatorship, is not all that terribly and mythically evil, just some dictators and tyrants are......

Tattoine, everybody was walking around and living a normal life....

The same thing with Cloud City....

The same thing with Hoth....

The same thing with Endor-no Ewok genocides or massacres going on there.....

They slaughtered Jawas and Luke's aunt & uncle for having a brief association with some droids. Sounds fairly evil to me.

Also the only people on Hoth were rebels.

What's is Your point by claiming that the only people on Hoth were rebel soldiers??? What's that gotta do with arguing anything that I said, my points that I was trying to prove???

They did slaughter the Jawa and Luke skywalker's aunt and uncle for having some droids with them. Yes, that was most certainly evil, there is no question about the evil nature of the slaughter of some innocent helpless defenseless civilians, you gotta remember that during WW2, the Allied powers did some war crimes too. Does that make the axis powers the good guys???? OF COURSE NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Both sides can commit evil during a war. The Soviet russian army soldiers did bad stuff to german women during WW2 in order to get revenge at the germans, by bringing innocent civilian people involved into it. The american troops killed some helpless prisorners of war.....

That doesn't make the Allied Powers evil overall, because in the long run they did rid the world of evil sickos........

CapableMetal said:

Father Skywalker said:

No. After Alderaan was destroyed by the first death star (and despayre too, if U count the EU/the Expanded Universe)

However the empire tried to destroy Yavin IV, Endor, and Chandrila (senator mon mothma's home-planet) and the planet Mon Calamari (home to the mon calamari aliens), as self defense, a retaliation to the rebels. They destroyed 2 planets-the planets alderaan and depsayre, to test out the first death star and keep the galaxy (not just the rebels, but ordinary civilians too) in line with fear of its power. After the destruction of the first death star, the second death star was never used, or even attempted to be used, in an offensive attack/strike on an innocent civilian planet.....

Surely though the DSII was never used because it was never finished... Why would the Empire build a Death Star (the name alone should show that the Empire aren't exactly understanding of those it rules over) just to have it fly around the galaxy on the off-chance of finding some capital ships to blast away? It's not the most manoeuvrable or subtle craft. Destroying planets, or at least having the ability to destroy planets, is all part of its purpose; it is a weapon of fear to keep systems from defying the oppression of the Empire. The fact that both Death Stars were defeated before they got a chance to be properly used (Alderaan excluded) doesn't mean that they were never going to be used!

The point of the rebels wanting to blow both Death Star's up isn't just one of self defence, but also of necessity in their crusade to defeat the Empire and bring freedom back to the galaxy.

Sometimes, having interesting discussions with people, especially if it's about detailed or deep conversations (not small talk!!!!!) can be very hard and confusing, not only because of circular arguements and keeping track of what everybody is saying, but because understanding and interpeting what somebody means or is trying to say, especially if it's all really vague and stuff, or u dont get exactly what they're are talking about.

For instance, I said self defense. By self defense I meant defending innocent civilian planets, you could be interperting what I said as defending rebel military bases-too totally different topics and discussions.

What exactly was the point of blowing up the two death stars, beyond the obvious??? Exactly, the obvious!!!!!!

The DS2 almost tried to destroy 3 rebel planets, and I'll admit here that destroying any planet, regardless of whatever military enemies are on it, is evil, because it destroys the enviornment, plants, animals, and innocent life that is one that planet, however, just because one side does an evil deed, doesn't mean that their enemies are good.

Either the rebels defeated the empire before they could do anything evil on a large scale

And, most/all of the Star Wars SW fans will claim that the death star made the Galactic Sith Empire (duh it was ruled by two dark lords of the sith), and that was the reason that it was evil. However, you just implied that the death star was built to keep rebel terrorists in line. Defying the opression of the empire is another way of saying joining the rebel alliance and becoming a traitor to the imperial state, committing treason........

The empire's evil deeds were a response to the rebels alliance.......

Tyrphanax said:

Father Skywalker said:

SilverWook said:

Missed the joke by a mile.

An Empire founded before there was even a Rebellion, and killed lots of people in the process of an orchestrated war to create it.

I know that already, they started the clone wars to get to power. That doesn't explain anything about what life was like for imperial citizens. They all seemed pretty happy, very happy, regardless of the unjust methods that their leader came to power with.

Do you have any examples of how happy they were?

While democracy is the most ideal form of government, the lack of democracy, ie, a dictatorship, is not all that terribly and mythically evil, just some dictators and tyrants are......

Tattoine, everybody was walking around and living a normal life....

The same thing with Cloud City....

The same thing with Hoth....

The same thing with Endor-no Ewok genocides or massacres going on there.....

darth_ender said:

So I'm among the minority here that finds redemptive value in the prequels despite my disappointment with each of them and their many flaws. I've been considering TPM lately in particular. There are many juvenile moments, bad acting, the lame midichlorian excuse, and a weak story in many regards. However, I'm starting to warm up to the film, even all those things I just mentioned. It has many beautiful shots (particularly with the aristorcratic Naboo), interesting ships designs, and a fun lightsaber fight. Even more significant to me in recent viewings is that to me it does carry a Star Wars feel to it, perhaps better than the faster paced Episodes II and III. It uses real miniatures and one can easily tell the difference. The lightsabers remind me of the originals with their flicker. The Jedi actually seem to be powerful.

In fact, among all the criticisms of the film, my biggest problem with it is not what most people say. Rather than Jar Jar or intracellular symbionts, my biggest complaint is the strange pacing: it cuts from scene to scene far too quickly, yet still feels too slow. I don't mind slow films if they are cut in a similar fashion, but somehow this movie is fast and boring at the same time.

But at the end of the day, I still feel like I'm watching Star Wars when I see Episode I. That's something I like about it.

I love star wars episode 3 the revenge of the sith, it is so godlike and awesome, and it kicks some serious ass, no offense all of you prequel-haters.......

I agree with all of you prequel bashers that star wars episode 1 the phantom menace overall sucked and was so freaking extremley boring!!!!!! There are some redemptive moments though-the revelation that Anakin Skywalker/Darth Vader is the product of some kinda virginal conception/birth, like jesus in christianity, the awesome epic john williams music and qui gon's funeral pyre which mirrored the funeral pyre of anakin, and a few other ones too!!!!!!

Tyrphanax said:

I think the Rebels attacked the Death Star at Yavin out of self-defense, considering the Death Star was going to come and blow the moon up.

It's not like the Empire had anything to fear from some tiny starfighters against a giant space station. The Rebels just got lucky.

Yavin IV 4 was a military target. 

SilverWook said:

Missed the joke by a mile.

An Empire founded before there was even a Rebellion, and killed lots of people in the process of an orchestrated war to create it.

I know that already, they started the clone wars to get to power. That doesn't explain anything about what life was like for imperial citizens. They all seemed pretty happy, very happy, regardless of the unjust methods that their leader came to power with.

There are 2 types of dictatorships and dictators in this world, and here it goes

1-Enlightened Desposts/Benevolent Dictators/Rulers. There is no democracy and one guy has absolute power, but all in all, the citizens of his country are living a nice happy life.

2-Evil genocidal mass-murdering tyrannical harsh dictators and tyrants, and the degree of severity on these kinda dictators can vary.

Wexter said:

Father Skywalker said:

Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

Father Skywalker said:

Episode 3 kicked some serious ass!!!!!
                    kiss my

fixed :)

please list at least 10 reasons why U hate star wars episode 3-the revenge of the sith.........

Look who's talking.

I would be willing to list 5 reasons why I hate the movie for every single reason why YOU love it, BESIDES the fact that it has gorgeous topless Hayden Christensen in it.

1-it has the "gorgeous, topless, Hayden Christensen" in it, with awesome long-dark brown hair, a beautiful yet evil and young lord darth vader-sounding-ish, voice-all good looks aside, he

Looked and sounded like a young Darth Vader without the james earl jones robotic cybernetic voice, the robot suit, the samurai helmet, the pale, white skinned-disfigured burned egg-shaped/looking ugly face, (like the Obi-Wan Kenobi said, more machine now than man, he started out as a normal looking-person but became disfigured inside of a suit, which was in the novelizations long before the prequels ever came out),

But rather, an evil creepy sounding charimatic devoted determined, young voice, evil-long dark brown hair like a badass medieval knight (or a heavy metal singer) or an ancient Roman Warrior, and long black robes of a dark lord of the sith. He just had that perfect evil-looking face, if not a beautiful handsome evil looking face.

2- Padme Amidala is Force Choked by Darth Vader, not an military imperial admiral/officer, but Luke and Leia skywalker's pregnant mother on a volcano planet being force-choked by young pre-suit Darth Vader, which means that darth vader also indirectly force choked his children too!!!!!

3-Anakin skywalker's turn to the darkside to save luke and leia's pregnant mother from some kinda pregnancy childbirth death. It made Darth Vader more humanlike.

4-The part where darth vader slaughters the entire seperatist council on Mustafar, and how Darth Vader actually cries about it afterwards, showing the good in him, and the conflict with him....

5-the march on the jedi temple was just pure plain epic awesomeness and godlike-style kickass

6-the sad music that played when the jedi were all killed off

7-the homages

Tyrphanax said:

Father Skywalker said:

BmB said:

 

Father Skywalker said:

OneCentSky said:

Mainly because it wasn't more of the same. I think it continued the story in a logical way. If you blow up the Death Star, you do not win for good, The Empire will come after you. It tells you what happens afterwards it isn't just Episode 4 with same characters, different villain. It is a logical continuation and I think it is the one of the greatest movies ever made. Granted, I like the first one a lot but I think this one is definitely my favorite but I guess that is just my preference.

What the hell was the point of blowing up the first death star anyways??? Why did the rebels steal the plans for it??

Not having your planet blown up seems like a fairly good reason.

 

I can agree with you on that, it may have very well been self defense, which in a war against evil mass-murderers, self defense is totally OK and morally good, right, and just; just think about the second world war........

Yes, this is 100% exactly the entire plot of Star Wars. There is no other alternative.

No. After Alderaan was destroyed by the first death star (and despayre too, if U count the EU/the Expanded Universe)

However the empire tried to destroy Yavin IV, Endor, and Chandrila (senator mon mothma's home-planet) and the planet Mon Calamari (home to the mon calamari aliens), as self defense, a retaliation to the rebels. They destroyed 2 planets-the planets alderaan and depsayre, to test out the first death star and keep the galaxy (not just the rebels, but ordinary civilians too) in line with fear of its power. After the destruction of the first death star, the second death star was never used, or even attempted to be used, in an offensive attack/strike on an innocent civilian planet.....

Tyrphanax said:

Father Skywalker said:

adywan said:

I'm starting to realise that father Skywalker is actually a 12 year old girl, which would explain the immature posts and the fact that they thing that episode 3 is better than the OT. Puberty can do strange things to people ;)

Im not a 12 yr old girl. Im neither of those two adjectives.........

I am actually interested in your real age, from a demographic standpoint.

i aint a girl, first of all....

adywan said:

I'm starting to realise that father Skywalker is actually a 12 year old girl, which would explain the immature posts and the fact that they thing that episode 3 is better than the OT. Puberty can do strange things to people ;)

Im not a 12 yr old girl. Im neither of those two adjectives.........

Tyrphanax said:

Father Skywalker said:

Tyrphanax said:

There is also always the chance that, well, there could be a mental component to this situation as well. Which is why I am being as gentle as I can and attempting to explain things clearly.

What Do U mean by a "Mental component to this situation"???

I mean differences in our mentalities; our perception of things versus yours are very different.

Everyone here is very staunch in our defense of the Original Trilogy, dislike of the Special Editions, and consensus about the canon (whether we agree with the official canon or not), the morality of the factions, and whether a character died or not; and you are very staunch in your love of the Prequels and Special Editions, defense of your hypothetical situations, and obsession with Hayden Christensen's looks and hair.

I love Victory Celebration far better than yub nub; THAT is one of the reasons that I am in love with the special editions of the star wars movies, especially episode 6, return of the jedi, the victory celebration song is cheerful dancy, it has a nice beat, and it's is very melancholic and epic at the same time!!!!!!!

Jaitea said:

 

Why does this happen every so often, look it was fun...for a while

I'd say stop responding to the Father.

J

 

stop spamming/double posting. I've already reported U to the forum website moderators.......