I think we’re getting super close with this.
I don’t think the line “As with Vader, he plotted to kill those you loved” is necessary, as it adds another wrinkle that’s not really relevant to the story being told here, or at best is inferable. Something more useful could sit here
Still, great work.
Even the worst nobodies of parents still don’t want their kids killed!
Excellently, thanks! Thanks to NFB and RogueLeader, we’re close to a release of a higher quality than I could have put out originally.
1 & 2 are properly smooth now, only needing re-rendering, 3 is vastly improved and just needs some minor addition of score, and 4 is just being mulled over a little further. Full release soonish.
As a cheeky bonus, this actually gives an explanation why Palpatine didn’t die the first time, using something like Horcrux logic!
Love all of that.
I’d perhaps change “destined for evil” to “destined for power”, since explicitly identifying as powerful is more what the sith do than call themselves evil.
“Why did the Emperor come for me?”
“Because none of his clones could survive hosting his spirit. So like Vader before you, he influenced the force to create life. You… are Palpatine’s heir.”
"He sees you as a true Palpatine, created to inherit the throne of the Sith. But what he doesn’t know is that we’ve become a dyad in the Force, Rey… two, linked by the raw power our families share. We can end him and the Sith, and create something new, together…”
This also works to convey the truths that Palpatine would have told Kylo Ren (both to seduce him and to get him to bring Rey to him), whilst retaining the parts of the plan that Palpatine would have kept secret (spirit transferrence into a host) that he’d act on when he had Rey available.
I think this can be simplified a little further. Rather than explicitly two bloodlines - Skywalkers and ‘Palpatines’ - I think it’s best if they’re essentially one and the same, simply two attempts at the whole ‘manipulate the midichlorians to create life’ thing (not that we’d use the M-word), both of which make powerful potential hosts, rich in the Force. Technically, by this interpretation, Anakin is a ‘Palpatine’ (in the loosest sense of the term), and Rey by the same token, but what we see in TRoS is Luke and Leia (and this plotline) essentially loosely reinterpreting ‘Skywalker’ to mean ‘a Palpatine creation who rose above it’.
This is well supported by the actual themes of the original TRoS, with Rey declaring herself Skywalker (with Luke and Leia’s approval). They’re saying “sure, be a Skywalker”, but here it’s loosely implicitly “like us you’re Palpatine offspring in the light, so the Skywalker name suits you too”.
I’m not saying we should make any of that explicit in the text, but that we should maybe do away with the “bloodline” angle and simply refer to Vader (and his heirs) and Rey, as all simply products of Palpatine’s will - with Vader as his first attempt and Rey as his (perfected if you like) second. So technically Luke and Leia are ‘Palpatines’ too by this interpretation, albeit in a way we wouldn’t make explicit.
And sure, I could go either way on the “bring me Rey” angle rather than needing her killed. You make fair points.
Haha, it even makes her more truly a Skywalker too! What is a Skywalker but a Palpatine heir who rose above it?
Nev, I’m glad you pointed out about Leia, I’d thought that and wanted to emphasise it too, but then forgot. It’s a great reason for why she gave up her training.
And, as you say JJB, it also helps deal with one of the common issues people have with Luke in TLJ. It even explains his hesitance to train her, and his shock when she went “straight to the dark”.
As Nev says, it’s built on something inexplicit in the movies- but something intended by Lucas and one of those things that’s included in the novelisations and widely known to be canon, to the degree that it’s likely enough to reappear in new canon works too. Besides, why not reinforce it here too, giving the original idea the explicit references it deserves?
We don’t even need the chosen one prophecy here- Palpatine’s involvement in Anakin’s birth was not directly related to the chosen one thing anyway, it’s just that some Jedi thoight he was. I really like the idea that Palpatine had these really watertight plans, but that irony or the Force kept freeing his creations from their dark origin.
Agreed, but we’ve seen him want to kill her (via Snoke/Kylo) in movies prior. I think it’s acceptable to imply he wanted one of Kylo and Rey to kill the other to prove their worthiness. I think it’s worth it for how much it adds to their collective myth with such compatibility with existing canon. If Kylo is also apparently worthy then it also explains why the Dyad is so powerful to him- it’s the power of both bloodlines, an unexpected best possible outcome.
As an aside, maybe we want to use other dialogue to imply that all of his Snoke/clone experiments were only ever intended to be temporary hosts at best.
This would even be compatible with him wanting Luke to strike him down in RotJ- his spirit could pass to a child of either bloodline, making the ending of RotJ an apparent Win-Win for him, failing only because he wasn’t truly struck down, but chucked away by Vader out of love for Luke, not anger at Palpatine.
It also makes sense that he didn’t inhabit Vader, since he was unexpectedly crippled at Mustafar. Any of these four (Vader, Luke, Kylo, Rey) could have been apprentices until they became hosts- also having Palpatine cheat the rule of two (the apprentice must supplant the master) by making a bloodline that he’d take over in continued life even if they followed that doctrine.
And if we want to retain Palpatine wanting to kill Rey (which fits better with TFA/TLJ):
“You know why the Emperor wanted to kill you. I’ll come tell you.”
“Why did the Emperor want to kill me?”
“Because he only needed one vessel from the two dark bloodlines he sired. Vader’s, or the one he perfected with you. You… are Palpatine’s heir.”
"We were created to inherit the legacy of the Sith. Skywalker and Palpatine. But what he doesn’t know is that we’ve become a dyad in the Force, Rey… two, linked by raw power. We can end him and the Sith, and create something new, together…”
(Removes his helmet)
“You know what you need to do. You know.”
“I do.”
I’ve just posted above in a way I think gives you both options. (We don’t need to say they cared for her- they were her parents even if she wasn’t planned for, and their actions in the flashes and regular story convey that well enough.)
“I’d never lie to you… your parents were no one… junk traders burdened with a child they never planned for.”
“Don’t!”
“Did you know that Vader’s mother was a nobody, too?"
“I don’t want this!”
“Palpatine chose you."
“No!”
“Your parents fled across the galaxy. He hunted them.”
What better than a nobody to use to create his heir? It’s what he did with Shmi - perfectly using existing canon to marry Rey Palpatine with Rey’s-Parents-Nobody
The only thing I might consider adding, is making it clear he had other experiments (implicitly including the Palpatine clone he now inhabits), but that Rey or Kylo still would be better vessels. I’d also include an angle about Palpatine wanting to kill her if he couldn’t possess her - but I think this core principle is the right angle.
YES! It leaves room for other Palpatine experiments/clones but it uses his known tool, and works for all the reasons you chose it. It’s also compatible with the chosen one prophecy without using that term. Really excellent.
Well that’s fair enough, though I don’t mind it myself. But maybe we should split this exercise out into logical steps then- first establish our goals, then establish her backstory, then rework the dialogue? Because right now it feels like there’s a lot of good ideas here but a few crossed purposes! (That’s not a criticism of any individual, you’re all awesome.)
I feel like we want to be using as simple concepts and language as possible. We really don’t want to be adding anything more for the audience to be thinking about than the bare minimum to make this work.
Parents joined the cult? Then let’s just say that directly in simplest terms. We don’t need to delve deep into her parents’ motivations beyond carrying this bit of plot.
In simplest terms, to carry us from “nobody parents” through “Rey Palpatine” to the events depicted in TROS:
Well then, perhaps simply-
“Rey… wherever you are… you are hard to find.”
“You are hard to get rid of.”
“I pushed you in the desert because I needed to see it… I needed you to see it… who you are. I know the darkness that lives in you, Rey…”
“You’re lying.”
“You were right… your parents were once nobodies. Junkers, seduced by the Sith to join the cult on Exegol.”
“Don’t!”
“They were trusted to raise you, alongside other dark… experiments.”
“I don’t want this!”
“But they betrayed that trust… out of love."
“No!”
“They stole you away from him. From Palpatine.”
(Rey sees the vision of her parents and her abandonment.)
“Rey, my love… be brave.”
“You’ll be safe here… I promise.”
“Come back! Nooo!”
“They paid for your freedom… in more than one way.”
“Stop talking.”
“Rey… I learned what happened to them.”
(Cutaway to heroes capture)
“Your parents sought Luke’s protection, searching the Jakku desert for his allies… but Palpatine’s assassins tracked them down. They wouldn’t give you up, and so they died, forgotten by the galaxy once more.
(Rey sees her parents get killed.)
“So that’s where you are.”
“You know why the Emperor’s always wanted you dead. I’ll come tell you.”
…etc
“Why did the Emperor come for me? Why did he want to kill a child? Tell me.”
“The Sith cult made many attempts to create a stable host vessel for his fading spirit. Rey, you’re a clone of the Emperor. You… are a Palpatine.”
“But his essence chose another body, making the rest of you… rivals. But what Palpatine could not foresee is that we’d become a Dyad in the Force, Rey… two, linked by pure power. With that power we can end him and the Sith, and create something better, together…”
(Removes his helmet)
“You know what you need to do. You know?”
“I do.”
I like to think they’re just glorified nannies. Tending to Palp’s brood.
Added some further lines to my post above just as you were sending that message.
Yeah, this is definitely ‘Rey Palpatine, but better - with Nobody parents’.
In fact, I think this can be simplified further, with her parents not needing to be Sith cultists:
“Rey… wherever you are… you are hard to find.”
“You are hard to get rid of.”
“I pushed you in the desert because I needed to see it… I needed you to see it… who you are. I know the darkness that lives in you, Rey…”
“You’re lying.”
“You were right… your parents were no one. Junkers, kidnapped by the Sith to serve the cult on Exegol.”
“Don’t!”
“They were forced to raise you, alongside other dark… experiments.”
“I don’t want this!”
“But they grew to love you nonetheless.”
“No!”
“They stole you away from him. From Palpatine.”
…etc
“Why did the Emperor come for me? Why did he want to kill a child? Tell me.”
“The Sith cult made many attempts to create a stable host for his fading spirit. Rey, you’re a clone of the Emperor. You… are a Palpatine.”
“But his essence chose another body, making the rest of you… rivals. But what Palpatine doesn’t know is that we’ve become a Dyad in the Force, Rey… two, linked by pure power. With that power we can end him and the Sith, and create something better, together…”
(Removes his helmet)
“You know what you need to do. You know?”
“I do.”
Adoption works very nicely with the new vision of her parents in TLJ, where she’s looking for her parentage and finds only herself, with a flash of Palpatine.
Yeah, I’m also not sure we need the lie angle - again mainly because it feels like something future content will likely contradict.