- Post
- #1339727
- Topic
- Poll: which ship would you wanna fly?
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1339727/action/topic#1339727
- Time

DuracellEnergizer
This user has been banned.
- User Group
- Banned Members
- Join date
- 30-May-2010
- Last activity
- 30-Dec-2020
- Posts
- 24,211
Post History
- Post
- #1339473
- Topic
- <strong>Return Of The Jedi</strong> - a general <strong>Random Thoughts</strong> thread
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1339473/action/topic#1339473
- Time
I suppose it’s time to make a permanent exit from this thread. My low regard for ROTJ is clear by now; there’s no point continuing my snarky remarks. I’ll try keeping to the areas of the forum where my cynicism is less liable to flare up.
- Post
- #1339371
- Topic
- <strong>Return Of The Jedi</strong> - a general <strong>Random Thoughts</strong> thread
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1339371/action/topic#1339371
- Time
I firmly remember you belittling people who liked SC. 38 Reimagined. You apologized, but I thought it was a true indication of your character. That may be unfair, but your posts have such a smug sense of superiority to them that I believe it.
A lot of people have taste for things I dislike or an indifferent towards. Sometimes I simply fail to understand how they could derive any enjoyment from those things. Overall, though, I’m content to say “different strokes for different folks”. Yeah, there are times when I have an especially bad day, when I let my cheekiness devolve into cantankerousness and I’m needlessly rude/cruel towards those people. I’ve made an concentrated effort to avoid those slip-ups, but they still happen time-to-time.
But hey, you want to assume the worst of me? Go right ahead. It’s only par for the course.
- Post
- #1339364
- Topic
- Lurkers Name suggestions (Come On Lurkers JOIN IN!)
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1339364/action/topic#1339364
- Time
- Post
- #1339357
- Topic
- <strong>Return Of The Jedi</strong> - a general <strong>Random Thoughts</strong> thread
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1339357/action/topic#1339357
- Time
Your posts reek of toxicity.
Forced to live in a capitalist hellscape can do that to a person.
Whenever I read your posts here, the general attitude is that you think you’re better than people who like media that you dislike.
If I felt that, I’d say that. Don’t mistake my contempt for the art for comptempt for those who like the art.
You may have some good points, but I find you utterly insufferable.
Very well.
- Post
- #1339343
- Topic
- <strong>Return Of The Jedi</strong> - a general <strong>Random Thoughts</strong> thread
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1339343/action/topic#1339343
- Time
Kurtz was also asked to produce Revenge Of The Jedi - which he turned down for the reasons we all know…
That seems extremely unlikely. After falling out with Lucas, it would be ludicrous to think that Lucas would ask him to do anything for him after that.
Like Lucas asking him to stay around until the film was finished? As stated below in your reply to Wook? 😉
I did not want to imply that he was asked to stick around. I implied that they just let him stick around in order not to cause any trouble, like making a complaint to PGA, which could easily doom already fragile situation. 😉
The information that “he was asked to produce ROTJ” only ever came from Kurtz during his interviews (and of course secondary sources that refer to him saying so). I have not seen any other independent source confirming that information. Also, he never specified by WHO he was asked. Maybe by a voice in his head? Unless he was asked by Lucas (which is more or less impossible), it makes the whole thing completely irrelevant.
A ‘voice in his head?’ - no, somebody from Lucasfilm had obviously obviously spoke with Kurtz and offered him Producing work (or credit) on ROTJ - as of 1981, in the official Lucasfilm press release below… to which Kurtz must have agreed to.
This seems like a thing for the public not to question and wonder why he was removed and replaced. Lucasfilm always seemed to have tried to make it look like everything was fine and dandy. We did not even know he was removed until many years afterwards when people investigated behind-the-scenes for books and documentaries. Same goes for many other key figures and events of OT that we had only learned about many years after.
Even if this “Production Consultant” was an actual job (which it was not for sure) instead of just a make-up for the public, it is still by no means any kind of proof that he was offered to actually produce ROTJ. I mean you do not remove a producer in the middle of the film only to then offer him to produce a sequel.
• https://www.jeditemplearchives.com/specialreports/banthatracks/archives/banthatracks11.pdf
^ Bantha Tracks: Issue 11 (official Star Wars Newsletter), dated February 1981, re Revenge Of The Jedi and an official Lucasfilm press release:-
“Gary Kurtz, who produced ‘Star Wars’ and ‘Empire Strikes Back’ will serve as a Production Consultant on ‘Jedi’, while he prepares two of his own projects.”
So, not so ‘ludicrous’ as you think or claim, yes? 😉
As to ‘Independent source’? who are you expecting to know outside of Kurtz and high-end Lucasfilm employees that would have know he been offered the job of producing ROTJ? Do we need ‘independent sources’ to confirm Lynch was offered the chance to direct ROTJ, or Cronenberg etc?
The who and the when are irrelevant in the context of Kurtz stating he was asked to produce ROTJ - the statements came the man himself - to which nobody from Lucasfilm has challenged any of them - including George. You believe a professional and highly regarded producer (a job which requires inordinate levels of trust & professionalism) and would make continuous false claims he was offered the producer job for a famous film… when at any time the said employer - or employees - could turn around and deny it? His reputation and credibility would likely be ruined.
In fact, would a be a ‘ludicrous’ thing for Kurtz to claim… if it was not true, yes? 😉
Like said above, Lucasfilm extremely rarely challenged anything or anyone in order to keep things appear fine and dandy. In his later interviews, Kurtz seemed very resentful of his removal, so it would not surprise me if he made it up. After all, he did use ideas from Lucas’ pre-SW drafts and tried to present them as if they were ROTJ draft (when it actually did not exist in any form at the time). Also, he tried to claim that he left because he did not like the direction in which the saga was going in order to try to cover the fact that he was fired because the production was hugely over-budget and over-schedule. 😉
‘Seems’ is a word - often a guess - people use when they wish to use / value a narrative or opinion etc over or contrary to fact or evidence.
As for your book claims… most strange… as you stated previously it is also years after the event that Kurtz gave his, so far, undisputed account.
And we know for a fact that Rinzler’s ‘Making Of’ books contained retcons & revisionism (at the request of George himself, according to Rinzler) - and also omitted or downplayed people’s contributions to the making of the films (even the author himself as to the Lippincott interviews / archive).
You also stated it would be ‘ludicrous’ for Lucasfilm to have anything to do with Kurtz (after your claim of him being removed and replaced / Kurtz sending in his resignation letter) - and yet when presented with a document of Lucasfilm crediting Kurtz as a Production Consultant just two years later for ROTJ… you now claim this is ‘just a make-up for the public’.
Not forgetting the official ‘Once Upon A Galaxy: Making of Empire Strikes Back’ book… which has Kurtz involved in post-production on Empire - you should really give that a read as to Kurtz’ work on Empire throughout the whole process, it is quite illuminating.
Available evidence and facts don’t cease to exist because they are ignored. For many, they also remain above opinion and speculation - though you are most to welcome to your opinion 😉
(I’ll have to leave it there - though found it fun; especially the gap-filling guesswork and dismissal of statements and documents contrary to it. Let me know if you do ever find proof to back up your opinions to continue this 😃 )
In return, you provided some obscure fan club newsletter material to base your conclusions on (btw “Production Consultant” or whatever is not a Producer by any means) along with a bunch of opinions of your own that you claim as facts. In response to that fan club newsletter material, I can provide the film credits of ROTJ. I am sure if they listed just about every assistant of an assistant, he should be there somewhere, right?
At least we agree that this debate is pointless to continue. 😉
Dude, ooj provided a link to image of an official Lucasfilm press release from 1981 where Kurtz was credited as a ‘Production Consultant’ at the time - within a Bantha Tracks fan club article. ooj links to content like that so you know what you are going to be clicking on.
Of course Kurtz didn’t appear in the credits in ROTJ, becuase things changed over time - ooj never claimed otherwise. He was illustraing how ‘ludricous’ and wrong your earlier claim was that Lucas would have nothing do with Kurtz after ‘removing and replacing’ (your words and claim) him on Empire, and there was a working relationship there between them.
Are you trying to rubbish the actual Lucasfilm press release, or ooj posting a link to it via Bantha Tracks?
Considering he has highlighted how you use your opinion as a narrative, while ignoring statments and documents that conflict with them, and also twist words to give credence to your claim, it does appear you are bent on doubling down and carrying on.
I hope you do - this IS fun!
I see you’ve meet imperialscum.
- Post
- #1339342
- Topic
- <strong>Return Of The Jedi</strong> - a general <strong>Random Thoughts</strong> thread
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1339342/action/topic#1339342
- Time
I still maintain that Luke didn’t actually save the galaxy - a fact that renders his entire ‘new hope’ journey somewhat meaningless to me.
Luke was the only one who could get through to Vader. Vader was the only one who could destroy the Emperor.
Without Luke, there’s no hope. He saved the galaxy by redeeming his father. (or, by Returning the Jedi, if you will)I also hate the sister thing. Luke should have gone off alone in search of “The Other” at the end.
I’ve beat this drum several times in these forums, but the best way to explain my unease wth Luke’s actions is to boil it down to the following - what exactly did Luke tell everyone at the Ewok after-party?
If he’d said “I defeated the Emperor” that would’ve been a lie. He didn’t beat the Emperor. He surrendered and circumstances luckily prevailed in a way that led to Palpatine’s demise. That’s it. What Luke actually did was a) refuse to fight (after a brief and justifiable tantrum), b) spare the life of the second most evil guy in the galaxy because…well, he’s dad, and c) declare himself a Jedi and throw his weapon aside. All of this, by the way, while countless innocent beings were being slaughtered outside.
He probably said “I redeemed my evil father, Just like I told Leia I would & he killed the Emperor.”
All of those actions, or inactions, saved the galaxy. *shrugAnd he would’ve found himself hanging from the nearest redwood. How many rebels would’ve lost loved ones and/or had their lives ruined under the jackboots of Vader and his buddies? How thrilled would such folk be to hear that, while Palpatine was killing people by the hundreds with his new weapon, Luke was hiding under a staircase because he didn’t want to lose his temper and risk Vader not going to Jedi Heaven?
Nor can I see why anyone would even consider the possibility of a new Jedi Order based on these actions.
That’s EU anyway. Nowhere in the film does Luke even hint towards restarting anything.
[EDIT- I guess the ST says that Luke went on to do whatever, but that’s not in this film]Yoda says “pass on what you have learned”. The implication is that Luke will go on teach younglings how to hide under staircases in order to spare the bad guys.
Okay, now it just seems like you’re deliberately misinterpreting the movie. The message the movie was trying to get across was that everyone can change, not that you should hide under a staircase or whatever you said. And the whole “war criminal” thing doesn’t apply, because Star Wars shouldn’t be taken that seriously. It’s a mythic fantasy, not a true story.
Indeed. Shopping Maul’s take sounds like a CinemaSins-level bad-faith interpretation of the movie, fundamentally misunderstanding the whole point about redemption and Luke’s connection to his father. It’s not meant to be a strict reflection of reality, nor should we want it to be. This is a fantasy story, not gritty realism.
Sounds like the best way to interpret ROTJ. The movie isn’t worthy of good faith.
- Post
- #1339337
- Topic
- The Unpopular Film, TV, Music, Art, Books, Comics, Games, & Technology Opinion Thread (for all you contrarians!)
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1339337/action/topic#1339337
- Time
The Motion Picture and The Search for Spock are both underrated. And both are better than any of the TNG movies.
- Post
- #1339114
- Topic
- The Drunk Thread (was: The Durnk Thread)
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1339114/action/topic#1339114
- Time
I guzzled five beers in a row. I HATING HATE BEER! It makes me congested and sad.
- Post
- #1339028
- Topic
- Star Wars <strong>News</strong> | articles that may not have enough interest for their own threads...
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1339028/action/topic#1339028
- Time
Disney wants to legally own your tweets for using a hashtag
And I want to string Bob Iger & co. up by the feet and let them breathe celluloid fumes as I set fire to the Disney vault, but it ain’t gonna happen.
- Post
- #1339013
- Topic
- The Random <em>Star Wars</em> Pics & GIFs Thread
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1339013/action/topic#1339013
- Time
On a serious note, this would be kinda cool, I feel like most fictional universes don’t pay attention to the evolution of language in their worlds. But I would be surprised if they actually made the effort to have everyone speak in the old republic like Yoda.
What’s more likely, in my mind, is the culture/language of Yoda’s species follows that pattern, but if baby is raised by Mando, or other Basic speakers, then he will speak normal. But who knows anymore, haha.
Good points & cool ideas, but I bet it’ll talk like Yoda. Cause that’s what people like. ugh.
Ascended fandom in a nutshell. “Do everything the same cuz nostalgia.”
- Post
- #1338869
- Topic
- <strong>Return Of The Jedi</strong> - a general <strong>Random Thoughts</strong> thread
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1338869/action/topic#1338869
- Time
Also, the “Leia becomes Queen” thing…
Queen of what? She was the princess of a planet that was destroyed years ago. When we first meet her, she’s mostly using the princess thing as a ruse, hiding the fact that she’s part of the Rebel military.
Who’s to say there weren’t other inhabited planets in the Alderaan system?
- Post
- #1338839
- Topic
- Your DVD Collection
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1338839/action/topic#1338839
- Time
ADDED
Though it cost too damn much, I’m immensely satisfied to finally own a copy of The Changeling.
- Post
- #1338834
- Topic
- The Unpopular Film, TV, Music, Art, Books, Comics, Games, & Technology Opinion Thread (for all you contrarians!)
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1338834/action/topic#1338834
- Time
Ray’s gonna disown me for this…
Gojira (1954) is the only good Godzilla film. And only the original Japanese version is good; the American hackjob with Raymond Burr is worthless and every copy on every format should be collected to be burned.
- Post
- #1338573
- Topic
- The Unpopular Film, TV, Music, Art, Books, Comics, Games, & Technology Opinion Thread (for all you contrarians!)
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1338573/action/topic#1338573
- Time
I watched the first six episodes of Firefly before I lost interest. Actually, I’d likely lost interest before then but stuck with it in the hopes the magic everyone else sees in it captivated me, but it didn’t. I can’t say it’s a bad or mediocre series; I rated most of the episodes I watched fairly high, and the show itself 8/10. I think it comes down to too many of the planets visited in the show being rather uninteresting/interchangeable. That and Joss Whedon’s typical smarminess being all over everything.
- Post
- #1338324
- Topic
- Out of Context Thread: New and Improved
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1338324/action/topic#1338324
- Time
fuck the nerd
I’d tap that.
- Post
- #1338323
- Topic
- The Unpopular Film, TV, Music, Art, Books, Comics, Games, & Technology Opinion Thread (for all you contrarians!)
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1338323/action/topic#1338323
- Time
I love Back to the Future & Back to the Future Part III, but Back to the Future Part II couldn’t disinterest me more. It’s an alright sequel 'til it gets to 1985A. Biff was an asshole in the first film, but a believable asshole; in this film he’s a Saturday morning cartoon supervillain straight out of Captain Planet, and it just doesn’t wash for me. And the sidequel route the film goes from there feels more like lazy fan service than inspired storytelling.
- Post
- #1338319
- Topic
- The Unpopular Film, TV, Music, Art, Books, Comics, Games, & Technology Opinion Thread (for all you contrarians!)
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1338319/action/topic#1338319
- Time
I like isolated scenes from Ghostbusters 2. The film as a whole is superfluous.
- Post
- #1338203
- Topic
- Last movie seen
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1338203/action/topic#1338203
- Time
That’s the Jeepers Creepers guy, ain’t it?
Guy looks like an anthropomorphic greasy turd.
- Post
- #1338076
- Topic
- Out of Context Thread: New and Improved
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1338076/action/topic#1338076
- Time
frogs are pretty
Damn straight.
- Post
- #1337845
- Topic
- The Unpopular Film, TV, Music, Art, Books, Comics, Games, & Technology Opinion Thread (for all you contrarians!)
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1337845/action/topic#1337845
- Time
The Conjuring is insipid trash.
- Post
- #1337809
- Topic
- Small details that took you <em><strong>FOREVER</strong></em> to notice in the <em>Star Wars</em> films
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1337809/action/topic#1337809
- Time
^Best time travel plot since Time Runner.
- Post
- #1337807
- Topic
- What is your personal canon?
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1337807/action/topic#1337807
- Time
Maybe, just an idea popped into my head.
Guess I better try again.
Anything R2 projects onscreen is canon, but nothing else.
I can get behind that.
- Post
- #1337806
- Topic
- General Star Wars <strong>Random Thoughts</strong> Thread
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1337806/action/topic#1337806
- Time
George Lucas reminds me oddly of myself. 😕
Interpret that as you will.
You have a penchant for flannel.
Done and done.
- Post
- #1337804
- Topic
- The Unpopular Film, TV, Music, Art, Books, Comics, Games, & Technology Opinion Thread (for all you contrarians!)
- Link
- https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1337804/action/topic#1337804
- Time
The Matrix is a mediocre film. Yes, the original. Keanu Reeves alone prevents it from being good. The man critically undermines almost every movie he has a significant role in.