Director

Bobson Dugnutt said:

Director said:

Well, it seems you have more questions than I can answer inside a thread,

Why? Is there a character limit or something?

Director said:

I do not wish to use any TN1 scans due to their scans having bad colour that would require me to spend another 5 years.

Another 5 years? I thought you started working on this in “November 2023” as per your current original post.

Arguably, you are wasting your time by working with such a low quality source, being this mysterious scan done in 2012 that no one has ever heard of that looks more like the GOUT.

And yeah, look at those bad colours. Terrible, unusable. Definitely better to use some “unknown scan from 12 years ago in SD” (GOUT) rather than a fresh HD scan.

While you can call the preservation 2006 Dvd/GOUT (or whatever name it is called), but the unrestored version of the videos were very red, blue or green, and I fixed them within 5 years, but while 4K97 would normally be a good choice, the audio mix of Empire when I put it in my editing apps, is German, and ANH cantina colours are far from accurate and would require me to spend a lot of time exporting and importing the same video just to get the colours right, same thing with binary sunset and Death Star interior scenes.

RU.08 said:

Director said:

Well, it seems you have more questions than I can answer inside a thread, but yes, there was no release In 1996, but the film versions and reels that were used in 1997 release, were ready in the end of 1996. And the Swedish website was a torrent website, the user was using English for communication. The original scan file has been created in May 22, 2012, and last modified in 2013. I do not wish to use any TN1 scans due to their scans having bad colour that would require me to spend another 5 years. And the films “always being 480p”… did you even read the responses? that was a mistake I made.

There’s a few different things here.

The colour grading in Star Wars and Empire in particular is all over the place on 35mm. That was part of the creative process GL chose to follow: audiences are more forgiving of inconsistent colourtiming in a blackened cinema. He made other decisions as well that resulted in lower-quality scenes technically but allowed more of the effects scenes: lower spec matte paintings, shooting scenes for optical composition on 35mm instead of 65mm and so-on. Secondly, different shots fade at different rates based on the density of the shot itself. This is why, for example, all the optical-wipes had to be re-done for the 1997 SE - because those scenes had faded to the point that it was impossible to restore them to be consistent with the before and after scenes.

The detail in an average SW print is about 1.5K - not 480p (0.7K).

I have noticed the 480p videos have more detail than there should be on a 480p video, so you are right. And yes, I totally agree with what you said before. I am not really satisfied with the 1997 colours but I made them accurate for the preservation.

Bobson Dugnutt said:

Director said:

Well, it seems you have more questions than I can answer inside a thread,

Why? Is there a character limit or something?

Director said:

I do not wish to use any TN1 scans due to their scans having bad colour that would require me to spend another 5 years.

Another 5 years? I thought you started working on this in “November 2023” as per your current original post.

Arguably, you are wasting your time by working with such a low quality source, being this mysterious scan done in 2012 that no one has ever heard of that looks more like the GOUT.

And yeah, look at those bad colours. Terrible, unusable. Definitely better to use some “unknown scan from 12 years ago in SD” (GOUT) rather than a fresh HD scan.

Well, technically yes and technically no. the fixing of the colour began already in 2019.

Bobson Dugnutt said:

Yeah I still don’t understand what this project is, nor what the goal is.

There was no wide release of the OT in 1996. The SE was 97.

No one is familiar with any 35mm scan of the SE OT being done in 2012. Certainly not from an anon user on “a Swedish site”. As far as I know, no 35mm SW scans were released until at least 2016 with the SSE.

If a scan was released on a swedish site, then wouldn’t it be from a swedish user, scanning a swedish print of the Stjärnornas Krig Trilogin? All the crawls and credits you show off are in English, not swedish.

You say it was discoloured so you “corrected to look like it was in 1997”, what’s your source on colour reference?

And why is this in 480p? You insist that “the films were 480p in 1997” but clearly a cinema print of a brand new $20 million restoration of the most successful films of all time would not be in standard definition.

Also, why do this in SD too? There are at least a dozen scans of the OT that have been done in the past few years. Why use a “35mm film print from 1996, scanned to digital in 2012” that is apparently only in 480p. Why not use 4K97_IV or any other high quality sources?

I get more questions than answers from this thread.

Well, it seems you have more questions than I can answer inside a thread, but yes, there was no release In 1996, but the film versions and reels that were used in 1997 release, were ready in the end of 1996. And the Swedish website was a torrent website, the user was using English for communication. The original scan file has been created in May 22, 2012, and last modified in 2013. I do not wish to use any TN1 scans due to their scans having bad colour that would require me to spend another 5 years. And the films “always being 480p”… did you even read the responses? that was a mistake I made.

bkev said:

Hi Director,

First off I thank you for your openness to learn. As That guy with no name said, people are rather passionate here – and, whether on purpose or not, to those unfamiliar with the tone here it can very much come off as snark.

Second, I appreciate you adding clarity on your sources. You’ll find that many of us will still be confused as none are familiar with a scan of the SE done in 2012. I am sure I am not the only one who would be curious to see some raw capture of that footage if you still have it handy, as the archivist in me (and ideally all of us) would love to learn more.

While I imagine being in 480p means this project is not for me, I’m always curious about the creative process behind restorations.

Thank you for your response. I might make a v2.0 this year or 2025. It will be done with a different scan but same colours and will be either 720p or 1080p.

That guy with no name said:

Director said:

That guy with no name said:

Director said:

SonnyGFunk said:

Director said:

stwd4nder2 said:

This thread feels like an elaborate troll…

Well I can close it if it leads to this kind of debates.

I’m sure no one wants this thread closed, we’re just curious as to which sources you have used and the reasoning for some of your workflow choices. You say you haven’t used any of the TN1 scans, in that case which 35mm scans have you used? Is it all 35mm based? As Adywan has noted the resolution of a 35mm release print is somewhere within the 720p-1080p range, so the decision to issue a 480p release is a bit confusing.

Ok, I understand. there was a long and heated debate about this at thestarwarstrilogy forums.

I really hope your not feeling to bad about all this. You just misunderstood things that’s all. We explained things to you, and to your credit your accepted it. It’s not a debate or an argument. It was just a mistake.

Keep on trying and you’ll get better.

Thank you for your kind words. I really did regret ever announcing this until I noticed that the people at thestarwarstrilogy.com are not trying to be mean and then I noticed your newest message. Your words convinced me to not close this thread.

No one’s trying to be mean. they may seem like that, but it’s just that there very passionate, as I’m sure you are.

Yes, I understood. I have added sources to the FAQ section of the main text.

That guy with no name said:

Director said:

SonnyGFunk said:

Director said:

stwd4nder2 said:

This thread feels like an elaborate troll…

Well I can close it if it leads to this kind of debates.

I’m sure no one wants this thread closed, we’re just curious as to which sources you have used and the reasoning for some of your workflow choices. You say you haven’t used any of the TN1 scans, in that case which 35mm scans have you used? Is it all 35mm based? As Adywan has noted the resolution of a 35mm release print is somewhere within the 720p-1080p range, so the decision to issue a 480p release is a bit confusing.

Ok, I understand. there was a long and heated debate about this at thestarwarstrilogy forums.

I really hope your not feeling to bad about all this. You just misunderstood things that’s all. We explained things to you, and to your credit your accepted it. It’s not a debate or an argument. It was just a mistake.

Keep on trying and you’ll get better.

Thank you for your kind words. I really did regret ever announcing this until I noticed that the people at thestarwarstrilogy.com are not trying to be mean and then I noticed your newest message. Your words convinced me to not close this thread.

SonnyGFunk said:

Director said:

stwd4nder2 said:

This thread feels like an elaborate troll…

Well I can close it if it leads to this kind of debates.

I’m sure no one wants this thread closed, we’re just curious as to which sources you have used and the reasoning for some of your workflow choices. You say you haven’t used any of the TN1 scans, in that case which 35mm scans have you used? Is it all 35mm based? As Adywan has noted the resolution of a 35mm release print is somewhere within the 720p-1080p range, so the decision to issue a 480p release is a bit confusing.

Ok, I understand. there was a long and heated debate about this at thestarwarstrilogy forums.

Then something in my research was wrong. thank you for starting this conversation.

CatBus said:

Director said:

LexX said:

CatBus said:

Don Porcino said:

Hi, does this project include Finnish subtitles on all the movies in the trilogy and if it does could i get them?

Yes it does! PM sent.

FWIW, the Finnish subtitles in Project Threepio were translated by one our own users, LexX. The official Finnish subtitles tend to be abbreviated/summarized, which loses some of the flavor of the original dialogue.

Indeed, and I have a new and improved, hopefully final version ready. I try to keep an eye out when the next update is coming and I can send those your way.

How fluent the Finnish subtitles are? Are they translated using a translator or?

LexX is a native Finnish speaker and a Star Wars fan… so the best combination.

Okay, that is good, I am Finnish so I wanted to know how good the subtitles are.

stwd4nder2 said:

This thread feels like an elaborate troll…

Well I can close it if it leads to this kind of debates.

adywan said:

Director said:

adywan said:

Director said:

doubleofive said:

I do not understand what is happening here. So you got full film scans (from the Team Negative One forums?), and then you color corrected them, then un-color corrected them, they compressed them to DVD resolution?

No? But maybe I explained it unclearly; so I got the scans years ago and NOT from TN1 forums. I did some remastering and cleaning, and then I used a foreign colour-match tool (not the one in this forum) to make the colours perfectly match the cinema versions. TheStarWarsTrilogy.com forum has a 4K97 but it is not the best in colour and the quality of the films were always 480p, I did nothing but transfer the films to an MP4 file as 480p.

Why do you keep insisting that the quality of the films were always 480p, when you have been told on numerous occasions that they were NOT?

The films were 480p in 1997, and I do not understand why have you not understood it? The films were released as 360p in home video releases, and the original videos from 1996 were 480p. And when I got the scans, they were 480p. If they are not 480p, what is it then? the films were 480p in 1997, and I have no intention of making a 720p, 1080p, 1440p or 4K version. I do not wish to argue, but this is getting me irritated.

The films projected at the theatres in 1997 were NOT 480p. Depending on where you saw it you were watching the equivalent of over 720p when viewing a 35mm film print. as these prints were newer than the originals, taken from the newer negative and with newer film stock , it’s closer to 1080p that it would be to 480p. Even back in 1977, with older projection and different film stocks , you would still be viewing something around 720p, if not higher. Just take a look at the scans of the films done by TeamNegtive1. They were taken from theatrical prints that would have been shown in cinemas. THAT is what you would have been seeing. You can’t honestly think that they are really only 480p worth of detail in there.

Well, it does not matter what they are presented on, but let’s avoid arguments and/or debates in the future.

adywan said:

Director said:

doubleofive said:

I do not understand what is happening here. So you got full film scans (from the Team Negative One forums?), and then you color corrected them, then un-color corrected them, they compressed them to DVD resolution?

No? But maybe I explained it unclearly; so I got the scans years ago and NOT from TN1 forums. I did some remastering and cleaning, and then I used a foreign colour-match tool (not the one in this forum) to make the colours perfectly match the cinema versions. TheStarWarsTrilogy.com forum has a 4K97 but it is not the best in colour and the quality of the films were always 480p, I did nothing but transfer the films to an MP4 file as 480p.

Why do you keep insisting that the quality of the films were always 480p, when you have been told on numerous occasions that they were NOT?

The films were 480p in 1997, and I do not understand why have you not understood it? The films were released as 360p in home video releases, and the original videos from 1996 were 480p. And when I got the scans, they were 480p. If they are not 480p, what is it then? the films were 480p in 1997, and I have no intention of making a 720p, 1080p, 1440p or 4K version. I do not wish to argue, but this is getting me irritated.

LexX said:

CatBus said:

Don Porcino said:

Hi, does this project include Finnish subtitles on all the movies in the trilogy and if it does could i get them?

Yes it does! PM sent.

FWIW, the Finnish subtitles in Project Threepio were translated by one our own users, LexX. The official Finnish subtitles tend to be abbreviated/summarized, which loses some of the flavor of the original dialogue.

Indeed, and I have a new and improved, hopefully final version ready. I try to keep an eye out when the next update is coming and I can send those your way.

How fluent the Finnish subtitles are? Are they translated using a translator or?

doubleofive said:

I do not understand what is happening here. So you got full film scans (from the Team Negative One forums?), and then you color corrected them, then un-color corrected them, they compressed them to DVD resolution?

No? But maybe I explained it unclearly; so I got the scans years ago and NOT from TN1 forums. I did some remastering and cleaning, and then I used a foreign colour-match tool (not the one in this forum) to make the colours perfectly match the cinema versions. TheStarWarsTrilogy.com forum has a 4K97 but it is not the best in colour and the quality of the films were always 480p, I did nothing but transfer the films to an MP4 file as 480p.

Caston said:

ArcherEdits said:

The '97SE vhs tapes are the Star Wars OT I grew up on, but I’ve rally struggled finding a good quality version of them since, really bums me out 😕

Check the 1997 Special Edition OT Preservation Projects category of the An Index Of Projects & Help Thread for Star Wars Preservations thread for all the 1997SE projects, including some HD projects that have been released.

Most of the preservations have yellowish colour, especially during A New Hope cantina scenes.

Knightmessenger said:

Why was the Lowry “restoration” even necessary. I mean wouldn’t most people have been pretty happy with the quality of an anamorphic transfer from the 1997 prints?

Remember, most of the Empire of Dreams footage is from the 1997 version in anamorphic widescreen and I think that looks pretty good. Why did they need to spend all that money on a restoration that just screwed up the video and audio presentation? So they could claim “digitally remastered” on the box?

What the hell? Why does every movie have to be “Digitally restored” or whatever? I mean what if the film already looks pretty good? Do studios think people won’t buy something unless they spend money on restoring it anyways?

Most people would have been amazed at the improved quality simply by it being on dvd. After all, not many people have even heard of laserdisc, fewer had the movies on that format so their previous reference would have been the vhs tapes. Seriously, how could a dvd not be light years ahead of fricken vhs?

If I had seen the 2006 original version dvds back in 2004, I would have thought they were amazing. Because I didn’t know anything about video technology then and I always had the impression of the Star Wars movies looking very bad on tape. Just seeing a video master without the blurriness added by vhs would have looked stunning to me. But by 2006, I knew what laserdisc was, knew what anamorphic widescreen meant and my family purchased a widescreen television.

Totally agreed!

for anyone who wants the special editions right now as they were in cinemas in 1997, I have made a preservation about this.

screams in the void said:

Director said:

“The special editions were not that bad, but people insult them because after the release of the VHS/LaserDisc/DVD of the 1997 Special Edition”

Well ,the 97 Special Edition was never released on DVD , but even further changes were made to the movies in 2004 for the DVD debut of the OT , and then again in 2011 for the blu ray , and again in 2019 for D+

" people realised the original versions will never be re-released again."…you got that right , its the reason this here site exists .

and the 2006 DVDs were a slap in the face

The Special editon was released on DVD, but not many have the DVDs of them.

What will be the audio mix of this preservation?

v2.0 is unlike to ever be released, just for note.

DVD-BOY said:

I was hoping you would speak about the sources you used, and how you created the project, but your previous response said it was too long to mention.

Well done for getting this project over the finishing line and released, because a lot of projects are announced but fail to materialize for one reason or another.

Thank you, this was not easy, and since either the 1997 projects are not finished and will never be, or the announcer is inactive, I spent a lot of money to actually get this done.

DVD-BOY said:

So what resolution are the mp4 files?

Was there anything else you wanted to ask?