Cthulhunicron

thedaner said:

Heh, this is what Wikipedia considers the plot hole in Empire:

• In Empire Strikes Back, it is stated that armor on an AT-AT Walker is "too strong for blasters". A short time later, however, a walker is shot in the neck with a blaster and is immediately destroyed.

There's a silly YouTube video floating around called "The Biggest Plot Hole Ever" and it's of precisely that.

How could he have known that Anakin would be sent to rescue him? 

And even if the EU does explain it, that doesn't excuse the fact that the movie leaves it so unclear.

If Grievous knew that Palpatine witnessed Dooku's death, that doesn't necessarily mean that he knew Palpatine ordered it. One of his droids could have walked up to him and said "Sir, the Jedis killed Dooku and freed the Chancellor." If Grievous knows Dooku is dead, and he knows that Palpatine and Sidious are the same person, and he knows that Palpatine was in the room when Dooku was killed, then it makes sense why he says "But...the loss of Count Dooku!" instead of "Sir, I have bad news. Count Dooku was killed."

However, if he didn't know, then did Palpatine order his own capture? Seems like Grievous was taking all his orders from Sidious and Dooku. Even if Sidious didn't order his own capture, and Grievous came up with the idea on his own, it seems like he'd still run the idea by his superiors. If I were Palpatine and Grievous said to me, "Hey I'm thinking of capturing the chancellor," I might try to steer him in another direction.  Or at the very least, make it difficult for one of the armies I'm controlling to capture me.  If you're going to play both sides of a military conflict, and your subordinates on one side don't realize you're also the leader of the opposing force, it's probably a bad idea to let them capture you, since they might think killing the enemy leader would win them the war. 

In any event, it's pretty clear to me that Lucas didn't think about any of this when he was writing the script, and ultimately it's ambiguous what Grievous actually knew.

Sounds awesome to me. You know what they say..."the day we stop believing in democracy is the day we lose it." ;)

I think he was more than a flunky. He did order the separatist leaders to Mustafar, so it seemed like with Dooku dead, he was directly below Sidious in the chain of command.

I’ve seen Harmy’s despecialized editions and they are freaking amazing. I was just wondering if there are any fan edits of Star Wars out there that still contain some of the more innocuous changes from the SE, but do not have any unique alterations of their own, such as rearranged scenes, brand new effects, audio, music edits, etc.

Just to get an idea of what I’m talking about, here’s a list of some of the changes I’d be okay with being left in:

The SE aliens added to the Cantina scene.

The perspective change to the prison hallway.

Extra Stormtroopers and the TIE fighter when Han rounds that corner in the Death Star.

Luke and Biggs reunion scene.

CGI fighters taking off from the rebel base.

Y-Wings don’t disappear before completely leaving the frame.

I’m not asking anyone to whip up a fan edit based on my recommendations, just wondering if something similar exists.

The only way I can get this to make sense in my head is if Grievous sent him a quick communication in the escape pod, briefly summarizing what just happened, and the scene where he's talking to Sidious's hologram is their follow-up conversation.  If that scene is literally supposed to be the first time he's contacted Sidious since his ship was destroyed, then it seems to suggest that he knew all along, which makes the whole abduction seem pretty pointless.

I can just picture Grievous capturing Palpatine and Palpatine's whispering at him, "It's me, you nitwit! I'm working both sides!"

I think this is probably one of the most poorly written parts of the whole PT.

I've always been puzzled by this as the movie doesn't make it very clear. Grievous seems to be pretty close to Dooku in terms of power and influence over the separatist army, plus he's undergone some Sith training, so it seems somewhat likely that he was in on the secret. Dooku definitely knows, since he was Palpatine's apprentice, and we've seen them on screen together meeting face to face. (One could argue that Nute Gunray should have put 2 and 2 together, but since his only interactions with Sidious were through a low-quality holographic image, I'll let that slide). Furthermore, immediately after escaping from the Jedi, Grievous contacts Sidious and says "But the loss of Count Dooku!" which could imply that he thinks Sidious knows that Dooku has been killed, indicating that he knows Sidious had been in the room when it happened.

However, if he does know, then I really don't understand why he would capture him. Was it all a ruse to lure Anakin to his ship, so he and the two Sith lords could try to tempt and corrupt him? How could they know that Anakin and Obi-Wan would be sent to rescue Palpatine? How did they know they wouldn't be killed before they even got to the ship? Maybe Palpatine predicted that would happen, kinda like he predicted that Luke would confront Vader on Endor? I can't think of a real good reason why they would fake a capture, so I'm kinda leaning towards Grievous didn't know and just happened to kidnap his own boss without realizing it....which still kind of strikes me as pretty bad writing. 

Thanks.

I remember back when Attack of the Clones first came out, my friend was telling me that he read somewhere that Lucas's original idea for the clone wars involved some enemy infiltrating the Jedi order with clones. Can anyone confirm or debunk this? I've checked Wookieepedia and this forum, and I can't find any reference to this concept anywhere.