CatBus

This is the real deal, kids! Thanks, Harmy!

First priority is fixing the problems in ROTJ 3.0, with 3.1. Should be very soon.

In anticipation of the official ROTJ DeEd 3.1 4K release, I created some UHD artwork (DVD versions also available).

UHD (4K) Blu-ray: https://drive.google.com/file/d/130M9JMoRdT6oYjM3Dvm22sNgpkifrJuK/view?usp=drive_link
HD (1080p) Blu-ray: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1glb8XnVxqJstm_FOE11EsGmeCgS6HBQ4/view?usp=sharing
DVD: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rcddg4WCtAqhiOhyaLPqw_1UCww4d050/view?usp=sharing

The only difference between 4K and 1080p cover art is the logos (Blu-ray vs Ultra HD Blu-ray). The DVD cover art is very similar, but some changes were necessary due to the different case proportions.

They’re designed to be in the style of the 1990 VHS releases (Star Wars, Empire, and Jedi), but there are a few places where I modernized things a bit. These owe a lot to the work of ChainsawAsh and EyeShotFirst. There’s nothing preservation-specific about these covers, so they’d work just as well for Despecialized, 4Kxx, D+xx, or anything else you like.

Disc art is also included, in a matching style (including distinct designs for the 1981 version of Star Wars and the 70mm version of Empire).

There are also “alternate artwork” versions, which more faithfully reproduce the artwork on the home video releases:

Disc art is also included, in a matching style (including distinct designs for the 1981 version of Star Wars and the 70mm version of Empire; bottom row is alternate artwork):

dusenet said:

Hi there,

Please can I get the 15.0 link?

also, does ROTJ-eng-alien-35mm.srt exist?

PM sent. ROTJ-eng-alien-35mm.srt does not exist. The point of alien-35mm SRT files in this project is to generate realistic-looking reconstructed alien PGS subtitles with the same appearance as the original 35mm subtitles, using look-alike fonts. For some languages, that’s currently the closest we can get. But for English and a couple other lucky languages, there’s no need to muck around with look-alike fonts, we can just use the images lifted directly from a 35mm print scan. So for those languages, there are PGS subtitles that look like the 35mm subtitles because they’re taken directly from a 35mm scan, not generated from text. There’s no SRT file because that step in the process wasn’t necessary.

PM sent.

PM sent.

Thanks Harmy! We’re waiting (somewhat) patiently!

I suspect none of the above. If you can’t count on the native subtitle format to be frame-accurate, I would not trust another format that has to be converted into that native format to be frame-accurate either. So I’d just make sure they never show up early (which IMO is worse than late), and call it good enough.

LexX said:

I’m doing a complete overhaul for my subs so stay tuned… 😃
But I found a weird problem. It seems that sub tracks have different timing when used in mpv vs. MPC. I can’t play SW 4K smoothly on MPC so I’ve always had to use mpv, also when re-adjusting the timings. There seems to be 2 frame difference between the players. That’s pretty weird, does anyone know the reason?

I know PGS subtitles can be off by a frame from what you intend because the internal timecodes use 24.000fps, even for 23.976 subtitles, and rounding issues can potentially send a subtitle to one frame or another. Presumably since PGS is more like the native subtitle format and even it has issues, text-based subtitles could potentially have even more due to the extra conversion. And, of course, there are just plain errors. For most people, if the subtitle is off by two frames, nobody would even report the bug, let alone fix it.

4K77 currently includes at least one frame from the Blu-rays.

Enjoy your stay.

PM sent.

He’s there. I’ve linked to his Japanese ROTJ audio thread from my International Audio thread if you can’t find it.

Many forum-spanners like me post more info here when we feel it would be useful to be seen by more people (publicly searchable).

Honestly I’d recommend the 1080p route for now at least. The 4K files are huge and require significant decoding horsepower, and people regularly report playback issues in less-then-ideal circumstances. You could try looking for smaller or less demanding 4K encodes if you like (or make your own), but really 1080p is just the fastest and cheapest way to your destination IMO.

Edomex Sound said:

What I have noticed about the Laserdisc audio in many films is that the sound is very in-depth and robust.

Which Original Trilogy preservation do you recommend?

Depends on what you want. If you want the experience of watching the movies in a theater, go for the 4Kxx projects. If you want to see what a respectful Blu-ray release would have looked like, Despecialized is your best bet IMO. I lean toward the latter. Star Wars is sadly in the roughest shape of the trilogy for both projects.

So, “matrixed stereo” is a stereo mix encoded in a special fashion where, if you pass it through a proper Dolby ProLogic decoder, you can get four-channel audio. The Laserdisc audio can be decoded in this way to get true multichannel. The six-channel reconstructions are based on this four-channel decode of Laserdisc audio, and for the past several releases has used a proper professional-grade decoder for that work. We also have in-theater recordings of the six-channel mix, which aren’t an audio source per se, but allow us to know which slight variations of sound effects happened, and when. The LFE is a bit of a best-guess, using some SE when it aligns with theatrical effects.

This work is all based on the theory that the six-channel and stereo mixes were based on the same four-track master audio, which has at this point been proven enough through various audio discoveries to be considered fact. There’s a lot of archaeology in this as well…

Keep in mind that, at the time, only the Star Wars six-channel mix even attempts to match any unique 70mm six-channel content. That may change, but right now Empire and Jedi are more like “tasteful and respectful upmixes” than 70mm mixes – although they may end up being extremely similar to their respective 70mm mixes, due to the shared lineage of the four-channel master.

ProLogic decoding can’t get you literally back to the discrete six-channels on a 70mm print. For one thing, there’s still a bit of channel bleedover that would not be present on a 70mm print, the other is of course the missing two LFE channels*. But these things were done with love. It’s not at all like those Blu-ray mono-to-5.1 upmixes which kill the soul of the original audio. It can be done well, and in this case, it’s been done in an exemplary fashion.

* The original 70mm six-channel audio was 4.2, not 5.1. It was L, C, R, and a single surround, plus two LFE channels. So a four-channel ProLogic decode gives you everything except the LFE. Since 5.1 is far more compatible with modern playback systems, that’s how it’s encoded for these preservations.

Edomex Sound said:

What are the best audio versions for the Prequels and Original Trilogy?

Audio is typically restored as a different project, and then included with restorations that are designed to sync to it. The only difference is scan-based projects which will usually include optical audio directly from the film print.

“Best audio” could be its own thread, and there are tons of opinions. First of all, some people swear by the optical audio because it sounds more like what you’d have heard in the theater back in the day.

However, Laserdisc-based preservations provide more of a clean, high-end home-video sound. Laserdisc-based audio is available for the original stereo mixes and 1993 revised “THX” mixes, and the 1985 home video mix for Star Wars. The mono audio is typically from either broadcast recordings or film scans. There will likely soon be at least one original six-channel mix available from a print scan too.

But what I feel stands above the rest is hairy_hen’s six-channel reconstructions, which are based on the matrixed stereo mixes, and a ton of TLC.

Which mix is “best” is a matter of taste and priorities, but I feel I can safely say:

• For Star Wars, people gravitate to the six-channel or mono mixes. The 1977 stereo is so close to the six-channel as to be a “why bother?” option – you may as well downmix the six-channel. The 1985 stereo mix has no dynamic range to speak of, but is a valid mix if you’re trying to reproduce that home video feel. And the 1993 stereo mix is generally great quality, but includes divisive additions.
• For Empire, the six-channel is much-loved. The 1980 stereo mix is solid, and as with Star Wars, the 1993 stereo mix is generally great quality with one small error. The 1980 mono mix is more of a novelty but it includes alternate dialogue, so it’s fun.
• For Jedi, again I recommend the six-channel. The 1983 and 1993 stereo mixes are both very good, 93 with better quality and no divisive changes or errors. The mono mix is definitely a novelty with missing foley effects.

Hope that helps. Generally speaking, the most recent preservations will have the most recent versions of the six-channel audio. The others have not changed much in years, as the best-of-breed Laserdiscs were found and ripped years ago.

Be careful mix-and-matching audio. There are two frame standards currently in use (GOUT and theatrical), but they’re close enough that you might not notice slight sync differences until years later.

I have no opinions on prequel audio.

If it helps, there are already at least two projects that do exactly that or something very similar: Despecialized and D+77/D+80/OTD83. The main project files are large, since they try to keep their encoding quality similar to an actual Blu-ray disc (~20GB+ seems about right for this). But there are also official AVCHD versions for burning to DVD9s, which are necessarily under 9GB, and even DVD5 downscales for those who don’t need HD. I also know that there are a ton of unofficial re-encodes of Despecialized that sacrifice a little visual quality for a lot of space savings, often putting the whole trilogy at under 10GB. If you’re looking for torrents, you’re actually more likely to run across one of these unofficial re-encodes than the official version, since there seems to be a similar bias in favor of small file sizes in that community.

PM sent, and thanks! That change has been made and will be in the next release (which likely won’t be for a while).

Thrashlark said:

Speaking of said corruption, I’m guessing the name of the project comes from 3PO being said out loud, as well?

If you check the English credits for Star Wars, R2-D2 is actually spelled out as “Artoo-Detoo (R2-D2)”, and C-3PO is “See Threepio (C3PO)”. At least to me, Artoo and Threepio still work fine as nicknames, but spelling out their full two-word names like that is pretty awkward.

But yes, the project is named after C-3PO, because he was also known to be fluent in a few languages.

Thrashlark said:

Hey, Catbus, I was interested to get a download for the Spaniard and Castilian Spanish subtitles of the OT, if possible. I’ve always been curious to know what differences were made by each region for Star Wars, Empire and Return. Thanks in advance!

PM sent, but keep in mind: Project Threepio’s subtitles are not necessarily the same as any official translations (subtitled or dubbed) for any language. They often start out the same as the official translations, but users contribute improved translations to Project Threepio all the time. The goal is that they eventually become the best modern translations of the spoken English dialogue, rather than something with quirks from the time and place they were first translated.

All of this is especially true for Spanish. We have had some active Spanish contributors over the years.

PM sent.

PM sent.

Grindhouse doesn’t attempt to do the cleanup and stabilization that would be done to more involved restorations. The color correction is usually pretty basic. Missing frames are common, although this one is fully GOUT-synced. Basically, watching it is like watching the film at the end of its run in a cheap second-run theatre. A bit banged up, but watchable. It’s an informal term for this sort of preservation, not an official term.

LPP just says what sort of 35mm filmstock it was (Lowfade Positive Print), because especially when you’re dealing with old faded prints, that is sometimes relevant (low-fade doesn’t mean no-fade, especially after decades of non-ideal storage conditions). Some filmstock fades differently or worse than other filmstock. This could be relevant if you’re trying to fill in missing frames using another film scan – mixing filmstocks could give you different color or grain characteristics.

Project files have been updated to version 15.0 (codename: “Rohini”), and the first post has been updated. Please PM me for temporary download links until the files/ are available at some more permanent locations.

Rough summary of changes from 14.0 to 15.0:

• Added new machine-translated languages: Hindi, Urdu, Swahili, Uzbek, Azerbaijani, Albanian, and Georgian, including titles-only subtitles to accompany dubs and voiceovers, wherever applicable
• The synchronization script supports more targets: 35mm Guerre Stellari Italian Preview, ESB 35mm German Print Grindhouse, ESB Super-8 Scope, ESB Fuji 2 Preview, and the ESB and ROTJ 70mm grindhouse releases (thanks to hot noodles). Popular print scans that don’t require any special synchronization are now mentioned by name in the compatibility guide.
• The synchronization script now supports changing PGS subtitles from one aspect ratio to another (repositioning within the frame). When synchronizing to pre-defined targets, this conversion is automatic.
• For preservations available both with and without a brief intro clip, the synchronization script now targets the version without the intro clip, and the sync offset for the version with the intro clip is included in readme.html
• Added Tajik titles-only subtitles (machine-translated), to accompany Persian dubs
• Improved Dutch subtitles for ESB (thanks to frater)

PM sent!