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CatBus

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Join date
18-Aug-2011
Last activity
30-Jun-2025
Posts
5,996

Post History

Post
#1317383
Topic
So my son is 6 years old, and is all about starwars.
Time

Advantages of DeEd over 4K77: cleaner Blu-ray like feel, more Blu-ray like contrast (less crush), more theatrically accurate colors, more fine detail (the 720p/4K labels are a bit of a red herring in this regard). I get that DeEd has issues – the seams do show from time to time – and 4K77 is Harmy’s favorite for that very reason, but DeEd still has some clear advantages.

The advantage in fine detail alone is worth it for viewing on bigger screens IMO. A projection print scanned at 4K resolution simply has less detail in this case than a negative scan at 720p, even if that’s how it was in the theatre.

Post
#1317268
Topic
So my son is 6 years old, and is all about starwars.
Time

I’d say at the moment Despecialized for all three, but more or less the same points as above. Fan restorations are definitely in a good enough state to swap for the official cuts without any worries. Even Star Wars, which is the roughest of both the 4Kxx and Despecialized series, is still more than good enough for a first-time viewing (although I’d give the nod to Despecialized if they’re accustomed to that pristine Blu-ray look).

Depending on how much time you feel you have, you can download and compare to decide what you’d prefer to do. I personally would not choose the Disney+ version, but that’s just me.

Many of us, including myself, are parents who have gone through something similar. In fact, I came to this site at more or less the exact same point in my new parenthood, looking for a way to make an anamorphic DVD version of those bonus disc releases of Star Wars, back when that was a thing people did. The situation has improved a bit since, thankfully.

Post
#1316892
Topic
Special Edition Changes that SHOULD have been made/should be made in the future
Time

As long as we’re starting from the base assumption of being stuck with the SE, we may as well make the existing SE more tonally consistent.

Star Wars

  • In the cantina, there should be an extended music video that pauses the story for a few minutes, breaks the fourth wall, and is generally incongruous with the rest of the cantina. You should be able to see at least one of the cantina musicians’ uvulas as they scream at the camera.
  • After Obi-Wan dies and his ghost voice speaks to Luke, it should be Ewan McGregor’s voice.
  • At the end of the awards ceremony, Jar Jar should yell “Weesa free! …At least weesa thinks so!”

Empire Strikes Back

  • The Wampa should blink creepily.
  • When the snowspeeders blow up the fallen imperial walker, there should be a praxis effect ring.
  • In Cloud City, Vader should yell “Maclunkey!” and shoot at Han before Han shoots at him.
  • Cloud City should have comic dinosaur antics in the hallways as Lando shows the crew around.

Return of the Jedi

  • Luke Skywalker’s hologram should carefully explain to Jabba that Han is his prisoner, to which Jabba responds: “How is this possible?” Luke’s hologram calmly responds that if Jabba checks his favorite decoration, he’ll know it to be true.
  • When Boba Fett falls into the Sarlacc, the Emperor should scream. The Sarlacc’s burp should also be the Ian McDiarmid’s burp.
  • The Sarlacc should yell “Maclunkey!” and shoot at Han before Han shoots at it.
Post
#1316398
Topic
How to download projects from here?
Time

There are no links on this forum, generally speaking. Usually consulting the first post in the project thread for downloading instructions, or doing google searches for project keywords will get you what you want. If that doesn’t work, you can post a message asking for help in the project discussion thread. As a last resort, you can PM the project author(s), but some projects are more receptive to that that others.

This site is really just project discussions, not project distribution.

Post
#1316182
Topic
Star Wars vs. A New Hope - Which do you say and why?
Time

It was a slow transition IIRC. The original boxes used big names and little names (giant and small font). Originally, they were either STAR WARS or STAR WARS/A New Hope, Star Wars/THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK, and Star Wars/RETURN OF THE JEDI. Then around the time of the faces set, they switched to Star Wars/A NEW HOPE, Star Wars/THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK, and Star Wars/RETURN OF THE JEDI. I don’t think they ever called it A New Hope without also including Star Wars.

It’s hard to say whether this was because they wanted to include the series title on all films (which makes sense), or because they didn’t want to confuse fans who wouldn’t know what “A New Hope” was and were just looking for “Star Wars” (which also makes sense).

And episode numbers. Hell, I stopped paying attention to packaging long before they started putting episode numbers prominently on them. I imagine they’d start doing that to improve the relevance of the prequels.

Cthulhunicron said:

Man, I remember being 8 years old in 1993, watching Star Wars on VHS. It always confused the hell out of me that the first movie was called Episode IV in the title crawl. Lucas is a madman.

When watching Empire in the theatre in 1980, audiences were shocked that it jumped to Episode V, leaving kids like me to wonder what might have happened in the three episodes they skipped between Star Wars and Empire.

Post
#1315907
Topic
Alien subtitle fonts
Time

Streaming services generally use text fonts that are rendered on the client (using the system or user-specified font). Blu-rays use graphical fonts that could technically be any image at all, but are usually just pre-rendered text with a specified font, size and position. Technically they could use burnt-in subtitles if they wanted it to look consistent between streaming and disc versions, but that would cause problems with international releases.

So I imagine the Blu-rays will revert to the Franklin Gothic appearance.

Post
#1315744
Topic
Info Wanted: Which version of the Original Trilogy preservations to watch?
Time

Regarding color correction, if you’re interested in the topic, you should check DrDre’s threads and color correction theory and methods very carefully. I was skeptical at first but have been convinced. Color fade can be modeled and reversed mathematically, and can be done for the most part without using any judgment calls, as long as you can find good candidate frames in the shot. Because of this, when anyone uses DrDre’s tools to color-correct faded images, they get very close to what can be called the original colors with a good deal of certainty. So when DrDre does his correction, it’s 95% math, 5% finesse on top of that. How do we know those are the theatrical colors? Because that’s what the math says they are – if they’re not, the only explanations are that either color theory is wrong, DrDre’s code fails to correctly model color theory, or you’re using the tools wrong – because seriously, it’s just math. While white balancing against the soundtrack is a clever idea, it doesn’t account for fade with nearly the same level of accuracy as DrDre’s tools (in short, because color correction is more than just white balance), and doesn’t deliver good results.

When you look at DrDre’s color corrections for Star Wars, Empire, and Jedi, it’s very easy to see that Despecialized is currently a closer match than 4Kxx for all films. I say “currently” because, as people have said, 4Kxx is always getting new color corrections (and DrDre himself is working on some of them), and will certainly one day surpass Despecialized in terms of theatrically-accurate color.

So with one caveat, we can, in fact, know what the theatrical colors were, with a good deal of certainty. And in fact we already do know, for the most part. The caveat is that different filmstocks may have different color characteristics – for example, the Technicolor prints have a yellowish tone not present in other prints, etc. But these were slight color differences compared with the huge variance we currently see among fan preservations. Because the colors of some of the fan preservations are, to be blunt, way outside the range of what could ever have possibly been correct (specifically, they have some of the same overly-magenta cast that has plagued Star Wars home video releases since the THX releases, which is probably because the color correctors were trying to make it look like their old VHS tapes, and succeeded).

For example, want to see what the theatrically accurate colors for Jedi were? Easy. You’d be correct if you noticed it doesn’t look anything like any existing 4K83 release. Empire? Here. Star Wars started off as matching someone’s manual regrade, but I think has matured into using the color correction model more exclusively, which is why I’m linking to latter posts in that thread.

Post
#1315509
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

ray_afraid said:

CatBus said:

Stotchy said:

CatBus said:

three of which I can handle like my existing official Blu-rays: glue them all together, put a string through the middle, and suspend them inside one of the cavities in the walls of my house, so nobody accidentally watches them or stumbles across them and thinks that I like those films enough to buy them

This is really funny.

That is seriously what I did with the 2011SE’s. You glue the shiny sides together so it’s really clear what’s on the disks. Star Wars and Empire on the sides, Jedi in the middle, a little offcenter so that you can see some of its cover too. They’re currently hanging inside the wall cavity of my youngest child’s bedroom closet.

Love it.
But be careful… Some may not think that’s valid.
I got heavily berated for announcing that I only own the paper receipt from my purchase of the BD boxset. “THAT’S NOT GOOD ENOUGH! HE SHOULD BE BANNED!” even though it proves, irrevocably, that I paid my hard earned cash for the set (you can even trace it to my bank account). Simply possessing the set says nothing. Ya coulda’ stole it, bought it second hand, ect.

Thanks for the idea – I’ll glue the receipt to the discs.

Post
#1315483
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

Stotchy said:

CatBus said:

three of which I can handle like my existing official Blu-rays: glue them all together, put a string through the middle, and suspend them inside one of the cavities in the walls of my house, so nobody accidentally watches them or stumbles across them and thinks that I like those films enough to buy them

This is really funny.

That is seriously what I did with the 2011SE’s. You glue the shiny sides together so it’s really clear what’s on the disks. Star Wars and Empire on the sides, Jedi in the middle, a little offcenter so that you can see some of its cover too. They’re currently hanging inside the wall cavity of my youngest child’s bedroom closet.

Post
#1315466
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

Broom Kid said:

that’s all well and good but the thing you want is so worthless to me I wouldn’t just destroy it, I’d turn it into something so unusable I’d put it INSIDE the walls of my home so I wouldn’t have to pretend I even own it unless the Fan Edit police come and investigate me.

That’s a pretty fair summary, actually.

It’s hard to believe there’s no implication there of subtly suggesting or demonstrating that accepting any conditions by which this set might have value is being frowned upon.

To illustrate my point, replace the various iterations of Star Wars with ice cream flavors. I think Strawberry sucks and I’d never buy it, and if someone gave it to me for free I still wouldn’t eat it and would just throw it away, and if any somehow got on my tongue I’d have to wash my mouth out. And yet in spite of that, I’d have no ill opinion of you at all if Strawberry happens to be your most favoritist flavor ever.

Because people have wildly different preferences on things, and that’s all fine.

Post
#1315442
Topic
4K restoration on Star Wars
Time

Broom Kid said:

I would like to own the official product. An official version (possibly taken from new elements, even) of the full scores to ALL the Star Wars movies in that set, synced to picture. That doesn’t exist yet. It’s never existed, in fact. if this set has it, I’m going to buy it. I don’t know why this has become such a point of contention.

After re-reading the last page of this thread, I’m just not seeing any contention. I just see people who want different things, and are making different choices based on what they want. You want the isolated scores and don’t mind the 4KSE versions of them. Other people don’t see any value in the 4KSE versions of the score (or any of the other films). Everyone here’s a rational actor making purchasing decisions based in their personal preferences. The expression of a different preference is not an implication that your preference is wrong for you.

As for me (and probably like many here), I have interest in only three films: the unaltered original trilogy. I would absolutely buy a grossly overpriced boxed set containing nine films that I have no intention of ever watching in order to get those three films. But those three films are nowhere to be found in the set that’s been announced.

At the moment, that means no sale, because there’s zero value (to me) in that set. If, however, a good-quality fan reconstruction of the films I actually want arrives that is based on those 4KSE’s, according to the rules of fan edit ownership here, I will buy them. And if this set is the only way to get them, then that’s 27 really expensive coasters heading my way, 24 of which I suppose I can immediately throw away, and three of which I can handle like my existing official Blu-rays: glue them all together, put a string through the middle, and suspend them inside one of the cavities in the walls of my house, so nobody accidentally watches them or stumbles across them and thinks that I like those films enough to buy them, but good enough to fish out if someone ever questions my legitimate ownership requirement for the fan reconstruction.

Post
#1315424
Topic
Info Wanted: Which version of the Original Trilogy preservations to watch?
Time

Vladimon said:

A very helpful thread for forum newcomers such as myself who have found it difficult to know is what in the sea of all these different cuts, versions, preservation projects.
I will add that while the 4K project versions are the most accurate to the originals currently out there, they all have crushed blacks when compared with the blu-rays or Harmy’s Editions. Correct me if I am wrong on this, but that is what I have seen in all the versions so far. So, just consider that u will be losing quite some detail in the dark areas/scenes in the 4K versions. Still, very nice to watch, I love the grain too.

It is not your imagination. That’s a normal by-product of the optical duplication process – each generation of duplication (negative -> … -> interpositive -> … -> projection print) reduces fine detail, adds grain, and boosts contrast. That’s just how it works. By the time you get to a projection print, there are multiple layers of grain, a substantial loss in detail, and you get clipped whites/blacks. But that’s the “theatrical look” – it’s what film actually looks like projected in a theatre. So if that’s what you want, then 4K77 and 4K83 have you covered. But in these days of Blu-rays and digital projection, people often have a preference for that less-contrasty, more detailed look.

Since the Blu-rays (and thus Despecialized) are based on elements further up the duplication chain, they have more fine detail, less grain (even without taking into account DNR), and less severe contrast/less crushed blacks. You will see some clipped reds in Despecialized that aren’t clipped in 4Kxx, however, because of some of the color boosting on the Blu-rays. That would presumably be taken care of using the 4KSE, which seems to be much better in terms of color.

That said, 4K83 loses surprisingly little due to clipping, and looks much better IMO than 4K77. Honestly my biggest complaint about 4K83 right now is the color – it’s a shame that something based on the Blu-rays has far more theatrically accurate colors than an actual film scan – but DrDre is well on his way to fixing that problem, and then after that it will be a close match indeed.

Post
#1315203
Topic
Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)
Time

I’ll send you a link to the current version – the Latin American subs have gotten several revisions over the years, so the latest version is very different from what is included with Despecialized, for example. If you have changes to the latest version, you can just PM me with new translations for specific lines or links to updated files.

I wouldn’t try making revisions to the copies you have unless they’re current.