I hope they don’t do anything too experimental with the scores of these films. I could handle them not having the main theme but I would prefer them to remain symphonic orchestral scores.
At the risk of contributing something to this thread, I’ll mention that I didn’t like Han shooting the bowcaster three times. The first time made sense (Chewie was injured) and Han’s reaction was funny. The second time didn’t make a ton of sense (although you could argue he was able to do more damage that way) and the reaction joke fell flat because it was basically the same joke as the first time. And the third time was completely nonsensical - why wouldn’t Chewie shoot the stormtrooper, or why wouldn’t Han use his blaster?
The point of the scene is to explain how Rylo Ken didn’t just squish Finn and Rey. The Bowcaster is billed as being really powerful and then Chewie shoots Ken loads of times so he has a strong handicap during the much moaned about final confrontation between them.
I liked that duel a lot. It also made the crossbars on his saber make sense when Ken twisted them into Finn’s arm.
As much as I loved the movie, one thing felt odd.
The music isn’t that memorable, maybe it’s because I’ve only seen the film once so far but eh. I can remember Rey’s theme and that’s it, even the prequels soundtrack was more memorable and I find myself humming it once in a while.
I’m not saying the music was bad, but it isn’t memorable to me. I may end up loving and remembering it when I see it again and when I buy the soundtrack.
^I said this already 😄
Ah, I didn’t see it and I’m new to posting here 😛
Welcome…!
I was attempting and failing to express solidarity. More than one person can hold the same opinion on here. It’s all good. And yes Welcome…!
Not to the extent that Poltergeist is lift from Jaws
I’ll fully admit I have not seen Poltergeist in a really long time and I have never been able to sit through Jaws (here we go…), but I’ve never heard that before.
If you get a break I’d recommend both. They are both good films and worth a watch the plot similarities aren’t as annoying as the two films aren’t meant to exist in the same universe and they aren’t as extreme as the situation here. I’m surprised you haven’t made it through Jaws.
You could chuck in CE3K into the trilogy and that would almost have been of relevance as Poltergeist and Gremlins both came from the aborted sequel to CE3K which also became ET.
Lord Haseo said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sq51w34Hg9I@ 1:45
This argument need not go further
They ran around it like it was nothing when they were going toward Ben. Once Luke yells, it’s suddenly become a gigantic chasm and somehow they can’t seem to find a way around it
When they went around it the Stormies were distracted by Vader and the old guy in a dressing gown having a glow stick dance party (opps that was Episode 3).
With Luke screaming the galaxy’s favorite word at the top of his voice all the attention was on the remaining heroes.
Yes we all know that Stormies only hit heroes when the plot demands it and never fatally but they don’t know that. So you have a line of troopers firing away and a death pit (the bad guys think railings are unnecessary for some reason).
For me TFA was a cynically constructed marketing exercise with great acting and nice art design and those scenes are parallel to each other.
Hasn’t Star Wars always been a marketing exercise on some level?
ANOTHER WAY TFA RIPPED OFF THE ORIGINALS
I think George saw the potential to sell stuff where others didn’t but I don’t think even he saw what would happen once Star Wars came out.
The first film was designed to evoke nostalgia for the serials that George (and indeed I) watched as kids just as American Graffiti was designed to provoke nostalgia for the 50s but the plot doesn’t ape a previous film to the same extent.
The second film is designed to push the characters forward not to ape the first film (though the Hoth battle is sort of the first Death Star battle with the location and sides switched).
The rot set in with ROTJ and then the scene and plot steals and all the references get even worse in the PT.
The acting, directing and art design is much better with TFA
ANH has got bits of Dune, Flash Gordon, 633 Squadron, Hidden Fortress, The Searchers etc, etc but it’s not a plot transplant from any one of those sources.
Not to the extent that Poltergeist is lift from Jaws and certainly not the extent here.
When Kylo Ren lands his ship on Jakkoine Darth Maul’s bike flies out from the ramp.
We next see it when Rey is wandering around the junked spaceships in the sand.
As much as I loved the movie, one thing felt odd.
The music isn’t that memorable, maybe it’s because I’ve only seen the film once so far but eh. I can remember Rey’s theme and that’s it, even the prequels soundtrack was more memorable and I find myself humming it once in a while.
I’m not saying the music was bad, but it isn’t memorable to me. I may end up loving and remembering it when I see it again and when I buy the soundtrack.
^I said this already 😄
Your definition of plot is so general that it doesn’t say anything about the actual movie at all.
What a load of rubbish.
In that case small resort town governed by a politician more concerned with the possible reduction in holiday revenue than the risk to the lives of the townsfolk, being attacked by a carnivorous fish, resulting in a local law enforcer, a marine biologist and a noted Bond villain going on a hunt of the ocean isn’t even remotely In Like Flint. 😛
Balls. The footage proves my point. Or maybe you have the acrobatic skill to leap over a death pit or run around the sides while a line of armed men fire laser bolts at you? In which case I’m impressed but you aren’t Luke.
I fail to see how this is in any way analogous to Rey, Finn, and Chewie watching Han and Ren talk.
There are many similarities between ANH and TFA but I can’t accept that these two scenes qualify.
If you can’t see that at a plot level the whole sequence is essentially the same, I don’t think you ever will. So rather than describe what I see again and again as clear lift from the earlier film and bore you into submission just take it that that is how I see the thing and sincerely to the point of being irked. 95% of people going by the made up piece of technology I’m looking at right now agree with you. For me TFA was a cynically constructed marketing exercise with great acting and nice art design and those scenes are parallel to each other. Maybe and it’s probable I’m utterly insane and have no special insight to give the world on anything. But that’s the way I see it folks.
Balls. The footage proves my point. Or maybe you have the acrobatic skill to leap over a death pit or run around the sides while a line of armed men fire laser bolts at you? In which case I’m impressed but you aren’t Luke.
Leia makes a point of warning Luke of the danger and Han suggest a means by which he can get some revenge shots in. Rescue is not an option.
Add thuggees Shortround and Willie Scott to Han’s death scene.
Yes, I’m aware of that, but it doesn’t “separate” anyone. It’s not an obstacle and it’s not relevant to the plot.
It wouldn’t be an obstacle to Duke Dooku who would leap over the pit and corkscrew through the closing blast doors while decapitating every stormtrooper as he went but after sneaking by the distracted troopers the hole is a significant barrier to Luke, made more so by the troops. It’s clearly meant to be as such by the way the shots are composed.
What pit in ANH divided our heroes from the suicidal mentor?
Stormtroopers don’t count.
Yep there is a great big hole in the hanger floor where the troop elevator goes up and down. When Luke goes nuts after Ben’s death he shoots at the troopers and at least one falls in because the lift is retracted.
Bingowings said:
TFA Our heroes have just escaped a rescue attempt on the main female characterRey pretty much rescued her fucking self.
It’s still a rescue attempt. As I have said three times now the diffences come from the new characters doing what the old characters did but it’s still the same plot.
It is bordering on cult speak the way some people defend movies they like from people who don’t dig their new gospel. But as as someone who has done a bit of this in the past I don’t care.
It’s not an issue for you… Cool. It is for me and I can’t see you converting me. The real world is crappy enough. It’s just a movie.
ANH the older mentor is intercepted by the masked lead villain
TFA the masked lead villain is intercepted by the older mentor
At least tell it the right way.
As a sometimes annoying pedant I appreciate your valuable input here 😄
One of the biggest complaints I consistently hear about TPM though (aside from its general crapness) is that Maul didn’t survive to be a recurring villain, so it’s another case of the screenwriter being damned either way…
I said at least they mixed it up.
I didn’t say mirroring the scene again and again was a good idea, far from it.
They could have had a completely different fight.
Instead we had the Maul fight mirror the Obi-Wan/Vader fight in ANH
The Dooku fight in AOTC with some new (largely goofy) elements but the main character loosing his arm as a parallel ESB and then the Dooku/Anakin fight being a mirror of the Luke/Vader fight of ROTJ
There are other situations to be had where people hit each other with swords.
The nearest we have to that in TFA can’t help but throw in a nod to Luke in the Wampa cave.
It’s just a jumbled up bag of references.
Write a story FFS.
They aren’t different scenes.
They come at the same part of the same plot and are framed the same way.
ANH Our heroes have just escaped a rescue attempt on the main female character and are in the process of making their last moves in order to escape the planet smashing villain fortress when the older mentor is intercepted by the masked lead villain who has a past with him.
Our other heroes are divided from their confrontation by a pit and the older mentor is killed.
The lead hero reacts violently to his noble sacrifice and make their escape.
TFA Our heroes have just escaped a rescue attempt on the main female character and are in the process of making their last moves in order to escape the planet smashing villain fortress when the older mentor is intercepted by the masked lead villain who has a past with him.
Our other heroes are divided from their confrontation by a pit and the older mentor is killed.
The heroes react violently to his noble sacrifice and make their escape.
The only difference comes from the characters and I like the new characters and the old characters but the new ones are just repeating the actions of the old ones so I can’t engage with them.
I have seen this scene in the prequels too. Qui-Gon killed while Obi-Wan is trapped behind a force field.
At least they mixed it up a bit by having the Luke character kill the Vader replacement.
If they had subtitles for Chewie I bet he called out “Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!” at the same point too.
Blackstar Warrior as a full length movie.
A ship is only as smooth as her pilot.
Is Bespin a gas giant?
I thought it was just rich in a gas that was mined there.
It’s certainly got a breathable atmosphere (unless there is some sort of protective bubble around the city.From StarWars.com:
An immense gas giant surrounded by a number of moons, the planet contains a band of habitable atmosphere among its endless clouds. In this stratum of life, enterprising prospectors have established floating mining complexes devoted to extracting valuable gasses from deep within the planet. The most well known of these ventures is the opulent Cloud City, formerly under the administration of Lando Calrissian. During the tail end of the Galactic Civil War, the Empire garrisoned Bespin and took over Cloud City, though the outpost and the planet enjoyed freedom after the defeat of the Emperor at the Battle of Endor.
Okay so scientifically highly improbable but it’s Star Wars 😄
Lord Haseo said:
You’re still boiling down to it’s barest essentials and omit details. If you actually watch the film it feels completely different. A decent percentage of the similarities are reworked/repackaged to give a different feel to the film
Of course I am.
That’s what plot is.
The only differences come from the new characters doing the things the old characters did.
Ben sacrificing himself to set Luke on a collision course with his father isn’t the same as Han sacrificing himself to try to help his spiritually conflicted murderous son.
There are however other plots they could have used that would have introduced those characters in a more engaging way and I could have handled more Death Stars.
The issue wasn’t that there was a planet smashing weapon but it’s used in exactly the same way at the same point of the plot in the film I’ve already seen hundreds of times.
The initial set up of the film tells us that the Galaxy has divided into the New Republic and the First Order and there is a kind of Cold War situation where the First Order has built up it’s military and the Republic is lending deniable support to insurgents in First Order territory.
A way to use Death Star tech in this situation would have been to mirror the proliferation of Nukes in our cold war. The Republic has had to build it’s own superweapons to balance those of the First Order. This creates an moral and ethical conflict with the old guard who fought to keep the galaxy safe from such things and maybe lost their whole home planet to one. The Republic would have lost the higher moral ground and the line between the good guys and the bad guys would be blurred. Possibly why Ben becomes Ren.
That would be using using a bit of story from the old films and developing to the new setting.
It would be different enough to draw me into the new situation and then into the new characters.
Instead we have essentially the same movie with different characters which is half way to being a classic movie but not a classic movie. It’s another cynical corporate marketing exercise, not a story.
In my view.
I appreciate the film will continue to make loads of cash and will have fans.
Just not me.
Same with the prequels.
Or the secret mind reading powers of the Bavarian Illuminiati. You pick. 😉
I’m just trying to picture Harrison Fnord in all this.
Is Bespin a gas giant?
I thought it was just rich in a gas that was mined there.
It’s certainly got a breathable atmosphere (unless there is some sort of protective bubble around the city.
It’s slightly different but practically the same. If it were made in Italy with with a lower budget in the early 1980s it would have been called a Star Wars rip-off.
Where as arguably TPM could be described as a Escape From Galaxy 3 rip-off.