BedeHistory731

I’ve given it a tweak, using the normal speed “once thought as you do” and adding a pause between the two parts. I don’t think I like it as much. While adding a “but” between the two lines would work, I couldn’t find a clean enough clip of Jones saying it as Vader.

Here’s the new one. Again, I’m sure Adywan or another sound editor could make it sound cleaner and better edit the music around eliminating “I must obey my master!”

Excellent work, Adywan! I’m glad to see that the skies have really improved from the SD version. The claw grasping the Tantive IV is also an excellent touch (I’m assuming you’ve resized the model or given it a CGI replacement as well, yes?), as is the use of 4K77 footage on the 3PO/Sandcrawler shot and the scanned matte painting of Tatooine. I do like that you kept the battle droid carcass as the last little prequel reference if only to demonstrate your opinions on those movies.

ray_afraid said:

K4YR4H said:

any plans to go back to ANH and implement the SC38 reimagined fight by FXitinPost?
(probably slowing it down a bit to fit the pacing)

I’m so ready for this question to die.
SC38 is awful.

Indeed. It’s a downright trashy video game cutscene.

I liked how Adywan recut the scene. If he just cuts down on reused shots and tightens up some of the longer bits of the original, it’d work.

I’ve been experimenting with trimming “I must obey my master!” while also incorporating Sir Ridley’s “Your mother once thought as you do” (albeit slowed-down). What prevented me from deleting “You don’t know the power of the Dark Side” was both Vader’s turn and making sure that Luke’s follow-up line made sense. The edit is a bit rough, but I’m sure Ady can do better working in the 5.1 mix.

Here it is.

I was perfectly happy with how Ady re-cut the sequence, especially in the Purist version (no added music). It could use some tweaking to make the re-use of shots slightly less obvious in some cases.

My biggest problem with Adywan’s re-edit was how he had Obi-Wan ignite his saber first. To me, that doesn’t fit with the character or Kenobi’s goals in the movie. It just looked like a “cool” shot done for the trailers way back when. My suggest would be to have Vader with his saber already ignited (to keep the cool shot) or to have it like the SD version (albeit with Obi-Wan igniting his saber as in the official versions, just with the jump cut fixed).

JEDIT: There’s also this warped pylon that might need fixing:

ChainsawAsh said:

RoccondilRinon said:

DarthXenu said:

I’m also wondering how we all feel about deleting the line “It is too late for me, son.”

Personally I love that line, a great bit of voice acting and really adds depth to Vaders character. Makes him seem real rather than just a cut and paste bad guy. I remember seeing it at the cinema on first release and thinking, wow maybe, just maybe Luke can get through to his Dad.

Agreed. It isn’t telegraphing his later turn or creating some kind of illogicality. I think it’s one of his most important lines, in terms of the insight we get into his character.

Ady, if you mess with this one, we riot.

+1

Yeah, I like the line too. It’s the first crack we see in Vader’s resolve, furthered by his stare at the gantry window. I was kind of spitballing, as a lot of us seem to be torn about some of the dialogue choices in ROTJ. I saw that line appear on a few cut lists and was curious about where we stood on it. I’m glad we’re in favor of keeping it!

The Luke/Vader stuff doesn’t really need any dialogue trims.

Yeah, this exercise can snowball pretty quickly. 😉

DuracellEnergizer said:

OutboundFlight said:

I’ve never liked “Obi-Wan had a second apprentice, one named Vader the other Anakin, both turn evil, and then one dies while the other secretly survives.

It feels awfully contrived, and distorts the meaning of the PT to benefit the plot twist in Empire. The PT is all about Anakin’s turn to the dark side as a parallel to Luke’s resistance to the dark side, and both are symbols of the galaxy - in the PT, the Republic falls to the Empire, in the OT, the Rebels resist the Empire.

Removing Anakin’s proper turn to evil is (imo) the equivalent of removing Luke standing up to the Emperor. Instead, we’d just show Vader rising and overthrowing the Emperor, leaving Luke’s story in limbo, until a plot twist in Episode 8 reveals Luke did the right thing. It doesn’t work. Likewise, adding a second apprentice even if to support Obi-Wan’s lie would be the equivalent of adding in a new character (Luke’s sister?) for the sole purpose of having us wonder who will redeem Vader.

Now, this is all implying Lucas’ vision of the PT. It could have been set from an entirely new character’s adventures / struggles and not Anakin, in which case maybe he could have showed up in the first film and then been seemingly killed. But as long as the trilogy is about Anakin’s fall or Obi-Wan’s failure, I don’t think you can thematically justify keeping the plot twist.

A good reason fanedits of the PT should be made with the intent of dampening the flaws/improving the strengths of the PT rather than ironing out the continuity between the two trilogies. Myths of old have internal inconsistencies, as do modern ones; we should embrace and work within that condition rather than fight against it.

I just like having the spoilers of the OT intact, which would probably necessitate a “3-in-1” edit stuck between ESB and ROTJ in viewing order.

OutboundFlight said:

I’ve never liked “Obi-Wan had a second apprentice, one named Vader the other Anakin, both turn evil, and then one dies while the other secretly survives.

It feels awfully contrived, and distorts the meaning of the PT to benefit the plot twist in Empire. The PT is all about Anakin’s turn to the dark side as a parallel to Luke’s resistance to the dark side, and both are symbols of the galaxy - in the PT, the Republic falls to the Empire, in the OT, the Rebels resist the Empire.

Removing Anakin’s proper turn to evil is (imo) the equivalent of removing Luke standing up to the Emperor. Instead, we’d just show Vader rising and overthrowing the Emperor, leaving Luke’s story in limbo, until a plot twist in Episode 8 reveals Luke did the right thing. It doesn’t work. Likewise, adding a second apprentice even if to support Obi-Wan’s lie would be the equivalent of adding in a new character (Luke’s sister?) for the sole purpose of having us wonder who will redeem Vader.

Now, this is all implying Lucas’ vision of the PT. It could have been set from an entirely new character’s adventures / struggles and not Anakin, in which case maybe he could have showed up in the first film and then been seemingly killed. But as long as the trilogy is about Anakin’s fall or Obi-Wan’s failure, I don’t think you can thematically justify keeping the plot twist.

Well first off, neither one would be named Vader until after we see the suit. The second pupil character can be a natural part of the story from TPM, say Obi-Wan’s apprentice/partner before Anakin shows up. You already have the seeds of a rivalry and resentment between Anakin and the second apprentice, which can both fuel their turn. It wouldn’t just aid the mystery, but it would also add a bit of a familial dynamic to the main characters (Obi-Wan, Anakin, and the other apprentice; with Padme to the side). That would make the fall all the more tragic and kind of flip the OT’s themes (instead of the “rebel family” coming together, it’s the “Jedi family” falling apart).

I don’t think it’s contrived at all. We can see both apprentices fall in a way that satisfies the parallel to Luke standing up to the Emperor. You can imply that they both want to serve Sidious, without actually showing them bow to Sidious and receive the name.

You do bring up a good point about the “Obi-Wan’s failure” theme, as he should have been the main character of the Prequels. We see through him how he tried to train these pupils and failed, fuelling the fall of the Jedi and his exile to Tatooine to care for the offspring of Anakin (the other pupil would have been childless). It fits within GL’s general structure of the Prequels to center on Kenobi and you can work the story in a way that preserves the ESB twist.

ChainsawAsh said:

BedeHistory731 said:

If we go with the “he’s already wearing the suit” option, perhaps he fought the other pupil and they both sustained substantial injuries before Palpatine intervened. With it left ambiguous who truly lived, Vader would seek out Obi-Wan

Yep, that’s pretty much how I’ve always wished it had gone.

I don’t think it ever would have been possible to do the prequels while keeping Yoda’s appearance a secret, though. And that’s not a big enough reveal in Empire that the audience knowing who Yoda is before Luke causes that much of a problem IMO.

Indeed. It gives the whole scene a nice bit of situational irony, as we know that it’s Yoda but Luke doesn’t. Had the Prequels preserved Yoda’s sense of humor and general OT characterization, it’d be kind of funny.

However, I’ve still thought of ways to do the Prequels without Yoda appearing (he’d be mentioned a bunch, but never manifest in the flesh). These include:

-he’s exiled himself away from a corrupted Jedi Order, with Obi-Wan as his last pupil
-he was exiled by the Jedi Order for not siding with their current policies (which, if we’re talking release order viewing, should give viewers a perspective on the latter days of the order), with Obi-Wan taking his side in policy matters (a la Qui-Gon/Dooku in the Prequels)

Of course, have it be so that only Obi-Wan knows where he is. That way he can call him up via Force skype.

ChainsawAsh said:

BedeHistory731 said:

TMP - Age up Anakin to about 17/18.
AOTC - Give Obi-Wan another pupil, who is also tempted towards the dark side.
ROTS - Make it look like Anakin and the other pupil die about midway through the movie, with proto-Vader (mask, but no life support suit) taking his place.

YES to all of these, though I don’t think “no life support suit” is necessary for act 3 EpIII Vader.

I could go either way with that. My thinking about that final duel on Mustafar would be to have Obi-Wan fighting pre-suit Vader (mask with vocal distortion, but no breathing sounds or extensive cybernetics). This Vader, who is never linked to Anakin other than saying he destroyed him, would fall to his near-death onto the embankment of a lava river. This injury would render him quadriplegic (per the technical commentaries), leading to the immolation and the necessity for the suit. It could also be a way for the “Obi-Wan once thought as you do” line to make sense, as Obi-Wan tries to reach out to Vader and Vader chooses to fall to his death (I got the idea here). It’s like poetry, it rhymes! 😉

If we go with the “he’s already wearing the suit” option, perhaps he fought the other pupil and they both sustained substantial injuries before Palpatine intervened. With it left ambiguous who truly lived, Vader would seek out Obi-Wan and Padme. Padme would plead with this new man, trying to persuade him to come back to the light. He tries to kill her before Obi-Wan intervenes and starts the fight. Vader could also be immolated again here or trapped in something to allow Obi-Wan and Padme to escape.

Keeping Vader a mystery man in Episode III should have been a goal of the prequels (same with keeping Yoda off-screen and allowing Padme to survive the prequels on Alderaan with Leia). I like it when fanedits cut out Vader’s name and suit appearance from the film.

TMP - Age up Anakin to about 17/18.
AOTC - Give Obi-Wan another pupil, who is also tempted towards the dark side.
ROTS - Make it look like Anakin and the other pupil die about midway through the movie, with proto-Vader (mask, but no life support suit) taking his place.

ANH - Fix the Death Star plans graphics.
ESB - Include a line from Lando about Han endangering the people of Bespin (thanks, RougeLeader)
ROTJ - Replace the Second Death Star with a skyhook above a volcanic planet (basically Mustafar).

R1 - No puns from Vader.
Solo - No imperial officer giving Han his surname.

TFA - No Starkiller Base.
TLJ - No green milk scene.

Omni said:

darthrush did that for his edit, it’s pretty good. There’s also the moment right after Luke leaves the Ewoks and the gang to surrender himself to Vader.

The darthrush cutlist would be a good starting point for Ady to try more “radical” fixes to the movie. While I do like what darthrush did (especially in Ewok cutbacks and eliminating some of the cringiest moments), there are a few points I’m not keen about. Adywan probably won’t cut back Han’s banter to the extent of darthrush, nor will he keep the galactic celebrations or the 500 Nations-inspired theme.

I’m sure Adywan will release a color-corrected version of the blu-ray (using 2004 HDTV to remove blu-ray changes) when he finishes said corrections (like he did with ANH), so it should be easy for other editors to restore bits he cuts while maintaining seamlessness.

9/10

I highly recommend this documentary to anybody who is interested in the early days of vert skating and those interested in how a man can let fame go to his head and further screw-up his fragile mental state. There are some very disturbing images toward the end of the documentary, which didn’t feel too necessary, but I guess they further the point about how monstrous Rogowski had become.

ray_afraid said:

BedeHistory731 said:
deleting the whole “jealous Han” subplot

Yes, please! Han & Leia fall in love in Empire. That should be that.

All you have to do is cut Han showing up after Luke leaves for the base and shorten the Han and Leia scene at the end.

Leia: “He wasn’t, I can feel it.”
Han gives a surprised look.
Leia: “He’s my brother.”
Han and Leia kiss, with Han trying not to think about the incestuous smooch from a movie ago.

I don’t mind the callback to “I love you.” “I know.” in the bunker scene. It always struck me as Han realizing “This is why I love her so much. She can be just as devious as me!” I get why people don’t like it though.

Telion said:

exitzero said:

never made any effort to turn Anakin back from the Darkside so the line doesn’t really make sense. But Padme did. Her >attempt to talk Anakin back on Mustafar was similar to Luke trying with Vader on Endor. I also like the idea of Vader >mentioning Padme when he’s talking to his son. I think it would add a little more weight to the conversation & when he’s >looking out over the forest.

Like I said-just a wish list.

Oh fair enough I don’t really watch the prequels enough these days, but yeah I guess that makes sense.

Even discounting the prequels (a good idea, IMHO), it would be a good change because it gives a bit more characterization/importance to the otherwise non-existent Mrs. Anakin Skywalker (using the name “Padme,” if just watching the OT, has little meaning). It also implies that Vader still thinks about her, which gives Luke some hint of a bit of goodness within him. While the name “Anakin Skywalker” might not mean anything to him, his wife does still hold some significance in his self-identity.

I’m also wondering how we all feel about deleting the line “It is too late for me, son.” It seems way too telegraphed and kind of gives away Vader’s turn (as does “It is pointless to resist”). Just having Vader stand at the window is enough to get the point across. Adywan hinted at incorporating some dialogue tweaks and I think these would be solid tweaks, along with deleting the whole “jealous Han” subplot that gets all of two scenes and gets cut out of most ROTJ edits (e.g., Darth Rush, who handled it pretty well).

emanswfan said:

I’d agree that deepfaking fake wedge would be great, though I’m not familiar enough with the process to know how much work that would be. I’ve seen a lot of impressive deepfake videos but most still have noticeable artifacting, so I would only say it would be good if it can be done to a certain level of quality.

Honestly, getting a guy to dub the one line might be best. Microphones and mixing can get a voice to blend pretty well into the 5.1 mix.

I don’t think it’d be hard for Ady to get a voice actor to dub the one line. That’s a bit easier than recoloring his hair or a deepfake replacement.

Given how Dennis Lawson later did voiceover work for the Rogue Squadron games, I’m surprised he didn’t redub his ANH and ESB lines. Heck, said time would have been perfect to separate fake (using the original VA, who later appeared in R1) & real Wedge.

teharri said:

LordZerome1080 said:

That’s blasphemy

Granted it needs work for sure, but it is more consistent and is better than a 60+ year old actor playing a character in early 40s.

As far as Ady’s edits are concerned at the moment, the Prequels didn’t happen (at least, the way the movies manifested). I’d love it if he upgraded the crawls to delete the episode numbers.

He did like R1, which is why ANHR:HD will have pink-engined X-Wings.

exitzero said:

Goof Fix - Luke’s Kick from Return of the Jedi-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dejy3mo0DQk

Looks like a lot of work to me.

The guy did the opposite of what Ady will probably do. He extended Luke’s leg and moved the guy’s head closer. Adywan will probably try to create a clean background plate and move the guy forward, to avoid giving Luke “stretch Armstrong” limbs. Of course, this also depends on how Adywan’s Fett dies.

Given some of the stuff Ady did in ESB, it shouldn’t be too bad.

TK42-WAN said:

I posted this here a while back, but I am hoping to get back to this edit now I have the time. I love feedback on what people think of the restructuring of the duel. I’ve attempted to keep it in line with the physics of the OT.

WIP. Incomplete audio.

https://vimeo.com/321404471

Password: FANEDIT

I like what you’ve done here in streamlining the duel and eliminating the crazy physics. The deletion of all the dialogue was also a fantastic touch. Even if it was meant to be part of a larger prequel/Kenobi edit, the no-dialogue approach still works.

My one suggestion would be to eliminate or move the shot of the shuttle arriving if you want the duel to be a stand-alone piece (e.g., inserted in ROTJ or as a short feature).

A larger idea that I’ve long pondered would be to have a red saber-wielding Anakin (who gave his blue lightsaber to Padme, who subsequently gave it to Obi-Wan) simply going over the lavafall with the control arm thing. This would probably only work in a prequel/machete/Kenobi edit that operates on the presumption that Anakin dies and we don’t know who this “Vader” is until ESB.

I’m feeling pretty darn confident with Ady’s abilities. I’m just trying to break down for myself where several potential deaths could fit within the sequence.

1. Fett lands on the skiff, tries to shoot Luke but gets his gun chopped up. Potentially, Luke could just kill him here, but that means that a lot of the sequence has to change to accommodate Fett going away.

2. That gun firing from the sail barge hits Fett, knocking him over. This point could also be a place to insert a Fett death, as he falls down and the camera shifts to Lando asking Han & Chewie for help. Luke then jumps to the other skiff, meaning only a few shots have to be replaced with added footage or we cut back to the sail barge interior (which means a music edit).

3. Fett is about to fire on Luke, which Luke could sense. Fett would fire his wrist gun thing, Luke would reflect the blast, and Fett would take the full force of it. This requires even less editing of the sequence.

4. Han hits Fett with his spear. This point is probably where Ady will make the “better death” edit, with a few possible outcomes. Han could impale Fett with it, hit his jetpack and cause Fett to die in an explosion, or activate the jetpack and Fett explodes while in the air. These all require little in the way of re-editing the sequence, with the most work being a few insert shots done in the same manner as the Hoth extras or a CGI Fett exploding in some manner.

My big concern is what can be possible with extant footage, new material (e.g., ESB-style inserts), and CGI. I’m just happy the sarlacc (beakless, I assume) won’t burp after indulging on an overappreciated bounty hunter.

Whatever happens, I’m certain Ady can pull it off without music edits or interrupting the flow of the sequence.

I’m just wondering how Ady will execute the “more definitive” Boba Fett death within the timing of the sail barge sequence and in time with the music. There are a few ways I could see it go down.

1. Luke slashes Fett up with his lightsaber, perhaps decapitating him.
2. Fett’s blaster bolt gets reflected by Luke and Fett takes the full force of it.
3. The gunner on the barge accidentally disintegrates Fett.
4. Han hits the jetpack, causing it to explode and kill Fett.
5. Han’s spike impales Fett.

I’ve long thought that Solo is just the Star Wars equivalent of the opening scene from Last Crusade. It’s trying to explain everything about this character, all the while destroying the mystery surrounding his origins. While I like what I’ve seen of it, it’s got its problems and I think it would have been better served as a Disney+ series about the Star Wars underworld.

RogueLeader said:

That is really great! I feel like something could be done at the very end to help transition to the credits music. It just feels a bit jarring, it feels like it is missing some kind of build up or something. But honestly that is a perfect track to use for the ending!

Thanks! The way that song goes is that it builds up to a big note, then quiets down. I didn’t want to have the big note/crash happen, let the music quiet down (but not finish the song), then start the end credits (that felt more jarring).

“Luke and Leia” makes for a far better ending theme to the OT than “Yub Nub” or “Victory Celebration”/the 500 Nations emulation. Its tone doesn’t clash as much with the pyre piece or even “Leia Breaks the News” (which I like shortened, to eliminate envious Han).