BedeHistory731

Hal 9000 said:

But why would Vader head a criminal organization?

He has his hobbies. 😉

I like it, Snooker! I’m curious to see where you’ll go with the edit.

TNT, I always likes 3-in-1, so I’m curious about how you’ll handle it. I’m a Blackened Mantle guy, an edit where I liked the decisions made (fake subtitles paired with the Japanese dub, Grievous is Maul, etc.).

snooker said:

I don’t even care about preserving the Yoda reveal in Empire, it’s just that he’s sooo boring in the prequelsssss.

Indeed! I like having the situational irony in ESB with Yoda (who we know from I, II, and III) screwing around to test Luke. You can even argue that Yoda gets a character arc as the result of his prequel appearances (pompous, dogmatic ass in the prequels becomes a humbled, humorous, wise, but still dogmatic master in the OT).

Still, my attitude towards prequel rewrites is to keep all of the OT twists intact. We never see Yoda, we assume Anakin (and/or an additional Obi-Wan pupil) is dead at the end of the trilogy, and we only see the birth of one kid.

snooker said:

I’ve got a hot take: Yoda should only appear once in the prequels, and it’s in his scene with Obi-Wan near the end of The Phantom Menace

Exactly! Whenever I’ve done prequel rewrites, Yoda has been exiled by the Jedi for dogmatic disputes. Only Obi-Wan (and Qui-Gon/Dooku) know where he is (Dagobah). That way, the ESB surprise is enhanced (instead of us laughing with Yoda, knowing he’s just messing around with Luke).

While it’d be impossible to totally cut Yoda from the three movies, one could chop him out in a three-in-one edit with some difficulty.

I’m just annoyed they couldn’t find a woman VA to dub the female pilot in ROTJ. Also, what changed to allow Dennis Lawson to use his own voice in ROTJ as well?

Matt.F said:

“We weren’t doing anything that I think Peter Cushing would’ve objected to. I think this work was done with a great deal of affection and care. We know that Peter Cushing was very proud of his involvement in Star Wars and had said as much, and that he regretted that he never got a chance to be in another Star Wars film because George [Lucas] had killed off his character. This was done in consultation and cooperation with his estate. So we wouldn’t do this if the estate had objected or didn’t feel comfortable with this idea.” John Knoll, VFX Supervisor.

Please feel free to go ahead and be outraged anyway, and create an ‘ethical’ cut of the movie!

Meh, ethical or not, it still looked awful. Prosthetic makeup, like in ROTS, would have been fine. Either way, I like this cut sparing us having to look at it.

Also, just chill. Don’t try to write off OP as “whiny” and “outraged” because he disagrees with you and has different values from the filmmaker.

Matt.F said:

Peter Cushing was an actor.

Tarkin is a character. Do you see the difference? I can assure you Peter Cushing’s ‘corpse’ as you emotively wrote is quite undisturbed. Perhaps you should issue a fatwa on anyone who makes an image of someone who has passed?

Seems mock moral outrage is all the rage online today though.

It’s entirely normal to think that the CGI face looked terrible and may have been disrespectful, so it’s not “mock moral outrage.” There are serious ethical issues around this practice.

I like the editing as it is, but I’d recommend rotoscoping in appropriate backgrounds for the cutaways. It might help fix the issues that Rouge Leader described. I’d also recommend getting to the Tantive IV through a dissolve instead of a wipe.

JEDIT: Now that you’ve moved 3PO and R2 to the end, would you consider cutting out their Yavin appearance?

SomethingStarWarsRelated said:

Matt.F said:

Actually talking of voices, and from the same opening scene with the ‘ungloved hand’, the blond Imperial Officer who says “Inform the Commander that Lord Vader’s shuttle has arrived” speaks with a very noticeably American accent.

If you watch ESB and ROTJ back-to-back its actually quite jarring to hear the US accent from an Imperial officer right at the start of the film - in ESB the British accent was the voice of the Empire’s officer class and it gave the Empire a certain haughty aristocracy that worked very well.

Hardly a game changer but I think redubbing a British accent for that officer would be a nice little improvement to the movie.

Excellent point. I always thought that dub wasn’t very well done anyway. Doesn’t this dude show up later to deliver another line to Piett too?

Actually, other than Piett, are there any other officers that DO have a British accent? The “send three squads to help!” guy might be quasi British…I don’t know.

The Moff guy is also British in ROTJ, as is “Sir, we’ve lost our bridge deflector shields.” Still, some redubs would be good for ROTJ (adjusting dialogue).

joefavs said:

Forever baffled by the apparently common impulse to show fan edits for someone’s first viewing. Maaaaaaybe for the prequels, but the OT? Seriously?

It mostly applies to ROTJ. I’d rather kids not have to see “jealous Han,” too much Ewok chicanery, and some really clunky dialogue. They can watch the original alongside it, of course.

With ANH and ESB, I say have the fanedits as additional viewing (since it’s the best way to see the SE’s).

SilverWook said:

I thought Jabba was well developed for a slimy piece of worm ridden filth. 😉

If it had been Gene Roddenberry directing, he’d have gone on a tangent about how the Hutts reproduce.

Part of me wouldn’t mind waiting, see how much they absorb from pop culture osmosis alone.

I saw fans on Reddit wanting Witwer to overdub Peter Serafinowicz’s work in TMP because Serafinowicz isn’t “part of the franchise.” These fans are dicks.

Of course, you can make up a canon reason for switching actors, say “Witwer is Maul’s voice after Maul lost his lower body to Kenobi.” As for McDiarmid redubbing the lines, I’m glad they got Witwer’s permission.

I’m curious, will the audio changes be a replication of the ones done for the SD version?

JEDIT: Also, will you be restoring Leia’s reaction shot before Alderaan’s destruction? Much like the Tarkin shot at the end of the film, it adds some much-needed emotion to the scene.

ANH (4K77 and Revisited), ESB (Despecialized and Revisited), Clone Wars series, ROTS (Hal9000’s latest version), ROTJ (4K83 and DarthRush’s fanedit - I like his cutlist), TFA (Starlight Project, when it comes out finalized), TLJ (Rekindled, latest version), and ROS (whatever fanedit I like most).

Only show them TMP and AOTC with the Rifftrax, or through the excellent Lego Star Wars videogames. Blackened Mantle is also appropriate, if your kid likes reading subtitles.

If you’re rendering these frames on 4K83, I must say that you’ve rescued the original rancor composites! My biggest complaints about Despecialized 2.5 and Sanjuro’s grades were that the Rancor scene was too dark in the composite shots. Consistency looks pretty good as well, from my untrained eye.

RoccondilRinon said:

FWIW, the crying rancor keeper is one of my favourite moments. It’s the most creative moment in the whole Jabba sequence, IMO. It adds a bit of depth to the world, and it’s just plain hilarious.

I can understand why it’s polarising, but my vote is for keeping it. I also love the ironing droid in TLJ, so maybe I just have a thing for bathos.

I can see where you’re coming from with that, but I think it’s my least favorite moment in that whole movie. It’s silly, adds to a very bloated part of the story without contributing to the plot/character arcs, and is just kind of uncomfortable. With Adywan tweaking the droid torture, it’s time to get rid of the crying rancor keeper.

Had the Jabba’s Palace stuff been its own movie (which I think it was, correct me if I’m wrong), then you could keep it. The third parts of each trilogy have all had pacing issues, owing to the need to wrap so much up in a short span of time.

FreezingTNT2 said:

I have an idea: when Vader witnesses Luke being electrocuted by Palpatine, he should say “Leave my son alone.” instead of “NOOO!!!”. What do you think?

Correction: “Let that child alone!” 😉

Seriously, though: no dialogue from Vader for that scene.

ChainsawAsh said:

We have theatrical DTS audio for all six pre-Disney movies (1997 SEs and all three prequels).

Good to know!

Unpopular suggestion: can Ady cut the crying rancor keeper? I’ve hated it since I first watched the film and its removal would help reduce the bloat of the Jabba section.

It’s nice commentary on where Adywan thinks the Prequels belong (a large, junk-collecting tank). I’m happy that it’s the only real prequel reference, unless there’s a skeleton of a prequel species in the rancor pit.

Broom Kid said:

Almost anything you hear on the soundtrack referring to Jabba the Hutt doesn’t exist in the movie. I do wonder if there’s a way to get all of that music back in the film - and there’s a lot of it - without it feeling cut-up and disrupted.

I think it would be a testament to Ady’s sound mixing abilities to restore some of it to the film. Luckily, sound effects shouldn’t be an issue.

While he’s likely using the ‘04 mixes as a base (with insertions from the OOT), maybe the ‘97 DTS would be a better starting point (if we have the DTS of it/if there’s a marked dynamic/separation difference between it and the ‘04/‘11).

Adywan didn’t restore any of the missing ESB cues, so I doubt he’ll restore any here. I do think that there are some cues that could work in the film. “Bounty for a Wookie” instead of the Max Rebo outro music would be nice, as would using the Obi-Wan/Luke music.

My write-up has no sequel trilogy. If it did, it’d be the Thrawn Trilogy.

That sounds like a good idea to me, keeping Vader within the Empire and taking things down from the inside. Perhaps the Mustafar confrontation could be Luke surrendering to him?

I’m not sure you need to kill off a big-name hero. ROTJ was satisfying without it. Maybe include Akbar in III and kill him in IV? Take inspiration from the story of Admiral Yi, with him dying on the bridge and his subordinates commanding the battle for him.

Dre, I’m sorry about what happened at the other site. Just keep on keeping on and don’t let the others discourage you.

I like that “two movies” idea a lot! I think I’d go about it a little differently, namely to allow Vader’s redemption a bit more development and show him trying to fess up to his mistakes. I like your ideas, Outbound Flight, so allow me to build off of them.

Episode III: Labyrinth of Evil

• Do the whole rescue of Han deal, working into Han and Lando trying to mend their relationship. It could be a good piece on how Han’s character has grown and the desire to take action rather than sit the Galactic Civil War out like Lando was content to do. You even have them tag-teaming Boba Fett to end their arc, with Fett dying pretty conclusively (e.g., not much left of his body).

• Have Vader fall out of favor with the Emperor (over space skype), as Palpatine replaces him with a new apprentice (call him Maul, because I’m not keen on prince pheromone from SOTE). Vader is a fugitive, with nowhere left to go in the Empire.

• Maul tracks the heroes down to Tatooine, with Vader in close pursuit. Vader uses this time to reflect on how Palpatine has thrown him away and how he must join with his son to defeat the Emperor. We get flashbacks to his time as a young man, before Palpatine took him under his wing (different from the Prequel setup, obviously). These are the first inklings that Vader might be regretting his choices.

• Vader finds Luke and Leia, telling them what has happened. He announces his intention to betray the Emperor by aiding the rebellion, which both Luke and Leia have some doubts about. While Luke can sense that Vader is serious, he sees that he’s doing it out of selfish reasons. Throughout the movie, as he feeds correct information to the rebels and helps out Luke and Leia, we see that he can be trustworthy yet still within the dark side.

• Leia sees how pathetic Vader is and how he had little autonomy under the Emperor. He couldn’t fight the order to destroy Alderaan, even if he tried. She sees him as a useful resource but believes that he should be condemned for his crimes against the galaxy.

• Pepper in some flashbacks about Vader’s past, with Luke learning his name from locals and confronting Vader with the revelation. He says the whole “That name no longer has any meaning to me” bit from ROTJ, but Luke doesn’t do the whole “true self” deal, not yet.

• The movie would end with the defeat of Jabba and Maul confronting Luke and Leia. Luke would be outclassed in the fight, with Vader intervening to kill Maul. It would confuse Luke, as he did not feel Vader acting through the dark side. We also might see Leia using the Force, inadvertently, for the first time since the ESB telepathy.

• Our last scene would be Luke and Vader at the ruins of the Lars Homestead. This is where Luke tells him about the good he sensed in him, begging his father to “come with him” and tease it out. Vader merely responds with “It is too late for me, son.” Luke would respond, “But is it?” The heroes travel back to the rebellion, while Vader remains and meditates on this discovery.

Episode IV - Return of the Jedi

• With Vader continuing to provide the rebellion with information from a distance, the Empire (now revealed as the “Sith Empire,” which invaded and conquered the Republic - borrowing another Outbound Flight idea) has been pushed to a few straggling planets, one of which is the Wookie homeworld of Kashyyyk. We see this through a montage of imperial worlds falling to the rebels and the destruction of Star Destroyers/imperial artifacts. Learning that the Emperor is aboard his skyhook orbiting Kashyyk, the rebels plan to attack.

• Han and Leia lead the strike team to take down the shield generator and allow the rebel fleet to engage the last of the imperials (think Jakku, but it’s Kashyyyk instead). Han and Leia’s arc revolves around Chewbacca, with Han believing him capable of convincing the Wookies and Leia doubting that an exiled Wookie will win them much support (Chewbacca led a failed rebellion that resulted in the enslavement of many of his kind, including himself).

• Yoda and Luke meet, with Yoda dying after telling Luke about the “other Skywalker.” Obi-Wan then confirms it to be Leia, while also telling Luke that turning Vader is impossible. Luke then joins the others with the rebel fleet, telling Leia about her origins and how she can use the Force to further the rebellion’s goals.

• Luke then tries to find Vader to help him face Palpatine. He finds Vader on Mustafar, the planet where he sustained the injuries that forced him into the life support suit. This is an opportunity for both a flashback (perhaps to his fight with Obi-Wan) and for Luke to remind him about the good he sensed in him. Vader tries to push that down, encouraging Luke to join him in the dark side. They resolve to confront Palpatine and overthrow him, albeit for different reasons.

• Perhaps Vader converses with Flashback!Anakin, in an inversion of the Dark Side Cave from ESB. He sees a vision of what he could be had he not turned, looking a lot like David Prowse.

• The Palpatine-Luke-Vader scenes play much as they do in our ROTJ, albeit with Luke and Vader coming to blows because Vader fears Luke will be too powerful for him. They fight, with Luke almost giving in to the Dark Side after Vader threatens to turn Leia. The rest of the scene plays exactly as it did before, with Vader realizing the good within him and tossing the Emperor into the skyhook’s reactor core.

• The ground battle plays much as did in our ROTJ, albeit with less cutesiness and more strategy from the Wookies. The shield comes down, with Leia coming around to Chewbacca’s plan and using the Force to help access and destroy the generator. No main characters die here.

• The rebel fleet attacks the skyhook and the fleet, as Lando leads them to destroy its core. The Executor also severs the skyhook from the planet, as a turned Vader uses the Force to influence Piett to ram the ship.

• Our ending is the same, albeit with no jealous Han and Ewok cutesiness. The spirit of Anakin (Prowse) appears to Luke, with Leia catching a glimpse of him as well. Music would be a triumphant version of “Luke and Leia.” The camera pans up and into the stars, starting the credits.

TL;DR: Draw out Vader’s turn, have him act in ways that help undo the Empire’s damage, and give him more moments of reflection. A bit Zuko-ish, but it works. Tangentially, give Han more of an arc with Lando and Chewbacca, while also letting Leia use the Force more.