I thought Jabba was well developed for a slimy piece of worm ridden filth. 😉
If it had been Gene Roddenberry directing, he’d have gone on a tangent about how the Hutts reproduce.
Part of me wouldn’t mind waiting, see how much they absorb from pop culture osmosis alone.
I saw fans on Reddit wanting Witwer to overdub Peter Serafinowicz’s work in TMP because Serafinowicz isn’t “part of the franchise.” These fans are dicks.
Of course, you can make up a canon reason for switching actors, say “Witwer is Maul’s voice after Maul lost his lower body to Kenobi.” As for McDiarmid redubbing the lines, I’m glad they got Witwer’s permission.
I’m curious, will the audio changes be a replication of the ones done for the SD version?
JEDIT: Also, will you be restoring Leia’s reaction shot before Alderaan’s destruction? Much like the Tarkin shot at the end of the film, it adds some much-needed emotion to the scene.
ANH (4K77 and Revisited), ESB (Despecialized and Revisited), Clone Wars series, ROTS (Hal9000’s latest version), ROTJ (4K83 and DarthRush’s fanedit - I like his cutlist), TFA (Starlight Project, when it comes out finalized), TLJ (Rekindled, latest version), and ROS (whatever fanedit I like most).
Only show them TMP and AOTC with the Rifftrax, or through the excellent Lego Star Wars videogames. Blackened Mantle is also appropriate, if your kid likes reading subtitles.
If you’re rendering these frames on 4K83, I must say that you’ve rescued the original rancor composites! My biggest complaints about Despecialized 2.5 and Sanjuro’s grades were that the Rancor scene was too dark in the composite shots. Consistency looks pretty good as well, from my untrained eye.
FWIW, the crying rancor keeper is one of my favourite moments. It’s the most creative moment in the whole Jabba sequence, IMO. It adds a bit of depth to the world, and it’s just plain hilarious.
I can understand why it’s polarising, but my vote is for keeping it. I also love the ironing droid in TLJ, so maybe I just have a thing for bathos.
I can see where you’re coming from with that, but I think it’s my least favorite moment in that whole movie. It’s silly, adds to a very bloated part of the story without contributing to the plot/character arcs, and is just kind of uncomfortable. With Adywan tweaking the droid torture, it’s time to get rid of the crying rancor keeper.
Had the Jabba’s Palace stuff been its own movie (which I think it was, correct me if I’m wrong), then you could keep it. The third parts of each trilogy have all had pacing issues, owing to the need to wrap so much up in a short span of time.
I have an idea: when Vader witnesses Luke being electrocuted by Palpatine, he should say “Leave my son alone.” instead of “NOOO!!!”. What do you think?
Correction: “Let that child alone!” 😉
Seriously, though: no dialogue from Vader for that scene.
We have theatrical DTS audio for all six pre-Disney movies (1997 SEs and all three prequels).
Good to know!
Unpopular suggestion: can Ady cut the crying rancor keeper? I’ve hated it since I first watched the film and its removal would help reduce the bloat of the Jabba section.
It’s nice commentary on where Adywan thinks the Prequels belong (a large, junk-collecting tank). I’m happy that it’s the only real prequel reference, unless there’s a skeleton of a prequel species in the rancor pit.
Almost anything you hear on the soundtrack referring to Jabba the Hutt doesn’t exist in the movie. I do wonder if there’s a way to get all of that music back in the film - and there’s a lot of it - without it feeling cut-up and disrupted.
I think it would be a testament to Ady’s sound mixing abilities to restore some of it to the film. Luckily, sound effects shouldn’t be an issue.
While he’s likely using the ‘04 mixes as a base (with insertions from the OOT), maybe the ‘97 DTS would be a better starting point (if we have the DTS of it/if there’s a marked dynamic/separation difference between it and the ‘04/‘11).
Adywan didn’t restore any of the missing ESB cues, so I doubt he’ll restore any here. I do think that there are some cues that could work in the film. “Bounty for a Wookie” instead of the Max Rebo outro music would be nice, as would using the Obi-Wan/Luke music.
My write-up has no sequel trilogy. If it did, it’d be the Thrawn Trilogy.
That sounds like a good idea to me, keeping Vader within the Empire and taking things down from the inside. Perhaps the Mustafar confrontation could be Luke surrendering to him?
I’m not sure you need to kill off a big-name hero. ROTJ was satisfying without it. Maybe include Akbar in III and kill him in IV? Take inspiration from the story of Admiral Yi, with him dying on the bridge and his subordinates commanding the battle for him.
Dre, I’m sorry about what happened at the other site. Just keep on keeping on and don’t let the others discourage you.
I like that “two movies” idea a lot! I think I’d go about it a little differently, namely to allow Vader’s redemption a bit more development and show him trying to fess up to his mistakes. I like your ideas, Outbound Flight, so allow me to build off of them.
Episode III: Labyrinth of Evil
Do the whole rescue of Han deal, working into Han and Lando trying to mend their relationship. It could be a good piece on how Han’s character has grown and the desire to take action rather than sit the Galactic Civil War out like Lando was content to do. You even have them tag-teaming Boba Fett to end their arc, with Fett dying pretty conclusively (e.g., not much left of his body).
Have Vader fall out of favor with the Emperor (over space skype), as Palpatine replaces him with a new apprentice (call him Maul, because I’m not keen on prince pheromone from SOTE). Vader is a fugitive, with nowhere left to go in the Empire.
Maul tracks the heroes down to Tatooine, with Vader in close pursuit. Vader uses this time to reflect on how Palpatine has thrown him away and how he must join with his son to defeat the Emperor. We get flashbacks to his time as a young man, before Palpatine took him under his wing (different from the Prequel setup, obviously). These are the first inklings that Vader might be regretting his choices.
Vader finds Luke and Leia, telling them what has happened. He announces his intention to betray the Emperor by aiding the rebellion, which both Luke and Leia have some doubts about. While Luke can sense that Vader is serious, he sees that he’s doing it out of selfish reasons. Throughout the movie, as he feeds correct information to the rebels and helps out Luke and Leia, we see that he can be trustworthy yet still within the dark side.
Leia sees how pathetic Vader is and how he had little autonomy under the Emperor. He couldn’t fight the order to destroy Alderaan, even if he tried. She sees him as a useful resource but believes that he should be condemned for his crimes against the galaxy.
Pepper in some flashbacks about Vader’s past, with Luke learning his name from locals and confronting Vader with the revelation. He says the whole “That name no longer has any meaning to me” bit from ROTJ, but Luke doesn’t do the whole “true self” deal, not yet.
The movie would end with the defeat of Jabba and Maul confronting Luke and Leia. Luke would be outclassed in the fight, with Vader intervening to kill Maul. It would confuse Luke, as he did not feel Vader acting through the dark side. We also might see Leia using the Force, inadvertently, for the first time since the ESB telepathy.
Our last scene would be Luke and Vader at the ruins of the Lars Homestead. This is where Luke tells him about the good he sensed in him, begging his father to “come with him” and tease it out. Vader merely responds with “It is too late for me, son.” Luke would respond, “But is it?” The heroes travel back to the rebellion, while Vader remains and meditates on this discovery.
Episode IV - Return of the Jedi
With Vader continuing to provide the rebellion with information from a distance, the Empire (now revealed as the “Sith Empire,” which invaded and conquered the Republic - borrowing another Outbound Flight idea) has been pushed to a few straggling planets, one of which is the Wookie homeworld of Kashyyyk. We see this through a montage of imperial worlds falling to the rebels and the destruction of Star Destroyers/imperial artifacts. Learning that the Emperor is aboard his skyhook orbiting Kashyyk, the rebels plan to attack.
Han and Leia lead the strike team to take down the shield generator and allow the rebel fleet to engage the last of the imperials (think Jakku, but it’s Kashyyyk instead). Han and Leia’s arc revolves around Chewbacca, with Han believing him capable of convincing the Wookies and Leia doubting that an exiled Wookie will win them much support (Chewbacca led a failed rebellion that resulted in the enslavement of many of his kind, including himself).
Yoda and Luke meet, with Yoda dying after telling Luke about the “other Skywalker.” Obi-Wan then confirms it to be Leia, while also telling Luke that turning Vader is impossible. Luke then joins the others with the rebel fleet, telling Leia about her origins and how she can use the Force to further the rebellion’s goals.
Luke then tries to find Vader to help him face Palpatine. He finds Vader on Mustafar, the planet where he sustained the injuries that forced him into the life support suit. This is an opportunity for both a flashback (perhaps to his fight with Obi-Wan) and for Luke to remind him about the good he sensed in him. Vader tries to push that down, encouraging Luke to join him in the dark side. They resolve to confront Palpatine and overthrow him, albeit for different reasons.
Perhaps Vader converses with Flashback!Anakin, in an inversion of the Dark Side Cave from ESB. He sees a vision of what he could be had he not turned, looking a lot like David Prowse.
The Palpatine-Luke-Vader scenes play much as they do in our ROTJ, albeit with Luke and Vader coming to blows because Vader fears Luke will be too powerful for him. They fight, with Luke almost giving in to the Dark Side after Vader threatens to turn Leia. The rest of the scene plays exactly as it did before, with Vader realizing the good within him and tossing the Emperor into the skyhook’s reactor core.
The ground battle plays much as did in our ROTJ, albeit with less cutesiness and more strategy from the Wookies. The shield comes down, with Leia coming around to Chewbacca’s plan and using the Force to help access and destroy the generator. No main characters die here.
The rebel fleet attacks the skyhook and the fleet, as Lando leads them to destroy its core. The Executor also severs the skyhook from the planet, as a turned Vader uses the Force to influence Piett to ram the ship.
Our ending is the same, albeit with no jealous Han and Ewok cutesiness. The spirit of Anakin (Prowse) appears to Luke, with Leia catching a glimpse of him as well. Music would be a triumphant version of “Luke and Leia.” The camera pans up and into the stars, starting the credits.
TL;DR: Draw out Vader’s turn, have him act in ways that help undo the Empire’s damage, and give him more moments of reflection. A bit Zuko-ish, but it works. Tangentially, give Han more of an arc with Lando and Chewbacca, while also letting Leia use the Force more.
I agree with adding some EQ. If none of that works, might I suggest reaching out to a guy who can do a good Vader impression? Here’s one, Jesse Gomez:
His reading of the Luke/Vader scene is pretty good.
The big problem when stitching together dialogue is , if the intonation isn’t quite right, it can throw things off. To me, this sounds unnatural. Great work though. I have a great Vader impersonator that has offered to record some dialogue for me so, if i decide to change the line, it will be re-recorded .
That sounds fantastic to me! Does this person have some Vader impressions publicly available (e.g., on a Youtube page)?
SomethingStarWarsRelated said:
This is quite nice, Sir Ridley. However, I don’t think this single line spells it out to the audience. I hope Adywan will consider this for his edit:
Fantastic! Of course, like many ideas, LEGO Star Wars beat us the punch.
I kind of like the extra-deep rendition as well. If anything, we’ve given Adywan a fantastic demonstration that such a change is doable. I’m curious, what were your sources?
I’d say it’s better from a flow perspective, but I do think Broom Kid has a point about my tweaks to version seven. I added no reverb and slowed the whole line down, not just the first part. I thought that applying the effects universally made it less obvious, while also giving it some natural pauses. Redoing Vader’s breathing sound effects could help patch it up a little, as well as a little EQ to reduce any “artificiality.” Thankfully, Ady is a talented enough audio editor to improve the work that Sir Ridley (and myself, a little bit) have done here.
It’s fantastic that such a change is both doable and can work very well with available clips and footage.
Incremental improvements are often the difference between something that works for a fan edit and something that is completely seamless and looks/sounds like it always belonged.
The painful truth.
That’s why I could only cut “I must obey my master,” since Vader turns. Cutting the scene with Vader facing away from Luke breaks the 180 rule.
The timing of the line works now, but the clip needs a bit of a push to get it to sound perfect. You’ve done a fantastic job thus far, Sir Ridley!
While the latest version sounds pretty good, there’s no escaping that his reading of ‘mother’ is too fast for the scene. I did a search of all instances of the word ‘mother’ in the New Testament and came up with 92, some as the last word of a sentence. Surely there’s a slower reading in there?
It’s based on pieces from his Bible reading (I don’t remember which part), and he reads quite quickly. I’ll see if I can drag it out a bit, the problem is that the sound quality gets worse if it’s stretched too much.
Jedit:
New slower version. https://mega.nz/#!acsDjCYL!gQoGGPf4xwWMvGe1XKGMKi86g3KXklZmTP9uS-FTUE0
I think you’ve nailed it. Here’s it in movie form.
Also, here’s a bit of fun, courtesy of Conan the Barbarian.
Listening to the “Your mother…” clips and from picturing how the ending for ROTJ:R will be shows how this edit shouldn’t just be about the technical stuff but on what would give the story more depth.
Exactly! I support changing the line to “Your mother…” for a variety of reasons.
If we don’t acknowledge the Prequels, it gives Luke and Leia’s mother/Anakin’s wife more of a role in the story.
If we acknowledge the Prequels (say, Hal9000’s edits), it gets the movies to line up a little more.
I like the improved version! I do agree that adding the tinny undertone and maybe a pause would help. I experimented with adding a pause when playing around the version seven clip and I liked the idea behind it.
I’m trying to handle some of it, but I keep running into it sounding unnatural when I try to separate the different parts of Sir Ridley’s clip. Here’s one that incorporates the reverb and some additional fading/other items.
I’m not a big audio editor, so I suspect that it still sounds rough. It’s doable and a more talented editor can find better clips/equalization/reverb effects to make it work. I would suggest finding a clip where James Earl Jones says a drawn-out “mother” (probably from his Bible audiobook). One of the more audio-minded people here could really make this idea a reality for Adywan’s edit.