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Kenner Hand-cranked viewer and cartridges (Released)

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 (Edited)

Hi folks,

Just a quick post to say I have been contacted on youtube by some who has watched my ‘Building Empire’ and ‘Returning to Jedi’ films.  They are claiming that the Kenner 8mm Hand Cranked films have some different takes and alternate footage on them.  This could be the old childhood false memory syndrome, but I just thought I would enquire as to whether anyone has investigated this seemingly untapped area before.

Cheers

JD

Creator of Star Wars Begins, Building Empire and Returning to Jedi
Follow me on twitter @jamieSWB. Please support me at - http://www.patreon.com/jamiebenning/

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Jambe Davdar said:

Just a quick post to say I have been contacted on youtube by some who has watched my 'Building Empire' and 'Returning to Jedi' films.  They are claiming that the Kenner 8mm Hand Cranked films have some different takes and alternate footage on them.  This could be the old childhood false memory syndrome, but I just thought I would enquire as to whether anyone has investigated this seemingly untapped area before.

I was actually planning to do those next, after finishing Puggo Grande.  Don't yet know if they have alternate footage... the actual films in every cartridge I've seen are severely deteriorated.  Maybe they used some super-cheap film stock?

"Close the blast doors!"
Puggo’s website | Rescuing Star Wars

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 (Edited)

I cracked open a couple of these back in college, and tried to do some crude telecine experiments with them. Never saw any alternate takes. The only unique element were the title cards Kenner made for these.

The insides of those film cartridges is a maze of plastic gears and guides, which wear the heck out of the film loop they contain.

I know Kenner made one for Alien, but did they ever make any for Empire?

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Where were you in '77?

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satanika said:

Mielr has some of those! I think.

Yes, I've got a few of those. I haven't looked at them in a while, though.

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I used to have one of these, but not any more. It was the scene where Luke and Leia swing across the chasm.

I wonder if it has Luke's missing throw ;)

You know of the rebellion against the Empire?

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I have a couple of these as well, one cardridge even with the original box, but both (while outwardly in good shape) are in poor shape inside.  I think only one of them will actually crank, and possibly only backwards.

It's possible (though probably fairly expensive) to get hold of these in unopened condition, meaning also unplayed condition.  The film stock itself may still be deteriorated from the effects of time, but at least it wouldn't be damaged by the mechanism of the cartridge.

I guess the real question would be whether or not it's worth it to break open a new cartridge to scan the film.  If there was actually any alternate footage at all (though I'm pretty sure there isn't), it would definitely be worth it.  Regardless, I'd love to see some kind of preservation happen since this was really the only moving Star Wars footage I got to see besides the Holiday Special until Star Wars finally came out on video.

For the record, here are are the cartridges that were available for the Movie Viewer:

- May The Force Be With You (came with the viewer by default)
- Assault on Death Star
- Battle in Hyperspace
- Danger at the Cantina
- Destroy Death Star

--SKot

Projects:
Return Of The Ewok and Other Short Films (with OCPmovie) [COMPLETED]
Preserving the…cringe…Star Wars Holiday Special [COMPLETED]
The Star Wars TV Commercials Project [DORMANT]
Felix the Cat 1919-1930 early film shorts preservation [ONGOING]
Lights Out! (lost TV anthology shows) [ONGOING]
Iznogoud (1995 animated series) English audio preservation [ONGOING]

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Sorry I'm 4 years late to this thread! I'll have restored versions of all 5 cartridges soon :-)

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joetunon said:

Sorry I'm 4 years late to this thread! I'll have restored versions of all 5 cartridges soon :-)

That's awesome! How are you restoring them? How do you plan on releasing them?

A picture is worth a thousand words. Post 102 is worth more.

I’m late to the party, but I think this is the best song. Enjoy!

—Teams Jetrell Fo 1, Jetrell Fo 2, and Jetrell Fo 3

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:) Also, are there any alternate takes?

Preferred Saga:
1/2: Hal9000
3: L8wrtr
4/5: Adywan
6-9: Hal9000

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Wow, that was a fast response! I'm glad to see this thread is still alive! I didn't think I'd ever find anyone who would appreciate it! 

This is actually my second iteration of this restoration (I did the first one's with VHS footage before there were any DVDs). 99% of the work is already done for this newer iteration. Here's what I did:

- ripped the appropriate scenes from the theatrical DVDs (using the viewer and cartridges as a reference)

- edited the sequences to match the cartridges' scenes, frame by frame (very painstaking, and for the second time!)

- cropped each scene to the exact dimensions of the same scene on the cartridges (again, very painstaking, but wasn't possible the first time since the VHS versions had their own cropping that didn't match the cartridges)

- flipped 3 of the 5 resulting sequences horizontally (which is how Kenner made them for some reason, adding to the charm of these sequences)

- emulated the opening logo for each of the cartridges 

I'll post on YouTube when I'm done (should be in just a couple of weeks).

To answer the other question, there are no alternate takes, but the horizontally flipped scenes make them look like different footage, and most likely contributed to the memory of "alternate footage" ;-)

Between collecting the cartridges again on eBay, ripping from VHS and then ripping again from DVD, I probably spent a good 2 years of my life recreating my favorite childhood toy! I did this for my own pleasure so that I could once again scroll through the sequences I grew up with by recreating them digitally and playing them on a PDA or smartphone with software that would allow me to play the sequences forwards and backwards, and frame by frame, just like I could on the toy.

I just can't believe there's anyone else who cares! I definitely though this would be something I would only be able to enjoy without sharing it with anyone.

Stay tuned!  

MTFBWY

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Upon re-reading this thread it occurred to me I still might be on my own in enjoying this restoration, as I was referring to digital, not physical, restoration of this toy viewer and its cartridges. Sorry if I unintentionally got anyone's hopes up. Please let me know if you're still interested in a digital restoration of these sequences. 

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Don't sell yourself short.  While I would be most interested in preserving the original slides, particularly if they were taken from an alternate take, I think this is a worthwhile project you have completed.  Many projects here recreate an archaic format of something Star Wars related in a new manner.  For instance, there are projects that take The Story of Star Wars trilogy LPs and put them with video.  It appears quite successful.  I am definitely interested in what you have done. :)

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I definitely think there would be some interest around here.

I keep hoping someone would undertake a preservation of the Kenner Give A Show filmstrips. Something similar has been done with the ones made for classic Doctor Who, and have become DVD extras.

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Where were you in '77?

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I would love to see a Give-a-Show restoration too! I loved that toy.

I'm sure this has been asked a billion times: there's no search feature in these forums, is there? It's awful hard to find stuff.

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I would sure like to check these out.

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joetunon said:

I would love to see a Give-a-Show restoration too! I loved that toy.

I'm sure this has been asked a billion times: there's no search feature in these forums, is there? It's awful hard to find stuff.

I think we had one several years ago, until someone spilled coffee on it or something. ;)

Seriously though, google is probably the only way to search old posts for now.

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Where were you in '77?

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This thread had been lost in the fan edits forum, now moved into the correct location.

For those who have not seen it, here is Puggo's mockumentary about the restoration of the Kenner hand-cranked footage:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSXsvC4ZUHk

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Definitely interested! I have several cartridges...and are pretty familiar with the ones I don't have anymore. I seriously doubt there was any alternate footage.  They didn't plan on making these...only when the film was so successful did they go ahead, so I doubt they were working with temp footage or anything other than a super 8 print.

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 (Edited)

I don't know if this was pointed out anywhere else in the forum, but as I mentioned above, there is no alternate footage on these clips. The first three cartridges - "May the Force Be With You", "Destroy Death Star", and "Battle in Hyperspace" - contain horizontally flipped but otherwise familiar footage, while the final two - "Danger at the Cantina" and "Assault on Death Star" - are also familiar footage but with the correct orientation. The opening logos on all 5 are correct, so Kenner must have copied or mounted the footage backwards on the first three before adding the logos, and must not have caught on until they made the 4th and 5th sequences! 

Puggo's restoration of the first cartridge - "May the Force Be With You" - flipped the footage back to its original theatrical orientation. Anyone who owns the toy with the included cartridge can confirm this. The footage on the toy is not alternate footage, but horizontally flipped footage! Hence the childhood memories of "alternate" footage!

I'm almost done with all 5 restorations, and they will be true to Kenner's cropping choices and horizontal anomolies :-)

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These horizontally flipped pieces of footage can turn into footage for fanedits by next year.

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Ronster said:

Is this a wined up?

Like, it drank too much wine?

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TV's Frink said:

Ronster said:

Is this a wined up?

Like, it drank too much wine?

For one, it can be cranked, so no it's not a wind up, and two, probably.