logo Sign In

STAR WARS: EP VI -RETURN OF THE JEDI "REVISITED EDITION"ADYWAN - ** PRODUCTION HAS NOW RESTARTED ** — Page 37

Author
Time
 (Edited)

I initially would’ve suggested camo troopers, but like others have said, the all-white Imperial troops are reflective of Palpatine’s arrogance. Really, many aspects of the Empire are reflective of his arrogance and scare tactics. The AT-ATs are clearly less effective modes of transportation than the tanks in ROTS, but they’re also clearly more visually impressive and intimidating. The Death Star could’ve been stripped down to the size of a capital ship, consisting only of the superlaser, a control room, and engines to get 'er moving, but he chose to make it moon-sized with living quarters and hangars instead 'cause seeing an artifical planet-killing moon in the sky would make the population of a world crap their collective pants.

If Palpatine wasn’t utilitarian when it came to walkers and battle stations, why would he be towards grunt armour?

Author
Time
 (Edited)

DominicCobb said:

Is rejecting Jani from the forum on topic?

So instead of arguing with thoughts that makes sense, and true, just reject someone, because that is something you can’t do.
Rejecting you is way much better. You added nothing just acid.

Author
Time

Valheru_84 said:

Briefly on the topic of storm trooper camo - it’s entirely unnecessary and counter productive to the narrative and plot devices that the purposefully always white troopers are. Throughout the movies you see their armour take different shapes and forms in different environments that do provide different functionality but they always remain white which points to a higher conscious decision to maintain a stark white armour despite adapting its form & design to the conditions and military engagement.

From a logical viewpoint not taking anything else into account, yes it makes sense from a military perspective to provide forest, desert or urban camo armour as per the environment they are deployed to but this logic has obviously been consciously overriden (as per a GL statement quoted in an earlier post) in favour of the image and message it conveys by all troopers remaining white. It speaks to the might and power of the Empire, a constant and unmissable message conveyed wherever ther are seen, that they need not bother with such tactical matters nor do they ever feel the need even consider such matters as who would raise a hand against the mighty Empire? Until the Rebels off course…

The only military members of the Empire (apart from the Officers) that are not white are the black fighter pilots who primarily will always be on a Star Destroyer or the Death Star or actually inside a Tie fighter and not seen by the general public as well. And then there’s the ceremonial guards in red which again is all about the associated message - it is the colour of blood and is meant to convey fear and awe as it signifies the imminent arrival or presence of the Emperor himself.

It’s all about visual language such as the fact that Vader being all black makes him a fearful figure and really stand out in the Empire against the vast ranks of opposingly stark white storm troopers. Also being the public face of the Empire, troopers being white could be seen as a way to placate and mislead the masses into continual complacent acceptance of their control since white is not generally associated with ‘evil’ but with ‘good’ and so the masses are less likely to care about the Empire’s motives as long as they are generally left alone and will turn a blind eye to events they don’t have first hand knowledge or involvement with.

Ok, maybe that wasn’t so brief LOL…

.Val

Not brief but spot on.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

doubleofive said:

Adywan doesn’t like the prequels, but does like the new movies. So yes?

Could be fun to see a very old Naboo fighter taking part of the space battle though.

Author
Time

Can we elect Jani-wan as the new emperor of the site? He’s always right…someone wise, who makes us all agree! I know he’d be welcomed with thunderous applause!

Author
Time

ray_afraid said:

I agree, but this set in during the carbon freezing scene in Empire. 3PO suddenly becomes the voice that tells the idiots in the audience what’s going on and that trait follows him to Jedi.

SilverWook said:

It’s plot exposition. It has to go somewhere.

With respect, it’s bad plot exposition when it breaks the “show, don’t tell” rule of writing.

IMHO his exposition in ESB is forgivable as the audience is obviously completely unfamiliar with the potential outcomes of carbon freezing a human being. Having Threepio inform the audience is beneficial, and the way it was written was handled quite deftly.

Oh, they’ve encased him in carbonite. He should be quite well protected. If he survived the freezing process, that is.

Yes he comments directly on what’s happening on screen, but the primary comment is on the technical result of the process, with Han’s well-being a secondary thought. Exposition is delivered in an organic way with a dash of humour.

However in ROTJ it’s just amateur writing. The DarthRush edit trims this dialogue and the movie is better for it.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

nhoj3 said:

ray_afraid said:

I agree, but this set in during the carbon freezing scene in Empire. 3PO suddenly becomes the voice that tells the idiots in the audience what’s going on and that trait follows him to Jedi.

SilverWook said:

It’s plot exposition. It has to go somewhere.

IMHO his exposition in ESB is forgivable as the audience is obviously completely unfamiliar with the potential outcomes of carbon freezing a human being. Having Threepio inform the audience is beneficial, and the way it was written was handled quite deftly.

But Vader, Fett and Lando already tell us everything we need to know there. The dangers and the outcome. The exposition was handled very well until 3PO starts talking. Then it’s info dump for those who can’t pay attention.
It’s always sounded ham fisted/shoehorned to me. Just like his many moments in Jedi.

Ray’s Lounge
Biggs in ANH edit idea
ROTJ opening edit idea

Author
Time

darth_ender said:

Can we elect Jani-wan as the new emperor of the site? He’s always right…someone wise, who makes us all agree! I know he’d be welcomed with thunderous applause!

I always read this.

Author
Time

Loved TESB: Revisited, Ady! You did a phenomenal job!

Copied from my post on the wishlist thread:


I really want Sebastian Shaw to morph into Hayden Christensen - but not the same shot of Christensen that was used for the DVD/Blu-Ray release.

Heck - morph Alec into Ewan…Yoda can stay the same.


I’m gonna be a father! - ETA December 24th 2017

Author
Time

Darth Chronus said:

Loved TESB: Revisited, Ady! You did a phenomenal job!

Copied from my post on the wishlist thread:


I really want Sebastian Shaw to morph into Hayden Christensen - but not the same shot of Christensen that was used for the DVD/Blu-Ray release.

Heck - morph Alec into Ewan…Yoda can stay the same.


Yoda morphs into Creepy Puppet Yoda or no go.

Star Wars Revisited Wordpress

Star Wars Visual Comparisons WordPress

Author
Time

doubleofive said:

Darth Chronus said:

Loved TESB: Revisited, Ady! You did a phenomenal job!

Copied from my post on the wishlist thread:


I really want Sebastian Shaw to morph into Hayden Christensen - but not the same shot of Christensen that was used for the DVD/Blu-Ray release.

Heck - morph Alec into Ewan…Yoda can stay the same.


Yoda morphs into Creepy Puppet Yoda or no go.

Hahahaha!
Then Mace appears behind Anakin…and he looks grumpy.
Then all the younglings can appear…

Okay that’s taking it too far! Lmao!

I’m gonna be a father! - ETA December 24th 2017

Author
Time

darth_ender said:

Can we elect Jani-wan as the new emperor of the site? He’s always right…someone wise, who makes us all agree! I know he’d be welcomed with thunderous applause!

Im the bad guy, huh?
“Always right”, huh?
Feel free to prove me wrong on anything I said. No one stops you. On the contrary. I would even welcome that, since these arguments are what make projects benefit the most. These are the ones that clear things up, so when it comes to decisions, all the best information is available.
I don’t care if Im right or wrong. I only care about the product. Unlike you.

People who resort to irrelevant personal attacks without actually debating the content of an argument, are either unable to argue, because they are wrong, or not smart enough to argue, and unable to accept what they are.
Seems like you decided you are one of those people, instead of trying to help the project. Too bad.

Author
Time

doubleofive said:

Darth Chronus said:

Loved TESB: Revisited, Ady! You did a phenomenal job!

Copied from my post on the wishlist thread:


I really want Sebastian Shaw to morph into Hayden Christensen - but not the same shot of Christensen that was used for the DVD/Blu-Ray release.

Heck - morph Alec into Ewan…Yoda can stay the same.


Yoda morphs into Creepy Puppet Yoda or no go.

LOL

Author
Time

Gotta love newbies who think they know everything…so see if you can figure this one out.

Jani-wan said:

“Now Lucasfilm does what Disney says. If Disney says reshoot half the movie, they do.
If Disney says we need X-trooper for no logical reason but to sell, than there will be X-trooper in the movie.”

Jani-wan said:

“All I said is the truth. Like it or not.”

Author
Time

Jani-wan said:

darth_ender said:

Can we elect Jani-wan as the new emperor of the site? He’s always right…someone wise, who makes us all agree! I know he’d be welcomed with thunderous applause!

Im the bad guy, huh?
“Always right”, huh?
Feel free to prove me wrong on anything I said. No one stops you. On the contrary. I would even welcome that, since these arguments are what make projects benefit the most. These are the ones that clear things up, so when it comes to decisions, all the best information is available.
I don’t care if Im right or wrong. I only care about the product. Unlike you.

People who resort to irrelevant personal attacks without actually debating the content of an argument, are either unable to argue, because they are wrong, or not smart enough to argue, and unable to accept what they are.
Seems like you decided you are one of those people, instead of trying to help the project. Too bad.

You got me, pardner! Adywan can screw it up for all I care. I just want to insult you and no one else for no particular reason. Now that I’ve been outed, I don’t have to hide it anymore!

Author
Time

TV’s Frink said:

darth_ender said:

Can we elect Jani-wan as the new emperor of the site? He’s always right…someone wise, who makes us all agree! I know he’d be welcomed with thunderous applause!

I always read this.

You got one of my two references! Wanna go for the double?

Author
Time

Jani-wan said:

darth_ender said:

Can we elect Jani-wan as the new emperor of the site? He’s always right…someone wise, who makes us all agree! I know he’d be welcomed with thunderous applause!

Im the bad guy, huh?
“Always right”, huh?
Feel free to prove me wrong on anything I said. No one stops you. On the contrary. I would even welcome that, since these arguments are what make projects benefit the most. These are the ones that clear things up, so when it comes to decisions, all the best information is available.
I don’t care if Im right or wrong. I only care about the product. Unlike you.

People who resort to irrelevant personal attacks without actually debating the content of an argument, are either unable to argue, because they are wrong, or not smart enough to argue, and unable to accept what they are.
Seems like you decided you are one of those people, instead of trying to help the project. Too bad.

Or maybe some of us don’t want to muck up ady’s thread with an off topic debate that we’ve already had a million times before?

Author
Time

DominicCobb said:

Jani-wan said:

darth_ender said:

Can we elect Jani-wan as the new emperor of the site? He’s always right…someone wise, who makes us all agree! I know he’d be welcomed with thunderous applause!

Im the bad guy, huh?
“Always right”, huh?
Feel free to prove me wrong on anything I said. No one stops you. On the contrary. I would even welcome that, since these arguments are what make projects benefit the most. These are the ones that clear things up, so when it comes to decisions, all the best information is available.
I don’t care if Im right or wrong. I only care about the product. Unlike you.

People who resort to irrelevant personal attacks without actually debating the content of an argument, are either unable to argue, because they are wrong, or not smart enough to argue, and unable to accept what they are.
Seems like you decided you are one of those people, instead of trying to help the project. Too bad.

Or maybe some of us don’t want to muck up ady’s thread with an off topic debate that we’ve already had a million times before?

Stop adding nothing just acid. We’re as tripped-out as we can go.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Okay then, things apparently got a bit out of hand up there…

To bring this back on topic, I guess now is as good as any to throw in my 2 cents about the camo/white armor debate from earlier.

I was initially in favor of the idea with some kind of camouflage armor for (most of) the Imperials on the moon of Endor. This is the concept art that got me completely on board with it:
camo

For camo, I thought the above image displays it quite subtly. It’s not in your face with several, vibrant, earthy colors, but it’s enough to serve its purpose. It makes sense, after all, that they’d have something to help hide themselves in the forest. It also goes along with the Empire having multiple armor designs for designated roles/locations, including the shoretroopers (I know, I noticed there are some differing opinions about them, but I liked them just fine).

However, people here not wanting them to have camo armor have made several good points, and for sure I’d agree with most of those points I’ve read. In addition, I’d also add another con with having camo for Imperials: There must be a distinguishable difference between the Rebels (who already do have camo) from the Imperials, otherwise I can see it getting confusing in certain instances for the audience.

But, here’s an alternative idea I haven’t seen brought up here yet: what about introducing the shadow troopers?
shadow
These guys have armor like your standard stormtroopers, so no alterations to the armor is needed, except they are black (or I’ve sometimes seen very dark gray). Could be relatively easy, too, to adjust the hue of the originally white armor in an editor (for sure easier than adding camo frame-by-frame). Then for shooting extra scenes during the battle, most of the extra Imperial troopers could possibly already be wearing this type of armor; I’m sure there are many good ones out there created by fans.

I just love the idea of there being a visual difference from the standard stormtroopers and the Emperor’s “best troops” (assuming his dialogue is left as is, and not condensed to be "An entire legion* of troops awaits them). If Krennic has his death troopers, I believe the Emperor would have certainly hand-picked a selection of “best” soldiers to have custom armor too.

So with this idea for having shadow troopers, A) the black (or very dark gray) will hide them a lot better in a forest environment than white (which was the reason for suggesting camo to start with), B) keeps true with the Empire having primarily white/black armor (which goes along with those who made points against camo armor), and C) of course it would add that extra element of ‘badass’ during the battle.

With that in mind, I believe there should still be some regular white scout/stormtroopers on the moon. Could actually be very interesting to see ordinary stormtroopers being overshadowed (pun not intended) by the prowess and aggressiveness of the Emperor’s “shadow troopers”.

(*) This has been brought up before long ago, but should the Emperor say “legion”? Instead should it be just “garrison” perhaps? Legion sounds overly large, unless of course he was purposefully exaggerating to Luke in hopes of getting him riled up any way possible - If so, I’d buy that for a dollar. So I guess I could go either way about this.

Wishlist Of Ideas/Suggestions For Improving ROTJ

Author
Time
 (Edited)

.Mac. said:

But, here’s an alternative idea I haven’t seen brought up here yet: what about introducing the shadow troopers?
shadow
These guys have armor like your standard stormtroopers, so no alterations to the armor is needed, except they are black (or I’ve sometimes seen very dark gray). Could be relatively easy, too, to adjust the hue of the originally white armor in an editor (for sure easier than adding camo frame-by-frame). Then for shooting extra scenes during the battle, most of the extra Imperial troopers could possibly already be wearing this type of armor; I’m sure there are many good ones out there created by fans.

I just love the idea of there being a visual difference from the standard stormtroopers and the Emperor’s “best troops” (assuming his dialogue is left as is, and not condensed to be "An entire legion* of troops awaits them). If Krennic has his death troopers, I believe the Emperor would have certainly hand-picked a selection of “best” soldiers to have custom armor too.

So with this idea for having shadow troopers, A) the black (or very dark gray) will hide them a lot better in a forest environment than white (which was the reason for suggesting camo to start with), B) keeps true with the Empire having primarily white/black armor (which goes along with those who made points against camo armor), and C) of course it would add that extra element of ‘badass’ during the battle.

With that in mind, I believe there should still be some regular white scout/stormtroopers on the moon. Could actually be very interesting to see ordinary stormtroopers being overshadowed (pun not intended) by the prowess and aggressiveness of the Emperor’s “shadow troopers”.

(*) This has been brought up before long ago, but should the Emperor say “legion”? Instead should it be just “garrison” perhaps? Legion sounds overly large, unless of course he was purposefully exaggerating to Luke in hopes of getting him riled up any way possible - If so, I’d buy that for a dollar. So I guess I could go either way about this.

This I like. I’ve loved the shadow troopers since I first saw them in the Crimson Empire comics.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

nhoj3 said:

ray_afraid said:

I agree, but this set in during the carbon freezing scene in Empire. 3PO suddenly becomes the voice that tells the idiots in the audience what’s going on and that trait follows him to Jedi.

SilverWook said:

It’s plot exposition. It has to go somewhere.

With respect, it’s bad plot exposition when it breaks the “show, don’t tell” rule of writing.

IMHO his exposition in ESB is forgivable as the audience is obviously completely unfamiliar with the potential outcomes of carbon freezing a human being. Having Threepio inform the audience is beneficial, and the way it was written was handled quite deftly.

Oh, they’ve encased him in carbonite. He should be quite well protected. If he survived the freezing process, that is.

Yes he comments directly on what’s happening on screen, but the primary comment is on the technical result of the process, with Han’s well-being a secondary thought. Exposition is delivered in an organic way with a dash of humour.

However in ROTJ it’s just amateur writing. The DarthRush edit trims this dialogue and the movie is better for it.

It’s a joke. Somebody never saw The Great Muppet Caper. 😛

Forum Moderator

Where were you in '77?

Author
Time

Sadly, too many people haven’t seen it. Highly underrated.

Author
Time

SilverWook said:

nhoj3 said:

ray_afraid said:

I agree, but this set in during the carbon freezing scene in Empire. 3PO suddenly becomes the voice that tells the idiots in the audience what’s going on and that trait follows him to Jedi.

SilverWook said:

It’s plot exposition. It has to go somewhere.

With respect, it’s bad plot exposition when it breaks the “show, don’t tell” rule of writing.

IMHO his exposition in ESB is forgivable as the audience is obviously completely unfamiliar with the potential outcomes of carbon freezing a human being. Having Threepio inform the audience is beneficial, and the way it was written was handled quite deftly.

Oh, they’ve encased him in carbonite. He should be quite well protected. If he survived the freezing process, that is.

Yes he comments directly on what’s happening on screen, but the primary comment is on the technical result of the process, with Han’s well-being a secondary thought. Exposition is delivered in an organic way with a dash of humour.

However in ROTJ it’s just amateur writing. The DarthRush edit trims this dialogue and the movie is better for it.

It’s a joke. Somebody never saw The Great Muppet Caper. 😛

I called it first! Your joke made me very happy. Best part about it is that Muppets are on topic in this thread!

Author
Time

I think you’ve confused Muppets with puppets.

And a Star Wars puppet making an appearance on The Muppets doesn’t count!