STAR WARS: EP VI -RETURN OF THE JEDI "REVISITED EDITION"ADYWAN - ** PRODUCTION HAS NOW RESTARTED ** — Page 31

TV’s Frink said:

I think some of you puppet lovers are seeing them through nostalgia glasses.

Yoda was brilliant. But compare him to some of those ROTJ puppets…it’s not even close.

Thank you.
When Max Rebo appeared on screen when I was but a wee lad, I started laughing. Mom asked “Do you like that guy?” and, still laughing, I yelled “No!”

asterisk8 said:

I have a soft spot for the bad ROTJ puppets because there’s something endearing about the handmade craft quality to them that shiny CGI just doesn’t have.

I have a soft spot for many of the effects that have been removed from SW:R and ESB:R, but they were removed for a reason…
And I don’t know why CGI keeps coming up. Nobody’s suggesting that the terrible monster designs be replaced by cartoons.

It’s perfectly fine to have the “bad looking puppets” in the background of shots (that is if the shot is important to keep to begin with), but it’s when they are frequently and unnecessarily brought up to the foreground as they are seen laughing, that’s when their costuming stands out and it just looks silly. So yeah, with nostalgia aside, these certain close-up shots can be removed without tarnishing the quality of the scene 😃

I can’t believe that anybody who has seen ESB:R would be worried about Ady’s ability to alter backgrounds without tarnishing the scenes. It’s kinda his specialty, no?

Only thing I will suggest in this thread is to remove or replace as many puppets in ROTJ as possible.

There is something so lacking in quality in Jabba’s palace compared to ESB - and even it’s much-cheaper ANH counterpart, that the entire sequence is so conflicting to witness. From one scene to another I go from excited to laughing, to annoyed, to laughing again. I will never forget last year when me and two friends re-watched ROTJ the first time in two years (for my part at least), and I was so conflicted about the whole beginning. We couldn’t stop laughing at certain parts because of the stiff movements from many of the aliens, or their horrible facial designs and/or movements. The whole experience made ROTJ into a comedy for me.

If replacing or somehow improving proves difficult or too expensive, I’d suggest just removing the worst designs that are in the forefront all together.

The problem isn’t just that many of the designs are poorly done or ineffective in costume, but that it cheapens the entire sequence in Jabba’s Palace, which is a very worrying problem for the rest of the movie.

The designs that do work are undeniably Jabba, Boba Fett, Leia in disguise, Jabba’s Guards, and others given more than a two-second treatment. Most of the others… what were they thinking… this wasn’t 1950. This was the 80’s! The height of puppeteering and practical effects. And simply going for “background characters will go unnoticed” as a thought of process simply won’t due, even with nostalgia added into the mix.

It would be better to remove all the unpractical and/or bad designs sticking out and have fewer people in the Palace, than a bunch of “im a man in a suit” to take you completely out of the movie and ruin suspension of disbelief. We mustn’ forget that this is the ending chapter (or was, that is) of the Saga, and to have the supposedly thrilling and action-packed opening sequence be dragged down by a bunch of bad and lazy designs will ruin the rest of the experience - especially with the introdution of the Ewooks just 30 minutes later. You could instead rely on sound design to make the Palace more crowded and its inhabitants be a little bit more “everywhere”, as in there are more rooms nearby in which aliens party and talk.

TV’s Frink said:

For what it’s worth, I hate this guy’s design.

He’d fit right in at Jabba’s palace, unfortunately.

You’re not allowed to have the same opinion as me!
It says so in clause 42-b of the standard Internet Behavior form.

TV’s Frink said:

For what it’s worth, I hate this guy’s design.

He’d fit right in at Jabba’s palace, unfortunately.

That’s it, one quarter portion for you then 😉

It’s interesting to me, though, you think that poorly of him. I actually appreciated his design probably because I saw it as an attempt to be the “mediator”, if you will, for the better designs and the poorer ones that have been created in SW. I guess I wasn’t bothered either because I thought the personality of his character was interesting too. But I realize this is a whole 'nother topic for another thread.

So to bring this back on track, Ady’s skills at digital enhancements (like what they did for Unkar Plutt and what he did for the cantina) is of course the way to go for enhancing many of the background puppets in Jabba’s palace 😃

I think part of the problem most of us have with this is the fact that he looks a lot like the thing being cooked in Men in Black 3.

CarboniteSolo said:

Of course they don’t look good, they didn’t have much time to build them from scratch with the limited amount of time George had to pick the ones he wanted from several other designs that were created.

lol no

the main reason that a lot of them are not that great, is because… it really didn’t matter to George at the time, he just wanted to finish his trilogy and be done with it.

yes

DominicCobb said:

How do you even “fix” Max Rebo without just filming a new puppet altogether?

I think Ady can do some tricks to fix him up. Changing the cartoon color, dulling the plastic sheen and bringing him to life a la the cantina creatures/Yoda will go a long way.
If he can add four eyes to a lizard, I imagine he can do some tricks with Rebo.

nightstalkerpoet said:

I think part of the problem most of us have with this is the fact that he looks a lot like the thing being cooked in Men in Black 3.

That’s a blobfish.

Bingowings said:

FVDnz said:

Bingowings said:

regularjoe said:

The Obi-Wan scene is needless, all he does is tell Luke that Leia is his sister. Cut that. Cut it cut it cut it - do it. Now.
Cut this scene and leave the one where Yoda says “there is another Skywalker.” Trim the scene where Luke and Leia talk on Endor to reflect this
NOW
During the end battle Vader says “you have a twin sister” do a flash of Leia via the Force. Yads did this in one of his edits but if my memory is correct I don’t think he scrubbed all the earlier stuff. Now it was Darth Vader who told Luke that he was his father and now it is Darth Vader telling Luke that he has sister, who is now fair play as a target. The scene makes the Skywalker family tree a revelation to Luke, Vader and the Emperor. Luke losing his cool makes even more sense when you cut it this way. I’ve done an edit of RotJ using the Yads edit as a base (the Boba Fett less one) and it works very, very well.

I disagree. I think Ben needs to answer for out and out lying to Luke. If one half of that interlude needs to go it’s Yoda’s death scene. It’s awful and says less.
Particularly positioned where it is in the movie. He hangs around for the whole gap between Luke leaving for Cloud City and coming back from Jabba just to get a bit ill, tired and then die within a space of a few moments and without finishing his final sentence. The whole sequence is comically awful. George is practically screaming at the audience (I DONT WANT TO DO ANY MORE STAR WARS MOVIES). Like Boba Fett its a thing that we don’t even need to see. Luke could be on Tatooine and sense Yoda’s passing if he is a fully trained Jedi Knight. Ben however has to finish telling Luke the story of his father. I would prefer him to do that where he started on Tatooine where there is some actual resonance rather than resting his ghost butt on a tree stump on Dagobah but it’s not my show.

How would it work if Ben revealed his story to Luke on Endor after the Battle had been won? Of course, some dialogue will need to be edited out such as Luke discovering that Leia is his sister. Which would also include having to possibly bring Luke and Leia’s conversation later in the film as well like before or during the celebrations, but it would be difficult with Luke leaving to face Vader in the scene originally. It would be quite an undertaking and could it really disrupt the flow of the ending that much?!

Exposition when necessary should be a springboard. The only way you could have ghost Ben do this on Endor would be as a prelude to a prequel edit. You won, this is where you have come to, now I will tell to a tale of where you came from.

I guess in a way you’re right. This is a concluding part of a trilogy after all, unlike Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix where Dumbledore had been avoiding Harry for most of the novel, then began to tell everything to him at the end of the story. Luke discovering Vader as his father was hard enough, but to learn that Leia being his twin sister while facing his father during the final battle? Now I’m beginning to think it not being a good idea after all, but I do think the Luke Ben conversation on Dagobah could be touched on a little.