Jay has said more bans are likely as he reviews the thread. And he hasn’t even seen the movie yet so he’s spoiling himself in the process.
He should watch it first then. This is his site, so he should have already watched it.
People are busy, y’know.
People can make time for things.
Dude, the movie has only been out for less than a week.
Jay has said more bans are likely as he reviews the thread. And he hasn’t even seen the movie yet so he’s spoiling himself in the process.
He should watch it first then. This is his site, so he should have already watched it.
Besides, if he can’t ban the person the used the r-word, because he hasn’t read the thread because he hasn’t seen TLJ, then how can be ban Frink? Someone with banning power must have Frinks post.
I think it was Jason or Wook.
Jay made the post explaining the ban.
Yeah I know. I’m not sure how the reporting system works, is what I’m saying I guess. I assume someone reported a post, and Jay read it, or another mod read it and reported it to Jay, or whatever. I don’t know.
Jay has said previously that all reports are only sent to him.
Jay has said more bans are likely as he reviews the thread. And he hasn’t even seen the movie yet so he’s spoiling himself in the process.
I hope the person who used that word is a part of those bannings.
It wasn’t willfully offensive, though. He just used R in lieu of, say, the word idiot. People over there are all comparing the r-word to the n-word—while I understand the need to try not to be offensive, the r-word is not omgwhattheheckdidyoujustsay levels of offensive that’s worthy of instaban—despite it hitting a sensitive chord for some people.
At a basic level, these words are just words. The things that makes them epithets is how people react to them. If people react to the r-word as much as the n-word, they should be treated the same.
Jay has said more bans are likely as he reviews the thread. And he hasn’t even seen the movie yet so he’s spoiling himself in the process.
He should watch it first then. This is his site, so he should have already watched it.
Besides, if he can’t ban the person the used the r-word, because he hasn’t read the thread because he hasn’t seen TLJ, then how can be ban Frink? Someone with banning power must have Frinks post.
I think it was Jason or Wook.
Jay made the post explaining the ban.
Ok, if I am understanding things correctly, someone described a character in TLJ by using the r-word. It of course pissed off Frink and he responded using the f-word and other things and got temp banned for it. Did the person using the r-word get banned or disciplined at all?
No, and that’s what I think is the real injustice.
They only said it once. And they did get warned that it’s not acceptable.
How many times they said shouldn’t matter. The point is, the rules say that any use of slurs results in an “immediate and permanent ban with no prior warning.” Jay should at least apply his rules equally.
Frink, meanwhile, didn’t just blow up about that, but he kept berating and harassing Jedi Master Skywalker about probably-being-JMOW instead of just reporting him and letting the mods sort it out. (by the way, JMSW is not JMOW, so say the mods.)
Ok, but if it were for his whole corpus of behavior that day, Jay should have said so. My argument is not that Frink should not have been banned, but that both should have been banned. That’s the fairest solution.
Frink has had more than one incident, and over an extended period of time. Just that one use of r-word is not, I think, ban-worthy.
Under my reading of the rules, it is.
Jay has said more bans are likely as he reviews the thread. And he hasn’t even seen the movie yet so he’s spoiling himself in the process.
He should watch it first then. This is his site, so he should have already watched it.
People are busy, y’know.
Jay has said more bans are likely as he reviews the thread. And he hasn’t even seen the movie yet so he’s spoiling himself in the process.
I hope the person who used that word is a part of those bannings.
Ok, if I am understanding things correctly, someone described a character in TLJ by using the r-word. It of course pissed off Frink and he responded using the f-word and other things and got temp banned for it. Did the person using the r-word get banned or disciplined at all?
No, and that’s what I think is the real injustice.
I suppose where I’m at with it is this: People saying things need to be mature and sensitive of others; and people hearing things need to be mature and not overreact.
The arguments people make about offensive conversation seem to gravitate toward one side or the other, when I think both are exactly equally important. On the one side people accuse the offended as “snowflakes”, and on the other side people accuse the offensive as racist, whatever-negative-stereotype.
I think the important thing is to be mature about things, whether speaking or listening in equal measure. And that doesn’t mean people have to watch everything they say, but that they can also diffuse a tense moment quickly and easily when it happens by being civil and mature.
A: "[unknowningly offensive word]"
B: "Please don’t use that word. It’s offensive to me."
A: “Oh. Okay, I’m sorry.”I’m guilty of over-reacting here as well. And, for me at least, it’s because for a long time, it was nearly impossible to get the moderation to do anything unless a post was really over the top vile (like the guy who posted 100 anime dicks). So things naturally escalated, and we would all just basically act like bigger and bigger (anime) dicks toward each other. Walking away was probably the right thing to do. But with little moderation in place, walking away might have felt more like just handing over the thread to people who are in the wrong. Frink may have felt that way at times, and I certainly think people have thought it when they’ve stood up to Frink at times when he hijacked threads.
I quite agree. If you’re here, you’re probably of the argumentative type, which means that it might be hard to let your arguments go. I’ve felt that many times before. You hold on to your arguments like children.
I’m just tired of that. Just tired. It doesn’t matter who posts their opinion about anything, there’s always someone whining about it and needing to have the last word. It’s become so tiresome that it’s better to just keep your opinions to yourself if you don’t want the bully squad on your ass.
Wrong!
So, for how long will this ban be in place? A couple of days? A week? A month?
I suppose where I’m at with it is this: People saying things need to be mature and sensitive of others; and people hearing things need to be mature and not overreact.
The arguments people make about offensive conversation seem to gravitate toward one side or the other, when I think both are exactly equally important. On the one side people accuse the offended as “snowflakes”, and on the other side people accuse the offensive as racist, whatever-negative-stereotype.
I think the important thing is to be mature about things, whether speaking or listening in equal measure. And that doesn’t mean people have to watch everything they say, but that they can also diffuse a tense moment quickly and easily when it happens by being civil and mature.
A: "[unknowningly offensive word]"
B: "Please don’t use that word. It’s offensive to me."
A: “Oh. Okay, I’m sorry.”I’m guilty of over-reacting here as well. And, for me at least, it’s because for a long time, it was nearly impossible to get the moderation to do anything unless a post was really over the top vile (like the guy who posted 100 anime dicks). So things naturally escalated, and we would all just basically act like bigger and bigger (anime) dicks toward each other. Walking away was probably the right thing to do. But with little moderation in place, walking away might have felt more like just handing over the thread to people who are in the wrong. Frink may have felt that way at times, and I certainly think people have thought it when they’ve stood up to Frink at times when he hijacked threads.
I quite agree. If you’re here, you’re probably of the argumentative type, which means that it might be hard to let your arguments go. I’ve felt that many times before. You hold on to your arguments like children.
We have moderation now. And Jason seems to be quite responsive. We should be able to deal with inflammatory posters in a reasonable way like many other forums do, now. Maybe I’m wrong, and Frink’s behavior doesn’t stem from this. I just think that a lot of the tension and escalation that happens here is due to it, previously, being a bit ‘wild west’ and people defending themselves instead of being able to rely on moderation.
I think this has a bit of truth to it.
…inconsistent application of the rules.
Welcome to OT.com, we hope you enjoy your stay.
If they’re going to be inconsistent, at least just state it clearly and don’t direct your moderators to say that they are interested in fairness.
I would like to direct attention to rule number seven.
- Personal attacks and slurs based on race/ethnicity/religion/gender/sexual orientation/etc. aren’t tolerated under any circumstances.
While Frink’s posts may well have been an overreaction, couldn’t using the “r-word” be considered a slur based on mental ability? Or is it not considered so on this forum? Pretty much every dictionary agrees that it is an offensive and derogatory term, so why do we treat it differently as other slurs? Also notable is that this rule, according to the announcement, is punishable by an “immediate and permanent ban with no prior warning.”
On another note, I can understand where Frink is coming from, but having to respond, mentioning your children, to every post that contains that word is a bit excessive. The fairest punishment would have been to ban all involved.
I agree the word is a slur and ban worthy, though I think he got away with it because he wasn’t using it in reference to any posters here (which I think is absolutely ridiculous and irrelevant).
I agree, especially since the most noteworthy use of that rule—Haseo’s ban—referred to no forum member directly. I smell hypocrisy, or at the very least, an inconsistent application of the rules.
Although of course recent history proves that you can use the word in reference to other posters here and still not get banned, so maybe Jay just doesn’t care.
Unfortunate, that would be.
Autistic people aren’t retarded, constantly linking the two together kind of bothers me. I know the intentions are well-meaning, but I can’t get over that.
I don’t think he’s trying to link the two. I just think he’s trying to go against the linking of those two by other people.
Indeed, but most times it’s used here, they aren’t linking the two.
So if I use the n-word, not intending to link it to slavery, it’s fine?
That’s ridiculous. The two words are completely different.
They offend people in similar ways, right?
Do they? In the context of the relevant incident, the person who said R was calling a TLJ character an R for not seeing something coming when he thought they should have, as an example of the film for not living up to their expectations. Afterward, he seemed to think calling a fictional character R was not as offensive as calling an actual person that.
A lot of the people using derogatory slurs probably don’t know how derogatory they are.
Personally, I didn’t know that to say “that is retarded” about some annoyingly unfortunate event occurring is extremely offensive.
But you still agree it’s offensive, though? The point I was trying to demonstrate with the post you quoted was to explain that trying to peg a level of offensiveness to derogatory words is a hopeless endeavor since derogatory words, by their definition, offered people, and that’s what we should be trying to avoid.
Autistic people aren’t retarded, constantly linking the two together kind of bothers me. I know the intentions are well-meaning, but I can’t get over that.
I don’t think he’s trying to link the two. I just think he’s trying to go against the linking of those two by other people.
Indeed, but most times it’s used here, they aren’t linking the two.
So if I use the n-word, not intending to link it to slavery, it’s fine?
That’s ridiculous. The two words are completely different.
They offend people in similar ways, right?
Ironically, people are taking the wrong point from my post, which is mostly my fault.
Autistic people aren’t retarded, constantly linking the two together kind of bothers me. I know the intentions are well-meaning, but I can’t get over that.
I don’t think he’s trying to link the two. I just think he’s trying to go against the linking of those two by other people.
Indeed, but most times it’s used here, they aren’t linking the two.
So if I use the n-word, not intending to link it to slavery, it’s fine?
I hate that comparison. Not all derogatory words are equally derogatory.
I wasn’t trying to rate the the badness of bad words (mostly a worthless endeavor); I was just trying to state that good intentions don’t change the way things are taken.
That thread is cancer.
You’re not helping me trying to avoid it… Reverse psychology!
Autistic people aren’t retarded, constantly linking the two together kind of bothers me. I know the intentions are well-meaning, but I can’t get over that.
I don’t think he’s trying to link the two. I just think he’s trying to go against the linking of those two by other people.
Indeed, but most times it’s used here, they aren’t linking the two.
So if I use the n-word, not intending to link it to slavery, it’s fine?
Autistic people aren’t retarded, constantly linking the two together kind of bothers me. I know the intentions are well-meaning, but I can’t get over that.
I don’t think he’s trying to link the two. I just think he’s trying to go against the linking of those two by other people.
On another note, I can understand where Frink is coming from, but having to respond, mentioning your children, to every post that contains that word is a bit excessive.
He doesn’t have to explain himself. All he’d need say is “Please don’t use that word. It is offensive.”
But instead he says
That’s true. That’s why I said the fairest solution would have been to ban all involved in that conflict.
He doesn’t have to explain himself. All he’d need say is “Please don’t use that word. It is offensive.”
I don’t understand what you’re responding to.
I would like to direct attention to rule number seven.
- Personal attacks and slurs based on race/ethnicity/religion/gender/sexual orientation/etc. aren’t tolerated under any circumstances.
While Frink’s posts may well have been an overreaction, couldn’t using the “r-word” be considered a slur based on mental ability? Or is it not considered so on this forum? Pretty much every dictionary agrees that it is an offensive and derogatory term, so why do we treat it differently as other slurs? Also notable is that this rule, according to the announcement, is punishable by an “immediate and permanent ban with no prior warning.”
On another note, I can understand where Frink is coming from, but having to respond, mentioning your children, to every post that contains that word is a bit excessive. The fairest punishment would have been to ban all involved.
It’s basically all in the stickied spoiler thread.
Don’t go in there. Trust me. Even if you’ve seen the movie.
Now you’re just making me want to read it… without having seen the movie first. Argh.
Also, how did he post here if he’s been banned?
He is a man that defies all logic.
But seriously, that is a good question.
