Watched review. Skipped the ones mentioning the finale and, season 7 Jake. I watched most of DS9 when it first aired but, was kind of off and, on during it's last season. Also, completely missed the finale. I'm watching DS9 now becuase, I got all of it as a gift. I remembered/found out what happened with Worf though. Since, he's my favourite TNG character. I just don't want spoilers on stuff I either don't remember well/haven't seen.
That aside. I wholeheartedly agree about the treatment of Riker transporter-clone. Thomas has the worst luck in life. I would've liked it if in Death Wish eppy Q instead brought Thomas there and, he stayed there on Voyager. I mean Harry was the one most crap got piled on there. He'd act as a buffer for Thomas I'm sure. Janeway wouldn't off him since, she seemed to respect Riker.
Also, during my rewatch of that Cardassian science officer eppy I kind of got distracted via the fact that it's Captain Lockley from Babylon 5 under that makeup. I was getting a snack during the credits so I was like "That's LOCKLEY! No it isn't Lockley." In my head all throughout rewatching it. After the eppy I confirmed my suspicions. That said, even distracted, I thought that it was a really bad move to turn it into an alien mating ritual thingy. Essentially I agree with you.
Re: Trill Punishment it's also contradictory to the earlier TNG Trill eppy. Where Dr. Crusher was all ready and, willing to continue on the relationship through three hosts IIRC. Only thing that stopped it was Dr. Crusher couldn't see past the new woman host to the person she lusted over. No mention of possible death. None of that. It's also hypocritical that Dax's friendships like Sisko are okay to be carried over but, not romantic entanglements. I mean c'mon the society's going to sentence them to death for falling in love, again, in brand new hosts, looking completely beyond the physical. However, you want your casual friends to stay by you. Oh sure go right ahead! He can even visit the sacred pool area thingy. Kind of puts the whole Trill-symbiont institution in a new light. I mean they say "we don't have enough symbionts for the population that are compatible." Then, "Yeah, we death sentence the Trill symbionts who retain their previous lovers... What? Why you looking at me like that?"
Yes the Kai thing was poorely handled. At the time of initial airing I just excepted it though... I was a kid... Yes that's my excuse er, reason!
Valiant um, no comment. I simply haven't watched that episode in full yet. I missed it's initial airing and, only watched your review of it. I also missed profit and, lace... Um, will I see two bad episodes at the same time or, will I just skip them again? That is the question...
I'de seriously like your oppinion on this matter.
Worf and, Quark escaping punishment. I kind of get the feeling of executive meddling there. I don't know why but, I do... Gut feeling is all.
RE: Worf deadbeat dad. I'm a bit ambivalant about this myself.
As for what I personally feel is the lowest DS9 moment. I disagree with you only because I know more about the behind the scenes. I feel DS9's lowest moment is what started it in the first place. They essentially ripped off JMS's Babylon 5 pitch and, shoehorned it into the Star Trek universe. JMS comments on why he didn't sue paramount:
(Interviewers in bold)
Well, in the process of shopping the series(B5). Everybody knows the story about you(JMS) approaching Paramount. Knowing that they had Star Trek, why go to Paramount? Why bring them another space opera type story?
"Well the thought at the time was, because they had that corner of science fiction universe covered. That they might be the best place to go. Also they were trying to put together their own network at the time. Uh, and they had a good block(?) of syndication. They were the big guns. You always go to the big guns first. They were doing other shows beyond Star Trek. You know for syndication and, they seemed like the likely choice. And we gave them the material um, everything. The treatment, the pilot script, the artwork, all that stuff. There were executives(?) in the back. That mentioned that the 2 guys that had 'a new show' was gonna be up at a big exhibition thing in san francisco. They were gonna look at some of this themselves to get some suggestions. Just look at it in general and, they first came back very interested. Suddenly out of nowhere 'uh, no! We're gonna pass!' Which surprised me because, we knew they were interested. Very interested in pursuing it and, well we figured that's, that. Went off elsewhere and, um we're kind of surprised another show comes up. On a spacestation, with a um gambling area, casinos, and a bar, ambassadors, and trade going on. Um there'd never been a show like that preceeding 16 years of television 2 suddenly come out the same time. Seemed curious to us."
So given that how much credence to you put to the fan urban legend that Paramount wholly ripped off B5? Just kept the property enough to make their own notes and, then said "no." Then made stuff from your notes.
"Well, I put it in two terms *sigh*. First off again if you look at the two starting points side by side. Male captian, female second in command, a big casino-like area, a bar, ambassadors, trading, on a spacestation. Which had a shapeshifter in it's pilot. Um it's kind of hard not to see a corrilary there. I was in my office one day and, Peter Jurasik came in and, said 'do you know?' Mentioned one of the cast members from Deep Space Nine. I said 'I'm familiar with him I don't know him personally but, I know this person.' Said 'Well, I saw him at a party last night. He wanted me to give you a message.' I said 'Okay, other then "screw you" what's the message?' He said 'we know that our show came from your show. We wish you all the luck.'"
Really?!
-Wow
"Uh-huh and, um those are the only two points I think are worth making."
Wow
"I will say that I discussed a big lawsuit with Warner Bros. but, they were concerned. That if I did that both shows would end up in litigation and, neither show would get anywhere. So they overruled that and, I could not pursue without them. So that was the end of that."
Source podcast part 1 Part 2
***Possible B5 spoilers in podcast***
So essentially the credits should read "Based upon Babylon 5 created by J. Michael Straczynski". So yeah I do think this beats out a bad episode. The fact that it's a rip-off of B5. That said I still like both shows and, JMS himself is also a Star Trek fan. In fact in 2004 he approached Paramount again proposing a prequel tv show. That showed how Kirk and, his crew met. That certainly turned out alright now didn't it?
FYI: The main reason I saved this as a draft is because, I had to find that podcast again and, type the relevant parts up... So now I test this draft thingy to see if it works.
So that's my response. Hope it's comment worthy enough for you!
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