Thanks guys! Hal, as I mentioned in PM, I will send you those shots when they’re locked down!
Meanwhile, I made another adjustment to the Crait battle sequence to remove the cannon beam from the shot of Finn exiting the crashed cockpit (this required both audio and video changes).
Crait Battle (cannon beam removal at 1:40)
https://vimeo.com/289775362
pw: fanedit
I’d say a little more transparency and less strong of an effect would be perfect.
Agreed. I also think a bit of debris and viewscteen reflection in the last shot would help a bit as well.
I made adjustments, including to the last shot! The last shot actually always bugged me because the star field and planet seemed to be fixed to the viewscreen and not actually in a 3D environment. So, I replaced the star field and adjusted the planet so that as the camera moves, the environment looks more 3-dimensional.
Deleted Shuttle Scene Improvements
https://vimeo.com/394579555
pw: fanedit
RogueLeader said:
It would be cool to see the guard fighting Rey lose that blade in the previous shot of them fighting in the distant background. There’s a point where there is a big flash of light where they hit blades, and I feel like it could be removed at that point to imply that Rey cut it, explaining why the other blade is gone in the next shot of them.
Alrighty, RL! One may never be able to notice it, but in the distant BG, Rey now knocks off the blade in the praetorian’s left hand (sending the blade falling).
Praetorian Knife Removal (disarm at 0:06, removal at 0:22)
https://vimeo.com/394568223
pw: fanedit
Here’s a pass at spicing up the first shot of the deleted shuttle scene, adding reflections and particles to help polish the scene.
TLJ - Shuttle Scene - 1st Shot
https://vimeo.com/394579555
pw: fanedit
While thinking of going down the road of asking Immersion FX for the edit without the lightsabers and all the back and forth that might entail, I started playing with it myself. It’s only 17 frames that needed to be changed, so I kept going and eventually think I got to something usable!
Praetorian Knife Removal (removal at 0:22)
https://vimeo.com/394568223
pw: fanedit
Let me take these in reverse order as best I can! I probably will comment by topic rather than each person’s comment just to save time, sorry!
REBEL RING
Hal, (one exception!), here’s the link to the updated Broom Boy scene, which has the exact same audio timing, but extends shots after the ship goes to hyperspace to cover the rebel ring shot:
https://vimeo.com/393368723
pw: fanedit
FINN/ROSE SHUTTLE SCENE
I definitely will not be cutting this scene. It means too much to Finn after his story was trimmed, and after all of the chaos, it’s nice to have a quiet character moment. I will look at the scene again to see if anything can be done to make it feel a bit more polished, but not sure exactly where I will land on that.
PRAETORIAN GUARD FIGHT CONTINUITY ERROR
This is just one of those things that doesn’t really bother me, and without an easy solution, is not worth fixing. However, looking at Jar Jar Bricks’ edit, it does seem like a pretty clean and simple edit! I also like the masking idea which would maintain the pacing, and if someone has done that already I’d love to see it.
FINN COCKPIT EXPLOSION
I’ll take another quick look, but I think I’m happy with it looking natural. I don’t think it needs to be in your face just to show that there’s a change (the idea really being to hide the change). The Rose explosion is different because it’s an exterior shot and the blast hits the rear of the cockpit, whereas Finn’s speeder was hit in the middle of the ship, spliting it in half. That and the red from the cannon beam would cover much of the bright flash.
CANNON HUM WHEN FINN EXITS COCKPIT
This is a good call, and something I think I should be able to EQ out of the mix so you can’t hear the cannon beam sound (or at least minimize it).
3RD LESSON CARETAKERS SCENE
As we’ve discussed before, the third lesson scene is not really visually complete and doesn’t seem necessary. It’s nice, but I don’t think it’s worth bringing the caretakers back for, and doesn’t add enough to the narrative in my opinion.
I think the covers the last day’s comments! I do appreciate the pouring in of positivity and ideas, and I’m sorry I can’t respond specifically to every single comment. Thank you all for the interest and help!
Ok, made slight updates to the Rebel Ring shot timing and Finn speeder targeting screen (even a tweak to the Finn cockpit shot), which is posted to the same vimeo links. Currently, I’m rendering out a new workprint, which should be ready tonight and posted tomorrow. Thank you!
Yes, to be clear, it’s not a recent addition, it’s always been a part of Rekindled. If you look to the left before he turns, some sparks fly, and there’s a flash of brightness on the left side of the cockpit and his face.
Actually, I’ve already added sparks and lightning effects (even some sounds) to the Finn shot in the cockpit! You might not have a before and after ready, but there’s definitely a few new elements to the moment where Finn turns his head.
I think regardless of whether we need to push it further and tweak a little more, the ending will not have the rebel ring!
smpearce1981, thanks for pushing me on the idea and bringing the proof of concept with the speeder to get it all to work. I will probably tweak the movement of the ship a little more, but otherwise I think it’s close!
As for your suggestions for the ending, I’ve tried rearranging the shots in different ways, including the way you suggested, but I can say confidently that it wont’t work. For one, it feels like a jump-cut to go from the hyperspace shot to the wide of the boy. More importantly, the music cue when ship streaks across the stars is inextricably linked to the shot. It’s so perfectly executed by John Williams that breaking them apart feels wrong. That leaves the few seconds as the music is swelling, where we really only have two shots to work with: the 2nd closeup of the boy and the end shot. We can play with lengthening one and shortening the other, but that’s about the extent of it. Still, thanks for the suggestion!
Axios said:
One question though, it seams Rose lost her “no” line…was that intentional, cause right now she is just mouthing the word and looks a bit strange. Does it have to do with the louder line?
That’s a mistake, thanks for catching! I’ll recheck the sequence tomorrow.
Alrighty! I delayed the render of a second workprint and took a look at smpearce1981’s proof of concept, which does look good so I grabbed it! I wasn’t sure how long it would take me to blank out the target indicators, but I ended up able to recreate it and put the ship in a bit of motion (stuttery and lowres to match the original look). Take a look!
Crait Battle (targeting shot at 1:10)
https://vimeo.com/289775362
pw: fanedit
As for the ending, I think I’m actually leaning towards the version without the rebel ring. It has so little context in the sequel movies that I think it takes away from the children playing with Luke Skywalker toys and drawing inspiration. It’s one of the first comments I received back in V1 of Rekindled, but I had no real solution for it. I could shorten the child’s closeup a few more frames and lengthen the last shot, but I hope I’m close to the best balance possible. I would definitely be interested in everyone’s thoughts; yes to removing the rebel ring or keeping it?
1:56:09 alright thats fair, I cant expect you to be a magician lol, thanks for the camera shake though. even just a green light in the corner would do a world of help though.
Okay, so I went back and added some lights, and an overall red push to match the red look of the walker cockpits:
Crait Battle (targeting shot at 1:10)
https://vimeo.com/289775362
pw: fanedit
Also adjusted the end shot to shorten the boy’s last closeup a bit:
Ending - No Rebel Ring
https://vimeo.com/393368723
pw: fanedit
NOTE: I’m probably going to render a new V3 workprint tonight with the latest changes for those interested. Should be up tomorrow in the same location!
Yeah, I think I’m leaning B as well (though I appreciate the thought, idir_hh). I agree with Jar Jar Bricks; the hanger is such a tense and even scary moment, I don’t want to take away from the drama.
Great! Think I might do!
Here’s a couple of options for the Wilhelm Scream. One is only slightly different from Hal’s, but I wanted something a bit lower in the mix.
Wilhelm Option A
https://vimeo.com/393498424
Wilhelm Option B
https://vimeo.com/393498450
PW: fanedit
So I did some playing tonight, and here’s a new attempt at removing the rebel ring from the ending! Essentially, it required extending to shots around it to avoid messing with the music cues.
https://vimeo.com/393368723
pw: fanedit
Wow! Well, I asked for it!
Axios, thanks for the detailed notes, it’s an impressive list of changes. I won’t respond one by one here (might do that in the PM), but I will say that many of these are notes that have been discussed before, though are always worth revisiting. I’ll say I did look at your timecoded (thank you!) comments alongside the actual edit sequence. Some notes you suggested I played with and didn’t work, a couple of notes I will likely change, and most of the rest fall into one of two categories for me:
Things that just don’t bother me, often regarding tone and humor. I made a decision a while back to stick to Hal’s model of leaving in most of the humor and gags, even the cheesy ones. They generally don’t bother me, and feel consistent with much of Star Wars to me (which is subjective, of course).
Things that are good notes, but fixing them would create more problems. For example, cutting the Paige reaction shot of the detonator falling. That shot is already trimmed to avoid the detonator being so far past there’s no way she could have grabbed it (still using some movie suspension of disbelief). Cutting the shot entirely, though, feels like a jump-cut between two similar framings of the detonator. I tried it, but unfortunately, it doesn’t work. There are many such suggestions to trim shots or adjust transitions, but I run into the same problems.
I would like to respond to a few notes here, including ones I decided to act on!
14:25 I LOVE how the music changes the feeling of this scene! My only critique is the method of bringing the music back in after it goes silent feels to quick and swelling (out of place, I can tell it was edited). Perhaps replace it with something more subtle and more inquisitive to match Rey’s emotions
This is interesting, because the music that feels like it slowly fades back in is actually the same way in the original mix (albeit with a longer music gap). It just kind of slowly fades in after Rey says “Master Skywalker.” It works for me, anyway, as a continuation of the musical flow with just the wind as the little moment of natural sound.
54:23 not enough time has passed for the “we’ve searched this whole place zero red plomblooms, where is this guy” dialog to make sense. I think you should cut “weve searched this whole place” line leaving only “zero red plom blooms, where is this guy”
Just wanted to note that the only thing trimmed here is a few seconds of the BB-8 coin gag. The scene always played a little fast with the “search” of the whole place.
1:55:22 I love everything about this change! The only thing I would change slightly is, since it all happens so fast it can be hard to follow what happens to rose, I would make Finn’s “Rose!” louder, a few frames later in the base (for establishing context for where the voice is coming from) and easier to hear (less muffled by radio) that way the audience can track better
I made an adjustment to this, delayed and lengthened his line a bit. It’s still under the shot of Poe, as we had it under the shot of the base many passes ago and it didn’t feel right. Still, a hint of reverb echoes in the base after the cut, and I think it gives the moment a bit more weight!
1:56:09 Since you went to such lengths with the Palpatine radio visuals I was wondering if you’d be willing to edit the “gun lock-on graphics” to differentiate between the walkers and the Tie Fighters (where you got the aiming from 1:52:18). Just something a little different, more lights on dash maybe, less red lines on the screen and no camera shake (since the walker is stationary)
I don’t know about modifying the look too much, but I agree about the camera shake. I stabilized the shot and makes more sense now I think.
2:11:38 Only the slightest of slight changes with the transition out of Kylo’s face. after watching it with the pace of the film and the scene I think if the middle swipe transition was a bit slower then it would be perfect. I think it would establish finality for Kylo in the movie, so the audience knows thats the last we see of him in this film.
I slowed this down a few frames and it feels better! Thanks for the note!
2:11:41 kind of a funny request here but as an actor I noticed something funny with the actors right after that transition. Then I realized there was no action called and Oscar Isaac probably started the take thats why for a second everyone else around him is standing around emotionless and as soon as they notice Poe hugging they start smiling at there scene partner and acting happy. SO would you mind cutting just a few frames after that transition please haha, its a very small thing and really not a priority, but hey still
Wow, that’s a great catch! Never noticed that before. I cut 11 frames and I think it removes enough of the awkward pause while still giving us enough time to register what’s happening.
2:13:49 If you feel that keeping the broom boy enhances the scope of the film (I understand your point of view and I respect it) then absolutely I will support your decision to include him. I think it might tie things together in the end after all, who knows. HOWEVER, if we are going to keep him in to give the universe scope, please cut the shot of the rebel ring. The audience has no context for it, it doesnt make sense for the established universe’s timeline and it will only bring up confusion and questions when we are supposed to feel hopeful and content. I see no reason to keep it in with the current version
I don’t necessarily disagree, but I’ve tried many times to remove the shot, and I’m never happy with the result. I’ll play with it one more time, but I’m afraid it would require adjusting the music cue, which I would hate to do here at the end of the film.
Thanks again for taking the time to give such detailed notes, and I hope you understand if I only make limited adjustments. Everyone has their own idea of the perfect version of the film, and it’s impossible to really nail it, but we try!
accidental post
I’m with jarbear on the third lesson. I’m not sure it really adds anything, and with the unfinished effects of Rey running and seemingly skipping over the rocks, it’s a tough sell.
PM sent!
That would be great, thank you!
Alrighty, I am pleased to say I have a workprint for V3 ready!
If any are interested, please let me know if you’d like to take a look. It’s the same link as V2, so you may have access already. I would especially be interested in help from those with surround systems to check the levels, as I have limited access to surround and will be checking that aspect less often than would be ideal.
The V3 workprint file is a 10gb encode with 5.1 AC-3 audio.
The major changes are at the following timecodes:
12:38
44:06
49:20
51:23
1:06:22
1:09:07
1:34:06
2:10:57
Thank you very much to all who have helped review round after round of changes, and for continually helping push this to be the best possible update! Hopefully, this version will improve the transition to TROS without detracting from TLJ, and it should be compatible with any version of the TROS we are likely to get in the coming years, including the theatrical release.
Hey Axios, feel free to share your thoughts! Timing-wise it’s funny, because at the time of this writing, I literally just finished drafting up a message for the V3 workprint, which will be posted very soon. However, I am always willing to hear new ideas. If it’s something I agree with and see a good solution for, then maybe I’ll open the project back up!
Hey Jarbear! Works been pretty busy lately, but my intent is still to finish in the next few weeks. It takes some time to get the sound mix right, so I can’t just render what I have. My time should start to open up soon though!
What Sade and ash said. Do what’s best for you, you’ve already accomplished more than any of us could have dreamed of!
I think that was a good, healthy, debate, and yes: given the passionate arguments for this scene as-is, I think it’s best not to change it (other than adding Hal’s subtle addition of the Palpatine laugh). Not a bad thought, but I don’t think it helps the scene or overall story.