muddyknees2000

Ronster said:

I think Adywans Idea of Darth Vader (in suit) going to the Jedi Temple is the idea that would make ROTS truly amazing if it could be pulled off but re-arranging the plot will be difficult... He must have a draft sub-plot or something to allow this to happen that will need filming... I doubt he would confirm that idea without knowing it is do able

He does indeed have it all laid out....and it works really well.

AntcuFaalb said:

I understand how you view the films and see why Yub Nub doesn't meet your expectations. Considering my POV, do you see why it exceeds mine?

Absolutely.....but you ARE correct....you and I are both taking away very different things from this experience.

As for "Lapti Nek".....I'm pretty sure Ady has confirmed that neither it nor "Jedi Sucks" will be returning to the Revisited cut. Something new will replace it. I have not heard what yet (I personally would like to see a gambling scene where Oola is placing Jabba's bets for him, loses, and gets dropped into the pit)

Bingowings said:

muddyknees2000 said:

Ronster said:

...would it not be better for the whole PT if we never saw the Emperor until ROTS and only Palpatine as it is pretty obvious who he is...

While I like this idea quite a lot.....I think you end up losing some of the better scenes that the PT has involving the dark side characters.....Dooku meeting with Palps at the end of AOTC for instance. 

I fail to see how that scene of any narrative value what so ever in it's current form.

It confirms that Dooku is a Sith Lord.

What with the red saber, Sith lightning, generally being a bit naughty this is not really a surprise.

Actually, I quite felt like they were presenting Dooku to us as an in-between type character. The very last scene (which actually somewhat ruined the character of Dooku for me by making him a flat out bad guy and NOT an in-between) does in fact (or did for me) confirm that no, he's not playing anyone...he IS a bad guy. I felt like he was enough of a grey area character, neither black nor white, that he did need to confirm what exactly he was, or who's side he was on, or if perhaps he WAS on both sides (the option I was personally hoping for)

It definitely CAN be argued that this is accomplished elsewhere, but its just a visually beautiful scene.....in a film where much of what you're looking at feels like filler.

AntcuFaalb said:

How do you feel about Yub Nub?

I think that in a film full of soaring, fantastical and moving pieces of music, that tell as much of a story as the action on the screen does.....Yub Flub is a substantial failure. Again, instead of telling of a slightly tragic victory, where Luke met, and ultimately killed his own father....instead of strains of hopeful dreams for the new galaxy and the growing relationship between Han & Leia.......instead of new beginnings for a once shady, but now much celebrated hero, Lando Calrissian.....we get teddy bears singing a nonsensical little party song.

The song isn't the only thing to blame......I think the ending could have been more bittersweet, and more interesting than the group photo pose that we did get......but the music definitely doesn't help what is already a rather silly film.

AntcuFaalb said:

muddyknees2000 said:

thejediknighthusezni said:

               I wonder if it's possible to slim down the ewoks and give them a different fur texture to make them less teddy bear- like and more wild predator in appearance. Build on top of what's already there. That along with facial feature changes. Maybe morphing type tech. Then blinks and cantinization.

I've never had a problem with the way they've looked.....with their domed, unblinking eyes I actually found them rather creepy looking. It was their teddy bear like mannerisms that made us feel that they weren't to be taken seriously. The ewok musical themes that were designed for them (wicket's especially) didn't help either.

I agree and think there's value in the lightheartedness they bring to ROTJ. Yub Nub FTW.

IMO, one of the wonderful things about Star Wars is that the films never took themselves too seriously (whatever the hell that means -- films don't think!).

Don't mistake my meaning.....I think their LOOK works as is...without blinks or changes to their physical appearance.......but the Ewoks need some serious editing to make them work in the film. They make what should have been an epic climax into a pathetic joke.

thejediknighthusezni said:

               I wonder if it's possible to slim down the ewoks and give them a different fur texture to make them less teddy bear- like and more wild predator in appearance. Build on top of what's already there. That along with facial feature changes. Maybe morphing type tech. Then blinks and cantinization.

I've never had a problem with the way they've looked.....with their domed, unblinking eyes I actually found them rather creepy looking. It was their teddy bear like mannerisms that made us feel that they weren't to be taken seriously. The ewok musical themes that were designed for them (wicket's especially) didn't help either.

Ronster said:

...would it not be better for the whole PT if we never saw the Emperor until ROTS and only Palpatine as it is pretty obvious who he is...

While I like this idea quite a lot.....I think you end up losing some of the better scenes that the PT has involving the dark side characters.....Dooku meeting with Palps at the end of AOTC for instance. 

ben_danger said:

Can you imagine the tension if the car chase was flipped? So they were rushing to save padme?

You just blew my mind.

Apart from validating the "high ground" issue, I don't see how any of that fixes anything.....the action set pieces are not the problem really. A few lightsaber battles could be cut down in length.....but the real problems lay elsewhere.

No, he wants to do the full 6 film saga.....and honestly if he manages to make them watchable/enjoyable it'll mean a whole lot more fun than just one solitary film would.

Ronster said:

Character driven story... Thats what I mean by 3 films in to 1 film

Doing that won't make it a character driven story.......there aren't really a lot of great ways to do that. Ady can make improvements, but the PT (even the PT:R) is always going to be a little weak in the character dept.....simply cutting it down will never solve the problems as they are too deeply embedded in the film.

Consider that in the OT we have Ben, who tells Luke that he was good friends with Anakin....and yet we sense more warmth between Anakin and Palps in one scene than we ever see between him and Obi. Ben.....who reminds Yoda of his own youthful recklessness and yet when we see him in TPM (and through the rest of the PT) he is the dorkiest, most careful and rule abiding Jedi there is.

Qui-Gonn acts nothing like a Jedi should......HE was more the Jedi that Obi should have been. Then you have Yoda who acts almost completely contrarily to his older self.

Anakin, when we first meet him, SHOULD have been a teen...thereby eliminating the creepy setting up of the future romance between him and Padme....they could have jumped right into it...or started off hating eachother ala Han & Leia...and slowly build up to it by film's end. This would also do away with the weird non aging of Padme in the decade between TPM and AOTC. Not to mention the fact that no 9 year old would ever leave his mother.....walking away, without looking back, and only realizing that leaving means..you know...LEAVING....only after he's fully packed, and 100 feet away...potentially leaving his mother behind, never to see her again.

 The characters are all wrong, and no simple cutting of material is going to fix that.

They will NEVER be as good as the OT.......not with the crap that Ady has to work with as his base ingredient.....but they CAN be made into decent films. They'll never be as character driven as the OT....they're always going to be more like documentaries about what happened to Anakin Skywalker.....simply because of the material that George shot (or didn't shoot) and the way he chose to tell his story. But they CAN be made to be entertaining. MUCH more so than they are now.

And Ady has said that his versions are going to come in much shorter than their current running times.....which makes sense what with all the crap that has to be cut out.

Yup.....hate Grievous....more than Jar Jar. 

And I would say that I am of a very similar opinion anytime I watch a little piece of the PT here or there....it just doesn't seem salvageable. BUT then I remember the things Ady has told me he wants to do.....and I really have to say......if you don't think it can be made into a better, even watchable, film....then you're not thinking creatively enough......Ady is literally going to destroy these films, rip them apart, and use their guts to make something that doesn't even resemble what we had before. You need to deconstruct it more.....tear it down to its bare elements. Jar Jar can be used, because he can be re-dubbed....made to sound less ridiculous, and given new purpose. The battle droids and Neimoidians made to sound less comical and more menacing. Anakin made to sound less dorky (at first) and less whiny (later). Performances can be changed with new voiceover work. With a bit of editing character's motivations can be made to fit with their OT counterparts' actions and motivations better. New effects work can be implemented to change the meaning of sequences and make them feel more like a SW film, and not just some random Sci-Fi (yes, the OT was fantasy....but the PT was pure Sci-Fi). 

If movies have taught me anything (well, the good ones anyways) it's that it's always who you least suspect. So logically, the spy is Ady.

Matticon said:

We only need to see EP:VII to find out what decisions they made and then ADY should he choose to, adjust Revisited. 

He has already chosen not to......I don't understand why we can't put this one to bed.

Ep VII is the first in a TRILOGY OF FILMS.........something could pop up in the 2nd or 3rd film (a decade from now) that might not add up with Revisited....either way, we're not waiting around to find out.

Revisited will NOT work within official canon...Ady's decisions vis a vis the PT have already decided this. The ST not syncing up won't change anything as Revisited will already be a different canon.

Revisited is MEANT to be watched as a separate saga. Ady isn't trying to remain true to official canon in any way shape or form. He is making his own creative decisions here, regardless of how they will affect viewings of official versions of these films. Revisited is a separate entity.

Ady has already said he does not plan to link Revisited 1-6 with the new official ST.

Buy the Blu Ray....that's it...you're covered. FOX only cares about the bottom line....money. So as long as no one fan edit is significantly taking away from their profits then they won't pay lawyers to chase someone down with cease and desist letters. They don't care about the older releases, as they're long out of print, but the newer, still current release. We always say that it is because the Blu is the source material that was used......but more accurately it is because it is the current home viewing version of SW being sold....and we'd be encouraging out and out piracy if we didn't ask people to go buy it before downloading our fan edit.

thayerj said:

Why not have a 2nd ending credits with everyone who helped along the way and have it set to the imperial march song?

not a bad idea...have it in one of the sub menus....special features or some such.....

Personally I'd much rather have the film credits as unmodified as possible (obviously Ady's work needs to be recognized, so his and a few other's names need to be in there)......and it WAS already said that names in the credits wasn't going to be a thing for ROTJ:R, so I'd also prefer the credits for the entire trilogy to resemble eachother as much as possible.

Bingowings said:

This sort of storytelling should be extended to the locations and ships of the PT.

I agree, but as it stands now, I don't think it is well done. Everything is slick and featureless. The eye slides off of everything, nothing sticks or catches your attention to tell you anything about the object, be it either that it is shiny and new, or old and used. The CG is too perfect....things need to be re-textured. The Queen's ship for example.....yes, it is something that would be kept in immaculate condition, but after punching its way through a blockade & being blasted to hell, having droids shot off its back, and then spending a couple days parked in the unforgiving Tatooine conditions it STILL looks perfect. When they arrive on Coruscant they should look like hell.

An entire planet that is one big city will never look entirely pristine. There will be older parts of town, run down areas, or areas where the money just isn't being poured into anymore, simply because there are newer, more popular areas. Making the entire planet all look like it was freshly renovated, every building at the same time.....is as unrealistic as all the gamoreans from ROTJ looking identical.

There ARE places that should look spotless.....Padme's apartments, the opera house for example......but we visit enough other parts of the planet....Dexter's diner, the "seedy" club after the speeder chase.......that we should definitely see some variation to the wear and tear.

Bingowings said:

Making everything look like the Millennium Falcon doesn't make sense at any point of the story.

I'm not totally on board with that. There ARE some things that could look pristine-ish....the naboo fighters perhaps, or the Queen's ship (though I think the fighters could do with a bit of wear on the inside, in the cockpits, or in the maintenance areas of the bigger ship (monarchies often put on a good show, but are more tattered from within than anyone knows).....but not much else should look like it just rolled off the assembly line. The galaxy didn't suddenly spring into existence just before the opening credits of the film with that "new galaxy" smell......things should feel like they've been around a bit, even if they ARE well taken care of.

darth_ender said:

I wonder if there is some way this could be better conveyed on the screen, as it makes Luke seem to slide perilously close to the dark side and makes his decision to not kill Vader more dramatic.

Yeah I'd love to see this accomplished......and my thinking is that it could be relatively simple. When Jabba says "There will be no bargain".....all Luke has to do is smile.

Bingowings said:

muddyknees2000 said:

The opening crawl says there's a war on......the reveal is already done....no need to clumsily hide it visually as well. 

The only way to keep a reveal would be to completely change the composition of the shot......and that is a LOT of work when all you need to do to remove the error is to put the battle in behind the SD in the pan down.

The only other film to have something interesting happen at the beginning is ANH.

And I don't mean just action I mean visual story telling.

Here we see Coruscant, the crystal calm heart of the Republic and after a second of serenity, the reality, the war has made it even to there.

The PT gets so much wrong and is so visually dull it should be acknowledged when it attempts to do something interesting.

Where it fails it should be helped to succeed.

The baby shouldn't be thrown out with the bath water.

As for the crawl, are those words set in stone?

I really hope the ROTJ crawl is altered as well as pretty much every PT one.

Can't say I disagree...I was simply looking at it from a workload point of view, AND...speaking of re-editing it...the film WILL work better once its been Revisited....so it will have other big moments, thus reducing our need to remain attached to THIS specific one.

The opening crawl says there's a war on......the reveal is already done....no need to clumsily hide it visually as well. 

The only way to keep a reveal would be to completely change the composition of the shot......and that is a LOT of work when all you need to do to remove the error is to put the battle in behind the SD in the pan down.