msycamore

Nice, another swede... Hello Hefa and welcome to the forum! Like russ said, both audio and video are of great interest, see this thread: http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/1983-UK-TVS-Star-Wars-premiere-anybody-still-have-a-recording/topic/14122/  As we in Sweden didn't have ad breaks on the few channels we had back in the early 80's this may be a more complete version of this telecine master if it proves to be the same as the one broadcasted on UK television that is, there will of course be swedish subs in picture...

Bingowings said:

One friend of mine refused to watch the VHS with me when it came out but would watch the first two which I thought was a bit pointless.

I have no trouble to understand the choice by your friend, ROTJ was IMO an insult and a joke to the audience who expected a real continuation and sequel to ESB. I don't find it pointless to only rewatch those films I do like even if that film have an open ending. I personally find it a bit pointless to repeatedly watch something you don't like only because it's a sequel to a film or a series of films you happen to like.

Darth Mallwalker said:

Yes.
149737
149738
continuing until 149771/149772.
Look like Easter eggs

Thanks for checking! Not good, I was hoping it would be something unique to my copy.

Dunedain said:

Leia isn't too far off, but still red, Daine Jir, more reddish yet, but perhaps that can be adjusted a bit. :)

Sorry, when I re-read your comment again, who to say you based your opinion on my screenshots, if anyone have suggestions on how to make improvements, please mention them, that's one of the purposes of posting samples after all.

bkev said:

Was the script custom made for this film...

Yes, it doesn't work on Blues Brothers. ;) Joking aside, it should work good on other sources with similar chroma noise, tested it on my JSC ESB capture and it worked very good, as with all derainbowing and dotcrawl filtering it isn't bulletproof, there's even minor artifacting from it in the sample I just posted. g-force script is made to be applied after IVTC, most derainbowing/dotcrawl filtering are actually most effective or even needed before IVTC.

source  = last
sigma   = 40
filt    = source.FFT3dFilter(sigma=sigma,plane=4,bt=3)

idx1    = filt.MSuper(pel=2,sharp=1)
bw_vec1 = MAnalyse(idx1,isb=true, delta=1,overlap=4,plevel=0,dct=1,chroma=false)
fw_vec1 = MAnalyse(idx1,isb=false,delta=1,overlap=4,plevel=0,dct=1,chroma=false)
bw_vec2 = MAnalyse(idx1,isb=true, delta=2,overlap=4,plevel=0,dct=1,chroma=false)
fw_vec2 = MAnalyse(idx1,isb=false,delta=2,overlap=4,plevel=0,dct=1,chroma=false)

idx2    = source.MSuper(pel=2,sharp=1,levels=1)
pcorr   = source.MDegrain2(idx2,bw_vec2,bw_vec1,fw_vec1,fw_vec2,thSAD=800,thSCD1=150,thSCD2=75,plane=4)
corr1   = Median1(source,pcorr,filt,chroma="process")

idx3    = corr1.MSuper(pel=2,sharp=1,levels=1)
corr1.MDegrain2(idx2,bw_vec2,bw_vec1,fw_vec1,fw_vec2,thSAD=400,thSCD1=150,thSCD2=75,plane=4)

Median1(corr1,last,filt,chroma="process")

MergeLuma(last,source)

#######################################################################################

Function Median1(clip input_1, clip input_2, clip input_3, string "chroma")
{# median of 3 clips from Helpers.avs by G-force

chroma = Default(chroma,"process") #default is "process". Alternates: "copy first" or "copy second"

Interleave(input_1,input_2,input_3)
chroma == "process" ? Clense(reduceflicker=false) : Clense(reduceflicker=false,grey=true)
SelectEvery(3,1)
chroma == "copy first" ? last.MergeChroma(input_1) : chroma == "copy second" ? last.MergeChroma(input_2) : last
Return(last)
}

Dunedain said:

Very nice, msycamore. :) Getting the faces right when color correcting the Star Wars trilogy is always the hardest thing (dark_jedi and You_Too know all about that :) ). It's so hard to restore that accurate natural fair look with the sources available. Leia isn't too far off, but still red, Daine Jir, more reddish yet, but perhaps that can be adjusted a bit. :)

Thanks! Haven't seen their accomplishments but yes the skintones are of course the most crucial part when color correcting, there are several reasons why my first upload ended up looking like it did, uncalibrated monitor, lack of care and in a way of getting it over with so that I could continue with THX 1138 which I still after all this time haven't finished. :( But the positive response I got with this one even though the DVD looked like shit (IMO) makes me want to do a much improved one, especially when I know how much better it can look.

Didn't know who the hell Daine Jir was but now I know after some google search, you learn something new everyday :) I guess every stormtrooper in the film have a name these days as well... I agree that the colors in the sample are far from perfect but I don't go scene-by-scene, instead just reel-by-reel to find a middle ground. The reasons for the screencaps are only to show the excellent derainbowing by g-force, not the colors as they varies quite much, had I taken a screenshot from a second later or earlier it would perhaps look too green or to yellow, that's why screenshots doesn't work so good with this source. I'm glad you like the improvements though. :)

Just an example of the variations in levels I mentioned earlier... the same settings that I used on the previous video sample:

^^ brightness and contrast looks quite ok, we cut to Han and back to Leia and boom the levels are changed:

^^ the colors are actually much better here, but the brightness and gamma is way off. This happens quite often in this telecine, sometimes even in the middle of a scene. This makes setting a correct white and black point quite difficult sometimes.

Darth Mallwalker, when you have time for it, could you please check this scene on your copy:

Will try to find the numbers for you, curious if it is a mastering defect present in all copies of this LD. Thanks. 

Thanks for the feedback guys! g-force's great DeRainbowing script makes a huge difference, the absence of burning faces also helps of course. It's unfortunate that the colors fluctuates so much in this transfer, the brightness, contrast and hues often shifts wildly as you may have noticed, sometimes the brightness or contrast actually change right in the middle of a scene, I'm wondering if this is only a case of a badly worn print that is starting to decay or if this is also the work of the telecine operator adjusting on the fly.

Darth Mallwalker said:

 

CapableMetal said:

the first frame of the last shot

Do you mean the last shot before wipe to credits?
(My 2004 DVD is sealed in polythene, so I can't even count that one.)
Using msycamore's proposed numbers (which I'm not endorsing yet) it came out to 183,826 in my script.
183.825 is the last frame of Mr.Shaw's ghost.

Are we in sync?

 

:) I decided to delete the Jedi files when I saw the quality of those sources, and I wouldn't trust those Jedi numbers I posted either before more investigation is done. I just did a quick compare against the US NTSC DVD, and those shouldn't be regarded as the final word on frame counts as the ESB DVD lack a few frames that are present in the '97 SE DVB's for example.

Those frames mentioned that are absent in the TB ESB can easily be restored by using the G'Kar (except 75305), that's how I did it.

g-force has been kind and made an awesome DeRainbowing script for this one, which is great because I can sort of live with the aliasing and dotcrawl but the chroma noise is what really hurt my eyes, obviously it also helps with the compression if you don't have shimmering noise all over the place. His DeRainbowing is hands down the best I've tested, only a slight desaturation on very fast moving objects such as laser bolts and blinking lights etc, so I will avoid using it on select scenes.

Here's how it looks in action: http://www.sendspace.com/file/l1u9o7

That's not what I meant 005, it's just not healthy going through some of these scenes frame by frame. Zombie asked the same thing some pages ago, don't know if none have everything in order in his spreadsheet...

robfett said:

I had no idea people were picking apart slower/faster wipes and wisps of clouds. 

And I think it's AWESOME :)

Yeah, we are a little crazy around here, glad I could be of service. :)

Have a few more alterations coming but I believe it is time for me to stop listing these.

I'll be damned, Kasdan back into Star Wars again. Interesting, I never thought I would see the day. I know that I'm not alone to f***ing love that guy for the simple reason that he penned two of the best adventure films of all time - Raiders and ESB. But he was a hungry 30 year old screenwriter back then just as Lucas was a young hungry filmmaker back then.

With the risk of being a killjoy as I know people are excited by these news... you simply don't get the kind of movie magic you got with the first two SW-films by just bringing back the old guys. Back in the early 90's, did anyone think Lucas was a bad choice to write and direct Episode 1? Back in '79 was Kersh the name on everyone's lips on who they wanted to direct Star Wars II? Lightning in a bottle don't happen by design. And the words on bringing back the old cast... well, I get Indy 4 vibes all over again. Sorry if I sound so damn pessimistic about it but I honestly feel this is 20 years too late.

ww12345 said:

OK, that's what my print says, "Dolby System." However, it does say the "Some Enchanted Evening" bit, too. I wonder if they would have redone the titles just so that it would not have that in, from when the scene was originally cut? I guess it gives me an excuse to watch the movie... :D

If not "Some Enchanted Evening" is used anywhere else in the film that may also be a '78 addition. I don't remember if it is.

SilverWook said:

Keep in mind Dolby was around as a noise reduction system at the time. We need to research this a little more.

Yes, of course. Silver is right, I missed the fact it says Dolby System not Stereo. I don't think there is another way than to check if those previously mentioned added scenes are included or not to be sure.

Thanks for posting these frames, your print seems to be in fantastic condition! be gentle with it. :) I suspect that IMDB-info could just be inaccurate, they have been wrong in the past. An easy way to determine what version you actually got is to check the end credits, the re-issue was remixed in Dolby:

Easterhay said:

Knowing John Williams as you do, of course!

Well, you don't need to know him in order to understand this simple fact, it's the way film scoring usually works. Sure there is tracked sections in the original films as well, but in the SE you've got music originally written for the trash compactor scene and music originally written for ROTJ dropped right into the Mos Eisley scenes.

Just take the scene where Luke and we as the audience see the Millennium Falcon for the first time. The score beautifully builds up to that moment, would he have written the music this way if we already had seen the ship in the Jabba sequence some time earlier?

One scene leads to the next... Lucas new additions are as subtle as a TV-commercial break.

thecolorsblend said:

The one exception I might've been willing to make is the wampa cave sequence.

Yet another addition where Williams score takes a hit, IMO it's unnecessary and destroys the great editing and drama of the original scene.

Easterhay said:

I don't see how the addition of the Falcon taking off hurts the pacing but in every other aspect of what you say I agree with you.

It interrupts an originally perfectly edited and scored action sequence. Williams score is another thing that constantly takes a hit with his mindless re-editing, not only in the obvious ways like in the Falcon takeoff, but the way Williams wrote the score is definitely not how he would've written it if the film had the editing of the SE.

Looking forward to it! :) I'm sorry that I cannot be of any assistance and give any advice in regards to get a high quality scan made, hopefully those with the expertise in the field will chime in. I'm sure -1 and team would be able to let you know the details on their MO, lots of effort involved I guess.

The original 1973 theatrical cut a.k.a. the studio cut is very similar to the 1978 re-release version. Lucas was able to restore a few scenes that had been taken out by the studio in its original release after his success with Star Wars and create his director's cut (the same thing happened with THX 1138 that same year);

• The Louie, Louie sequence at the hop. 
• Terry's exchange at the used car lot just before the first hop sequence.
• Bob Falfa singing Some Enchanted Evening from South Pacific after he picks up Laurie.

The audio was also remixed in Dolby Stereo for the reissue.

The original theatrical release has never been released on home video. Also, don't know if this info is true or not but according to IMDB:

"In the original release, John Milner is listed as having been killed by a drunk driver in June of 1964 in the closing segment just before the final credits. When the movie was reedited in 1978, the date of his death was changed to December of 1964, most likely in anticipation of the release of its sequel, More American Graffiti."

Bingowings said:

He looks rather sexy when he takes his glasses off

Agree, but he looks even sexier when he takes more than his glasses off:

ww12345, that's awesome you own a scope print and that Puggo are willing to make a transfer! A 2k or 4k scan would be fantastic, hope you are able to fulfill those plans. You should perhaps start a thread for this, there are maybe people around here that is able to help you out with this. Guess it could be the original theatrical cut if it was struck in '76, the re-release version came out in '78, exciting!

Found this clip of the opening titles in the '83 home video release: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYVe6Jzr0VA

I think it's interesting that they actually bothered to create new titles for the pan & scan format instead of letterbox or squeeze it...

Theatrical vs home video titles:

See how red faded and drab the LD-transfer is, but what happened to the Mels drive-in neon sign. Could perhaps be the result of the red fading.

Photo of a projected Derann Super 8 print:

Going by the various home viewing alternatives over the years, the updated composite was ironically more rarely seen.

The unique dissolve to the credits on this broadcast still baffles me, the only thing I can think of is that it was done in order to have the revised '77 end credits in place. But why a dissolve when you can treat it like it was done on the home video master; make the edit point beginning with the last group shot... it's just weird. The print source is an opening day '77 one with the '81 opening crawl attached in a crude way, video samples of the opening and the end credits dissolve for the interested...

Opening shot edit and lack of corridor marks:  http://www.sendspace.com/file/y9rec4 (some corrupted frames in this one)

End credits dissolve: http://www.sendspace.com/file/1rqv9q

The familiar glue marks seen in the 80's home video print:

also at the last frame of the '77 opening shot:

AntcuFaalb said:

How many different ITV recordings are there? I count three, but I may be wrong...

That's quite an impossible question to answer. ;) I believe there was yet another recording that was utilized in the Mono mix restoration project around here.

Russ' words; "For the Monomix Restoration Project, my ITV recording was rated third behind Moth3rs and a Danish broadcast. Only a small part of it was used." I don't believe the Danish is the one danny_boy has.

Moth3r said:

You should not need to deinterlace - I think you can just swap the field order.

Had a second look and you are right about that, wasn't paying attention. An easy fix if a re-encode should take place. Except for the audio, did you ever digitize your recording Moth3r?

I don't like sand people.