frank678

Asaki said:

Just out of curiosity, reel 1 ends at Threepio's oil bath, right?

Yep first shot of reel 2 is 3P0 going into the oil bath I think.

drngr said:

A professional 1080p scan of Star Wars would only cost $550 (well, if the place I'm talking about would scan copyrighted movies - they did a trailer for me). Much less than the cost of the HLD-X0.

4K would be a lot more: $5000 at the place I just looked at.

I'd settle for the time being with some one just pointing a video camera at one of these things being projected like the Senator Screeening clips except for the whole movie. Then maybe a taster of this could reach a wider audience, and maybe force the hand of the powers that be to present an official release of one of these prints.

So close and yet so far!!

Thanks for bringing this to light Photodroid+Puggo. It's a shame its not from a 35mm print. I think it would maybe compliment the rest of the bootlegs depending on how certain scenes come out via the balances on this tape where they are distorting on other tapes. It is improved for me (subjective) with an auto-white balance >

There was also V2000 tapes of the first star wars release, saw one on ebay. 

I had thought of this of getting an old PAL betamax tape and sending it away to get it transferred. But I suspect if they are from the same master betamax would only give a slight improvement to whats going to show up on tape format. However it would be good to see a comparison just for interest, I saw a betamax rip of Eraserhead on demonoid when it was still alive and it was surprisingly good (but hard to judge properly as it was black and white).

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Best-official-color-source/post/604660/#TopicPost604660 , to show how much blue was hanging around in this print (although this blue is probably distorted by how pink shifted/candy-coloured + over brightened + whatever else) and you can see the sandscrawler scene in motion in the middle of this clip https://vimeo.com/62410166 (my REMIX of the balances= https://vimeo.com/62332689)

I'd love to have a program with a function like this where you could just match colours from one frame to another like in the video AntcuFaalb posted, just to see what new balances could be got from individual scenes.

http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/New-colormatching-script/post/624554/#TopicPost624554

Joel said:

frank678 said:

Here's a converted/downsized clip from the Starkiller transfer which should give an indication of the colours https://vimeo.com/63697801

Thanks for that - It is a really different color palette isn't it?

 

Yes, for me this 82 laserdisc is a bit too yellow, overbrightened and in translation some of the deep vivid colours look a bit harsh and one dimensional. But I think the print/negative used here was much less pink shifted here in 1982 on this release . It's a pity none of the consumer formats of the day had the dynamic range to capture all the complexity a blu ray can.

 

 

Joel said:

Is the "better master" a big deal in a standard-def LD, and worth the mediocre analog audio? I'm not trying to sound cynical, I really want to know. If this is the LD to check out, I want to check it out!

And I'm assuming we're talking about a CAV disc, too, yeah? (Sorry if this has been asked to death).

No its not really a big deal in these old formats to be honest. Why its better is that you can see the print behind the 82 LD master was less 'on the turn' in places than the print behind the 1982 NTSC VHS, so although the VHS has some scenes where the colours are really intact and great it has some really odd shifts where things are turning purple. The laserdisc is overall much more even and the colours are vivid in places and it can give a better idea what the original colour range was before all the pink shift started happening. The other reason to get it has the original pre-remix soundtrack i think, which is really dynamic sounding on the disc. Althought the starkiller preservation has a long section of glitchiness in the soundtrack due to rot i suspect.

ilovewaterslides said:

frank678 said:

Have you seen the Starkiller 1982 preservation?

I've searched everywhere for this version, i still can't find it. Is it the same master as the 1982 Rental VHS?

It should still be on the newsgroup if you do a search, or go backward through the pages. The 1982 laserdisc is a different (much better) master to the vhs tape, from my comparision of preservations.

Spaced Ranger said:

@ frank678

Was that any better? :D

 

Yes easier to get my head round thank you for explaining

Spaced Ranger said:

To mis-quote a certain dark helmet ...

"Don't be too proud of this HSL representation you're using. The ability to over-saturate a picture is insignificant next to the power of RGB."

;)

 

O.k. I really need a "for dummies" version of what this means :)

Spaced Ranger said:

As you can see, one can do anything to the curve (with enough control points) to do anything to a picture or to parts of a picture. Dangerous territory. :)

Thanks I havnt got my head round histogram adjustment yet but I have been playing with gradiation curve filter (along with film color filter) in virtualdub, to improve on a very red shifted VHS source, I have not been trying to push it to meet a reference on this but just try to get the skintones more back into the realistic range. Sometimes this just looks like going from red to a more palatable orange:

original https://vimeo.com/62410166

filters https://vimeo.com/62332689

Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

I have PhotoDroid's tape now and will start a new thread after I've had a look at it. Any suggestions for the name of the project? I think "Shea'79 bootleg" sounds nice.

Puggo have you had chance to view what was on PhotoDroid's tape? Any initial findings to share?

/

It definitely looks that way, but the exact balances are hard to gauge from different sources=

film cell

senator screening

film cell

pre anh bootleg

Even TeamNegative1's sources seem to show hue variation:

The 70mm scans seem muted

Retartedted's 1982 preservation is the one official source where the green uniforms and dark blue tints (the blue effect is strange as it seems to be an effect from the wall lights picking out dark blue tones in the grey wall paint?) seem to be still intact. I took a stab at trying to get the Pal VHS to uncover the original mix, but was limited by what I started with https://vimeo.com/59244857

The blue and green information is hinted at in the greys on some transfers its just so washed out it hardly registers/can be recovered.

Ive got my fingers crossed that Photodroid 's Shea '79 bootleg is not grey looking. Very interested to find out what it looks like!

>

TServo2049 said:

 

And to clarify, this is the image frank says is the "original":

 

I don't think he was the person who originally captured it.

Yep that is the original vlc snap from Starkillers 82 preservation.

@ Spaced Ranger, what I'm primarily interested in is seeing if theres a way to undo the red-infused colour mix of the widescreen versions, back to less uncontaminated colours like on the 82 laserdisc. You_Too and Dark_Jedi are already working on this but are using one overall correction setting. What I was interested in was whether there was a more automated systematic way to use earlier information (for example from the 82 laserdisc) and import that over/apply that to a widescreen version. G-Force has written a script to do colour matching, which AntcuFaalb used to do something along these lines = http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/New-colormatching-script/post/616355/#TopicPost616355. What I'm trying to garner in this thread is how much it is possible to undo mixed up colours (if red shift is the result of missing blue and green information- can this be added/painted back in using an earlier source to gauge the right levels?)

Heres a Gout still, followed by the 82 which I think looks much more like the natural world (albeit limited), and lastly a 70mm still which I guess itself must be faded somewhat. Can you tell just by looking at the whats here and based on your damn impressive correction on the THX 1138 project, what can reasonably be acheived. Is this actually a workable idea?

http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=ejikxe&s=6

Spaced Ranger said:

Unless you are merging frames from different sources (for a particular reason), you will get nothing more than if you adjust that single frame.

 Hey Spaced Ranger I've found making one frame with the contrast set far apart and one with the contrast in the mid range and layering as transparencies then I get a composite spread of the different information I could'nt get from one set of settings on one frame. Not entirely clear on how it works - I only know that I can't duplicate the results without layering with the program I have. I agree using references and matching the data would be a much less haphazard and more true way of approaching this to my guesswork.

/