I saw a u.s. sw trailer in the past year on ebay u.k. which started and ended at £70 (no bids) and it looked less scuffed up - it was a later re-release trailer
Just realized my comments re: old versions on vhs might have been better in a thread like this:
http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/BD-Releases-That-Are-Arguably-Inferior-to-DVDs-and-HD-DVDs/topic/14376/page/1/
My idea of the perfect transfer would be to get flesh tone as realistic and 3D as at the .43 second mark in this trailer:
skyjedi2005 said:
Is that Empire tape the pre cert one for Empire. Did russs ever preserve that tape?
Hopefully it is not a bad ntsc to pal standards conversion as the first issue empire uk laserdisc which also happens to be one of the worst rotters in history of the format next to the first issue star wars UK disc.
Basing this on info grinder gave me. As even though i have the discs i don't have a pal laserdisc player.
I bought an ex-rental of the first empire release in a charity shop, unfortunately it was snowy and crudded up the heads on the video recorder so i had to throw it away. My take was aside from being over brightened (for crt display?) it was a straight transfer of a relatively new print not a ntsc conversion. the blues and whites on hoth were really clean. I got one of the early return of the jedi pal vhs= the print was not as colourful (jedi is the only film i can remember seeing at the cinema and the vhs didnt do the original colours of jedi justice). My guess would be the first pal empire might be the best transfer out of the three films on vhs (of the u.k. releases). Russs15 has done a capture which i'd love to see some more stills from/or to see someone take some photos of the original playing on a tv screen to double check my impressions. anyone else have the original pre cert pal tape and a cameraphone? the laserdisc might not be as good as the vhs then (also it came out a year or so later?)- and i read u.k. laserdisc for star wars was an ntsc conversion also(??). the ntsc empire laserdisc as represented by negative1s capture screenshots looks like lucasfilm put some sort of processing on it distorting it, the pal vhs looked better to my eyes
puggo's forthcoming PSB will almost certainly blow it out of the water but it would still be worth preservation i feel
thanks due to russs15 for this comparison post:
http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Help-Im-new/post/582999/#TopicPost582999
here's a laserdisc capture, it *feels* the most accurate compared to the stills to me:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNghhjO9lUs&list=UUi7Y-sm5OpyZn5zh2dORovw&index=26&feature=plcp
negative1 said:
there's a lot more discussion about this stuff here:
----------
http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/forum.cfm/Other-Preservations-and-Fan-Projects/forum/18/
probably should start something over there.
later
-1
apologies, found this thread now:
http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Blade-Runner-color-timing/topic/14095/page/1/
AntcuFaalb said:
Blade Runner is one of my favorite films, so I wouldn't object to capturing it.
Can someone tell me if the colortiming on the Blu-ray release of John Carpenter's Halloween is accurate?
For Halloween just looking at stills online the skin tone on the blu ray look really natural, however i dont know horror films much to know any that well. When I look at blade runner on the linked page it looks too green tinted now but previous versions dont seem to be right either. there was a thread about this on other preservation section but no one goes as far back as vhs with this stuff i dont think
AntcuFaalb said:
I wouldn't mind tackling Blade Runner, but my setup is only capable of handling NTSC. Would that be OK?
Would be brilliant! In case I appear a bit cheap on this - only do this if you think there is a reason for you - I'm still not sure what my monitor is screwing up exactly. However, I think this may be the last gasp for VHS so if ever there was a time for this stuff its now!
add: yeah blade runner is confusing not sure whats right there??
1990osu said:
Harmy said: it's quite possible that the tech prints had slightly different colourtiming in some places than even '77 Eastman prints. But since all the surviving Eastman prints are faded, we may never know
That's why the new PS78 bootleg tape is so exciting- an unfaded color reference for an unfaded Eastman print....
+1
sunday256 said:
frank678 said:
apologies for posting misinformation! also i shouldnt really comment on this subject not having watched the finished scene, i just remembered that still from the senator screening.
there is something off about this sequence for me like they shot it with a really delicate contrast level and its been skewed slightly ever since. anyway i can tell this one has been done to death, so i'll bow out here
And here I thought that OT.com folks only complained about the Prequels! Maybe I'm just in the wrong thread. LOL.
leave now before you engage in this kind of insanity (!):
http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Calling-all-Color-Correctors-Can-this-source-yield-a-different-set-of-results-to-Gout/post/577769/#TopicPost577769
apologies for posting misinformation! also i shouldnt really comment on this subject not having watched the finished scene, i just remembered that still from the senator screening.
there is something off about this sequence for me like they shot it with a really delicate contrast level and its been skewed slightly ever since. anyway i can tell this one has been done to death, so i'll bow out here
Trooperman said:
Given the gazillion changes to the audio over 1977, as well as changes to the credits (apparently) over the course of that same year, is it at all possible that George Lucas went back to the original negative and had certain scenes recolored at the lab, too- and then implemented into new prints of the film, because he wasn't perfectly happy it as it was?
It could be this scene was intitally corrected for the LPP print and went uncorrected for the technicolor dye print. It could be *shock idea coming up* the technicolour dye print HAS faded in parts
AntcuFaalb said:
frank678 said:
If anyone needs ideas for non-star wars vhs films to preserve i have a few! (as I'm sure lots of others do to) :O)
Go on...
Yay!
Here's a couple of titles which I think would have different colour timing on early vhs versions to how they are presented in 2012 and so might be important to preserve: Blade Runner,(http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film/DVDReviews24/bladerunner.htm) Apocalpse Now (http://www.avsforum.com/t/1264333/apocalypse-now/510#post_19446351). Blue Velvet looks like its going pink to me on the Blu Ray- certainly its not like the deep blues i saw at the cinema. http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film/dvdcompare5/bluevelvet.htm
This will probably have no appeal to anyone but to me the criterion Days of Heaven (1978) also looks like it has pink shift in it to me. The trouble is I don't know how much of me seeing this pink/red shifted is effected by my monitor, which has a definite pink tint. Also I dont know how good/faithful NTSC telecines would be. http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film/dvdreviews9/days-of-heaven.htm
The first PAL release of Empire Strikes on VHS I think needs preservation.
my theory is when the ib technicolor print (or as one theory goes this 1 of the 100 technicolor prints made from the original negative) was made this scene had already faded on the negative and so the odd look of this scene is captured 'as is' = colour faded.
I havn't been able to get back on my home account to be able to download Harmy's DE 2 but just from comparing the shot to this IB screening it seems like he was aiming to match what was going on in the IB reference
http://petergaultney.smugmug.com/Movies/historic/Star-Wars-at-The-Senator/13089279_nXePV#!i=948681807&k=3oFJ2&lb=1&s=A
I'm fairly sure he's done more homework on this than all of us put together!!
If anyone needs ideas for non-star wars vhs films to preserve i have a few! (as I'm sure lots of others do to) :O)
@negative1
thanks for the reply. its tricky to ask a question about this project whilst keeping in mind sensible privacy about it. i imagine for me if i was involved in this project i would hope to develop a real love of the organic qualities of film and love for keeping projection alive for the future. However I know this stuff can also be over romantised and might be in reality a pain in the ass in these digital times.
negative1 said:
i'm not mad. but that's because i got to play
around with all this stuff for the last 2 years.
maybe if it never got released, then yeah,
but life's too short. so i probably would just
live with what we have.
later
-1
You have a very patient way of looking at this stuff and to patience to tackle this in the first place(!), I suppose you could thank Lucasfilm for inspiring you to learn more about 35mm film and film restoration, and to develop a new skill set. Can I ask if there was already the interest in 35mm projection before this project and has it lead to interest in it further? I would be interested in (apologies if youve answered this before) if you have the means/chance to compare analog vs digitised projection of this source and if its perceptibly different?
AntcuFaalb said:
An Aside
I often hear bootlegs regarded as the Holy Grail for Star Wars fans in the '80s. To what extent is this true?
I'm sure many of you were conscious during that time (I wasn't, as I was born in the late '80s), so do you have any stories to share? If so, please do!
Born in 1975 I was too young to get to see star wars at the cinema and so the version I knew was the pan and scan version that would have been shown on u.k. t.v. during the 80s. One of the many ways Star Wars fired up my imagination were the quick cutaway shots which would give you tons of alien stuff/information/detail in one second and then be gone (this is before I had the ability to pause films) . It suggested whole films within films, worlds within worlds. Then one day I visit my cousins house and he's got this star wars paperback with 16 colour inserts, with pictures wider than pan and scan, pictures not actually in the film i've seen, and pictures with deep rich inky colour unlike i've seen. I see there is a whole different version of star wars that i've never seen before a richer more detailed (later understood as the documentary style feel Lucas was going for) version that was there when it first came out in the cinema and which i've unfairly missed by being too young. Will I ever get to see this version? Is the only place you can see this version in america? These questions are still kind of waiting answers decades later.... (!)
i realize the film i imagined through these pictures stems from inaccurate colour printing technique and so exists in an alternate universe, but still the dream (reality!) of a richer original starting print is what the PS78 is for me...
You_Too said:
Trust me, after trying hundreds of variations of the script, I'm sure it looks best this way.
Based on these new stills and the amount of time you've been analysing the GOUT source I would put money on this next version being the best overall colour correction of GOUT ever. Looking forward to it!