darth_ender

P-21

P-20

I'm an honorary member, having dedicated my life to years of selfless service and the progress of humanity.  Don't tell leading member this but I'm actually planning on staging a coup and taking over the team.  From there we will wage war on the pitiful Team Negative 1!

P-19

Yeah, I know.  It's just in part an attempt to make it feel like it fits in with the rest of the shogi games, with the hope that other shogi variant enthusiasts would more readily adopt it.  In any case, there are severl potential pieces.  I'm interested in what you think might be a good fit:

-Mountain dove - from taikyoku shog i- one backward, or jumping every other space forward up to five landing squares (ten squares including jumped) 

-Mountain stag - from taikyoku shogi - up to four squares backwards (non-jumping) or forward jumping every other square up to three squares, or one square forward

-Buddhist devil - from taikyoku shogi - just like the flying swallow, but only up to three landing squares (six total) forward (or of course, one backward)

-Old rat – from maka dai dai shogi - up to two squares (non-jumping) backwards, or up to two landing squares (four total) forward

-Flying dragon – maka dai dai - just like a bishop, only up to two landing squares (four total) forward or backward

I'm sure there are others, but that's a good start, and probably sufficient, as I feel the right piece is probably in that pool of options.  Any stick out to you?  Let me know :)

The promoted value would still remain the bishop, of course.

I actually immediately suspected Sam, though I'm not sure.  He just hopped in all confident like and started criticizing with some very strange linguistic patterns.  Who knows?  I figured I'd wait and see instead of jumping the gun.  I hurt darklordoftech's feelings because I was too confident that he was FatherSkywalker.

I am convinced that you are right about the bishop/flying sparrow being too powerful, even early in the game.  I think it might be wise to have the demoted value as something similar but weaker, with a short-range bishop move.  Like the mountain dove from Taikyoku shogi would have a move just like the flying swallow when translated to the 1D board, but would limit it's forward movement to 5 squares (10, if we're including the skipped squares).  That's still pretty far, but maybe a little more searching would yield a better piece.

P-18

P*17

B-13

FSx19+B

RC-10

I have played and beaten The Legend of Zelda, Zelda II: The Adventure of Link, A Link to the Past, Link's Awakening, The Ocarina of Time, and The Minish Cap.  I have also played several others without taking the time to get very far.  They are all such enjoyable games, and there's not a one I didn't get engrossed in.  Even what many consider the odd duck, The Adventure of Link, was thoroughly engrossing (and frustrating) for me.  Thank goodness I was playing on an emulator and could save my state instead of always having to go super far back every time I failed at some portion.  Even then, it still was super hard and took a while to beat for me.

Anyone ever try out the CD-i rejects?  I thoroughly enjoy the YouTube vids of the cinematic portions, which ultimately are the only value in those horrible games.  Those cinematic scenes belong in the "So Bad It's Good" thread!

I do like your idea of dropping only as the demoted piece, but I'm not sure if I want to use it or not.  It was nice to be able to drop a more powerful piece to perform a few double attacks, only to be weakened drastically once it captured, but on the other hand it makes longer game when the pieces are stuck a bit weaker for much of the game, and it makes players less likely to trade them once they've promoted to a more powerful piece.

...

Let's try it with only dropping the weaker face up, and if we like it, we can keep it, and if not, we can try the other again.

P-14

I still am interested in the vice general or rook general, so I'd probably like to try that next game and see how that goes.

Qh5

RicOlie_2 said:

I think the set-up works well, but that game ended rather quickly. I messed up my first few moves and wasted moves trying to get in a more favourable position. Meanwhile, you got your pieces ready to go and I wasn't able to make a comeback.

Forgive the block quoting.  I'm not a fan of it, but there are times when it's best to address various points bit by bit.  I am starting to think this is the part of the game that will always be the weakest, no matter what we do.  In the beginning there are relatively few options.  It's hard to know how best to maneuver your pieces and initiate the first exchange without coming out the loser.  I still don't have a solution to this, and maybe there is none.  That might be just the part where players struggle the most till they find a way to poke at each other.

I still enjoyed it, except for the last few turns, but I had few options. Maybe it's just because the game was short, but it seemed to me that fewer pieces ended up promoting. It might also have seemed that way because we could only drop pieces with their demoted side facing up and pieces only promoted once. Even so, there were few captures during that game which made it less exciting than some games we've played.

True, there were fewer captures, so I see what you are saying.  The first game was definitely more exciting.  I wonder if that's not necessarily a flaw of this setup, but rather just a different game.  I want this game to be similar in length to games like Micro and Mini Shogi.  So I don't really need a long game.  Just one that is challenging.  This was, I felt, pretty challenging, and though not as challenging as others, it may have just been the way this game played out and not the setup itself.

I found the game more interesting with more promotions so maybe we should revert to the old promotion rules but still allow only the weaker values to be dropped onto the board. What do you think? Do you think the game would be more interesting if we did that?

But considering what I just said, you may be right, it may be best to go back to the alternating promotion/demotion.  That was one of the interesting challenges of our first game, as I would find I could drop a piece with an advantageous face up, but the moment I made a capture, I lost my advantage and it became a burden, as I often found myself trying to defend that piece only so it wouldn't fall into your hands.  Part of the problem of that first game was how often pieces got stuck, especially after a demotion.  But we've adjusted all the starting pieces so that, aside from the pawn, everything has at least a small backward movement.  The lack of backward movement is partly why I wanted permanent promotions.  But since they now can move backwards as well, even in their weak states, I agree, we should reintroduce the alternate promotion/demotion.

I also think that the FS/B should be stuck behind more pieces (maybe switch it with the RC/SC) at the beginning. With the current set-up it can be moved into play quite early in the game and is able to cover a significant portion of the board. If used effectively it can do a lot of damage. Once a player has both of them, like this game, the other player is suddenly very limited in what they can do since they can cover so much of the board at one time. I had a poor defense, so maybe it was just bad planning on my part, but I don't like how it dominated the game.

I have no problem with trying it that way.  I was kind of proud of the defense I used, where I placed the pawn in front of your RC so that if you captured it, it would become a cannon, which would have been ineffective in defending a particular piece.  But that's neither here nor there.  In any case, we can exchange their positions.  The cannon was a fun piece that first game, so putting the RC more in the front might give it more opportunity to come out.

Other than that, I enjoyed the first twenty turns or so and I could have gotten quite far if you had dropped the second FS/B onto the board just a few turns later. On the whole, I think the game works pretty well, and had I planned better, I probably would have done better in the end. That being said, I still think we should switch the FS/B with the RC/SC to make it even more enjoyable. :)

 I think you could have done a little better in the end as well.  But I agree with your suggestion as well.  That said, feel free to make the first move, with those two pieces switched and the alternating promotion/demotion rules.

I honestly don't know what a fair price would be.  What about you?  What do you think?

Man, I kept trying to make a move last night, but just as I'd determined to win the game, OT.com stopped functioning.  This is what I had typed last night:

Oh, you're right.  I didn't see it before, but I can force a checkmate.  Bx29.  Your only move is Kx29, after which I play RC*28 mate.

So tell me, what do you think of this version of the game?  Any pointers or nitpicks you might have about it?

I will add that I am thankful for another fun game with you.  This setup seems to allow for a playable game with interesting interactions and combinations.  The reverse chariot saw more action, the cannons never came out (which is okay with me, as they are cool, but last game they were too dominating in the game's strategy), and other pieces had a chance to shine.  In particular, the flying sparrow/bishop had more opportunities, which I think was nice.  I also kind of thought it was fun to use the threat of turning your reverse chariot into a cannon to prevent you from capturing one of my pieces.  I think the game turned out quite nicely.  Again I ask, do you have any thoughts?

Shameless! ;)

c5

Gosh Warb, I'm feeling like I don't know what to do.  Hopefully I can find a plan.

It's not over yet.  I'm not sure I can force a win even now.  FSx26+B#

P-27

FS*22

I suspect you missed my move.

darth_ender said:

Of course it is okay, Warbler.  And the chair does not recognize the delegate from Naboobia at this time!

The chair recognizes the delegate from the sovereign system of Naboobia.

The chair does not recognize the delegate from Naboobia at this time!

Will you defer your motion?

Oh, er...Qd5

I might be willing to purchase it if you are interested in selling to someone in AZ

Bx23

Well, the Flying Swallow I just captured is not much bigger than 2 meters.